posted
I didn't listen to the full thing (I was listening to it on my way home from work), but as I respect the opinions of the people here on Hatrack, what did ya'll think?
Posts: 2827 | Registered: Jul 2005
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I was scared, frankly. He basically stated that we need to go to war against Iran and "social security doesn't work because, back when it was created, people didn't live as long." I won't go into long rants, but I'm worried, frankly.
On a lighter note, Tim Kaine's eyebrows are AMAZING!
Posts: 1789 | Registered: Jul 2003
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I'm on an anti-politics kick right now. I didn't even watch it. Time was I wouldn't miss it, but I just don't have the stomach for it.
Posts: 14428 | Registered: Aug 2001
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Didn't watch or listen. I'll find a transcript and read it later. I've gotten to the point where I just can't look at or listen to that man without getting upset and frightened.
Apparently lots of people didn't listen or watch, though. I took my mother out to dinner just at the time the speech was starting (6 p.m. out here on the west coast), and the restaurant was packed. It's never that busy on Tuesday night.
Posts: 2454 | Registered: Jan 2003
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I actually liked some of the domestic policy that he proposed. I'm glad to see that alternative energy research is still a stated priority, and I hope that there is some followthrough on that in the coming year.
I also liked to see him talk about increasing science education. I can't really see this becoming anything besides more important in the future. As many manufacturing and other similar jobs are lost, we as a nation will become increasingly dependant on invention and innovation . In my opinion, education is one of the most important factors in this process.
Posts: 2437 | Registered: Apr 2005
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quote: I've gotten to the point where I just can't look at or listen to that man without getting upset and frightened.
I totally agree. There were parts that just upset me to no end and honestly scared me to no end. *sigh*
quote: My favorite part was when he called for a ban on animal-human hybrids.
Really. I just didn't see that one coming.
I was transcribing for my friend in England, and when that came up I had to reread what I had just written to make sure that what I said made sense. Needless to say, it didn't, but I sent it anyway.
Posts: 1789 | Registered: Jul 2003
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I'm halfway through his speech...here's what's jumped out at me so far.
quote:We have served America through one of the most consequential periods of our history -- and it has been my honor to serve with you.
I don't know, more consequential than the Civil War, World Wars, Vietnam, the Civil Rights Movement, the foundation of the country, the War of 1812....I suppose every president likes to say that, but compared to other problems we've faced, I'd say he's overstating. Besides, he if means consequential in the sense of consequences of our own actions...well, then he may be right.
quote: Dictatorships shelter terrorists, feed resentment and radicalism, and seek weapons of mass destruction. Democracies replace resentment with hope, respect the rights of their citizens and their neighbors, and join the fight against terror.
Really? Always? You don't seem to agree with yourself whenever you bring up Palestine.
quote: Yet there is a difference between responsible criticism that aims for success, and defeatism that refuses to acknowledge anything but failure. Hindsight alone is not wisdom. And second-guessing is not a strategy.
As soon as you recognize that difference, I'll be right there beside you with support.
quote: We show compassion abroad because Americans believe in the God-given dignity and worth of a villager with HIV/AIDS, or an infant with malaria, or a refugee fleeing genocide...
Yes, we're all about helping refugees by throwing money at the problem. Stop the genocide? What, and get our hands dirty?! No, let's send them cash.
quote:Keeping America competitive begins with keeping our economy growing. And our economy grows when Americans have more of their own money to spend, save, and invest. In the last five years, the tax relief you passed has left $880 billion in the hands of American workers, investors, small businesses, and families -- and they have used it to help produce more than four years of uninterrupted economic growth. Yet the tax relief is set to expire in the next few years. If we do nothing, American families will face a massive tax increase they do not expect and will not welcome.
Yes, and I wonder how much of that $880 billion actually goes to lower income families, and how much goes to the already wealthy. If you ask me, this is a vile misrepresentation of the tax cuts.
quote: me and President Bill Clinton.
Silly man, it's "President Clinton and I."
quote: Keeping America competitive requires affordable health care. Our government has a responsibility to help provide health care for the poor and the elderly, and we are meeting that responsibility. For all Americans, we must confront the rising cost of care ... strengthen the doctor-patient relationship ... and help people afford the insurance coverage they need. We will make wider use of electronic records and other health information technology, to help control costs and reduce dangerous medical errors. We will strengthen health savings accounts -- by making sure individuals and small business employees can buy insurance with the same advantages that people working for big businesses now get. We will do more to make this coverage portable, so workers can switch jobs without having to worry about losing their health insurance. And because lawsuits are driving many good doctors out of practice -- leaving women in nearly 1,500 American counties without a single OB-GYN -- I ask the Congress to pass medical liability reform this year.
quote: The best way to break this addiction is through technology. Since 2001, we have spent nearly $10 billion to develop cleaner, cheaper, more reliable alternative energy sources -- and we are on the threshold of incredible advances. So tonight, I announce the Advanced Energy Initiative -- a 22 percent increase in clean-energy research at the Department of Energy, to push for breakthroughs in two vital areas. To change how we power our homes and offices, we will invest more in zero-emission coal-fired plants; revolutionary solar and wind technologies; and clean, safe nuclear energy.
Did he seriously just say that? I think I just had a tiny orgasm. An energy plan from BUSH that is based on alternative energy and innovation and NOT based on drilling in Alaska!? It's a miracle! He must have been channeling Al Gore and John Kerry.
quote:Breakthroughs on this and other new technologies will help us reach another great goal: to replace more than 75 percent of our oil imports from the Middle East by 2025. By applying the talent and technology of America, this country can dramatically improve our environment ... move beyond a petroleum-based economy ... and make our dependence on Middle Eastern oil a thing of the past.
Yes!! YAY!!! YAY!!!!!!
quote:Third: We need to encourage children to take more math and science, and make sure those courses are rigorous enough to compete with other nations. We have made a good start in the early grades with the No Child Left Behind Act, which is raising standards and lifting test scores across our country. Tonight I propose to train 70,000 high school teachers, to lead advanced-placement courses in math and science ... bring 30,000 math and science professionals to teach in classrooms ... and give early help to students who struggle with math, so they have a better chance at good, high-wage jobs. If we ensure that America's children succeed in life, they will ensure that America succeeds in the world.
Holy crap, it's like he took his liberal pills this morning! And I think maybe I took some crazy pills, 'cause I am LOVING the things this man is saying. Would have been nice if he mentioned tuition assistance and pay raises for these new teachers, otherwise I don't see how he plans to lure that many people into teaching. This doesn't really affect me, as I'm going to be a history teacher, but I'm all for anything that improved education in the US.
quote: Tonight I ask you to pass legislation to prohibit the most egregious abuses of medical research -- human cloning in all its forms ... creating or implanting embryos for experiments ... creating human-animal hybrids ... and buying, selling, or patenting human embryos. Human life is a gift from our creator
If he means using stem cells to create new organs for people who need them, I'm against him 100%. Otherwise, I agree. Though, come on, cat people would be cool!
I would have liked to see something about trade relations with China, and how he plans to fix it. But I don't think he directly made reference to a possible war with Iran. If anything, it sounded like he was insinuating that we'd support a popular uprising in Iran. But all in all, the second half of that speech could have come right out of the mouth of Hillary Clinton, or any other of the "radical liberal" in the democratic party. I don't care though, I don't care who says it, and who gets it done, just so long as somebody does!
Posts: 21898 | Registered: Nov 2004
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That wasn't an exact quote. I was typing an IM to my friend at the time, and that was my friend's paraphrase. I should have stated that. Sorry.
Posts: 1789 | Registered: Jul 2003
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The bit about human/animal hybrids could prove to be a serious blow to some very promising research. I wonder if he's talking about all gene splicing research (e.g., putting human genes for insulin into a bacterium)? There's a horizon of custom-tailored medications that is going to be completely squelched if we can't do gene splicing unless it's human-to-human.
Posts: 22497 | Registered: Sep 2000
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quote: The retirement of the baby-boom generation will put unprecedented strains on the federal government. By 2030, spending for Social Security, Medicare, and Medicaid alone will be almost 60 percent of the entire federal budget.
That's how my friend interpreted it. Looking back on it now, though, I think that's the wrong interpretation, and I shouldn't have written that. But I can see where she was coming from.
Aka, discard all of my previous statements. Posts: 1789 | Registered: Jul 2003
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quote: Dictatorships shelter terrorists, feed resentment and radicalism, and seek weapons of mass destruction. Democracies replace resentment with hope, respect the rights of their citizens and their neighbors, and join the fight against terror.
I wanted to expand on this in particular more than what I said earlier. I think this, more than anything else in his speech, was a gross misrepresentation of the truth.
He's making the claim that we should support the war in Iraq because it will leave a democracy in our wake, and democracies always choose freedom and are the natural enemies of terror, but he flagrantly glosses over Palestine/Hamas in the second half of his speech. Clearly in the Middle East, democracy isn't automatically the same thing it is here, and it seems he's trying to hide that fact to pass his agenda and win support. I think that's dangerous for the American people. And I hope someone calls him out on it.
Posts: 21898 | Registered: Nov 2004
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I actually really agreed with most of it. Granted, my friends and I only paid close attention towards the domestic policy parts. During most of the international stuff we were joking about how it should have been labeled "State of the World" and about the title "War on Terror".
I think I agreed with all of the domestic policies except the domestic wiretapping. I'm also on the fence as regards to the line item veto, although I'm the first to say I don't have enough information to make a decision.
Still, overall a pleasant surprise. I also thought the Democratic response was surprisingly nonpartisan. I did think it was a perfect example of why Democrats aren't winning elections. Did anyone catch what the "better way" he kept mentioning actually was?
Posts: 4655 | Registered: Jan 2002
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While I cannot deny the obvious importance of getting children better math and science educations, I would like to see them semi-literate and able to enjoy reading books - you know, the silly things that belong in English departments. I certainly did not hear the speech this evening, and so I can't speak to the entirety of the President's speech, but taken out of context, I'm personally saddened by this lack of emphasis on that which makes culture and not just science.
Oh well. I'm just a hard-core Humanities person. I'll spread my love where I can and run from there, because people choosing to follow it instead of having it shoved down their throats for years in school is pretty nice to see.
posted
My favorite part was the standing ovations. The Republicans gave them after every punctuation mark or breath, whichever came first, and the Democrats started cheering whenever Bush fouled up.
Say what you want about the future of the country, but at least there's entertainment value in it.
Posts: 3293 | Registered: Jul 2002
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Overall, I kind of liked this speech. I think that he has some good plans he's trying to put through.
Some of the things I disagree with, such as the human cloning/genetic engineering, but... overall, not bad.
Posts: 1831 | Registered: Jan 2003
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I'll have to peruse it myself, but keep in mind Bush's track record tends towards not following through on the best-sounding parts of SOTU speeches.
Posts: 15770 | Registered: Dec 2001
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I agree with Carrie. Math and Science are not the most important things in life. Sure we're behind, but to focus only on math and science and not anything else can lead to more deficiency in education.
Secondly, I'd like to hear how he intends to lure these "math and science professionals" to teach. Teachers aren't exactly paid that much, it's going to be hard to convince someone making, say, $40,000 year, to teach and get $25,000 a year (that's about the current the starting wage in Utah for teachers). If you decide to pay these Math and Science professionals more than the other teachers, what sort of message does that send? That math and science are more important than English, or history? And if we do offer highter wages for these professionals to teach, it will be a State's taxpayers footing the bill; quite frankly, there's enough debate already about the ethics of taxpayers paying for public education.
Thinking about it, I suppose you could set up some sort of "guest teacher" program, but why focus only on Math and Science? If you're going to have guest teachers, why not bring in professionals from all walks of life?
Posts: 681 | Registered: Feb 2004
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We played "State of the Union Bingo" (basically, mark a square when the President says the word listed within) and were scoring Bingos within the first five minutes. Talk about your buzzphrase-happy speeches. I think the most egregious offenders this time around were "freedom," "democracy," and "terrorists"- i.e. business as usual.
Epictetus: As a science major who is attending a liberal arts college, I definitely agree that the humanities are critical to an informed and intelligent culture. However, I think that Bush was emphasizing the economic benefits of education, which mostly come from the steady stream of math and science professionals that universities pump out. It wasn't so much a denigration of the humanities and social sciences as much as it was a bone thrown to quiet those durned uppity scientists. As one of said scientists (or scientists-in-training, at least), let me just say that I wasn't impressed.
Don't forget that, in all likelihood, that entire section of his speech was nothing more than doublespeak designed to appeal to a demographic that almost universally despises him. I don't expect any real educational reform to come out of this Administration any time soon, any more than I expect them to actually fund real science. They've made it quite clear than, unless scientists follow the party line, they won't get necessary support, even if it's for desperately critical medical research. Just this week, the New York Times broke a frightening story about what amounts to direct censorship of scientists by the federal government: in effect, scientists that receive federal money have to go through public relations officers before they're allowed to speak with the press these days.
Posts: 1321 | Registered: Sep 1999
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More teachers are needed, period. They should make sure schools are fully staffed, not just load the nation up with math and science teachers.
Plus I'd like to think I'll be making a bit more than 25K a year when I start. My English teacher from high school makes more than 70K a year and he's in his early 40's.
Posts: 21898 | Registered: Nov 2004
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A friend of mine explained the human-animal hybrid thing, so I figure I'd just quote her. She said it better than I could.
quote:i believe there are some people who are studying genetic human diseases by inserting the gene for the disease into mouse chromosomes. this allows them to do experiments which they couldn't do with humans. not exactly the picture he will have given most people.
and note that he said _all_ forms of human cloning - so theraputic as well as the whole duplicating yourself thing.
his limiting research to the few lines that existed in 2001 have failed to stop stem cell research, so i guess this is his way of killing it off entirely. twit. of course, he is oblivious to the fact that this is not in accord with his claim that he will keep americans in the forefront of innovations and stuff.
i was momentarily encouraged by him saying that they would kill any programs that had failed to show results or were not cost effective, because i figured we would be saving billions when he killed missile defense...but it seems that wasn't what he meant.
posted
Lyrhawn, Epi said *in Utah* teachers are paid $25,000 which is, from my experience, true.
Epictetus, your last statement:
"If you're going to have guest teachers, why not bring in professionals from all walks of life?"
struck me as funny. Current teachers *are* professionals. I will watch what happens with this closely, I thought it was interesting.
As a Canadian, living in the States, I watched my first SOTU last night and overall I was impressed. The only thing that really stood out negatively for me was when he was talking about Iran and I wondered how he was going to get Iran to do what "we" want...!?!?
I really enjoyed this statement:
"Hindsight alone is not wisdom. And second-guessing is not a strategy."
Posts: 697 | Registered: Nov 2005
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Belle: I'm with you. Politics just makes me sick these days. The Republicans don't seem to care about shrinking the size of government which is why I voted for them and last night's State of the Dole Queue address just emphasized that...
Syn, dear, if you can't look at the president without getting angry you've lost your ability to listen to him objectively =(
posted
I thought Utah or Utah's teachers union and school boards set the teacher's pay? I don't see how that is Bush's fault or has anything to do with him? Doesn't Utah have a low cost of living as well? I mean $25K in Utah might be like making $50K somewhere else
Posts: 1918 | Registered: Mar 2005
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I listened to the part I was most interested in -- what he had to say about the Palestinian elections and Iran. While I wasn't too surprised, I did expect him to be a bit more belligerent. I was busy, though, so I didn't listen to the rest.
Posts: 10886 | Registered: Feb 2000
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quote:Originally posted by DarkKnight: I thought Utah or Utah's teachers union and school boards set the teacher's pay? I don't see how that is Bush's fault or has anything to do with him? Doesn't Utah have a low cost of living as well? I mean $25K in Utah might be like making $50K somewhere else
I don't recall anyone saying it was Bush's fault. People were saying that they hoped the money Bush wants to spend will go not only to math and science, but to increasing teacher's pay overall.
People insult Bush all the time, you really don't need to go looking for insults to get upset about.
Posts: 4655 | Registered: Jan 2002
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I usually get excited about state of the union addresses. I was like, yes, finally after listening to endless posturing by both sides this last year about everything from the Florida feeding tube case to Supreme Court nominations some things that I am really concerned about are really coming up.
But then I got sad after I read the last 10 years of SOTU addresses and compared the promises contained in those with reality. Seems like nothing will get done domestically.
Some people made some unfair jabs in this thread. Evie already printed a retract of hers. Maybe Bush's speech scared you, but what your friend said reveals about her mindset of scares me. What she said not IMO is not a misinterpretation, but an outright lie.
Lyrhawn, "Did he seriously just say that? I think I just had a tiny orgasm. An energy plan from BUSH that is based on alternative energy and innovation and NOT based on drilling in Alaska!?" If you've paid attention, he's been saying that for years. Now where the rubber meets the road is another story. However, I know that last year the company I work for got something like a 1 billion dollar contract for researching/developing alternative energy sources.
Like fugu, I have strong doubts about things getting done though.
Posts: 1412 | Registered: Oct 2005
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quote:As we make progress on the ground, and Iraqi forces increasingly take the lead, we should be able to further decrease our troop levels -- but those decisions will be made by our military commanders, not by politicians in Washington, D.C.
I assume by this he means that the recommendation will only be taken when the military advises it, not that the command of the army rests soley in military hands.
I think that was a little ambiguous.
quote:Our offensive against terror
It's not a war, I swear. Hee hee. OKay, I let them off for this one, there's only so many times you can say war in a speech. I just think it's funny.
Hee hee, I should so be a speech writer. I think it would be fun. It's like writing an essay, only without footnotes:
quote:Yet many Americans, especially parents, still have deep concerns about the direction of our culture, and the health of our most basic institutions. They are concerned about unethical conduct by public officials, and discouraged by activist courts that try to redefine marriage.
And they worry about children in our society who need direction and love and about fellow citizens still displaced by natural disaster and about suffering caused by treatable disease.
Okay, note this section. It has the controversal bit there, but then it goes on to cover its tracks by saying things that aren't disputable immediately after. It keeps the shock level down.
posted
In his reaction on the Today Show this morning, John Kerry asserted that 53% of kids don't graduate high school. What has he been smoking?
Posts: 326 | Registered: Aug 2005
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I try to listen to him objectively, but it is just...so... difficult... The frustrating hypocrasy of it all...
Posts: 9942 | Registered: Mar 2003
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quote:Still, overall a pleasant surprise. I also thought the Democratic response was surprisingly nonpartisan. I did think it was a perfect example of why Democrats aren't winning elections. Did anyone catch what the "better way" he kept mentioning actually was?
quote:At the start of 2006, more than half the people of our world live in democratic nations. And we do not forget the other half -- in places like Syria, Burma, Zimbabwe, North Korea, and Iran -- because the demands of justice, and the peace of this world, require their freedom as well.
At least now we know which nations need killin'! Mahalo plenny, Bushybush.
Posts: 4313 | Registered: Sep 2004
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It's not hypocrisy, it's speech writing. All political speeches are like this. I, too, find many of them unbearable to listen to, regardless of whether I agree because they are simply so schemey.
Posts: 8473 | Registered: Apr 2003
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It's not hypocrisy, it's speech writing. All political speeches are like this. I, too, find many of them unbearable to listen to, regardless of whether I agree because they are simply so schemey.
It's not just the speech writing. It's his actions. It's things like cutting taxes for the upper precentile during a war when the soldiers don't have proper body armor or protection for their vehicles. It's cutting beneficial programs. It's the way he always, always, ALWAYS insists that everything is going just fine, when you know it really isn't. Especially with the economy and so many other things.......
Posts: 9942 | Registered: Mar 2003
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quote:Originally posted by Irregardless: In his reaction on the Today Show this morning, John Kerry asserted that 53% of kids don't graduate high school. What has he been smoking?
Any link? That's indeed odd on the surface. I wonder what the referenced denominator was.
Posts: 14017 | Registered: May 2000
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quote:Originally posted by BaoQingTian: Lyrhawn, "Did he seriously just say that? I think I just had a tiny orgasm. An energy plan from BUSH that is based on alternative energy and innovation and NOT based on drilling in Alaska!?" If you've paid attention, he's been saying that for years. Now where the rubber meets the road is another story. However, I know that last year the company I work for got something like a 1 billion dollar contract for researching/developing alternative energy sources.
Like fugu, I have strong doubts about things getting done though.
Not entirely, he's never suggested something that extensive, and he's always made MORE OIL the focus of his plan, now he's focusing elsewhere.
And if he isn't serious, it's the stupidest political decision he's ever made. He just put an issue championed by the Democratic party on the front page, and the Dems can run with it. If he tries to shut them down, they get to call him a big fat liar, and he's hardpressed to really defend himself there. Either way, Dems win from that.
Posts: 21898 | Registered: Nov 2004
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posted
I just watched the video part where John Kerry said that 53% of "our children" do not graduate from high school...
I got to it by MSN video, which unfortunately made me use IE instead of Firefox. Yuck! Here's the link: http://video.msn.com/v/us/v.htm? Search for Today show in the MSN video search box, and it should be on the second page.
Edit: Just to be clear - have Macromedia Flash Player 7 installed, open up IE6 or higher, put the above link in the address bar, Search for Today show in the MSN video search box, and the John Kerry blurb should be on the second page. Katie Couric kinda grilled him a bit.
quote:In his reaction on the Today Show this morning, John Kerry asserted that 53% of kids don't graduate high school. What has he been smoking?
I tried a Google search, and found a statistic that said 43% of Mexican immigrant kids in California don't graduate high school ... and even that seems high. Could that be what Kerry was referring to?
Posts: 1539 | Registered: Jul 2004
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