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» Hatrack River Forum » Active Forums » Books, Films, Food and Culture » Zeugma's "How to delete an account?" Thread (Page 3)

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Author Topic: Zeugma's "How to delete an account?" Thread
rivka
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It's illegal. That's not gray at all.
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Dagonee
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It's not clear at all that it's illegal to post the copyrighted lyrics to a song - it very much depends on the context, including many factors. Fair use is pretty much the textbook example of "gray area." (Edit: To be clear, it is very often illegal to post copyrighted lyrics.)

What is clear is that our hosts have asked that we avoid the gray by following a bright-line rule of 3 lines.

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mr_porteiro_head
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The exact number of lines that you can quote from a song and still be within fair use and not be infringing on copyright is definitely a grey area.
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Dagonee
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Right. The proportion of a copyrighted work copied is 1 of 4 factors used to evaluate fair use. Sometimes copying the entire work is fair use. Sometimes less than one tenth of a percent is not fair use.
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rivka
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quote:
Originally posted by Dagonee:
Sometimes copying the entire work is fair use.

Hmm. Example, please?
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fugu13
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Haikus for academic commentary.
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rivka
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Ok. A haiku or other very short work, especially for academic use, I buy. I am not convinced that the full lyrics (or a large fraction thereof) of a song, for non-academic use, is in the same ballpark.
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fugu13
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A very simple song, consisting of a short melody and a repetitive refrain, could be similarly okay.
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Icarus
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Feliz Navidad.
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fugu13
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Thinking about it, even a more complex song would probably be okay, reproduced piecewise throughout an analysis or somesuch.
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mr_porteiro_head
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Happy Birthday To You.
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Dagonee
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quote:
Ok. A haiku or other very short work, especially for academic use, I buy.
That's black-and-white fair use.

quote:
I am not convinced that the full lyrics (or a large fraction thereof) of a song, for non-academic use, is in the same ballpark.
You're right - it's out of the trivial case and into the gray area.
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fugu13
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Reproducing Happy Birthday To You in many settings is not generally fair use. That's why restaurants who'll do birthday parties for kids generally sing their own little made up ditties. While it is probably fair use to sing for someone's birthday at home (at least, the copyright holder would never dare go after random people for it), reproducing it in print is probably generally not okay.

I suspect the copyright holder of Feliz Navidad has mostly given up trying to enforce it in many situations, either out of benevolence or exasperation [Wink] .

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fugu13
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Oh, I forgot some big ones. Google (and other) internet caches. To distribute copies of the song for study to a class. Copies of almost anything you've already purchased, for limited personal use.
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Threads
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quote:
Originally posted by mr_porteiro_head:
Happy Birthday To You.

Snopes on Happy Birthday
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mr_porteiro_head
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quote:
Reproducing Happy Birthday To You in many settings is not generally fair use.
I suspect that reproducing the lyrics of the two-line song is.


X = "Happy Birthday to you"
Y = "Happy Birtday dear " + name

print X
print X
print Y
print X

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fugu13
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Don't take my word for it, take the courts' (check out the Snopes link). People routinely pay thousands of dollars for the right to present renditions of it (notably in movies).

edit: I do not mean to imply the courts have ruled against reproducing the lyrics. They have ruled on who owns the copyright, and that there is a copyright.

Notably, the song Happy Birthday is based on (Good Morning to All) is in the public domain, so you can sing that all you want. You could even describe the differences between the two lyrics, most definitely.

The courts might even agree you could reproduce the lyrics completely, but I woudn't call it certain.

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mr_porteiro_head
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I didn't call it certain either. I said that I suspected it.
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Samprimary
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Hah. There's threads in poor taste, there's threads in really poor taste, and then there's this.
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Noemon
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And then there's subject/verb agreement!
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Belle
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[ROFL]
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Samprimary
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quote:
Originally posted by Noemon:
And then there's subject/verb agreement!

This moment is preserved on the internet forever >:[
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MightyCow
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There seems to be a lot of snark around here lately [Frown]
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Dobbie
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quote:
You agree not to post any copyrighted material unless the copyright is owned by you or by this BB.

- Rules, Policies, and Disclaimers
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James Tiberius Kirk
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quote:
Originally posted by MightyCow:
There seems to be a lot of snark around here lately [Frown]

Snark is cheap.

--j_k

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Snarky
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That was hurtful. [Frown]
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Hobbes
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quote:
It's illegal. That's not gray at all.
Which apparently can't be said of Noemon's underpants.

Topical humor.

Hobbes [Smile]

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Noemon
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quote:
Originally posted by Samprimary:
quote:
Originally posted by Noemon:
And then there's subject/verb agreement!

This moment is preserved on the internet forever >:[
I'm immortal!
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TheTick
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quote:
Originally posted by Noemon:
quote:
Originally posted by Samprimary:
quote:
Originally posted by Noemon:
And then there's subject/verb agreement!

This moment is preserved on the internet forever >:[
I'm immortal!
I have no rival, no man can be my equal...
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