"Where is the proof that straight-toothed = healthy?"
Good question, Dag. Price noted a marked difference in skull thickness between skulls from poorly-fed people (with crooked teeth) and the skulls of their more well-fed (straight-toothed) ancestors.
The more crooked the teeth, the thinner the skull.
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TBI, or post-concussion syndrome, is (I would guess) less likely with a thicker skull, all things being equal. I'm just guessing here, but I would perhaps guess that the recovery rate from all head injuries would be better with a thicker skull.
I've been in more than 1 car accident in my life. Anybody know anyone with long-lasting problems from head injuries? I can name at least two that I have known.
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quote:TBI, or post-concussion syndrome, is (I would guess) less likely with a thicker skull, all things being equal. I'm just guessing here, but I would perhaps guess that the recovery rate from all head injuries would be better with a thicker skull.
I don't think so. Seems like brittleness of the bone and -- most especially -- quality of the cushioning fluid would both be more important that merely the measurement of the thickness of the skull plates. That thickness may well not vary enough to be clinically significant in the populations you address.
Disorders like craniosynostosis can cause thicker-than-typical skull plates. Physiological extremes like this tend not to be a positive finding.
Edited to add: And surely one would not equate general health merely with ability to recover from a TBI. If one were to (mistakenly) focus on merely one factor to address health, I'd think cardiovascular health would be more central to the issue of general health.
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The picture in the book shows the ancestor's skull being about twice as thick. Never mind TBI, what about a skull-cracking situation? People get their skulls broken in car accidents.
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Yeah, but really, how many people get their heads cracked seriously over the course of their lives? And, for that matter, that still doesn't answer the question of "why is that more "healthy"?
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Again, whether or not they could run fast and perfuse their vital organs seems much more central to the pressures faced by these native tribemen.
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mentions the unusual recovery abilities of Native Americans on their traditional diet. It's not just a thicker skull that's at issue here. There are plenty of anecdotal cases in Price's work that talk about how people healed from cavities, diabetes, and scores of other diseases when they went back to their traditional diets.
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steven, the skull is terrifically sturdy. It requires quite a high impact to break it. For example, a fall from a bunk bed onto a wood or carpeted floor will not crack a child's skull.
It is very, very difficult to crack a skull, even if you are trying to. However, there are shear or rotational forces that can damage the brain tissue without harming the skull (e.g., diffuse axonal injury). This is a much more common cause of TBI than skull fracture.
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quote:Originally posted by steven: www.westonaprice.org/traditional_diets/native_americans.html mentions the unusual recovery abilities of Native Americans on their traditional diet. It's not just a thicker skull that's at issue here. There are plenty of anecdotal cases in Price's work that talk about how people healed from cavities, diabetes, and scores of other diseases when they went back to their traditional diets.
Regarding the regression in diabetes upon return to a more traditional diet, my understanding is that this is thought by physicians specializing in this area to be secondary to issues of change in glycemic loading, not trace minerals.
Why should I accept Price's noted correlation as a causation, even were I to buy that such a correlation exists? A better argument for a different factor (glycemic load) can and has been made, and a more convincing mechanism has been posed.
---------------------------------------------------------- Edited to add: steven, I admire your passion. I just don't think the information Price presents is convincing at all.
Had you thought about specializing in information on something you could be an expert on? Medical information is tricky, and there are many physicians, nurses, and other health care professionals here. It makes for a tough audience.
In contrast, you could become the Hatrack expert on the piccolo, or the collection of fishing net weights, or on a particular esoteric language, or the history of the Spanish-American war.
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Price's theories had nothing to do with trace minerals. He literally didn't mention them at all.
Trace minerals were not well-understood in 1939. I'm not sure that the techniques even existed to test for them.
Price thought it was the fat-soluble vitamins and the macro-minerals, mainly magnesium, that did the main work.
It's my assertion that trace minerals, mainly microcluster rhodium and iridium, are the seed factors that set the life process going. It's a big leap to say that, I realize.
I only say it because of three things:
1. White powder/microcluster rhodium and iridium are the two elements left when everything else has been removed from brain matter. My understanding is that they are the only two microcluster elements present in brain tissue.
2. The ancient alchemists were making compounds that assay as microcluster minerals, mainly rhodium, iridium, and gold. They claimed that the conpounds they made lengthened life and improved health.
3. Brain-to-body size ratio is the best indicator of aging in mammals.
All three of those things together say to me that the most important component of food is the microcluster rhodium and iridium, followed by other trace minerals.
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quote:Originally posted by steven: 1. White powder/microcluster rhodium and iridium are the two elements left when everything else has been removed from brain matter.
I love a good tautology.
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So far, steven, you've neglected to answer my question. Would you like me to explain the scientific method to you over E-mail?
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quote:Originally posted by steven: I only say it because of three things:
1. White powder/microcluster rhodium and iridium are the two elements left when everything else has been removed from brain matter.
This is true of anything in the brain. For example, take away everything else but water, and only water is left behind. That is sort of like a tautology, and it doesn't establish anything.
quote:My understanding is that they are the only two microcluster elements present in brain tissue.
Why do you accept this claim, in particular? On what convincing documentation do you base your belief that these are "the only two microcluster elements present in brain tissue?"
quote:2. The ancient alchemists were making compounds that assay as microcluster minerals, mainly rhodium, iridium, and gold. They claimed that the conpounds they made lengthened life and improved health.
And why do you accept this claim, in particular? On what convincing documentation do you base your belief that "the ancient alchemists were making compounds that assay as microcluster minerals, mainly rhodium, iridium, and gold?"
quote:Brain-to-body size ratio is the best indicator of aging in mammals.
What reason do you have to believe this? (Honest question.)
quote:All three of those things together say to me that the most important component of food is the microcluster rhodium and iridium, followed by other trace minerals.
I don't see the link. The steps of this reasoning are not obvious, even if one were to accept the premises.
steven, I have no desire to harry you here. I want you to enjoy Hatrack, and I think you have been very passionate and respectful in trying to discuss this. (That is so cool.)
I just don't think claims about truths of medical matters are going to be a pleasant way to spend your time here. The audience is too tough, and the consequences of disseminating misinformation can be too dire -- thus, people will push you when you say something that they believe is wrong and harmful.
Do you have other interests, other areas of expertise? Anything besides medical matters (raw foods, shellfish and organ tissue, etc) tickle your fancy? History, music, other arts, sports, literature?
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quote:Originally posted by Dagonee: Mine was worded better.
It's true. I just fired off the first thing that came to mind, while you took the time to lovingly and artfully craft a more meaningful post.
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Me too CT, I laughed so hard when I read this:
quote: In contrast, you could become the Hatrack expert on the piccolo, or the collection of fishing net weights, or on a particular esoteric language, or the history of the Spanish-American war.
Must have been my poor American diet at fault. Posts: 15082 | Registered: Jul 2001
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quote:Originally posted by Tante Shvester: They eat lots of Jiffy Pop Popcorn. Pops up light and fluffy every time. Jiffy Pop!
You'll be happy to know that I heard that in . . . um . . . what's-his-name's voice. You know, the guy who always wore the outrageous suits (may he rest in peace).
posted
That's the name that came to mind, but for some reason it didn't sound right, and I was feeling too lazy to look it up.
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Jon Boy, don't commnet on my girly screenname and I wonn't talk about how strange Jon Boy from the Waltons really was.....
Not as strange as you are, but really really close...
((I WAS gong to edit to correct a typo...tehn I realized I was psoting to Jon Boy so it was pretty funny as it was. ))
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I sense a great calm has descended over the Hatrack multiverse.
steven,
CT has been sharing true wisdom with you, in a way that I couldn't achieve. I hope you take her words to heart, especially the ones about logically linking disparate facts (and possible facts). Your post above where you list your reasons behind believing in the value of microclusters is a prime example of how you aren't connecting the dots for us. What has brain to body-size ratio got to do with aging, let alone with micro-clusters of iridium?
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quote:In contrast, you could become the Hatrack expert on the piccolo,
No fair. I should be the Hatrack expert on the piccolo. I've seen the piccolo, I've played the piccolo, and you, steven, are no piccolo expert.
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Tante... yep. I'm just preparing for the next "One more time about Dr. Price" thread.
What I really want to know is how quantum effects and emergent properties affect teeth straitness and skull density. I believe it has something to do with teleportation and small wind instruments. I think this because:
1) Microclusters told me so.
2) My aunt has one side of her body that will not grow hair.
3) Trace minerals built Stonehenge.
Are we all on the same page here?
I know Bob finally agrees with me.
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Bob, it's a beautiful riding day. Why don't you let this go and take Dana out for a spin before dinner?
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We stopped at the Old Market for Mongolian Barbeque on the way home from the airport. So it is definitely after dinner. Yummy!
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OK, Bob, let's talk about the brain-to-body size thing first.
I am referring only to mammals here.
Examples:
1. Little dogs are the longest-lived dogs. I am not citing this as a stand-alone, because they usually have a different lifestyle than bigger dogs.
2. A comparison between a large-brained mammal of a certain body size, and a small-brained mammal of a certain body size, will, so far as I know, pretty much always show that the longer-lived one is the one with the bigger brain size. a good comparison might be a 130-lb. male chimpanzee (maybe 60-70 years, or a little more), and a 130 lb. dog (maybe 20 years, with the record-holder being about 35 years).
3. Again, so far as I know, mammals generally will die of aging (on their natural diet) at about 10-12 times the age of natural puberty. Cows hit puberty at about age 2, and rarely last beyond age 25. Humans are somewhat of an exception, but I think that's mainly an issue of diet, stress, lifestyle, etc.
In other words, it's much more an issue of brain-to-body size than anything else, like metabolic rate, etc.
As far as the microcluster stuff, well, I got some of that from David Hudson's work. He rendered down some cow and pig brains using methods from gold mining (sulfuric and nitric acid), and the only microcluster elements he found were rhodium and iridium. He, and others, have also repeatedly stated that rhodium and iridium are the most important of the microcluster elements for health.
There are a number of experiments going on with using microcluster elements to cure cancer and other diseases. Chris Barnard is on the staff at www.platinummetalsreview.com and is involved in this research somehow, according to the Platinum Metals Review website. There's a regular section in that journal about curing cancer with microcluster platinum compounds.
The way I see it is, microclusters are so important because they act so well as catalysts in chemical reactions. They have the most surface area per mass of any substance, and surface area is very important when you are talking about catalysts. Biological processes proceed more smoothly in their presence.
One of the best sources of microcluster elements is unrefined sea salt. The animals that are the most filled with microcluster elements (the same microcluster elements that the alchemists make) are also the animals most prized by tribes on every continent for health, namely, fish and especially shellfish.
King Solomon used to make his gold from Dead Sea Salt. That's in one of Laurence Gardner's books.
I don't know exactly where we are with Price's stuff, but there's plenty more research I can talk about in his book. He has some graphs that show the rate of birth defects, mortality, etc. in different areas of the country. Back in the 20's and 30's, people ate mostly local food. He shows that the areas with the poorest soil have the most birth defects and highest mortality. The South has always had the poorest soil, and of course, the highest rates of mental retardation.
Price shows how the rates of birth defects are totally related to diet and soil fertility. He particularly notes that women on a rich diet have healthy children no matter whether they have their children in their teens, 20's, 30's, or 40's, unlike today's American women, who have higher and higher risks of birth defects after age 35.
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rivka, the Chinese of 200 B.C. were using the exact same alchemical formulas as the middle easterners and hindus of the same time. If it's ALL B.S., ( and some alchemy is), how were they getting them across the Himalaya? The Silk Road didn't open until several centuries later. Besides, it's not that hard to reproduce most of these methods. They do, in my understanding, produce microclusters.
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Yes, and I keep trying to figure out why people keep posting in this thread . . . and now I've done so as well.
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Like a sore in your mouth, you just can't keep from exploring it with your tongue, even though you know that if you just left it alone and ate some nice microclusters, it would soon go away.
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