posted
Funny. I last read this thread when it was on page two, then left the drama alone for the rest of the day. Just now I wondered how people could still be talking about this, and jumped right to page 5 without reading the middle.
posted
I have difficulty understanding how famous people, OSC included, deal with all the criticism that inevitably comes from being in the spotlight. It's pretty easy for Tom or myself or anyone else to criticize someone like OSC without really considering the possibility that it would really bother him - but I guess in this case, it did. And I'm guessing it wasn't just the thread in question - I'm guessing it's the countless times OSC gets attacked for his articles and viewpoints and projects and new books and so on and so forth. I certainly see why he'd be pretty mad.
But there is a problem with Mr. Card complaining about this, because you need to be willing to take what you dish out, or else stop dishing out what you wouldn't want to take. OSC writes articles in published papers and "reviews everything" on his website, and in doing so severely criticizes a whole array of people, even in areas that he is not really an expert. Yes, OSC may view an insult to his works as akin to insulting his child, but it's truly that many people will be equally insulted when you attack their political views, or attack their religious views, or attack their movies, books, products, and everything else. I'm willing to bet Tom does not appreciate Mr. Card's constant and blatant mischaracterizations of liberals in his articles. I'd be willing to bet a great many people would be hurt by OSC's writings - and are hurt to some degree everyday by similar criticisms by all sorts of people. When you criticize people like that, often unfairly, you are going to be criticized back.
When OSC criticizes Star Wars, is he out to destroy George Lucas? No - he's just out to offer his judgement. Similarly, when Tom criticizes OSC, there is no reason to believe he's out to destroy OSC. Every few months somebody gets called a troll or the equivalent, but the truth is that people who cause trouble rarely do so intentionally - they do so because they have something to say, and don't expect trouble from it, or feel it needs to be said nonetheless. Why do we have to insist they are monsters? They neither hate nor are out to destroy you.
Tom probably went too far in some of his criticism, but OSC has too, if not further. I'm not sure where the limit should be, as far as criticism goes - but there is a limit somewhere. At some point it becomes harmful.
So, yeah... I see where OSC is coming from and I can definitely see why this stuff would frustrate him, but I can't say Tom did anything out of the ordinary or exceptionally mean. If there's a problem it's that we, in general and including OSC, criticize people too severely - whether that be OSC, Jatraqueros, famous people, or even strangers.
Posts: 8120 | Registered: Jul 2000
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posted
The irony for me is that OSC himself has done more to make me uninterested in his ezine than anything Tom could ever say. I think OSC's posts in this thread pretty much solidify what feelings were forming in me over recent years about our gracious host.
Posts: 4753 | Registered: May 2002
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quote:Originally posted by Enigmatic: Funny. I last read this thread when it was on page two, then left the drama alone for the rest of the day. Just now I wondered how people could still be talking about this, and jumped right to page 5 without reading the middle.
Imagine my surprise.
--Enigmatic
LOL
I just did the exact same thing...buy I must have had a confused look on my face for at leat 5 min while I read the last page. Twice, because I didn't get it.
Then I backed up a page.
Of course then I had to back all teh way up to page two.
OK, for what it's worth (this and $1.00 get you a small coffee), I can understand where everyone i2 coming from in this.
I thought Tom was a little out of line at first, but not that far out.....but I didn't understand OSC's post in the first thread.
I understand it much better now.
I think Tom has made amends, at least as much as he is able to at this point. I hope neither of them leave HAtrack, it would be a far poorer place to be if either of them left.
I has disagreed with things OSC has said, but that in no way affects my love of his writing. I odn't have to have the same political views as an author to enjoy his book, and I went out of my way to drive to see him at a convention because if his writing.
He and Kristine were very, very nice, of course. I also taked to a number of book dealers there, and they had nothing but great things to say about him as well.
I don't have to agree with someones political views to like them personally, either.
I have no idea how to prove any of this, but it is my belief that this web site provides many, many people with a chance to see OSC's works, and has been a very successful medium for advertising his work and promoting his career/book.
I hope that this ezine will prove as successful, both in the quality of the features it provides and commercialy.
posted
It will do well if it has plenty of pictures of potato chips. Clearly, that's the dominant meme at the moment.
Posts: 3546 | Registered: Jul 2002
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posted
This is an interesting potato chip site. Googled it while looking for these chips, which are some of the best salt and vinegar ones I've ever had.
posted
Ok, I found Tom's thread, and I went and saw the Intergalactic Medicine Show site.
And I agree with the thread title: I don't get it.
IMO, OSC is seriously overreacting to this, and putting words in Tom's mouth, or thoughts in his head. I've seen Tom be arrogant and irritating before, but I have always got the impression that he tells it like he sees it. All this accusation of Tom's insincerity and condescension is way off the mark.
And frankly, again IMO, OSC's comments in this thread have done him more damage than Tom's thread ever could have.
Posts: 3735 | Registered: Mar 2002
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posted
I like black pepper chips. I've only seen them around here. I'm surprised that I've never seen anything like them before, since it makes perfect sense to put pepper on a chip.
Posts: 3546 | Registered: Jul 2002
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quote:Originally posted by Sopwith: I've got to agree with Storm on that one. Those things should come with a 12-step program flyer inside each bag.
Maybe, although it'd be better if they'd add an extra 13th or 14th step just to allow for some more chip eating.
Posts: 2437 | Registered: Apr 2005
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posted
Has OSC given out information on his new electronic magazine? Do we know if they will accept submissions from just anyone, or will it be by solicitation only? Has he proposed a subscription rate? Is there a place where I can find out this stuff other than pestering him about it?
Posts: 22497 | Registered: Sep 2000
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posted
*basks in the warm glow of another semi-effective fluff derailment*
Have to be in the right mood for Salt and Vinegar chips.
Like now -- I'm sick with a head and chest cold, coughing and snuffling so much that I think Salt and Vinegar chips may be the only ones I can taste. Posts: 9293 | Registered: Aug 2000
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posted
Bob, I think OSC said to send send any submissions to him, though they probably won't need any for a few issues. But they will accept them. The subscription fee will be in the neighborhood of 2-4 bucks a month. This is all from memory, so sniff around to verify it.
Now back to your regularly scheduled chip discussion. I don't like how small the opening of Pringles cans are. I can't get my big fat hand in there. Anybody else have that problem?
Posts: 5462 | Registered: Apr 2005
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posted
I think that's probably their intention. You can't reach in --> You pour from the can --> You eat more chips --> You buy more Pringles.
Posts: 4077 | Registered: Jun 2003
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posted
It's frustrating though. I feel like a gorilla trying to work a can opener. So for me it goes like this:
I can't reach in --> I pour from the can --> Chips go all over my shirt and couch --> I curse loudly --> I buy less Pringles.
Posts: 5462 | Registered: Apr 2005
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quote:Originally posted by Dagonee: [QUOTE] Finally, I strongly suggest using http://validator.w3.org/ on every page of the site before it goes live. Because when this site is linked at SlashDot, you'll really get a chance to see what hateful harsh criticism looks like.
I'm sorry to interrupt a good chip discussion, but I thought this point needed mentioning again. Like Dagonee said, it is very likely to get linked on slashdot. There are always some people on that site that seem to really get off on being hurtfull to others, and I wouldn't be surprised if at least a couple found their way over here.
Posts: 2437 | Registered: Apr 2005
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posted
Ever since I spent time in Mexico City, I have a hard time eating torilla chips. The smell of tortillas and diesel fuel are inextricably connected in my mind and the mere thought induces nausea.
Posts: 9871 | Registered: Aug 2001
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posted
Aah, in your condition, I really don't have to say anything for you to puke, do I? (I puked all day, every day, even the day I gave birth. I puked at the hospital while in labor, so I feel for you. "Morning" sickness my butt. And who in the world thought telling me it would only last through the first trimester was a good idea?)
Posts: 9871 | Registered: Aug 2001
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posted
Well, it's not as bad as last time. Last time I puked every day for 4 1/2 months-- with medication, I got it down to once a day. After 4 1/2 months, it calmed down a bit-- every other day or so until 6 months. 6 months was the golden time-- hardly any nausea, no throwing up, and I didn't get heartburn until 7 1/2 months.
I also threw up while in labor.
But the throwing up this time does seem to be triggered by stuff, as opposed to just "all the time, no matter what sickness".
Posts: 21182 | Registered: Sep 2004
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