posted
Katarain, I agree with you, though in general I find hatrack to be more civilized in its disagreements than other arenas. I know the feeling, though. I typically read political threads, but hardly ever post in them for that reason.
While I admire folks who stick up for their beliefs, I'd admire them more if they did it with less vitriol and more thoughtful consideration. That's one of the things that I've LOVED about hatrack: seeing the opposing viewpoints (well, opposing to my own, anyway) thoroughly and thoughtfully considered. That's why I continue to read the threads, despite the noticable increase in screaming matches lately.
Posts: 4077 | Registered: Jun 2003
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posted
Megan, I agree with you, too. (See, happy family.)
I really shouldn't let one bad experience sour me completely on Hatrack. I really like it here.
I'm perfectly willing to let other people disagree with me. I don't take it personally, and I don't feel a need to correct them in their views. So when I, in turn, express my views, I expect the same treatment. I suppose I made people angry with what I thought were pretty innocuous jokes in the other thread. Considering the mean jokes on the other side, I didn't think mine were so bad.. *shrugs*
posted
Actually, none of the DNC protesters did anything illegal and didn't need to be arrested.
It was the RNC protesters that broke the law. And were held in a facility large enough to encorporate them.
Finally, nothing unconstitutional or wrong was done to the protesters and as far as I have been able to tell, there exists no lawsuit by anyone against the city or RNC on any grounds.
The protesters should have been thrown in jail with the rest of the "thugs", but instead were taken to a place where only protesters were held.
Why?
Because they're smarter than me and you. You see, when you are wearing a shirt that says "I hate Bush" or "I'm Gay and I hate Bush" and you take that protester and you put them in a cell with Drunken Bush Supporter "bubba" or the Gay Hating Gang member "Slash-T" what do you think will happen to them?
You are actually saying that the jails should have been completely full of these lawbreakers and mixed with the general population of the NYPD precinct Jails.
Stupid, stupid move.
And you actually post quotes from people arguing that is was "inhumane" the way they were held in an abandoned warehouse?
The NON-Law breaking DNC protesters were confined to WORSE outside the DNC and they had broken NO laws. We're talking about cement barricades with Chain link fense around them. And THAT was the protesters area.
Your argument is as absurd as it is funny.
Yeah, those DNC protester's deserved to be thrown in jail with other common criminals. How dare they bus them to an abandoned warehouse with other like minded lawbreakers.
posted
"Actually, none of the DNC protesters did anything illegal and didn't need to be arrested."
Hm. Chad, let me make a suggestion, one that may well serve you in good stead if you take it to heart: before you say anything, spend thirty seconds thinking about whether it's provably false or not. If you think it is, spend another thirty seconds determining whether a quick Google search can prove it false.
This one minute of reflection would prevent you from jamming your head up your nether regions so often. Posts: 37449 | Registered: May 1999
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posted
BTW Tom, how's the view up there? (think before you post attacks against other posters directly)
Posts: 1533 | Registered: Sep 2004
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posted
Now everyone, please, let Chad speak. He's performing a valuable service for all Hatrackers in showing us exactly what Bush supporters want to see in a president. Think of him as Mini-Bush.
RNC protestors were very naughty and deserved to be rounded up and stuck somewhere. Observing their personal liberties would take too darn much time, actually charging them or letting them call their lawyers would just get complicated, and everyone knows the Miranda from cop shows anyway. The people that got rounded up along with them? They weren't really hurt, and anyway that's the price you pay for order. The comparisons to Guantanamo Bay are just silly, since the protestors got released eventually.
Listen to the media about Iraq? They're all Bush-haters with no clue what's going on over there. Do like Chad and Bush do, totally ignore the media completely, along with the obviously brainwashed military leaders and investigative committees, and just believe the reports that tell you how rosy everything is. Oh, and when the liberals cave and admit that some of the media is biased, and they might not be completely right? That means we won, because we'll never admit to the slightest mistake no matter what it is. That would make us look weak.
I urge everyone here to do a search for everything posted by member #6872 and read his posts carefully. That's what you'll be voting for in a few weeks. That's exactly it. This may be what you want, and that's fine.
Or, possibly, that's what you'll be voting against.
[ October 10, 2004, 04:09 PM: Message edited by: Chris Bridges ]
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quote: CStroman...but what about the NON-protestors that were rounded up with them??
That happens everywhere mobs gather and although not the best thing, happens everywhere in the world and is understandable (unless you are the person who made the decisions on whether to be there or not).
The police have the responsibility to STOP people from breaking the law and to apprehend those that do.
How do they know if those people broke the law or not as the rest did?
They don't, they arrest everyone who appears to be engaged in the illicit behavior and remove them so the threat of continued illicit behavior is not continued.
Everytime there is a mob of people and some nutjob decides to turn it "illegal" by his actions, the police have to GO IN and stop it and uphold the law.
I'm sure those apprehended who were innocent (if in fact they were because all we have is their testimony to go on) were brought before a judge, gave their case and released.
Where do you think "Wrong place, wrong time" comes into play?
Posts: 1533 | Registered: Sep 2004
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posted
"(think before you post attacks against other posters directly)"
Trust me, I did. You have a habit of posting things which are, to put this generously, factually inadequate. This will continue to plague you for as long as you do not take steps to avoid this behavior, since people will even ignore the valid arguments you might make in order to point out your obvious errors; it's a fact of human nature, I'm afraid.
You couple this with a tendency to speak in absolutes and generalities: "Democrats" instead of "some Democrats," or "none" instead of "few."
When these two tendencies are combined, it becomes very easy for someone to point out that your generalization is in fact in error. If this happens too often, it will begin to affect your reputation.
Ergo, I felt it appropriate to suggest to you -- as one of your defenders on this site, mind you -- that you pause to consider whether what you say is in fact something that anyone with a search engine can verify on their own before you say it, and that, if it is, that you verify it for yourself before writing checks that you cannot cash.
quote:Now everyone, please, let Chad speak. He's performing a valuable service for all Hatrackers in showing us exactly what Bush supporters want to see in a president. Think of him as Mini-Bush.
Unnecessarily inflammatory. You want me to paint all Kerrey supporters with Moore's brush?
That kind of post is exactly what I was talking about. Here you are saying that ALL Bush supporters MUST be like Chad--being very sarcastic throughout.
Doesn't anybody see that Bush haters use the same type of tactics? Does that mean you're all alike? Is the level of behavior from some Bush haters what we have to expect if Kerry is elected?
posted
I wasn't speaking of Bush's supporters. I was speaking of Mr. Bush. Some of the very attitudes and personal blindnesses I perceive in Mr. Bush are exemplified in CStroman's style of posting. Same overly general statements. Same habit of only going with the "proof" he favors. Same dismissal of counterclaims without evidence.
However, you are correct. I was unnecessarily inflammatory, and I apologize. CStroman, has, a couple of times to my knowledge, admitted to mistakes on his part, so the comparison isn't entirely accurate.
(edited to add: and of course in my first post I wrote "what Bush supporters want to see," which was indeed overgeneralizing on my part and well worth being called on. Please change that to "what we'll be voting for.")
[ October 10, 2004, 04:35 PM: Message edited by: Chris Bridges ]
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posted
I see my policy of ignoring political threads was sound. I'll try to apply it more successfully.
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Katarain - I don't hate Bush. Or CStroman, for that matter.
I strongly suspect Mr. Bush would be more fun to talk to. He loves his family and I believe he truly cares about the country and the direction it's going in.
It happens that I strongly disagree with many of the steps he has taken towards that direction, and it is extremely frustrating when the obvious (to me) dangers of those steps are not only dismissed by Mr. Bush and his administration -- at least those of his administration that have not resigned in protest -- but aren't even on their radar.
There are an awful lot of people who support Mr. Bush. Roughly half of them, in fact. Many if not most of them are intelligent people who like the way things are going (or at least appreciate the direction, if not all the methods). I would not care to lump them all together in any regard, as that would be a disservice to them all.
I admit that CStroman pushes the wrong buttons with me. His arguing style seems to match the exact same qualities that terrify me in our president. In a very real sense, arguing with him is like arguing with the President himself, and in a sloppy, sarcastic way that was the point I was trying to make.
[ October 10, 2004, 04:36 PM: Message edited by: Chris Bridges ]
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What is funny is that out of a total of 200 protesters there were 4 arrests. 4!
And then when you read the article and the people that were protesting...NONE of them were republicans it appears. No NRA, No Pro-Lifers, No Anti-Gay (I'm pretty sure there were 3 or 4 there by a photo I saw of the idiot "godhatesfags.com" people) but were anti-government, anarchists, anti-authority, anti-death penalty, anti-war, etc.
Well, at least our wackos (if there were any republican ones) were far outnumbered by the ones at the RNC.
I feel a little better. 1000+ arrests vs. 4.
Posts: 1533 | Registered: Sep 2004
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posted
"In a very real sense, arguing with him is like arguing with the President himself...."
Nah. Chad can use standard English when he needs to.
------
BTW, Chad, out of interest, what do you think Republicans would have to protest at the DNC? I submit for your approval the concept that protests are generally conducted against the party in power,. Posts: 37449 | Registered: May 1999
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posted
I wasn't actually talking about the RNC... I was talking about at actual Bush rallies. http://www.mikemalloy.com/board/viewtopic.php?t=12084 I have to find other sources. Sorry, Katarain if I might have been snarky in the other thread. It's just that this makes me so ANGRY... The more I read about Bush's policies, the angrier I get...
Posts: 9942 | Registered: Mar 2003
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i don't know why i'm doing this, but having just read the entire thread i simply cannot resist ripping into a few statements.
quote:And then when you read the article and the people that were protesting...NONE of them were republicans it appears
i haven't looked at all the pictures on that link, but i looked at about 10 screens of them and i didn't see anything indicating the people were democrats - not even a kerry poster.
quote:Well, at least our wackos (if there were any republican ones) were far outnumbered by the ones at the RNC.
it amazes me that your reaction to massive protests against the candidate you support is to conclude that democrats are wackos - never mind the fact that his actions over the past 4 years might have done something to piss people off.
quote:You see, when you are wearing a shirt that says "I hate Bush" or "I'm Gay and I hate Bush" and you take that protester and you put them in a cell with Drunken Bush Supporter "bubba" or the Gay Hating Gang member "Slash-T" what do you think will happen to them?
that's an interesting interpretation of due process, maybe we should just make a law that says if you're wearing inflammatory t-shirts at political functions you should get beat up without a trial or anything like that.
quote:The NON-Law breaking DNC protesters were confined to WORSE outside the DNC and they had broken NO laws. We're talking about cement barricades with Chain link fense around them.
of course they weren't being held against their will now were they? you could go freeze to death in antarctica and it would hardly be the fault of god for creating cold weather, you'd be the idiot who went there.
quote:I couldn't believe the level of hatred on parade at the RNC.
again, have you ever asked why this might be the case? i know it's easy to label people who act strangely as wackos but every once in awhile people's reactions have a cause. (and please dont straw man me with something about how people burning dragons can't be defended or whatever)
quote:That is what makes me sick. Their hatred. Their rage.
That's not me, nor representative of the feelings I wan't governing this country
...and again. you'd prefer to have someone governing the country who inspires that type of hatred, rather than exemplifies it?
quote:But then again, maybe some people here thinking blocking access to abortion clinics is totally legal and that none of them should be arrested as well, right?
what the heck are you talking about? when has anyone on this board ever said that? if you're going to construct parodies of your opponents viewpoints, at least give us the courtesy of not pinning them on US.
quote:I'm sick of Liberal censorship.
i take it you don't watch FOX very often...
argh. ok, it's out of my system (for now)
Posts: 380 | Registered: Mar 2003
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posted
Chad, if you have a minute, would you distinguish which pictures seem to demonstrate "hatred?" Because I'm not actually sure how to distinguish "hatred" from "contempt" or "loathing," and you have displayed both of the latter in your short time here.
Posts: 37449 | Registered: May 1999
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