FacebookTwitter
Hatrack River Forum   
my profile login | search | faq | forum home

  next oldest topic   next newest topic
» Hatrack River Forum » Active Forums » Books, Films, Food and Culture » Does gender affect interests and aptitudes? (Page 2)

  This topic comprises 2 pages: 1  2   
Author Topic: Does gender affect interests and aptitudes?
PSI Teleport
Member
Member # 5545

 - posted      Profile for PSI Teleport   Email PSI Teleport         Edit/Delete Post 
Porter- For the record, I never told my son that he should be just like Daddy. He decided to do that on his own.

I believe in letting my kids make their own decisions about what interests them. My husband is an artistic guy without a shred of athleticism in his body. But my son loves playing sports and we encourage it. There are alot of ways he's like his dad, but he's still himself and we've never tried to make him be any other way. I told that story to show that my son made his own choice not to wear girly clothes, because even though we clapped for him, he still got bored with it quickly. HE decided he wants to wear boy clothes, and he likes it that way. I have NEVER said to him, "Wear these clothes because then you'll be like Dad!"

Posts: 6367 | Registered: Aug 2003  |  IP: Logged | Report this post to a Moderator
mr_porteiro_head
Member
Member # 4644

 - posted      Profile for mr_porteiro_head   Email mr_porteiro_head         Edit/Delete Post 
PSI, I believe you. I was mostly just ruminating about my family. Thinking out loud... (which is an odd thing to say, considering the only audible manfestation has been the clacking of my keyboard while I type...)
Posts: 16551 | Registered: Feb 2003  |  IP: Logged | Report this post to a Moderator
PSI Teleport
Member
Member # 5545

 - posted      Profile for PSI Teleport   Email PSI Teleport         Edit/Delete Post 
I don't really think there's anything wrong with doing that, just so you know. It just isn't really my style. I kinda feel like, when it comes to being macho or not, my son should be allowed to decide where he wants to be on the macho scale.

As they get older, I will definitely try to instill in them what's important about being a man or a woman (gasp!) but I feel like I need to get a good grasp of who my kids are first, so that I can teach them how to be good people without stepping all over who they are inside.

Like, does a man stand up and fight for his family, or does he try to talk the problem out? Both could be good responses, depending on the situation, but I think it's going to depend alot on what kind of man my son is growing up to be.

Posts: 6367 | Registered: Aug 2003  |  IP: Logged | Report this post to a Moderator
mr_porteiro_head
Member
Member # 4644

 - posted      Profile for mr_porteiro_head   Email mr_porteiro_head         Edit/Delete Post 
PSI, We have also never said that our son needs to try to be like daddy or that our daughter should be like mommy. But when recognize "Daddy and I are boys" or "Mommy and I are girls", it is natural that they would identify with and emulate the parent that they share that with.
Posts: 16551 | Registered: Feb 2003  |  IP: Logged | Report this post to a Moderator
mr_porteiro_head
Member
Member # 4644

 - posted      Profile for mr_porteiro_head   Email mr_porteiro_head         Edit/Delete Post 
PSI -- I am confused. What were you responding to in your last post?
Posts: 16551 | Registered: Feb 2003  |  IP: Logged | Report this post to a Moderator
beverly
Member
Member # 6246

 - posted      Profile for beverly   Email beverly         Edit/Delete Post 
I grew up in a family of 4 boys 2 girls. Porter grew up in a family of 5 boys. From what I have seen, nurture has a great deal to do with gender rolls. But I also think it is utterly ridiculous to say that nature has nothing to do with it. (Not that anyone here on hatrack has claimed that.)

I think the big part of nature is the mix of hormones we get in the womb and after. I have always grown up feeling I wasn't very feminine. I have often wondered if I had the "wrong" balance of hormones in me, whether in the womb or out. My sister was much more of a "girly girl" admiring our mother, following in her footsteps, while I was a "tom boy" and adored my father and brothers. I had no interest in "girly" things. Our aptitudes were soooo different, what attracted or repelled us. I was into snakes, frogs, bugs, climbing trees, eschewed pink, loved to watch my brothers play video games (I was never good enough myself, so I mostly watched them--they were *good*!) She loved dolls, pink, lace, frills, playing house, dress-up, etc.

I eventually have come to incorporate more traditional female-gender-roll stuff into my life, by choice. I am a stay-at-home-mom, I make homemade wheat bread every week, I cook and (sometimes) clean, though I hate cleaning with a passion. I "do" what my Mom did. It has brought me joy and fulfillment. I think Porter really enjoys that I am not a "girly girl". I can appreciate so many of the things he likes. But he is still *way* more masculine than I. [Smile]

I don't mind our kids growing up somewhat in "gender rolls" insomuch as I think they are positive. There are some classic gender-roll aspects I will gently encourage, and others I will discourage. I will always try to take into consideration what makes that child happy. But I second what Porter said about our first two children. Our boy is *such* a boy. Our first girl is *such* a girl. While I think nurture plays a part, there is no doubt in my mind that they are drawn to the things they are because of nature. Sanford is obsessed with guns. His drive to find guns in everything is (in my mind) ridiculously excessive. This is not a matter of "identifying with his father and other boys". It is more of an irresistable, primal urge. Athena's motherly affection for her stuffed animals is so profound, deeply instinctual. I was *never* that way as a girl. I guess their hormone "mix" is right on for the norm in their gender.

I can easily imagine us having another boy that is not such a "boy" and our baby girl, Ivy, growing up to not be such a "girl". But for these first two, their nature deeply ingrained in them is very much in line with their gender.

Posts: 7050 | Registered: Feb 2004  |  IP: Logged | Report this post to a Moderator
BrianM
Member
Member # 5918

 - posted      Profile for BrianM   Email BrianM         Edit/Delete Post 
quote:
From what I have seen, nurture has a great deal to do with gender rolls.
That's not nurturing your kids, that's a case of McDonald's abuse.

[Angst]

[ April 26, 2004, 01:58 PM: Message edited by: BrianM ]

Posts: 369 | Registered: Nov 2003  |  IP: Logged | Report this post to a Moderator
PSI Teleport
Member
Member # 5545

 - posted      Profile for PSI Teleport   Email PSI Teleport         Edit/Delete Post 
Porter, my last post was in response to raising your kids and teaching them to emulate the same sex parent. I was trying to make sure you knew I didn't think that there was anything wrong with it, even though I never really do it. Didn't want you to think I was criticizing.
Posts: 6367 | Registered: Aug 2003  |  IP: Logged | Report this post to a Moderator
Synesthesia
Member
Member # 4774

 - posted      Profile for Synesthesia   Email Synesthesia         Edit/Delete Post 
Threads like this make me feel like a mutant.
When I was a kid I wanted to be a boy. I was not athletic, this could have been due to being sick when I was young but I liked-
Watching He-man, Thundercats, Jem, My Little Pony, Ducktales ect.
I liked playing with toy cars and a green Hulk doll and also a mum-ra action figure but I diapered some of my stuffed animals but didn't like dolls or barbies or pink
I hated dresses and liked wearing pants.
Even now I dislike shopping, but I sometimes like romantic stuff, but I hate most romantic comedies but coo over mush in RPGs...
I can wear the same sneakers until they fall apart. I don't like shoes and buy 1 pair every 2 or 3 years. I am messy.
I like cars such as mustangs and I like victoria's secret bath stuff but I don't see the point in paying a lot for fancy undawears especially false advertising bras...
I must be some kind of mutant.... [Confused]

Posts: 9942 | Registered: Mar 2003  |  IP: Logged | Report this post to a Moderator
BannaOj
Member
Member # 3206

 - posted      Profile for BannaOj   Email BannaOj         Edit/Delete Post 
Well Syn, you sound a lot like me... so maybe we create our own "normalcy" as it were.

AJ

Posts: 11265 | Registered: Mar 2002  |  IP: Logged | Report this post to a Moderator
Phanto
Member
Member # 5897

 - posted      Profile for Phanto           Edit/Delete Post 
Say you are perfect, non-sexist all you want.

Studies show that when a boy does an action, he is 8 times as likely to be punished for the action, and that the punishment is much worse than for girls.

That means the following:

Let's say a boy gets punished for acting up 8 times. If that boy was girl, she would only be punished one time, and on a much milder level!

You say that doesn't warp the mind?

What about this:

Again, studies show that the same baby when identified as a girl is praised as, "Pretty, cute, adorable." When as a boy, "Tough, strong, et cetra."

Posts: 3060 | Registered: Nov 2003  |  IP: Logged | Report this post to a Moderator
PSI Teleport
Member
Member # 5545

 - posted      Profile for PSI Teleport   Email PSI Teleport         Edit/Delete Post 
Phanto:

No one in this thread has suggested that nurture doesn't play an important part in the development of the minds of children.

But there is evidence that nature has at least SOMETHING to do with it. The question wasn't which played a bigger part, the question was whether nature had anything to do with it at ALL.

I think it's obvious that it does.

And just because your "studies" say that boys get punished more than girls doesn't mean that I am anything less than fair with my children. You should really know something about a person and their parenting style before you assume that some study you heard about, but don't even have a link for, said that I probably treat my son unfairly.

And of COURSE I don't praise my son by telling him he's pretty! He's NOT! Duh! But I definitely call him handsome, and sweet, and smart, and kind, and obedient, the same as I do with his sister. (Only she's not particularly handsome.)

It's a FAR cry from saying "most people do this because it says so in a study" and PSITeleport does this. If you saw me in action, you'd take your foot out of your mouth long enough to say you were wrong.

I'll assume you were talking to me because I'm the only one your points seem to have been possibly made toward.

Posts: 6367 | Registered: Aug 2003  |  IP: Logged | Report this post to a Moderator
Phanto
Member
Member # 5897

 - posted      Profile for Phanto           Edit/Delete Post 
Actually, I wasn't talking to you at all. [Razz]
Sorry for that impression. Forgive me.

quote:

But there is evidence that nature has at least SOMETHING to do with it. The question wasn't which played a bigger part, the question was whether nature had anything to do with it at ALL.

You're right. Nature is important. I posted these studies to show that even on a subcounscious basis our entire attitudes are changed by the word, "boy," or, "girl."
Posts: 3060 | Registered: Nov 2003  |  IP: Logged | Report this post to a Moderator
PSI Teleport
Member
Member # 5545

 - posted      Profile for PSI Teleport   Email PSI Teleport         Edit/Delete Post 
Okay, but then who were you talking to?
Posts: 6367 | Registered: Aug 2003  |  IP: Logged | Report this post to a Moderator
Phanto
Member
Member # 5897

 - posted      Profile for Phanto           Edit/Delete Post 
I was posting my opinion on the idea that any child is truly treated in a non-sexist manner. In essence, I was agreeing with Xaposert.
Posts: 3060 | Registered: Nov 2003  |  IP: Logged | Report this post to a Moderator
PSI Teleport
Member
Member # 5545

 - posted      Profile for PSI Teleport   Email PSI Teleport         Edit/Delete Post 
Ummm...hugs?

[Smile]

Posts: 6367 | Registered: Aug 2003  |  IP: Logged | Report this post to a Moderator
Beren One Hand
Member
Member # 3403

 - posted      Profile for Beren One Hand           Edit/Delete Post 
Normally I wouldn't. But oh... ok.

[Group Hug]

Posts: 4116 | Registered: Apr 2002  |  IP: Logged | Report this post to a Moderator
mr_porteiro_head
Member
Member # 4644

 - posted      Profile for mr_porteiro_head   Email mr_porteiro_head         Edit/Delete Post 
PSI, I was confused because I didn't think that I had said that we *are* doing that. I was just saying that it is natural that a child would emulate the same-sex parent more than the other one.
Posts: 16551 | Registered: Feb 2003  |  IP: Logged | Report this post to a Moderator
Phanto
Member
Member # 5897

 - posted      Profile for Phanto           Edit/Delete Post 
I'm not the kind of person to randomly hug expect when it's too annoy people, as I did early on in my posting here.

On the other hand, why not?

[Group Hug]

Posts: 3060 | Registered: Nov 2003  |  IP: Logged | Report this post to a Moderator
  This topic comprises 2 pages: 1  2   

   Close Topic   Feature Topic   Move Topic   Delete Topic next oldest topic   next newest topic
 - Printer-friendly view of this topic
Hop To:


Contact Us | Hatrack River Home Page

Copyright © 2008 Hatrack River Enterprises Inc. All rights reserved.
Reproduction in whole or in part without permission is prohibited.


Powered by Infopop Corporation
UBB.classic™ 6.7.2