posted
So I can't find another thread that specifically allows spoilers for those who have seen the movie, so I'm starting one.
I liked the movie overall, and agree with most of what was said in the other non-spoiler thread. I just have a question.
SPOILERS:
1. When Luke asks his sister if she remembers her mother in RotJ, and she says she only remembers her a little bit, and that she was sad, is she referring to Padme or her step-mom, because she obviously cannot remember Padme since she died during birth. But it seemed to make more sense that she was talking about her real mom, not her step-mom. Or did Princess Leia (sp?) just watch some videos of her mom as a child?
Or did Lucas just mess up on this detail?
2. Why wasn't Jar Jar given a bigger role? He was my most favoritest character in the whole Star Wars galaxy. Wait--actually my question is, why wasn't he killed?
Posts: 684 | Registered: Aug 2001
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posted
Now I remember my main beef with the movie...actually with the whole story.
Why do I feel like the Jedi never actually save the galaxy in the end? I know they win some fights here and there, but it is the dark side, Vader, that kills the emperor.
And I don't know if killing the emperor counts as redemption after killing innocent children and other who-knows-how-many people throughout the decades. Vader may have finally forsaken the dark side, but does he now get to go to Jedi heaven after all that he did?
Maybe I'm just too merciless. Posts: 684 | Registered: Aug 2001
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posted
1. Lucas probably just messed up. There are other little inconsistencies between the trilogies, but oh well. Every series of books, movies, or whatever has these little glitches
2. There was really no need to kill Jar Jar. It's just good that he doesn't speak at all. Even one line of his goofy dialogue would have been out of place in such a serious film.
No one ever said that the jedi would be the ones to destroy the Sith, the prophecy is that Anakin would, and he did. Whether or not that's enough to redeem him is simply a matter of opinion.
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posted
1. Lucas didn't mess up here. She had no idea that the parents who raised her weren't her biological parents. She's talking about her adopted mom.
Posts: 751 | Registered: Apr 2005
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posted
1. Make sense a Star Wars movie must not. Better if accept you will. edit: Or you could wait for the überspecial special edition where Leia's answer to Luke's question will be a resounding no.
2. Proof that even Lucas can listen to his fans sometimes.
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posted
About Vader, I agree. I don't see how refusing to murder your son, and then killing the man who you have sworn your alleigance to is redeeming.
Posts: 751 | Registered: Apr 2005
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quote:1. Lucas didn't mess up here. She had no idea that the parents who raised her weren't her biological parents. She's talking about her adopted mom.
Then why did Luke emphasize, "Your REAL mother"? She knew that she was adopted. Why else would she have accepted that Vader was her real father so quickly if she thought that she was raised by her real father?
posted
I wanted an explanation on why Yoda was stuck on Degaba. I thought they’d link the evil cave there to something he had to guard or protect.
Posts: 2845 | Registered: Oct 2003
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posted
Well, Porter, they don't actually say that Darth Vader was redeemed into Anakin Skywalker in RotJ-although the impression is so strong that it may as well have been fact.
In my own Star Wars head, Darth Vader refusing to murder his son and then finally killing Darth Sidious-as he wanted to decades ago-is just the first step on a very, very, very long road to redemption. Who knows what he's doing while he's wavery and blue?
Posts: 17164 | Registered: Jun 2001
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posted
I watched Episodes I and II in the weeks leading up to last nights release of Episode III. I plan to watch the original trillogy over the next week or two. I don't recall the Luke using the word real in that line where he asks Leia if she remembers her mother. I suppose I will find out for sure when I watch it again.
Remember that the first decisive step toward the dark side was when he chose to help the Chancellor against Mace Windu during their fight. Up to that point it had all been doing what he thought was right and following bad advice and his feelings. At that point he made a choice with full knowledge of it consequences to follow the teachings of the Sith. When Darth Vader chose to save his son and kill the Emperor he was making a consious choice to turn his back on the Sith and follow the teachings of the Jedi. Whether or not that moment was enough to redeem him there is a parallel between those moments. They are the pivot points of Anakin's journey with the force.
Posts: 148 | Registered: Mar 2005
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posted
But, when he came to Sidious' defense, he thought he was protecting an injured foe (pleading for his life) from a Jedi who had ceased to follow the code. He was arguing that Palpatine should stand trial, which seems very idealistiic, actually.
When he stops Mace from killing Palpatine and Palpatine blasts Mace (proving he was not as helpless as he seemed) Anakin immediately drops his saber and says "What have I done?"
Palpy: You just helped me kill one or the leaders of the Jedi Council. He was trying to take over the Senate, anyway. Better help me some more, 'cause if you go back to the Jedi and own up to it, your @$$ is grass.
1. The actor from Willow was in episode 1 because he plays Wicket the Ewok in Return of the Jedi. Which is why he got to play Willow(written/produced by lucas, maybe directed too)
2. I think because the emperor was old and weak and was trying to keep a whole battle in his mind at the same time, while sending a constant stream of lightning into Luke and wasn't prepared for Vader's turn.
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quote:Why do I feel like the Jedi never actually save the galaxy in the end? I know they win some fights here and there, but it is the dark side, Vader, that kills the emperor.
The Prophecy was of one to bring Ballance to the Force. I think this included wiping out the uber-dogmatic Jedi Knights, as well as the Sith. Basically, Anakin was a giant RESET button for Force-usage.
Posts: 2689 | Registered: Apr 2000
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posted
Did anyone else notice that Anakin killed Count Dooku after said he should have stood trial, and did so because Palpatine said he was too dangerous to stand trial.
Then later on when Mace is telling him they must kill Palpatine because he is too dangerous to stand trial, suddenly Anakin has an attack of morality and decides he MUST stand trial.
I know, I know, there are a dozen reasons why Anakin switches back and forth here. But it's a clear cut irony I hope everyone got to appreciate.
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quote:Did anyone else notice that Anakin killed Count Dooku after said he should have stood trial, and did so because Palpatine said he was too dangerous to stand trial.
Then later on when Mace is telling him they must kill Palpatine because he is too dangerous to stand trial, suddenly Anakin has an attack of morality and decides he MUST stand trial.
Yes I noticed that. This is why I felt that this action was the point where Anakin made a concious decision to follow the Sith instead of the Jedi way. Remember, he had been having visions that Padme and his childern would die. He couldn't tell the Jedi because then they would know that he had married Padme so he told his other mentor, Palpatine, who used the confusion and emotions of the situation to his own purposes. At the time he intervened he believed that if Palpatine died he would not be able to save Padme, which is ironic since his actions in betraying the Jedi and siding with Palpatine were what led to her dying.
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What I am wondering is, if obi-won knows leia is luke's sister now, why is he suprised in the original series.
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posted
Sorry Lyrhawn, I wasn't trying to come down on you. Earlier I had commented that when Anakin intervened on behalf of Palpatine, he had made his first concious decision to follow the Sith, and another poster came back saying that he was simply protecting an injured foe who should be given the chance of a trial. I was too busy to answer right away, but when I saw your post I saw an opportunity to use it in my response. I just wasn't clear in the way I did it. Sorry about any confusion or hurt feelings.
posted
See, I never saw Darth Vader killing the Emperor as bringing balance to the force.
Maybe I'm completely misinterpreting this. But I always thought Darth Vader balanced both sides of the force. When episode 4 begins their are only 4 people that we know that can use the force. Two on the dark side, and two on the light side. Whereas before, their was a big favor to the light side.
posted
And then after Jedi there was only 1 force user. So that's pretty balanced. So both places are balanced.
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posted
Yeah that's a good point. Unless Obi-Wan just assumed there wasn't time to train her, or that she might not have the Force with her.
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quote:In my own Star Wars head, Darth Vader refusing to murder his son and then finally killing Darth Sidious-as he wanted to decades ago-is just the first step on a very, very, very long road to redemption.
posted
Responding to the point about Obi-wan not knowing about Leia, we don't actually see/hear a reaction from Obi-wan when Yoda says "there is another", so how do you know he was surprised? Maybe he said that Luke was their only hope because he figured that there wouldn't be time to train Leia, and Yoda simply thought otherwise.
Posts: 1569 | Registered: Dec 2004
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posted
Who were the good guys in this movie? I mean Palpatine claimed they were going to take over the senate, and guess what they were going to do it! What a great group those Jedi are 1.You don't choose to be a Jedi. They take them from an extremely young age, before they can make the choice themselves and are pretty much brainwashed. 2. You're not allowed to have any personal attachments, you can't get married, you can't have feelings. 3. They "defend" democracy yet don't practice it. The Jedi concil alone picks it's members. 4. They have pretty much become enforcers of a corupt Republic.
The Jedi needed to be destroyed. They haven't adapted with the times, and are stuck in a dogmatic rut. I haven't read NJO but I'm pretty sure the New Jedi are what the Jedi should be.
Posts: 796 | Registered: Mar 2005
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posted
In the EU, the Jedi's primary fault lies in distancing themselves from everyone else. An 'Ivory Tower' syndrome, really, which is pretty darn accurate. To wit, not, you know, helping Anakin's mother out of slavery...
...or not doing something about entire systems on the Outer Rim which permitted things like sentient-being slavery.
Posts: 17164 | Registered: Jun 2001
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posted
Yoda's not ugly. He's funny looking and kind of cute. And even the ugly Jedi are noble looking, if nothing else. Turning to the Dark Side means getting deformed and scary looking. Not being non-human-esque to start with.
Posts: 17 | Registered: May 2005
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posted
Question...Was anyone else confused with the whole robot coughing thing? I didn't get the fact that he was part organic until,well, basically until his chest was pried open to expose the heart.
Posts: 3003 | Registered: Oct 2004
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posted
Anakin was pretty hot on his way to becoming evil... that whole scene with his shirt off...
Oh, sorry. Allow me to compose myself.
It's actually quite funny that the "Real mother" debate came up here. My roommate and I had the exact same conversation in the car on the way back last night after the midnight show. She argued that Leia didn't remember her adopted mother, I argued for the continuity error. And since I've got that scene Jedi in right now, I can officially say that Luke does stress the word "real."
In today's movie discussion with my roommate, we came up with a few things; not really problems, just observations.
1. Natalie Portman was extremely miscast. The material with which she had to work didn't help matters much, but her presence as a Queen and then Senator was not strong enough - not nearly the commanding presence nor the voice for the role. And when she finally broke in Sith, it didn't seem like that much. Seeing a stronger actress' character break would have been more heart-rending, especially with the "You're breaking my heart" line.
2. Anakin killing the Younglings was disgusting, necessary, and therefore awesome.
3. Obi-Wan never got laid. And if I'd been in a galaxy far, far away a long time ago, I could have helped out with that.
4. Frankenstein had no place in Sith.
5. The execution of the Jedi by the clones was masterfully done. It went quickly enough that it felt simultaneous, but dwelled enough to get the sense of tragedy across. Also, Yoda climbing up Chewbacca was a nice touch. For all Yoda's great Force abilities, he's just a short little green guy who can't run with the Wookiees.
6. It's nice to finally know how to pronounce "Kashyyyk."
Posts: 3932 | Registered: Sep 1999
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Yeah, I was *really* bothered by that. Later, I figured, OK maybe he's a cyborg. But I've since been informed that he is *not* a cyborg, he is a free-thinking droid with organic parts.
So now I'm annoyed again.
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With all the advanced technology at their disposal, wouldn't Padme have KNOWN she was carrying twins?
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The way it happens in the book, he was originally a human being who was mortally wounded, but not quite, and so was transformed. Just like Anakin, actually.
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posted
Carrie: remember she didn't talk to a lot of people about the babies, and towards the end she and Anakin grew further and further apart, so the viewer never got the chance to learn.
I wish Greivous was as cool as he was in the Clone Wars cartoon. There he was a borderline unstoppable monster.
And if you want to know why he's wheezing and why his heart is just out there, it's because Mace Windu crushed his chestplate with the slightest glance.
posted
I'll have to see the movie again, but I could swear that every time she mentioned her pregnancy, she spoke in the singular. Not a huge problem, just one I noticed a couple times.
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