posted
I'm so tired of the watered down version of Hanukkah that gets ladled out every year. Hanukkah is not a celebration of religious freedom. The Maccabees were fanatics who objected strenuously to the Hellenization of Jewish culture. The revolt actually began with the murder of a Jew who was about to publically worship an idol.
It's also not a celebration of beating the Syrian Greeks. The war with the Greeks continued for years after Jerusalem was liberated, and four of the five Maccabee brothers died before the Greeks finally begged off (which they did in large part due to pressure from the rising power of Rome).
When we defeated the Hellenist forces in Jerusalem and took back the Holy Temple, the Hellenist Jews in Jerusalem were confined to a fortress called the Acra, where they hid for fear of their lives while we purified the Temple.
Megillat Taanit, one of the oldest works of rabbinic literature, says that since the Syrians had destroyed the golden menorah in the Temple, we were forced to strap spears together to make a makeshift menorah until a new one could be built. It was on this menorah that the miracle of the oil occurred.
For those who don't know, only enough pure oil could be found to light the menorah for a single day. But miraculously, that oil lasted for eight full days, by the end of which we had managed to come up with more oil.
The civil authority in Judea at that time was the High Priest. The High Priest Jason, who was a Hellenist himself, was ousted in the Maccabean revolt, and after we retook Jerusalem, Judah Maccabee became the new High Priest.
To many eyes, this may have looked as though the entire revolt had been a cynical political coup. Not only did the miracle of the oil reassure people that God was on the side of the Maccabees, but the fact that the miracle took place on a menorah that wasn't technically even kosher, and which was made out of spears that had only shortly before been used in an all-out civil war, made it clear that there was a divine stamp of approval on the war.
The fanatics won. The Jews who wanted to be Greek by culture and Jewish only by ethnicity got their naked heinies handed to them. And I wonder, as I do every year, at the irony that has so many secular and assimilated Jews lighting candles for eight days in order to commemorate the victory of people who would have stuck a sword through them in a heartbeat.
One of the things I dislike most about Hanukkah is the songs. The tunes are nice, but the words... spare me:
Hanukkah O Hanukkah Come light the menorah Let's have a party We'll all dance the Hora.
Hanukkah was about an all out war against Hellenists and Hellenism. And not a metaphorical war, either, but a serious bloodbath.
One for each night They shed a sweet light To remind us of days long ago...
The saccharine is bad enough, but it's just such a misrepresentation. So I've prepared a modest example of the kind of Hanukkah songs that would be more appropriate to the occasion. Feel free to share these with your friends.
(As a minor note, you need to pronounce Antiochus as an-tee-OH-chus, rather than an-TYE-a-kiss)
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Hanukkah, O Hanukkah (to the tune of "Hanukkah, O Hanukkah")
Hanukkah, O Hanukkah A holiday of war First we kill a couple Greeks And then we kill some more
Invited in by Hellenists Who hated being Jews They brought their filthy idols And tightened the screws
chorus: They call us Fanatics For we fight for truth and the Lord
Stupid Antiochus Sent soldiers in to choke us Because he didn't think we'd raise a sword
Stupid Antiochus Sent soldiers in to choke us And now they've all been killed by the sword.
Hanukkah, O Hanukka The festival of light The flames of our fanaticism Still are burning bright
'Cause Judaism's never been Some airy fairy thing Made up of nothing more than The songs that we sing
chorus: It's truth and It's wisdom It's following God's holy plan
To sanctify the world Man and woman, boy and girl And to do just the best that we can
To sanctify the world Man and woman, boy and girl By obeying the laws He commands
Hanukkah, O Hanukkah A savage celebration Of blood and death and war That saved the soul of our nation
The Maccabees knew compromise With Hellenism's dreck Would kill us just as surely As a sword through the neck
chorus: Although they Were farmers They learned to be soldiers mighty fast
Despite what they became We still venerate their name 'Mongst the heroes of Israel's past
Despite what they became We still venerate their name For their valor has never been surpassed
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posted
I must say, I won't be able to resist reading starLisa's thread when Mel Gibson comes out with his Maccabee movie.
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posted
*no puns in this post, don't bother looking* It's an interesting view, starLisa. I've never heard anyone think of it that way. Thanks for sharing it.
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Here's the thing about Hanukkah or a lot of other Jewish holidays. Its not about celebrating the slaughter of enemy soldiers, its about a victory that may have been short lived, but important all the same to maintaining the Jewish identity. Remember, we celebrate Purim as well and that story ended with the execution of Haman and today we celebrate that fact by eating three cornered pastries. Also, the Hellenistic Jews weren't just acting Greek, but they traitors and idol worshippers as well. You might still not think of that as justification for killing them, but its not the same as killing every secular Jew.
posted
I can rewrite the dreidel one, too, if you'd like. <grin>
And to newfoundlogic, Gibson had said shortly after Passion came out that he planned to do a movie about the Maccabean revolt. God willing, he'll never do it.
And "traitor" is really in the eye of the beholder. I think it's pretty obvious that the Hellenists didn't see themselves as traitors any more than modern Jews who marry out and eat pork and support the enemies of Israel see themselves as traitors today.
That's the point. When we celebrate Hanukkah, we are affirming the view that they were traitors, and we should draw the proper conclusions.
Instead, we have interfaith families celebrating Hanukkah. We have the disgusting Chrismukkah on the O.C. We have all those Jews today who are really no different than the Hellenists lighting candles and eating latkes and remaining utterly oblivious to the fact that they're celebrating their own defeat.
My partner teaches at a Reconstructionist* Sunday school. Money is tight and it's always possible that some of the kids will learn something that will bring them to Judaism when they grow up, despite their parents.
One of the mothers came up to her and said, "I hope it's okay that my son isn't circumcized."
Well, holy hell! As if my partner was ever going to know that if she hadn't been told. This isn't a swimming class or a nudist colony, it's Sunday school. But having told her, of course it matters. Not that my partner can do anything about it, since pretty much anything goes with the Reconstructionists.
But you can bet your bottom dollar that this woman is going to be doing the whole Hanukkah thing. It's grotesque and offensive.
---- *Reconstructionism is a strange movement that was started by a guy named Mordechai Kaplan back in the '20s. To give you an idea of their "religion", here is Mordechai Kaplan's definition of God (blasphemy warning):
quote:God is a functional, rather than substantive, noun, thus denoting that power in the cosmos, including Man, that makes for the salvation of men and nations.
Like I said: strange.
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posted
Just because a Jew is secular doesn't mean they would have fought along side the Hellenists. How many members of the IDF are both secular and willing to sacrifice their lives for the State of Israel?
I have friends and even a first cousin who are only "half" Jewish, but they all were Bar or Bat Mitzvahed and they all celebrate Hanukkah to the best of my knowledge. I fail to see what's so horrible about that. At the very least it certainly wasn't their choice to have a mixed parentage.
"Marrying out" is something that shouldn't even be considered wrong. If you fail in that situation to at least give your child a chance to grow up Jewish then I think you're committing a terrible mistake, but even then as long as you're not teaching him or her to hate Jews I can hardly see how that would make one a traitor. Eating pork may be a sin, but you should know committing a sin in Judaism is "missing the mark," not treason. Supporting the enemies of Israel would actually be something that might be considered traitorous to Judaism, but even then the words "support" and "enemies" have to weighed carefully. Sharon initiated the Gaza pullout, does that mean he supported Israel's enemies by giving Palestinians control of that land?
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posted
by the way... Happy Hannukah!!! nice song... i'll share it with my congregation next week. a new point of view, isn't it? i'll have to read it again... and then i'll tell you what i think about it, today i'm rather in a hurry, and just read it fast.
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posted
I don't know what to say. I grew up in what my Rabbi at the time called a Progressive temple. I didn't know anything different. I grew up, went to college, fell in love with a Methodist girl, then found Birthright Israel. It was a real eye opener for me. I started researching my own faith and realized I could never truly be a part of it. Its too late to leave my fiance, I just could never do it. I decided to join a local Reform temple anyway just because it was the closest to the beliefs I hold.
I haven't agreed with Lisa on a lot of topics on the board, except for probably Judaism. I think she is right about everything she wrote. I know I'll never truly have Jewish children, unless by some fluke they decide to go through an Orthodox conversion. I do feel like I am betraying the Jewish people. However if I can have 2 kids that respect the faith and defend it, maybe that will mean something.
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posted
If your beliefs most closely mirror Reform then it should be adequate in your eyes if your children are either simply raised from birth as Jewish or are converted by the Reform temple regardless of your wife's religion and frankly it the only opinions you should hold in esteem regarding whether your children qualify as being Jewish are yours and your children's.
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quote:Originally posted by newfoundlogic: Just because a Jew is secular doesn't mean they would have fought along side the Hellenists. How many members of the IDF are both secular and willing to sacrifice their lives for the State of Israel?
What makes you think that Hellenized Jews wouldn't have done the same for Judea? The head of state was Hellenized, for crying out loud.
I'm sure that many, if not most, of the Hellenized Jews at that time considered themselves to be proud Jews who simply wanted to cast off some embarrassing customs that stood between them and being like the "normal" people in the rest of the world.
quote:Originally posted by newfoundlogic: I have friends and even a first cousin who are only "half" Jewish,
No such thing. If their mothers are Jewish, they're fully Jewish. If not, they're not Jewish at all.
quote:Originally posted by newfoundlogic: "Marrying out" is something that shouldn't even be considered wrong.
<blink> You're kidding me. It's about the worst thing a Jew can do.
quote:Originally posted by newfoundlogic: If you fail in that situation to at least give your child a chance to grow up Jewish then I think you're committing a terrible mistake, but even then as long as you're not teaching him or her to hate Jews I can hardly see how that would make one a traitor.
Intermarriage is definitely akin to treason.
quote:Originally posted by newfoundlogic: Eating pork may be a sin, but you should know committing a sin in Judaism is "missing the mark," not treason.
Cheit means missing the mark. Not avone or pesha or any of the other terms for violating the Torah.
Eating pork is wrong, but it doesn't even compare to intermarriage.
quote:Originally posted by newfoundlogic: Supporting the enemies of Israel would actually be something that might be considered traitorous to Judaism, but even then the words "support" and "enemies" have to weighed carefully. Sharon initiated the Gaza pullout, does that mean he supported Israel's enemies by giving Palestinians control of that land?
quote: What makes you think that Hellenized Jews wouldn't have done the same for Judea? The head of state was Hellenized, for crying out loud.
I'm sure that many, if not most, of the Hellenized Jews at that time considered themselves to be proud Jews who simply wanted to cast off some embarrassing customs that stood between them and being like the "normal" people in the rest of the world.
The problem was that they were more Greek than Jewish so I doubt that. The fact that you seem willing to condemn a lot of the people who actually keep Israel safe today from its enemies through your previous statements makes me wonder if you're the one who supports Israel's enemies.
quote: No such thing. If their mothers are Jewish, they're fully Jewish. If not, they're not Jewish at all.
I know what the technical definition of being "Jewish" is, that's why I put half in quotations. Certainly you aren't going to claim that when only the father is Jewish the child is miraculously wiped clean of the Jewish blood that runs through him or her when they are born. While you would certainly disagree I do happen to consider my uncle's son who was raised from birth as being Jewish and Bar Mitzvahed as being simply Jewish. Sorry to tell you, but the failure of extremists like you to acknowledge his chosen religion doesn't make him any less Jewish in my or my family's eyes.
quote: <blink> You're kidding me. It's about the worst thing a Jew can do.
First, you seem to be taking on the Catholic view of sin as opposed to the Jewish one. Second, I fail to see how it could be anywhere near the same level as say murder, stealing, adultery, worshipping false idols, or breaking any of the other six of the ten commandments. In fact, if a Jewish woman married a non-Jewish man and the children were raised Jewish I don't even see how the traditional arguments of protecting the Jewish population would be valid. Seriously, you're going to have provide some reason or logic as to why marrying outside Judaism is some horrible sin because we're clearly not working on the same assumptions. I seriously wonder if you know what treason means to be throwing around the word so lightly.
quote: Yes. Thanks for asking.
Why don't you just get it out in the open? Wanting something good to happen for another group if it means the least sacrifice for the Jewish people even it benefits the Jews in the long run is the same as committing treason to you.
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posted
ok, now that i read the whole thing, this are my words: i think, as you, that intermarriage is not a good thing, we don't practise that in my sinagogue, when they come asking for a ceremony like that, we just say "NO". and yes, it's true, those secularized and assimilated jews (as the woman who didn't want to circuncize(sp?) his child) light the hanukiah, and don't know that they're more like the hellenized, than like the macabbes. i must disagree in calling it
quote:a savage celebration of blood and death and war
. it is called the festival of light. and as my rabbi said, fire can be used to illuminate (light) or to eliminate (war). ok, there was a war, but that's not exactly what we're cellebrating, it's the victory of the few over the many, etc, etc, you know it, i'm sure. and i almost forget, you said something about reconstructionism... as your partner works with them, i must assume that you're not orthodox... i'd say you're masorti. if you are, i'd like to ask you something about that. the masorti movement's not at its best moment in my country. ok, nice to talk to you. and, really, have a happy hanukah.
quote:Certainly you aren't going to claim that when only the father is Jewish the child is miraculously wiped clean of the Jewish blood that runs through him or her when they are born. While you would certainly disagree I do happen to consider my uncle's son who was raised from birth as being Jewish and Bar Mitzvahed as being simply Jewish. Sorry to tell you, but the failure of extremists like you to acknowledge his chosen religion doesn't make him any less Jewish in my or my family's eyes.
ok, a person born to a non jewish mother and jewoish father can feel jewish, i know cases, they convert (is that the word) into jewish, and then they fulfil all the commandments and become jews. that's a good solutions to intermarriage. if you don't accept their children, then they'll never have the chance to become jews.
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quote: In fact, if a Jewish woman married a non-Jewish man and the children were raised Jewish I don't even see how the traditional arguments of protecting the Jewish population would be valid. Seriously, you're going to have provide some reason or logic as to why marrying outside Judaism is some horrible sin because we're clearly not working on the same assumptions. I seriously wonder if you know what treason means to be throwing around the word so lightly.
As the son of such a union I must regretfully agree with Lisa.
Having a true Jewish household is almost impossible if one spouse is not Jewish.
The children will also be less likely see the importance of marrying a Jew and further decrease the population.
Not to mention the marriage itself is not recognized. If the father was a Jew, then the Jewish people cannot take advantage of the offspring of such a relationship, and therefore the child is not a Jew. If the mother was a Jew, then she does not need a divorce, according to Jewish law, in order to seperate from he non-Jewish husband. (Civil law, of course, must be followed in non-Jewish countries). Therefore, according to Jewish law, she was as if one who was never married, and is therefore never referred to as a garushah. So the first relationship is sinful, and the second one, while not desirable, is not sinful, but is not a marraige since the woman can always leave the non-Jewish man without a divorce (omitting Civil obligations). The civil perception is not relevant.
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posted
Other than Lisa's objection to Chanuka songs (I actually like a lot of them, although mostly the ones in Hebrew), I agree with most of her rant. I would put it somewhat differently -- perhaps more like this -- but the utter hypocrisy of someone who is themselves secularized celebrating the defeat of secularization . . . *eyes cross* . . . well, it's almost as bad a "Chanuka bushes." <vomit smilie>
And Stephan, I cannot speak for Lisa, but it makes me ill.
quote: The Liebreichs and other interfaith families appreciate what the two holidays share: Both are happy social occasions, they say, and both emphasize the beauty of lights.
posted
The problem I have with your link, rivka, is the equating of multiculturalism to polytheism. Although I suppose it depends on what you mean by multiculturalsim.
Example: as a hospital chaplain it was my job to be familiar with the religious requirements of various faiths that might need accomadation during a patient's hospital stay, and to help explain/negotiate with the medical staff and facilitate the patient's practice of their religion (for instance, calling appropriate outside clergy if we did not have a chaplain of that faith on staff). I consider that being aware of multiculturalism. A friend of mine quit a position as chaplian at a large nursing home chain because she was expected to perform wiccan rituals if the patient requested it. She was replaced by a man calling himself a "new age rabbi" who would perform wiccan rituals, celebrate Christian communion, give Jewish or Mormon, or any other form of blessing -- basically pretend to be whatever religion the patient practiced. That I consider polytheism. And I see a BIG difference.
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Blayne Bradley
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posted
I must agree with the Hanukkah point. And I just say I do honestly like that song, it has a certain catchiness to it.
While the majority of StarLisa's views do seem a tad harsh in my honest opinion, but I'm not Jewish so I can't comment.
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quote:Originally posted by rajel_lebeina: it is called the festival of light. and as my rabbi said, fire can be used to illuminate (light) or to eliminate (war).
I like that.
quote:Originally posted by rajel_lebeina: ok, there was a war, but that's not exactly what we're cellebrating, it's the victory of the few over the many, etc, etc, you know it, i'm sure.
I do. Al ha-nissim v'al ha-purkan v'al ha-teshuot, v'al ha-milchamot. The war is definitely an aspect of Hanukkah. Certainly it's not the only thing, but since so many people ignore that aspect of it, I felt it needed to be emphasized a bit.
quote:Originally posted by rajel_lebeina: and i almost forget, you said something about reconstructionism... as your partner works with them, i must assume that you're not orthodox... i'd say you're masorti.
Oh, really not. She's taught at a Chabad cheder, and we're certainly not Chabadnikim. She was once the principal of a Reform Hebrew school. I could never do it, but everyone is different. She plants seeds, and you never know what will grow. She pushes the envelope when it comes to giving real Judaism to the kids, and the way I figure it, if a single one of those kids comes back to Judaism someday, well, it'll be as if she saved a whole world.
quote:Originally posted by rajel_lebeina: if you are, i'd like to ask you something about that. the masorti movement's not at its best moment in my country.
I grew up in the Conservative movement. But, as the saying goes, "I got better".
quote:Originally posted by rajel_lebeina: ok, nice to talk to you. and, really, have a happy hanukah.
You, too.
quote:Originally posted by rajel_lebeina:
quote:Certainly you aren't going to claim that when only the father is Jewish the child is miraculously wiped clean of the Jewish blood that runs through him or her when they are born. While you would certainly disagree I do happen to consider my uncle's son who was raised from birth as being Jewish and Bar Mitzvahed as being simply Jewish. Sorry to tell you, but the failure of extremists like you to acknowledge his chosen religion doesn't make him any less Jewish in my or my family's eyes.
ok, a person born to a non jewish mother and jewoish father can feel jewish, i know cases, they convert (is that the word) into jewish, and then they fulfil all the commandments and become jews. that's a good solutions to intermarriage. if you don't accept their children, then they'll never have the chance to become jews.
Why is that a bad thing? It's not as if being a Jew is "better" than being a non-Jew. When a Jew violates the Torah, it harms him, it harms all Jews, and it harms the very fabric of creation. A non-Jew has a much easier time and a much better chance of living up to his obligations than a Jew does, and if someone isn't Jewish, the only reason I can see for allowing them to convert is if they're really, really committed to keeping the Torah in its entirety.
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quote:Originally posted by Stephan: As the son of such a union I must regretfully agree with Lisa.
Having a true Jewish household is almost impossible if one spouse is not Jewish.
I agree. Even a union of a religious Jew and a non-religious Jew is something that rarely works out, and almost always results in the children being non-religious. Can a thief teach his children not to steal? Can a hitman inculcate respect for human life in his children? No more can a parent who violates the Torah do anything but teach his children, by example, that the Torah is a joke.
quote:Originally posted by Stephan: The children will also be less likely see the importance of marrying a Jew and further decrease the population.
I have a brother-in-law who is married to a non-Jewish woman. I like her a lot. I hate that my brother-in-law now has a metaphorical "No Outlet" sign on him, and that there'll be no continuation of Jewish heritage through him. But I'm glad they have no intention of raising their children as Jews. Because odds are they'll marry non-Jews themselves, and as non-Jews, that's perfectly okay.
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quote:Originally posted by starLisa: Why is that a bad thing? It's not as if being a Jew is "better" than being a non-Jew. When a Jew violates the Torah, it harms him, it harms all Jews, and it harms the very fabric of creation. A non-Jew has a much easier time and a much better chance of living up to his obligations than a Jew does, and if someone isn't Jewish, the only reason I can see for allowing them to convert is if they're really, really committed to keeping the Torah in its entirety.
Do any aspects of Christianity violate (in the Jewish mind) the 7 laws of Noah?
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