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Author Topic: So I'm done with Facebook...
Lanfear
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I'm getting ready to turn in my papers and serve a mission for the LDS church, and am slowly giving up unessential things so I can focus time on scripture studying and whatnot.

It's amazing how reflectively I type in Facebook.com before I even realize it.

It was kind of my go-to on the web

Anyways, I'm looking for some philosophy to alternate while I'm reading the scriptures.

I was just curious if anyone had a suggestion. I'm not well versed in philosophy but I would like to be. I have read The Fountainhead and just completed my first philosophy class.

Doesn't have to be religious or anything, just enlightening (which I assume is what philosophy is about)

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Blayne Bradley
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Just so you know, Hatrack is incurable. Facebook is one of those easily fixed diseaseses but Hatrack never goes away.

[Smile]

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Baron Samedi
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Hatrack says the same about you.
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Blayne Bradley
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Yeah but I'm the good kind of itch.

If you had stopped having unprotected sex all the time I wouldn't be here.

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Itsame
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You could always buy a complete works of Plato. Cooper is the best modern translation for a complete set, and it contains all the apocryphal works (you decide whether that is a virtue or not). Nagel has a great collection of essays called Mortal Questions that I just love.
Right now I'm just suggesting short works that you don't have to spend too much time devoted to, but you can always pick up something like Kant's critiques, though that would be significantly more difficult.

Edit: I just thought of something. If you want to be well-versed on philosophy as a whole and be able to discuss, at least to some degree, most topics in philosophy then pick up Copleston's History of Philosophy. It's an 11 volume set on the history of philosophy. Extremely detailed coverage. Copleston was a specialist in medieval philosophy, so the section on that is unbeatable.

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Samprimary
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quote:
Originally posted by Blayne Bradley:
Yeah but I'm the good kind of itch.

If you had stopped having unprotected sex all the time I wouldn't be here.

... you're the clap, wow.
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Jhai
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I would suggest you try your hand browsing around the Stanford Encyclopedia of Philosophy, if you're looking for a website to replace facebook. The articles are well researched, up-to-date on the latest discussions, hyperlinked, and there's enough interesting topics that you don't feel like you're just reading a textbook. And when you find an offbeat topic you can follow back to the articles which discuss the basics that you'll find yourself learning quite a bit.

I don't recommend that you try to read any of the typical "classics" of philosophy right now. These are books that are almost always better when discussed in a class with a professor who can explain the background of the philosophical discussion at the time, and help with language problems that might be a result of translation issues. Stick to modern texts, which tend to be a bit more user friendly, and often originally written in English.

If you're interested in ethics specifically, I can give you some good options of interesting texts. If there's another topic that interests you, I can point you towards some resources as well.

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Phanto
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well at least he has high self esteem
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Orincoro
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Personally I'd skip Plato and all the stoic philosophers and pick up a "selected works of Ralph Waldo Emerson." He is one of the most accessible philosophers, especially for an American, and you will really gain a better appreciation of how the American culture came to be what it is today, and why. It represents the best of our worldview, in my opinion.
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natural_mystic
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I would go for Russell's History of Philosophy. He's a great writer, and it's not unduly long.

If you are not interested in who said what and just want a book that examines fundamental questions, I agree with JonHecht that 'Mortal Questions' is a great read.

[ December 11, 2008, 11:54 AM: Message edited by: natural_mystic ]

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Armoth
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I'm currently listening to the Barnes and Noble's portable professor lecture series in philosophy. It's given by Peter Kraft - very enjoyable.
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Itsame
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With all due respect, I disagree with the suggestion concerning Russell's History of Philosophy. While he is a fantastic philosopher, and a great writer, he is a logician. His book doesn't seem to be a true work of scholarship, but seems more like a drunken philosopher at a bar saying, "Ehhh, that Huuuummmeee guy.... I dun like him!"


Just my opinion.

Edit: Once again, my top choice is Copleston's set. If you read those, then you'll be better versed in the history of philosophy than many grad students (and professors for that matter).

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twinky
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Plato
Aristotle
Aquinas
Augustine
Descartes
Hobbes
Locke
Mill

All good places to start. Just, whatever you do, don't start with Kant.

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Blayne Bradley
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Emmanual Kant?
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Itsame
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What kind of sadist would recommend starting with Locke or Hobbes? They're practically unreadable!

Edit... again: As well, many of Aristotle's works are extremely difficult (metaphysics, for example). People seem to have something against Kant, but not *everything* he wrote is difficult. Well, maybe. But also published is a book which is a compilation of his lectures on ethics, aptly entitled: Lectures on Ethics. It's a pretty easy read, imo.

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Orincoro
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quote:
Originally posted by Blayne Bradley:
Emmanual Kant?

No, Fernando Kant.... stupid.
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Armoth
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If you are a religious man, and I'm assuming you are since you're going on LDS mission and everything, why not pick up some Maimonides?
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dantesparadigm
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I hadn't taken any philosophy courses at the start of this semester, and I took a fairly innocuous sounding course on literary theory. It ended up being a rather rigorous course on philosophy that included me being thrown headfirst into Immanuel Kant. (He broke three ribs, I got a concussion.) It is probably not the best idea. I'd recommend starting with Plato and Aristotle, which will give you a solid grounding in the conceptual stuff. Then move on to Quintilian, who will help you understand the rhetoric. From there you can go with whomever you find interesting.
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King of Men
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I must say, it's difficult to have any respect for a field in which stuff written literally millennia ago is still considered up-to-date enough to be recommended.
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Jhai
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KoM, there's no need to update philosophy texts any more than there's need to update calculus, and for exactly the same reason.

Do you not respect mathematics?

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twinky
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quote:
Originally posted by King of Men:
I must say, it's difficult to have any respect for a field in which stuff written literally millennia ago is still considered up-to-date enough to be recommended.

Did you never study the Pythagorean Theorem in grade school geometry?
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Darth_Mauve
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If this is something to bring with you, I picked up a hardbound book on Symbolic Logic in my first semester of college. My high school math teachers said it wasn't really math and skipped those chapters in the books. My uncle, and of course Mr. Spock, convinced me to look into it.

The book is still on my shelf today, and I turn to it when I want some straight-forward logic puzzles as philosophy.

A v ~A
~A

Something fun and portable and no batteries needed.

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Baron Samedi
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quote:
Originally posted by King of Men:
I must say, it's difficult to have any respect for a field in which stuff written literally millennia ago is still considered up-to-date enough to be recommended.

So exactly how old can an interesting thought or a beautiful idea be before it suddenly becomes worthless?
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King of Men
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Yes, I did. In grade school.
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Itsame
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quote:
Originally posted by King of Men:
Yes, I did. In grade school.

Because you were laying the foundation for further development. Without these foundational works, it is hard to understand what comes later.
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Baron Samedi
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You know, atheist philosophers have been around for "literally millenia." Mary Baker Eddy, on the other hand, was born less than 200 years ago. I guess that means your philosophy is inferior to Christian Science.

(What do I win for converting King of Men?)

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Darth_Mauve
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quote:
I must say, it's difficult to have any respect for a field in which stuff written literally millennia ago is still considered up-to-date enough to be recommended.
I've heard the exact same argument used against the Bible
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King of Men
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Yes, well?
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Jhai
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Yeah, that isn't going to go anywhere, Darth_Mauve.
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natural_mystic
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quote:
Originally posted by JonHecht:
[QB] With all due respect, I disagree with the suggestion concerning Russell's History of Philosophy. While he is a fantastic philosopher, and a great writer, he is a logician. His book doesn't seem to be a true work of scholarship, but seems more like a drunken philosopher at a bar saying, "Ehhh, that Huuuummmeee guy.... I dun like him!"


Just my opinion.


I don't disagree with this - although I think his analysis is slightly more sophisticated than your example. It is definitely his take on the philosophers, and sometimes what he emphasizes is quite different from the emphasis given in an academic setting.

However, just as I like to know what my favorite authors think about other authors, the same goes for philosophers. And Russell is a top writer, so it is very readable and entertaining.

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twinky
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quote:
Originally posted by King of Men:
Yes, I did. In grade school.

Prior to studying more and more advanced and recent mathematical concepts.

Reading philosophy through the ages is like reading a really long discussion thread with a ton of different interesting ideas. If you don't read the stuff at the start, or at least read about the stuff at the start, it's harder to make sense of the stuff at the end.

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Lanfear
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Lot's of suggestions everywhere guys. Thanks for the help.

I've read a fair bit of Mill throughout the course, specifically his stuff on free will. I quite enjoyed it. It did take me a while to get into it though..

I'm quite interested in reading Beyond Good and Evil, by nietzsche

Our teacher said it was good.

And I don't think something loses relevance the older it is.

My usual problem with philosophy is when it loses all practicality. I don't know if that makes sense.

I'm a pretty practical person, and during class when we would discuss logic puzzles, or paradoxes, or free will, sometimes it would not be practical. As in, even if we solved the problem, it wouldn't help us do anything.

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TomDavidson
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Beyond Good and Evil is a great read, full of fun aphorisms that I, at least, get the impression the author only wished he actually meant. [Smile]
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natural_mystic
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quote:
Originally posted by Lanfear:

My usual problem with philosophy is when it loses all practicality. I don't know if that makes sense.

I'm a pretty practical person, and during class when we would discuss logic puzzles, or paradoxes, or free will, sometimes it would not be practical. As in, even if we solved the problem, it wouldn't help us do anything. [/QB]

I can also recommend some good electrical engineering texts.
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