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It's certainly no better or worse than people who use dating sites that are restricted for, say, Blacks, Asians, Mormons or Jews.
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Well if they can do this, maybe a good "place for nerds to meet other nerds" will develop online. I'm sure not meeting many nerds on the mainstream dating sites. Posts: 1960 | Registered: May 2005
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quote:Originally posted by pfresh85: Well if they can do this, maybe a good "place for nerds to meet other nerds" will develop online. I'm sure not meeting many nerds on the mainstream dating sites.
In Seattle, we call it "craigslist."
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I've seen this "craigslist" you speak of (at least the Dallas area one), but I wasn't too impressed.
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The return of DorkDater.com!
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Boon
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quote:Originally posted by pfresh85: Well if they can do this, maybe a good "place for nerds to meet other nerds" will develop online. I'm sure not meeting many nerds on the mainstream dating sites.
Judging from all the hook-ups, I'd say this is it. "Welcome to HatCrack, where nerds and geeks find each other."
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PS: Lyrhawn, if you could please email me your logins, I'll do that paperwork for you tonight and get them in the mail in the morning. Sorry it's taken so long.
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quote:Originally posted by erosomniac: It's certainly no better or worse than people who use dating sites that are restricted for, say, Blacks, Asians, Mormons or Jews.
Of course. Because cultural or religious beliefs are exactly the same as shallowness. Posts: 32919 | Registered: Mar 2003
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I don't know. I don't think there is a bad reason for not wanting to date someone.
It's so personal. What we want in other people is so personal, and if someone only wants to date people that have a BMI of 20, I can't really fault their desires.
Maybe I'm shallow? Because I have the preference that I won't date anyone shorter than me. I would just rather not. I also like brilliant, Mormon, articulate, well-read, and kind. Having dated a ton of people, those are the really the minimum requirements. If any one trait is missing, I'm not happy and any efforts to convince myself otherwise will fail. Since it's such a personal, subjective thing, I don't think any of those are shallow.
Maybe this site is seen as shallow because while almost everyone has "must be attractive to me" on their list, this site caters to those who put it first?
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Women I would never want to date ever shall frequent it and free up the general pool just a little bit.
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Incredibly, I agree with both porter and kat on this issue, simultaneously.
Somebody needs to sort this out. While I haven't spent every wakng moment of my life thinking about this issue, I have thought about it a little, and at different points over the last 18 years or so. I still have no definite conclusion, and I don't even know what that means, besides the fact that I am not great at making decisions.
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quote:Originally posted by erosomniac: It's certainly no better or worse than people who use dating sites that are restricted for, say, Blacks, Asians, Mormons or Jews.
Of course. Because cultural or religious beliefs are exactly the same as shallowness.
Insofar as they pre-screen for a set of prerequisites that a person wants in a potential mate, increases the chances that they will have things in common and increases the chances their lifestyles are similar, absolutely.
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Sure. The guy who is naturally slim and the woman who has had $30,000 worth of plastic surgery should have lots in common.
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quote:I think there are a lot of bad/shallow/unworthy reasons, and we all have them.
I really don't. I don't think you can tell someone who they "should" be attracted to.
There are decisions that will probably lead to happy lives and decisions that probably won't, but it is still up to the individual to pick. Every person is their own dating Supreme Court.
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quote:Originally posted by rivka: Sure. The guy who is naturally slim and the woman who has had $30,000 worth of plastic surgery should have lots in common.
Why shouldn't they?
None of the dating sites are perfect (as you well know). I don't see anything wrong with any sort of specialized dating website. Maybe it helps people for whom looks are atop their list find one another. I'm not one of those people, but it doesn't bother me that they have a place to connect.
It doesn't bother me that I'm not allowed on certain religious matchmaking sites. And it wouldn't bother me if there was a matchmaking site for D&D gamers, either.
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quote:Originally posted by rivka: Sure. The guy who is naturally slim and the woman who has had $30,000 worth of plastic surgery should have lots in common.
If they're both on this dating site, we can probably assume a few things about them:
1) They're proud of the way they look. 2) They want a mate who looks as good as they do. 3) They're largely superficial, since looks are their primary prerequisite and are willing to advertise this fact to find what they want, which suggests to me they'd be interested in a lot of the same things.
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quote:3) They're largely superficial, since looks are their primary prerequisite and are willing to advertise this fact to find what they want, which suggests to me they'd be interested in a lot of the same things.
I don't think that this is a warranted assumption.
I strongly prefer to date people I find very attractive and who find me very attractive. That's not my primary prerequisite, but it is a huge perk and close to a deal breaker if it doesn't exist. Am I shallow?
I don't think so. In my experience, attractive people have a similar distribution of traits, like intelligence, humor, etc, that are my primary prerequisites. I don't think it is neccesarily shallow or superficial to value physical attractiveness. What is is valuing it over all other things.
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But (without looking at that site) it is subjective as to whether you're attractive or not. It is not subjective if you're jewish or black or a geek. At least it is less so.
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Yes, but there are certain standards of physical attractiveness that are shared by a large segment of the population. I imagine, not having looked at the site in any detail, that these are close to the standards they are using.
For less common standards, say men who like really fat women, there are already specialty sites. Do people who think this is a shallow site also think that those sites are shallow too?
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Breyer, what do you think about using subjective criteria for dating?
I know I used to not like the idea, but it was the several occasions of me TRYING to like someone that didn't meet my subjective idea that made me ultimately conclude that dating wasn't something anyone should have to force themselves to do.
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quote:Originally posted by pfresh85: Well if they can do this, maybe a good "place for nerds to meet other nerds" will develop online. I'm sure not meeting many nerds on the mainstream dating sites.
posted
Now the site where the men must have a million dollar a year income and the women have to pass a very stringent "beauty" test, that sounds very shallow to me.
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quote:3) They're largely superficial, since looks are their primary prerequisite and are willing to advertise this fact to find what they want, which suggests to me they'd be interested in a lot of the same things.
I don't think that this is a warranted assumption.
I strongly prefer to date people I find very attractive and who find me very attractive. That's not my primary prerequisite, but it is a huge perk and close to a deal breaker if it doesn't exist. Am I shallow?
I don't think so. In my experience, attractive people have a similar distribution of traits, like intelligence, humor, etc, that are my primary prerequisites. I don't think it is neccesarily shallow or superficial to value physical attractiveness. What is is valuing it over all other things.
That's fine. I'm saying that in signing up for this dating site, you're advertising that physical appearance is your primary prerequisite, thus warranting calling its users superficial (which, incidentally, I don't consider a pejorative).
A certain amount of physical attractiveness is definitely a prerequisite for me dating someone, but like you, it's not the primary consideration, and I wouldn't consider myself shallow, even though it's a make-or-break deal.
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quote:Originally posted by pfresh85: Well if they can do this, maybe a good "place for nerds to meet other nerds" will develop online. I'm sure not meeting many nerds on the mainstream dating sites.
In Seattle, we call it "craigslist."
I'm only half joking. I set my former roommate up with a girl from a w4m ad, the title of which was something like "I firmly believe Dead Rising may be the greatest game in existence," and contained numerous gems like Penny Arcade / Invader Zim references, and lines like "if interested, send me an e-mail; otherwise, keep the picture of my tummy with my compliments." They're still together 6 (7?) months later, and it's led to some of the best stories ever.
For example: another of my friends came over to hang out and didn't know my roommate had a new girlfriend and asked about her. After the initial awkwardness of trying to explain "uh, my roommate found her on craigslist," he blurted it out, and my friend's response was: "HOLY CRAP, you're dating craigslist dead rising chick?!"
I love craigslist.
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eros, I disagree. They are saying that it is an important concern, but not their primary one.
People who sign up for a Jewish dating site, for example, aren't looking to date anyone who is Jewish, but rather people inside that pool that also have the requirements that they are looking for.
I don't see how this is different.
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quote:Originally posted by MrSquicky: eros, I disagree. They are saying that it is an important concern, but not their primary one.
People who sign up for a Jewish dating site, for example, aren't looking to date anyone who is Jewish, but rather people inside that pool that also have the requirements that they are looking for.
I don't see how this is different.
I'm not sure how, in signing up for a dating site whose only prerequisite is physical attractiveness (or Jewishness, or what have you), you can possibly not be saying your primary concern is physical attractiveness.
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Are you saying that people who join a Jewish dating site don't have 'Jewish' as their primary concern?
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You know, the site isn't really geared toward finding potential dates you find attractive; it's geared toward finding potential dates that fit into one sort of idea of attractive.
it's someone elses criteria. and if what you want fits in that criteria, and it is the most important thing on your list, then i probably wasn't going to try to date you anyways.
this site really doesn't bug me. it kinda weeds out the people i would rather not even be friends with for me. i agree it is shallow, but i wonder how many people on the site are looking for relationships that will exceed three years. heaven forbid anyone is looking to have kids - at least not untill women start carrying their wombs like helium balloons. heh.
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Maybe we are using primary concern differently. For me, primary concern is the most important thing you are using when determining who to date.
People join various dating sites to draw from a particular pool that they'd like to date in. Let's say there's a gamers site. People will join that site because they would prefer to meet gamers. But the thing that is going to determine whether or not they pick or continue dating someone on that site is likely not how good a gamer someone is, but a host of other factors.
Similarly, for many who join Jewish dating sites, they are looking to date in the pool of Jewish people (some, but far from all, exclusively). But, the primary thing is likely not going to be how Jewish someone is.
In the same way, people who join this site want to date attractive people, but I think it is not tenable to suggest that this is going to be their primary criteria for choosing who they date within that pool. I think (as I have a similar outlook) that it is likely that many of them are looking to date people who they are going to find attractive and be found attractive by who also are great conversationlists or good dancers or soppy romantics or a whole host of other factors. I don't think it is fair to me or them to say that we are primarily concerned about looks.
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The pool is people. In choosing a selective dating site, you are saying that regardless of what you end up discriminating by within that site, you are automatically removing everyone who doesn't meet that first criteria from your selection pool, period, regardless of their other characteristics.
How is that not primary?
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quote:Originally posted by El JT de Spang: Are you saying that people who join a Jewish dating site don't have 'Jewish' as their primary concern?
In the same sense that a heterosexual male would have "female" as their primary concern. Not what a man would usually list as their primary concern, though ... there are a whole host of things he's looking for in a woman other than just that she be female. Same with a Jew ... "Jewish" is the starting point from which you then look for the things that are important to you.
ETA: not that you asked me ... but I do get the point of "narrowing the pool".
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Because, when choosing inside that pool, they don't use the criteria as a major deterimining factor. I don't date very short girls. If there was a site that had a height requirement, I'd be more likely to join that one (all other things being equal) than one that did not. It just doesn't work out. Is height my primary concern?
I don't think so, but it does limit the pool of people I'm going to date.
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Jenna, That's a very good way to put it.
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I think that, if you were to take the perfect mate and list all of her qualities, the primary concern would be the one that, if it were to be reversed it would totally change her datability.
'Jewish' meets that criteria, as we discussed it above. 'Attractive' may also, although it also may not, depending on the person.
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Or female, or height, or having a certain level of intelligence, or having a certain degree of humor, a certain level of physical attractiveness or a whole mess of other things.
I don't date men, very short people, dumb people, people without a sense of humor, people I find ugly, people who stab me with knives, etc. Change any one of those things from my current girlfriend and we never would have gone out.
Which one of these is my priamry concern?
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quote:Originally posted by El JT de Spang: Are you saying that people who join a Jewish dating site don't have 'Jewish' as their primary concern?
In the same sense that a heterosexual male would have "female" as their primary concern. Not what a man would usually list as their primary concern, though ... there are a whole host of things he's looking for in a woman other than just that she be female. Same with a Jew ... "Jewish" is the starting point from which you then look for the things that are important to you.
ETA: not that you asked me ... but I do get the point of "narrowing the pool".
I was about to use sexuality as an example myself.
If you are a heterosexual man, you're not going to date anyone that isn't female, period.
Would you consider that a primary concern, Squick?
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quote:Originally posted by MrSquicky: Or female, or height, or having a certain level of intelligence, or having a certain degree of humor, a certain level of physical attractiveness or a whole mess of other things.
I don't date men, very short people, dumb people, people without a sense of humor, people I find ugly, people who stab me with knives, etc. Change any one of those things from my current girlfriend and we never would have gone out.
Which one of these is my priamry concern?
I don't know. But if you went onto a dating site like (I'm making these up) "straightdating.com" or "tallfriendfinder.com" or "IQMatch.com" or "ticklemyfunnybone.com" or "ionlydatepeoplewhodontstabmewithknives.com," then I'd know what your primary concern was based on which of those you decided to put a dating ad on.
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quote:then I'd know what your primary concern was based on which of those you decided to put a dating ad on.
And I'm saying no, no, you wouldn't. You'd know what pool of people I'd prefer to date in. And they can be combined. tallsmartfriendfinder.com. Also, I'm assuming whenever you sign up for a dating site, you make a choice in what gender you are looking for. So, you've already got at least two primary concerns with each site.
I was kidding with the people who don't stab me with knives thing, but that's actually an exageration of a real issue. Some dating sites conduct background checks and disallow people who have a criminal history. If someone joins one of them, is "not a criminal" their primary concern?
Also, I'm pretty sure that there is no law preventing people from signing up on multiple dating sites. What if I signed up for them all?
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Look, if you want to use primary concern this way, then I can accept that. That means that people have a ton of primary concerns. But if you are going to say that these people are most interested in how attractive someone is when looking for people date, I'm pretty darn sure you are wrong. I know that is not true for me, but, were I looking and the type of person to go on dating sites, I could se myself signing up for this site.
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quote:Originally posted by MrSquicky: Similarly, for many who join Jewish dating sites, they are looking to date in the pool of Jewish people (some, but far from all, exclusively). But, the primary thing is likely not going to be how Jewish someone is.
"Jewish" is a binary factor.
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quote:I was kidding with the people who don't stab me with knives thing
So you mean you actually would be willing to date someone that stabs you with knives? I guess I've heard of stranger things. Posts: 1256 | Registered: May 2005
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I'd think not getting stabbed with knives might be a primary concern in dating. I'd rather not come home with scars after the first date. Maybe others have different feelings about that though. *imagines stabmewithknivesplease.com* Posts: 1960 | Registered: May 2005
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So is "meets a certain set of physical attractiveness standards".
edit: Ooops. Sorry, I misunderstood.
It kind of depends on what definition of Jewishness you are using. The concepts of more Jewish and less Jewish are sensical in some contexts.
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