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» Hatrack River Forum » Active Forums » Books, Films, Food and Culture » I doubt this will come as a surprise to anyone (A Landmark) (Page 1)

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Author Topic: I doubt this will come as a surprise to anyone (A Landmark)
The Pixiest
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Well, after 4 years and 3000 posts, this is my first landmark.

First off I'd like to ask PapaMoose not to put this in the landmark section. What I'm going to say isn't so personal that I don't mind sharing it with a few thousand people I've never met, but it IS personal enough that I don't want to find it on a google search of my name in 2020.

I'm not sure how much of a surprise this is going to be to anyone as I've dropped hints for pretty much my entire time here and have outright told some people. Depending on how good the rumor mill is, it's likely that everyone already knows.

I am bisexual.

Aside from work and people I know from work, I am not in the closet at all. Most people know the first time something gay related comes up in conversation.

However, when I first came to Hatrack we were in the throws of dozens of gay threads. Many of these were vocal. And there was much anti-gay sentement flying around. I confessed to David Bowles my very first day in Parachat "I'm not sure this is the place for me." To further add to my lack of confidence, I had just come from a forum where I had been openly bashed for being Bi.

But these are all just excuses. I realized long ago that for the most part Jatraqueros are not homophobic people. There are many other LBG people around here and I could come out at any time. But the problem with being in the closet is you're always putting off coming out.

I have put it off no longer.

So on with the story...

Most bisexuals that I have met either always knew they were bi or started under the misconception they were straight and later discovered they were bi. I came to my bisexuality from the other direction.

In 1990 I was coming off the worst break up of my life. The woman I had been seeing had crushed my heart in ways I won't go into and I had retaliated by being clingy and hurtful and destroying any chance of maintaining a friendship with her.

In this time of paralyzing depression I met a guy on the net. He listened to me as I poured out my woes and comforted me as well as he could on the net. He started calling me on the phone and would talk to me late into the night. As the months went on, he told me he loved me.

Well, of course I couldn't love him back being a lesbian and all but as time went on I realized that more and more, yes I was starting to care about him too. Maybe not love but certainly more than friendship.

We decided to meet in a midwestern city that was more or less half way between us.

We spent a week together, touring the town and touring eachother. I was a 21 yr old virgin (with men anyway) and it was all new territory for me. Men weren't near as icky as I thought they were.

Then we went home.

That's when I started feeling weird. I'd been with a guy. I was a lesbian and I'd been with a guy. I felt slutty and unclean... and slightly nauseous.

The next time I talked to him I broke it off. He cried and I felt even worse.

...

By the time I realized what a horrible mistake I had made... When I had adjusted my self image to include this new peice of my idenitity, it was all too late. He had moved on to someone else. I didn't deserve him anyway.

Last I heard he was married.

TC, I hope you're happy wherever you are.

Pix

(edit: grammar)

[ August 18, 2005, 10:32 PM: Message edited by: The Pixiest ]

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beverly
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Hi, Pixiest [Wave]

Sometimes I feel like bisexuals don't get much notice, attention or understanding, what with the focus on homosexuals. I'm glad you feel comfortable sharing this part of your life with us. [Smile]

It is so hard when people pass like ships in the night, when there could have been something magnificent, but the time just wasn't right. You always wonder "what if".

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Storm Saxon
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I'm happy you feel comfortable enough around us to be yourself. I'm glad you're here. [Smile]
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Jim-Me
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I must say that you are one of the jatraqueros that really gets on my nerves the most, but that's probably a good thing. I like to be challenged and have nothing but respect for people who can be unabashedly themselves. Thanks for sharing and for being a part of this forum. [Smile]
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mothertree
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Due to Pat's abuse of your name, I'm never quite sure who you are. If you don't mind fielding questions, at what age did you realize you were interested in girls/not interested in boys? I was always boy crazy but did get a hot crush on a girl one time. I also have random sexual thoughts a lot of the time with my OCD but I don't let it bother me anymore, and it no longer distresses me.

Sorry if this sparkes a debate, but:
quote:
Those who are straight have much bigger things but they are just farther back in the closet and usually don't get discovered or brought out at all.

Does this not apply to the exclusively homosexual as well?
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The Pixiest
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Thanks everyone. I should have done this long ago.

Bev: In the end it worked out for the best. I'm with a wonderful man now. It just took me 10 more years to find him.

Jim: I've been trying to avoid political threads for just that reason. I get too fired up. and I know it's annoying.

Brett: I'm not playing Fantasy Football because I've been in my brother's league for years now. When I played in the hatrack league, I found I had too much of a conflict of interest. (ie: My quarterback for one team is my opponents quarterback for my other team.)

Pix

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The Pixiest
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mothertree: 4 years old. The little girl across the street and I used to play "getting married".

But knowing is not accepting and I went through years of vasselating. Trying to convence myself it was normal to think of girls like that at such a young age and that eventually I'd like guys. Of course the fact that I was desperately in love with a close female friend didn't help.

Pix

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jeniwren
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Hunh. I'm not really surprised, but I certainly didn't guess.

Pix, there are times when I've disagreed with you vehemently, and times when I've agreed with just as much passion, and more than anything, I've always enjoyed your presence here. I enjoy who you are because you do it very well.

Excellent landmark. I'm glad you wrote it.

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Dan_raven
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This is a wonderful landmark. However, there is one segment of your time here that your post doesn't get into. How can someone with such a fluffy name get so obstinate and viscious in her political debates?

I'm not complaining. I find it amusing to be scolded by a pixie. And you do it so well.

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Kayla
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Geez Pix, now you can't complain about OSC's obsession with getting gay people into straight relationships in all of his books. [Wink]

I'm glad you're happy though. [Smile]

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ElJay
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[Smile]

Happy landmark.

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Sopwith
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Keep on rolling on the path your life takes, Pix, just don't worry about the roadsigns other folks put up along the way. It's your journey.

I'm glad we get to share a wee bit of it now and then.

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Jim-Me
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quote:
Originally posted by The Pixiest:
Jim: I've been trying to avoid political threads for just that reason. I get too fired up. and I know it's annoying.

Oh it's not you getting fired up that annoys me, it's the way you manage to fire me up (something bev said in another thread about being able to dish it out but not take it, perhaps [Smile] ).

Also I find myself politically in line with you on many occasions... it's the philosophical/religious threads where you tweak my nose.

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Space Opera
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(((Pix)))

I'm glad you felt comfortable enough with all of us to share this part of yourself. Thank you for placing such friendship and trust in all of us who are a part of Hatrack.

space opera

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quidscribis
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I didn't know, I didn't guess. But then, I'm pretty much oblivious until, and even a lot of times after, someone hits me over the head with something. [Dont Know]

Having said that, I'm glad you feel comfortable enough sharing it with us, and I'm also glad you're here. [Kiss] May you have another 3000 posts. [Smile]

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TomDavidson
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I feel like I've known forever. I mean, you've basically said as much in a number of threads, right, especially ones on gay rights?
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Belle
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I must be totally out of the rumour mill because I didn't know and didn't guess.

I understand it's a big deal for you to come out and say this, and I'm glad you did it. [Smile]

Happy 3000!

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Bob_Scopatz
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So...I'm more curious how you came to your opinions on Israel.

[Wink]

Anyway, thanks for a nice landmark.

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Tante Shvester
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How cool for you, Pixiest. I'm glad that you feel OK about being out. And if anyone tries to dis you because of who you are, I'll defend you as fast as my clicker can click "Add Reply".
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Treason
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As long as you know you're not alone here in Hatrack in being bi-sexual. I never thought of trying to hide it...It's funny, I have been "bashed" for being bi (by straight and gay people) so you'd think I would be a bit more shy about it but my personality is always "out there". I am one of those people, I open my mouth and everything comes out.
So HUGS to you! And plenty of people here understand and support you!

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The Pixiest
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Jeni! I feel the same way about you! Sometimes I want to bite your head off and sometimes I want to hug you! But I've always been happy you're here =)

Dan: In the old days it was concidered impolite to discuss politics. If we never talked politics on Hatrack you'd probably never know anything but the fluffy me. But after ripping someone's opinions and having them rip yours, it's kinda hard to turn around and shoot at them with the Magic Cookie Gun(tm) (I'll try to be more fluffy!)

Kayla: I can complain all I want. It just won't do any good. =) 'sides, as I said the landmark, I'm the exception. Most Bis (that I know) come to their bisexuality from the straight side of the street.

Jim: That's the thing. I have opinions on both sides of the political spectrum so no matter what I say SOMEONE doesn't like it. The person I'm gnawing on in one thread is the person I'm salivating in agreement with in another.

Tom: I never outright said it, but good job on reading between the lines =)

Bob: No Politics at the Landmark Party =P =)

Tante: I think I'm pretty safe on Hatrack these days!

Treason: **gives you the secret handshake**

And thank you everyone who liked my landmark! (God I was so nervous about this I just want to hug you all!)

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Bob_Scopatz
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Actually, I've always been kind of curious about bisexuality, but not in the way usually meant by the term "bi-curious."

What I wonder about is something I don't really worry about with people who feel they are exclusively heterosexual or homosexual. But with someone who is bisexual, I do wonder if the possibility of long-term exclusive relationships (life long) exists? Or, does bisexuality mean, by definition, that you will have more than one sexual relationship going at a time...

I think most people practice a kind of serial monogamy. One partner at a time, whether inside of marriage or not.

But if one is attracted to both sexes, I could see where there'd be a more or less "organic" disatisfaction with any exclusive relationship.

On the other hand, I figure people are people, and if a bisexual person is in love, they're in love and not necessarily looking for another partner, regardless of them perhaps not fulfilling a part of their sexual drive.

I really don't know anything about it. I hope you don't mind my curiousity. It's not like you (an n of 1) could answer for all bisexual people everywhere anyway.

But do you think serial monogamy is the norm within the bisexual "community" as much as it is for the general run of people?

If you don't want to respond, that's okay. I hope you don't think I'm being too nosy.

Thanks!

Bob

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dabbler
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I also pretty much figured, but I'm glad you feel comfortable enough to tell us. *hug*

Hatrack is that much a better place that you can share this with us.

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dabbler
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Bob - I'll start a thread on sake about that, I think, but here I'll give you my brief impression (I don't want to sideline the thread):

Actually, most of the bisexual women I know have at one point or another, been involved in a multiple-partners mix of either girl and two men, or girl and one man and one woman. Currently all four of them are actually with a single man each at the moment... quirk of all quirks. In my case, I flirt pretty heavily with a couple female friends of mine (who are lesbian or bi) and this is accepted by my boyfriend as fine. However, I don't flirt with any men (nor am I particularly attracted to any men besides him) nor do I cross any boundaries between me and a girl. I think I'll always be free to cuddle with a girl but that's it. And that's okay with me.

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The Pixiest
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Bob... This really is a topic for another landmark... but I'll give the expurgated version.

As nice as it would be to not have to give up one sex or the other for a commited relationship, polyamory is not for me. I tried it. I'm no good at it. I have nothing but respect for those who *can* make it work.

I'll just have to be happy enough with my hubby that I don't miss women. (and I am =)

Some bisexuals see sex as nothing more important than hair colour. regardless of who the end up with, man or woman, it's no different than a non-bisexual ending up with a brunette vs a redhead.

I'm not in that camp. The differences between men and women are significant and both are beautiful and exciting in different ways.

I think, though, while many bisexuals experiment in polyamory, eventually most of them end up monogomous. It's just too hard to make poly work. You can't spread your time that thin without jealousy raising it's ugly head. But then I can only speak for a small segment of 20something bisexuals in the south bay 5-10 years ago.

... And that's the short version...

Pix

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Treason
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Bob- I don't know about Pixie but for me, if I love someone I am with them. I have been with my boyfriend for 4 years now and not looking for anyone else. Sure, I look at women with desire sometimes, but no more than I look at other men! I just don't want anyone else but him. Just like there are many different people to tempt you in a relationship, there are people to tempt me. It's the same.
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beverly
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Cool. And interesting. [Smile]
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Bob_Scopatz
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Thanks dabbler!

Thanks pixiest!

I appreciate the info and the candor.

People is people...I like that.

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Treason
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I totally agree with Pix. I tried being a married couples "girlfriend" and boy oh boy! That was difficult! I do love women but my boyfriend is enough for me.
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Bob_Scopatz
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Hmm...

Do you think most bisexual women end up in committed relationships with men eventually?

Or...

is there just a spectrum from almost exclusively with same sex to almost exclusively with the opposite sex?

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The Pixiest
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A> Yes. There are just so many many many straight men compared to bisexual/lesbian women. And, while there is a stigma against bisexual women in the lesbian community, straight guys tend to like bi women.

Further legal recognition gives heterosexual couples a feeling of stablity. "He can't leave me without going to court." Without that, doubt can grow and shake even the most stable of lesbian couples. (but let's not turn this into a gay marriage thread. please?)

B> Yes, there is a spectrum. Yet, while I'm on the "female prefered" side of the spectrum I still ended up with a man. Yet my friend <name omitted> ended up with a woman. (I understand they're married but I don't know if it's a legal (ie: VT or MA) one or not.)

Pix

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Bob_Scopatz
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Thanks...

And sorry if I was derailing your thread. I didn't mean to draw attention away from your landmark.

Sorry... I didn't even think about that.

<insert sheepish grin here>

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The Pixiest
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It was on topic, Bob =)
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Treason
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I'll just say, it's a heck of a lot easier on me ending up with a man. And I know a lot more straight men then I know lesbians or bisexual women. I do prefer men though, so it's not so strange I should end up with one.

Hey Pixiest, is it ok to talk about this stuff? I really don't want to take away from your thread, same as Bob.

Edit to say: maybe we should start a thread just for people who are curious about bisexuality...or would that be weird?

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Tante Shvester
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A bi-curious thread? That WOULD be weird.
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The Pixiest
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It's all on topic Treason. I'm sure you've answered all these same questions a buncha times too =)

(That's not to say the rest of you shouldn't ask questions. I put myself on this soapbox. Ask away!)

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Verily the Younger
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I tend to agree with Tycho from Penny Arcade, who said that bisexuality is not a sexual preference; "Indeed", he said, "it is the absence of a preference."

Therefore I don't consider it at all unusual that a bisexual person would eventually end up in a lifelong monogamous relationship. I just assume that bisexuals, like most of the rest of us, would eventually like to settle down with one person. They're just less picky about what sex that person is.

I don't see any reason why a bisexual in such a happy and committed relationship would suddenly feel an uncontrollable urge to go be with someone of the other sex so they can fulfull their bisexualness. Monogamy is monogamy. A straight man, by definition, prefers to be with women, but that doesn't mean that a married man is going to suddenly feel an uncontrollable urge to go be with another woman so he can fulfill his straightness.

Okay, so some men, and women, do feel those urges, and I'm sure those urges occur regardless of orientation. But for most of us, I think, monogamy means monogamy.

Of course, I say all this as a heterosexual male who will (most likely) never know what it's like to actually be bi- or homosexual. So it's pure speculation on my part, but I'm not one for easily swallowing the idea that other people are inherently "not like us" in some way or another. *shrug*

[ August 19, 2005, 01:02 AM: Message edited by: Verily the Younger ]

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dabbler
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A bit to defend my interest in remaining flirty with my female friends... I agree with Pixiest when she said that men and women are different in exciting ways. Being a little cuddly with some of my female friends really celebrates in that in a way that is still comfortable for all parties.
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kojabu
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Ee! I love coming out stories! And I feel like we should talk at some point because we have quite a bit in common. Like, same age and everything. Whoa man.
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Shigosei
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Pixiest, I'm glad you now feel comfortable enough here to share these things. Your perspective is really interesting, particularly because the bisexual people seem to get lost in all the debating that's going on between straights and gays.
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ClaudiaTherese
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Hey, Pixiest! Colour me clueless. *grin

Nice landmark. Glad you are here and absolutely delighted that this isn't "hanging over your head" here anymore. You should feel comfortable in this place, as you are a good part of it.

[Kiss]

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Beren One Hand
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"when I first came to Hatrack we were in the throws of dozens of gay threads"

Glad to see things haven't changed at all on Hatrack. [Smile]

Thank you for sharing your story with us.

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Jim-Me
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quote:
Originally posted by The Pixiest:
God I was so nervous about this I just want to hug you all!

I bet you do... [Wink]

sorry... couldn't resist! [Evil]

Edit: and count me in as someone who is fascinated by all this. Thanks again for sharing so much!

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Olivet
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Pixiest, dear, I thought you were prettymuch out already. I read the title of the thread and thought, "Oh, so she's going to make it official." [Wink]

I love ya, dearie, and I missed you during your long absences (and was always glad to see you back).

I have also banned myself from political threads. I just don't like how they make me feel.

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Tammy
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[Kiss] I'm glad you wrote about this. I'm proud of you! You spice up the place.

*wallows happily in the diversity of Hatrack*

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CStroman
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To me it doesn't matter if you are gay, straight or bi. It doesn't affect the way I look at you as a person.

You are you after all you say and do.
[Wink]

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mothertree
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Bob-
For me, being monogamous was a higher value for me than exploring my sexuality. I think it's that simple for me. It's like whether being a good parent is more important than staying with a spouse through tough times. You see many examples of either prioritization in society. I think all people value the same things, but they have different priorities to their values. I mean, do I really get to call myself a bisexual if it's not important enough to me to put first in my life?

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Stray
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Put me in the "didn't have a clue" category, and I'll echo others' sentiments about being comfortable enough here to trust us with it.

When I first came to Hatrack I felt acutely uncomfortable whenever the discussion turned to sex & relationships, since I was in the closet about being a practicing polyamorist (two male partners, one female--and I'm straight. Go figure). But I've mentioned in in a couple different threads now, and no one freaked--such a relief! [Smile] Hatrack really is an awesome place, it never fails to surprise me.

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The Pixiest
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kojabu: Coming out stories are the "where were you when kennedy was shot" conversation of all LBGs =) I love em too. Send me an email sometime at pixiest@yahoo.com!

Shig: Our issues are pretty much the same as other gay issues. We have coming out issues, legal issues, acceptance issues. We're not allies of the gay community, we're part of it.

Baren: Belive it or else, it's calmed down a LOT.

Jim: Not that way =P

Olivet: That was the response I expected from most people. I guess I've just been away too much! But it's people like you who keep bringing me back!

Mothertree: I'm monogomously married. I will likely never be with a woman again. But I'm still bi. If something happened to my husband and I survived the grief, I don't know which sex my next partner would be. But my hubby is still first in my life. You can call yourself bi if you like. It's a very broad term.

Stray: It's good to see a poly person. I know how hard it is and I'm glad you're making it work!

Pix

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Jonathan Howard
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1990... Where was I then? Oh, right, a newborn.
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