posted
I did yesterday while at B&N. I must say, while I love David Tennant (as all decent, good people should), I'm now cautiously enthusiastic about Matt. He seems like a genuinely smart, nice, quirky, excitable guy.
Just the qualities I like in my Doctors.
There's also a hilarious essay by Steven Moffat about how he initially rejected the Second Doctor "because he's too young!" ...and now he's running the series with the youngest Doctor on record.
Will the Regeneration happen this year, during the specials? Or are they going to wait for Series 5? Does anyone know?
Posts: 6689 | Registered: Jan 2005
| IP: Logged |
Blayne Bradley
unregistered
posted
we sure hes the next doctor? I hard rumors of Patrick Stewart.
IP: Logged |
posted
I think everyone is assuming he'll turn up at the start of season 5 with the changeover to the new team. But really, who can tell? (Though I am hearing some wonderful spoilers about the Christmas specials…)
I'm cautiously optimistic too - he was in a TV show I saw an episode of the other week and although his part was reasonably tiny and completely different from the Doctor, there was a moment where I just went 'now I can see why they might have picked him'. He definitely has that odd, 'happily oblivious to what most humans would do in this situation' quality down pat.
Plus, he looks quite weird. Physically, I think the Doctor needs to be a bit off-beat. I'm hopeful.
Meanwhile, they need to get Patrick Stewart on the show doing something. He’s amazing.
Posts: 1528 | Registered: Nov 2004
| IP: Logged |
posted
They're showing a special for Easter, a special for Xmas, and then a 2-part special around New Year's that'll be Tennant's last.
Posts: 2911 | Registered: Aug 2001
| IP: Logged |
posted
Personally, I'm hoping Matt is the Doctor who will meet River Song "for the first time" (her perspective, of course).
Posts: 6689 | Registered: Jan 2005
| IP: Logged |
quote:Originally posted by Puffy Treat: Personally, I'm hoping Matt is the Doctor who will meet River Song "for the first time" (her perspective, of course).
Oh, that would be awesome. I'm a big fan of Alex Kingston. Posts: 21182 | Registered: Sep 2004
| IP: Logged |
posted
I wonder if they'll have her show up in any of Tennant's specials?
(Hmm, maybe not, the specials all are being written by RTD, and she's more of Steven Moffat's character...)
Posts: 2911 | Registered: Aug 2001
| IP: Logged |
quote:Originally posted by plaid: I wonder if they'll have her show up in any of Tennant's specials?
(Hmm, maybe not, the specials all are being written by RTD, and she's more of Steven Moffat's character...)
Well, that, and she didn't seem to have seen that incarnation of the Doctor before those two episodes.
Posts: 21182 | Registered: Sep 2004
| IP: Logged |
posted
KQ, are you saying that she didn't seem to have seen Tennant's incarnation of the Doctor before those two episodes?
Posts: 16059 | Registered: Aug 2000
| IP: Logged |
posted
I know - that whole situation is so odd. On one hand it's heavily implied in the episodes that she knows Tennant's Doctor - she recognises him instantly, implies that his face looks like it did when they hadn't known each other long - all of which you'd think would be impossible if she hadn't met him in this body before. On the other hand, she also seems to know a future him, one where he's become ancient, wise and all powerful, and we haven't seen Doctor Ten turn into that man. Unless the specials take place over a few hundred years of his life, we'll just have to assume that since she'd told him what she wanted him to be, he went off, found her, and pretended to be extra-specially cool and clever to make her happy. And told her his name so past him would trust future her. Which is all a bit calculating and sad.
Posts: 1528 | Registered: Nov 2004
| IP: Logged |
posted
Either way, I'm really hoping that at least one of the specials involves his meeting her. If that doesn't happen, it seems to me that they will have introduced a huge continuity error into the show.
Although I suppose it isn't as though every moment of The Doctor's life is shown in the program; you could argue that they just happened not to choose to tell any stories from the period of time in which they met, fell for each other, and got married. That would be lame, but it could still be argued.
Posts: 16059 | Registered: Aug 2000
| IP: Logged |
posted
Plus it would be awkward if they tried to argue that 11 is her Doctor -- Matt Smith looks like he could be her baby! Posts: 3516 | Registered: Sep 2002
| IP: Logged |
quote:Originally posted by Noemon: Why do you think that?
I tend to agree with kq on this, especially having watched those two episodes a good four times (due to rewatching with friends and family who hadn't seen them yet), the last being on Saturday two days ago.
Anyway, some shaky evidence to thinking she hadn't seen Tennant's incarnation is that she's really scrutinizing him in the scene where she says she'd never seen him look so young. I'm of the opinion that it's not so much his physical appearance she's referring to but to...I don't know...his eyes or expression or whatever signs might tell of maturity level. It's like when a young child goes through something tragic, and an observer might note how old they've become in such a short time. I think it's something like that.
And now I can't remember why else I don't think she'd seen him in that form. Darn.
I just don't think there's any evidence there to make a good case for her having seen him as Ten before that moment either.
It's like Sarah Jane. She figured out quickly it was the Doctor even though he looked completely different.
As to the question of whether Matt Smith is it, I'm pretty sure someone on this forum posted a link to an interview with him and also with David Tennant a few weeks ago. (If not here, it might have been on LJ.) I also watched an interview with Catherine Tate recently in which she mentioned the announcement of the next doctor. She was half convinced by some paper or magazine calling her for an interview that it was her even though the BBC had never approached her. Quite funny!
Posts: 691 | Registered: Nov 2008
| IP: Logged |
quote:Originally posted by Traceria: Anyway, some shaky evidence to thinking she hadn't seen Tennant's incarnation is that she's really scrutinizing him in the scene where she says she'd never seen him look so young. I'm of the opinion that it's not so much his physical appearance she's referring to but to...I don't know...his eyes or expression or whatever signs might tell of maturity level. It's like when a young child goes through something tragic, and an observer might note how old they've become in such a short time. I think it's something like that.
I would agree with your description of the way she looks at him, but I see it as evidence that she had seen him in that body before. It was only when she scrutinized him closely like that that she was able to perceive the difference in him. They were fine distinctions caused by experience that she was picking up on, not ones of gross anatomy. When she first saw him, before she had had a chance to really gaze into his eyes and perceive those subtle differences in him, she didn't consider the possibility that the incarnation she was interacting with wouldn't have knowledge of her. All of that suggests to me a strong familiarity with that particular body.
You compare her recognition of him with Sarah Jane's. The difference between them is that Sarah Jane's was tentative--she thought that it might be him, but because of the different body, she wasn't certain. River Song knew who he was the instant she laid eyes on him. It didn't even occur to her that he might be someone else, or that he might not know who she was. I think that it's reasonable to attribute the difference between the two characters' reactions to him to the fact that the one was familiar with that particular form, and the other was not.
Posts: 16059 | Registered: Aug 2000
| IP: Logged |
posted
Good points, but my jury's still out. What you have done is made me wonder if she's there for his regeneration early in the next season or one of those specials... Hmm. No, that wouldn't work too well. I guess we'll just have to find out!
I'd be highly disappointed if what you mentioned ends up being the case, that they don't tell us those stories.
Posts: 691 | Registered: Nov 2008
| IP: Logged |
posted
I think she is supposed to recognize Tennant's incarnation, but I don't worry about it because that's just Moffat, who apparently was writing a completely different series from RTD's.
Seriously - look at Girl in the Fireplace. It's a lovely story, but it sticks out like a sore thumb in season two. It doesn't fit the season's story, it doesn't match emotionally with the epidodes before and after, and the Doctor in it acts more like Captain Kirk than the Doctor himself the rest of the time.
So, the Library two-parter clearly takes place in an alternative universe. Add in the dropped sub-plot of the stuttering sweetheart for Donna, and that clinches it.
Posts: 26077 | Registered: Mar 2000
| IP: Logged |
posted
I'm with Noemon on this. I was thinking at the time that they didn't have enough DT episodes left to explore that story and it had to be that incarnation.
Unless, somehow, Rose's Doctor is involved. And that would be wrong.
Posts: 11187 | Registered: Sep 2005
| IP: Logged |
quote:Originally posted by Traceria: Good points, but my jury's still out.
If you rewatch it, or if your other reasons reoccur to you, I'd be really interested to hear them (both because they're interesting and because I like talking about the show in general )
quote:What you have done is made me wonder if she's there for his regeneration early in the next season or one of those specials... Hmm. No, that wouldn't work too well.
I'm hoping that she's in two of them. We can tell from the two shows that she's already been in that unlike his regular companions, they have an enduring relationship outside of travelling around together. She's clearly spent lots of time with her, but at the same time it's clear that she's used to (and fine with) spending time apart. I'd like to see an episode that revolves around their meeting, and then another where they meet up and both recognize each other (and this one could be his regeneration, as long as they make it clear that they've had years of interactions that we as the audience simply haven't been shown directly).
quote:I'd be highly disappointed if what you mentioned ends up being the case, that they don't tell us those stories.
Me too! I want at least a taste of them! What I'd really like is one more season of Tennant after this year's specials, in which (among other things) their relationship could be further fleshed out for us, but that's not going to happen.
Posts: 16059 | Registered: Aug 2000
| IP: Logged |
quote:Originally posted by katharina: Add in the dropped sub-plot of the stuttering sweetheart for Donna, and that clinches it.
Man, I was really pulling for her, too. "Gorgeous and can't speak a word." XD
Edit since we were apparently typing at the same time, Noemon: Maybe I'll have to peruse the scenes again to jog my memory. I like your plan for bringing her back into the story. Do you think they'd have a problem with you writing an episode or three? Posts: 691 | Registered: Nov 2008
| IP: Logged |
quote:Originally posted by katharina: Seriously - look at Girl in the Fireplace. It's a lovely story, but it sticks out like a sore thumb in season two. It doesn't fit the season's story, it doesn't match emotionally with the epidodes before and after, and the Doctor in it acts more like Captain Kirk than the Doctor himself the rest of the time.
Well, but Mofatt has outright said that he hadn't read the end of School Reunion, and as a result didn't realize what the state of Rose's and Mickey's relationship was, right? And he left of the Torchwood references specifically at RTD's request, didn't he?
As for the Doctor falling in love with Reinette, it was painful to see him being so mercurial with regard to his emotions (or rather, painful seeing Rose realize that she was being left behind, emotionally), but it wasn't really outside his character to be that way.
Posts: 16059 | Registered: Aug 2000
| IP: Logged |
posted
Take this with a huge grain of salt because I read it on one of the Doctor Who wikis, but apparently Moffat stated at ComicCon 2008 that River has met other incarnations of the Doctor in addition to Ten.
Posts: 6689 | Registered: Jan 2005
| IP: Logged |
I could believe that River's relationship with him spans more than one incarnation; I just feel like it has to start with Tennant's.
Posts: 16059 | Registered: Aug 2000
| IP: Logged |
quote:As for the Doctor falling in love with Reinette, it was painful to see him being so mercurial with regard to his emotions (or rather, painful seeing Rose realize that she was being left behind, emotionally), but it wasn't really outside his character to be that way.
It was, kind of, for Rose. I mean, one episode before there was this conversation:
Rose: "Is that what happens? Will you just leave me behind?" Doctor: "No. Not you."
Girl in the Fireplace doesn't fit with that. He did leave Rose behind in that episode, and stuck on a futuristic spaceship with killer robots, no less. It doesn't fit with the "I'm on my honeymoon." giggles with Rose that permeated the whole rest of the season. It's like he had a stroke or hisself from a different time fell through a wormhole just for the one episode. If he left her behind emotionally, he came running back and just in the next episode was Rose's sweetheart again, making Mickey feel bad about how the circle of the two of them didn't leave room for anyone else.
Posts: 26077 | Registered: Mar 2000
| IP: Logged |
quote:Originally posted by Noemon: Did he go into any more detail than that?
I could believe that River's relationship with him spans more than one incarnation; I just feel like it has to start with Tennant's.
The wiki article describes it as a "slip", so I'm guessing whoever added that tidbit (if they are reliable) thought he hadn't intended to reveal that much.
Posts: 6689 | Registered: Jan 2005
| IP: Logged |
quote:Originally posted by Leonide: Plus it would be awkward if they tried to argue that 11 is her Doctor -- Matt Smith looks like he could be her baby!
Not if 11 meets a younger version of River.
If he does. I'm not particularly attached to an incarnation and a way they have to meet. Posts: 6689 | Registered: Jan 2005
| IP: Logged |
posted
We haven't really marked spoilers in this thread, even though we're going into a lot of stuff, but just in case
SPOILER
Maybe 11 will meet a young River Song. And then it will be a sort of pseudo-Reinette situation, with the Doctor popping back in over time throughout his travels as she grows older. Then the ages will align more appropriately, and she can see him "change" but get used to him enough to have recognized him "instantly" as 10.
Question: Does the Doctor ever keep pictures of himself? Why wouldn't he ever show someone, especially someone as important as River Song supposedly is, pictures of his previous incarnations?
edit: lol, puffy, i didn't see your post before I posted! Posts: 3516 | Registered: Sep 2002
| IP: Logged |
posted
I wouldn't be surprised if at some point we find out that River can change appearance, too, so that more than one actress can play her...
Posts: 2911 | Registered: Aug 2001
| IP: Logged |
posted
I didn't like her as River. She seemed way too smug. I didn't get why the Doctor would like her.
Posts: 26077 | Registered: Mar 2000
| IP: Logged |
Blayne Bradley
unregistered
posted
Probably grew into it.
Also, the thing with Renneit is that I merely assumed that she was in person so amazing a woman that he was just smitten with love. Inferred Ability so to speak.
IP: Logged |
posted
I like the whole idea of the River Song/Doctor relationship; after Rose, there's no easy way to do a Doctor-falls-in-love-with-random-young-Londoner story again. This should definitely be different.
Posts: 2911 | Registered: Aug 2001
| IP: Logged |
posted
On another 11th Doctor topic, which classic adversaries (if any) would you like to see return in Series 5?
I think the Daleks and Cybermen have been well and truly beaten into the ground, now. Give them a rest. At least until...oh...Series 7?
I wouldn't mind seeing the Master return, especially if that mysterious woman's hand turns out to have been the Rani after all. But then, supposedly Nine and "Yana" were the last Time Lords...supposedly.
Posts: 6689 | Registered: Jan 2005
| IP: Logged |
posted
I want Neil Gaiman to write an episode toooo. But I wish he could write one while David Tennant was still there. I do not like this young upstart.
Posts: 910 | Registered: May 2000
| IP: Logged |
quote:Originally posted by plaid: I like the Daleks.
I like 'em too! It's just...they're a tad overexposed in the new series. If the Series 4 finale hadn't brought back Davros (who is awesome) and made Caan so cool, I wouldn't have enjoyed it half so much as I did.
Posts: 6689 | Registered: Jan 2005
| IP: Logged |
quote:Originally posted by Noemon: You compare her recognition of him with Sarah Jane's. The difference between them is that Sarah Jane's was tentative--she thought that it might be him, but because of the different body, she wasn't certain. River Song knew who he was the instant she laid eyes on him. It didn't even occur to her that he might be someone else, or that he might not know who she was. I think that it's reasonable to attribute the difference between the two characters' reactions to him to the fact that the one was familiar with that particular form, and the other was not.
I wonder if she might have seen a photograph of him as Ten? There is definitely videotape out there with him on it, too. (convoluted, I know, and not so clear as to why she expects him to recognize her -- unless maybe [this part made no sense, so let's just forget it]? I'm unsettled by how many versions all with time travel mean any one of them could come in at any period)
------------------------
quote:Originally posted by Leonide: Question: Does the Doctor ever keep pictures of himself? Why wouldn't he ever show someone, especially someone as important as River Song supposedly is, pictures of his previous incarnations?
Egads! Er, what she said. Posts: 14017 | Registered: May 2000
| IP: Logged |
In the scene where River's flicking through the diary trying to find out when they are, she casually squints at him and says 'Going by your face, I'd say it's early days for you, yeah?' Which doesn't imply anything until she then goes on to ask him whether they've done the various trips that she's noted down on the early pages of her diary - suggesting that he looked this way when they first met and that she's using the way he looks to judge what they've done together. She's surprised when he doesn't remember them, then flicks back towards the very beginning of the book. It's only when she stops vaguely glancing at him and really stares into his eyes that she figures out that he's at all different. If they did ever want to revisit the story, I think they'd just have to ignore this scene.
As for baddies - I'd like them to make up some new ones. Really, really scary ones. I'm just not sure Daleks are getting the kids hiding behind the sofa anymore. Still, scary is subjective. When I was little, watching reruns of old episodes, I thought the Autons were terrifying. Posts: 1528 | Registered: Nov 2004
| IP: Logged |
posted
Thanks for looking that up, Bella. There would still be room to work that in, but they'd have to revisit the storyline immediately, and make it clear that decades have passed (from The Doctor's POV) between meeting and becoming involved with River and regeneration.
quote:Originally posted by Bella Bee: As for baddies - I'd like them to make up some new ones. Really, really scary ones. I'm just not sure Daleks are getting the kids hiding behind the sofa anymore.
Yeah, I agree. I wast ticking through my mental list of Doctor Who monsters, and many of my favorites have been very creative one-off enemies that it wouldn't make sense to revisit. Time for some new, compelling, villains.
Posts: 16059 | Registered: Aug 2000
| IP: Logged |
Blayne Bradley
unregistered
posted
Speak for yourselves I'm 21 and I'm still scared out of my pants when daleks are around.
IP: Logged |
Printer-friendly view of this topic
![[Cool]](cool.gif)
![[Big Grin]](biggrin.gif)
![[Smile]](smile.gif)
![[Cry]](graemlins/cry.gif)
![[Wink]](wink.gif)
![[Frown]](frown.gif)
![[Blushing]](graemlins/blushing.gif)
