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Author Topic: Grad School Application Thread
Lyrhawn
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9 for me. If I have to do this all over again, it'll probably be like 12. I'll cut out a couple of the PhD programs and add in a lot more masters programs. Problem is that once you get to schools that offer a terminal MA, you're already in the second tier. For history, all of the best programs, and a lot of the decent ones only offer a combined MA/PhD.
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Strider
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Lyrhawn, it's not too late to apply to more MA programs. Most of their deadlines are later.
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Lyrhawn
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I'm looking into it. Part of me wanted to wait until I heard back from places. A few of the places I've looked at have rolling admissions, which makes me think my application will be a waste of money since I really can't go anywhere decent without funding, and funding decisions will have been made by now for a lot of the places I was considering.

I'm looking at a couple of really local places that I really don't want to go to, but it'd be a way to kill a year.

This is something that I'll probably look into a lot more closely when more rejection letters come flooding in.

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Dr Strangelove
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For the record, Lyr, at FSU the funding decision won't be made until next Friday. Not that you applied here (we have a couple Latin Americanist's who do labor history!), but just sayin. I myself am eagerly awaiting the decision as to whether or not I got a coveted summer teaching position (complete with the all important summer tuition waiver). I am one of two people qualified to teach my class, but I think my chances are pretty good.
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Itsame
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Berkeley sent out acceptances and I was not among the recipients.

[ February 15, 2011, 12:06 AM: Message edited by: JonHecht ]

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Lyrhawn
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Got an email today from Nebraska saying I was recommended for admission.

Nothing to get excited about. It's not official, and no word on funding (which is vital, I probably won't even go without SOME sort of funding), it's my backup school, and it's an MA program, which means it was the easiest thing I applied for since most of them will take anyone who'll pay tuition.

I'm kind of pissed now though. My car broke down yesterday, and I had a dream of being accepted somewhere; two signs that I was SURE meant good news sometime in the next few days, and I wake up to finding out I probably got into my safety school. Not what I was hoping for. Wasted a perfectly good Ford Focus on this.

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rivka
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How is a car breaking down a sign of anything other than a hit on your wallet?
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Lyrhawn
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Last October after my car was smashed into and some stuff was stolen, I found out almost the next day that I'd won second place in a national research paper writing contest. A month later, when I was on my way to take my car in to get the window fixed, my engine exploded, and the next day I found out that I'd won my university's Undergraduate Distinguished Achievement Award (pretty snazzy around these parts).

Every time my car has been broken into or broken down in the last few months, I've gotten great news from school soon afterward. Plus when I got that national award, I actually had a dream the night before that I'd won second place.

I thought between my car breaking down and the dream I had the other night, great news was sure to come. I'm convinced that my car breaking down is now a good omen. But it looks like this is the good news. Sure, it's still good, but not great.

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rivka
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Past performance is no guarantee of future results.
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Lyrhawn
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I'm three steps away from making a wish on a magic monkey's paw.

Clearly I've already abandoned the level of reason you're trying to apply. [Smile]

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Itsame
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Right now I'm 0/3 with 13 left.
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rivka
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quote:
Originally posted by Lyrhawn:
I'm three steps away from making a wish on a magic monkey's paw.

Clearly I've already abandoned the level of reason you're trying to apply. [Smile]

And yet you have refrained from requesting that people at Hatrack pray for you. I admire your restraint. [Wink]
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Itsame
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U of Arizona sent out acceptances. I was, once again, not recipient. This is getting quite depressing.
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Lyrhawn
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You still have plenty of options left and it only takes one. You can't expect to get in everywhere.

Of course, when people tell me that after I get a rejection, I don't feel any better, but it's the standard issue advice. Also, are your schools sending out staggered letters? Many of my schools have already sent out letters to the top students, but there's still a list of finalists that they haven't made a decision on yet, but still have a chance for admission.

If the rejection letters have gone out and you haven't gotten one, there's still a chance.

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Destineer
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Arizona rejected me as well, Jon. Hang in there. [Smile]
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Itsame
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Thanks guys. We'll see what happens.

Edit: And that actually makes me feel a lot better, Destineer.

Edit2: The real thing is that I thought I was a much stronger candidate, based on what my professors all said. I guess I'm not as a strong a candidate as I thought.

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Lyrhawn
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I've taken everything I've ever been told with a huge grain of salt. But you have to look at it this way as well: Pretty much every professor I've corresponded with in the last month has warned me that regardless of my personal credentials, this is maybe the worst year to apply for a PhD program in the last couple decades. Between the economy, the major cutbacks to the humanities, and the overwhelming boom in the sheer number of applicants, even the most qualified applicants are going to have serious competition. And it's only made worse by the fact that you're likely competing with a large crowd of masters students who are transferring (I cant remember if you're doing the PhD route, but even worse if that's the case).

My main professor at my undergrad school that I've been sort of taking my cues from told me that 20 years ago I'd have been a sure thing almost anywhere, but it's a different world out there. He also told me that I was a serious candidate, but that a lot of it was going to come down to a lucky break. It realistic advice and I appreciate it, and every prof that I emailed during the pre-admissions time said it was a tough year for everyone.

A lot of it isn't your fault, or has nothing to do with you being strong or not.

For myself personally, I found out that I made it past the first cut at Indiana, but there are still a few dozen of us competing for the less than 10 spots that remain, so while the odds are improved, it's still very difficult, and I'm barely even taking that as good news.

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Jon Boy
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I have a phone interview with Northern Arizona University tomorrow. I didn't even know they did phone interviews for grad school. Anyone have any advice?
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rivka
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No advice from me, just good wishes. Good luck!
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Lyrhawn
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I've heard of both phone and Skype interviews even. I've never been in one, but from what I've heard, it can often be just a casual conversation where they want to get to know you better than your application can tell.

Good luck!

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Jon Boy
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Thanks! I feel like it went pretty well. I've only heard back from one other school so far, and I was rejected. But they said at the end of the call that they're very interested in me, so obviously that's encouraging.
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Lyrhawn
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Just got a phone call from the graduate chair of the history program at Nebraska. Funded offer for their MA program in history.

I'm very excited. [Smile]

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dkw
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Congrats! Is that at Omaha or Lincoln?
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rivka
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Jonathon, that does sound encouraging. [Smile]

Congrats, Lyr!

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Jon Boy
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Congrats, Lyrhawn!

And good luck to everyone else who's still waiting to hear back from schools.

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Itsame
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Congrats, Lyr! You're the first Hatrack admit of the season.
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Lyrhawn
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Thanks for the congrats, all. [Smile]

It's Nebraska-Lincoln.

It was a surreal conversation with the grad chair. I was in the middle of reading the email from the department letting me know that I'd officially gotten in when my phone rang. I saw the area code (definitely not from around here) and thought maybe it was from a college I'd applied to. It was the grad chair who was nice and complimentary (which was really flattering, I actually felt like I was being courted in some way, which is new for me), and he called not only to congratulate me on acceptance but to offer funding, which blew my mind.

From everything I've heard, getting a funded MA in the humanities is even harder than getting a funded PhD, because all the money goes to the PhD students, but I knew there were a few TA spots open, and luckily I got one.

They offered to fly me out there in April for the big graduate program thing that they put on. My mom's first question when I told her was, "yeah but, you're still waiting to hear from other places right, places closer to home? Hm?" That reminded me that I really might be moving to Nebraska!. Normally that might fill me with dread, but right now I'm just excited for the adventure, and it's only two years before I apply to another PhD program.

And of course, I still might hear back from another school with good news, so there are still balls in the air. It's a huge relief though to know I'll still be in school next year, and I won't have to go bankrupt to do it!

Huzzah!

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rivka
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quote:
Originally posted by Lyrhawn:
I actually felt like I was being courted in some way

They want to fly you out for an event and are funding you -- you ARE being courted.

Enjoy! [Big Grin]

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airmanfour
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Congrats, Lyr!
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Dr Strangelove
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Wow Lyr, that's amazing! Congrats!
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Itsame
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Got into NIU MA program and am in top 5 waitlist for funding. They have an incredibly good placement record for people going on to phd programs.
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Lyrhawn
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Congrats Jon! I hope things break your way for funding. You're going to love the weather. [Smile]

On my front, it looks like Michigan made a lot of offers today and I didn't get a phone call. Not surprising, but a little sad since it was my first choice, the fit was so good, and it would have been close to home. Oh well.

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Belle
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Congratulations to both of you! That is fantastic news.

[Smile]

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Itsame
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Michigan, UMass, and UCLA sent out acceptances. It looks like I'll probably be going to an MA program (or Fulbright then MA) next year.

Edit: What's really frustrating is that in light of my GPA, I'm not even sure I got I made it past the first round cut off at any of these places. I wish I knew how I could have made my application stronger.

Edit2: Mich sent out their waitlists. Also didn't receive that.

[ February 23, 2011, 10:51 PM: Message edited by: JonHecht ]

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Lyrhawn
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Lots of people have differing opinions on etiquette regarding contacting grad chairs to ask about your rejection, but so long as you word it right, I don't think there's anything wrong with it.

Someone linked me to a thread on another board where professors were throwing a major tantrum over students who email them or show up in person to complain about being rejected, but it seems that the majority of their complaints were about people who never had any business applying to grad school.

I think you're within your rights to email a chair and say something to effect of "Hello. I recently received a rejection letter from your program, and I'm wondering if you could provide me with some constructive criticism. I'm not here to complain about your decision, for while I'm disappointed, I'm far more interested in knowing what I can do next year to improve my chances for admission."

Some places probably won't like that, but some are perfectly willing to explain the problem with your application, or at least explain their process so you know if your GPA cut you before you even made it to the committee for review. It could also be that you sailed through with flying colors but the larger powers that be axed you for a GPA, so you might have been fine. There's really no way to know, but from what you've told me, your GPA, when combined with your other numbers, shouldn't have been enough to cut you in the first round.

If I had to guess, I'd say that a lot of your problem is that you applied to a lot of really good schools, and you're competing not only with other talented undergrads, but probably a lot of MA students who want to get their PhD but have an extra couple years of experience (and likely publications) over you. That's a lot of what I ran into this year, and I think a big part of why the only place I am accepted to is Nebraska is because it's an MA program that I'm only competing with other undergrads for (that and it's not a top history program, sadly).

Michigan had me pretty sad too. My Penn rejection letter came in my email on Monday. I wasn't too broken up about it since it was probably never going to happen anyway, but Michigan was really my top choice, even if it was just as unlikely. But oh well, in two years I'll apply to Michigan again with an MA under my belt. I think where you get your PhD, when it comes to the job market, is likely going to prove more valuable than where you got your MA.

Besides, you still have other schools to hear from!

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Itsame
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And like that, the only schools left to send notices are NYU and Rutgers. Thus far, I have not been admitted to any PhD programs. On the upside, I started learning Greek and have been working on a paper on how counterfactual semantics informs certain accounts of knowhow. On the downside, both these efforts are hindered by the fact that since I graduated, I lack access to both a library and articles that require library membership.
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katharina
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When I applied with just a B.A., I applied to both Ph.D. and M.A. programs. I was rejected from every Ph.D. program; I was accepted to every M.A. program, one with full funding.

Y'all's experiences make me wonder if giving PhD program preference to those who already have M.A. degrees is the norm now.

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Itsame
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I've heard that a few programs, Rutgers included, are reserving at least half their spots for MA students.
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Lyrhawn
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History programs lately have been moving towards a "funding for all" way of doing things, so they accept far fewer, but everyone gets a full ride, and most of those spots go to MA students. This is making things a little tricky since the best programs don't even offer a terminal masters, only a combined program, so you either need to be the best BA student in the country, or get an MA from a lesser program. That's fine with me I suppose, but I might have applied differently had I known that in November.

There's also far, far less funding available for MA students. PhD students are getting a better chance of funding as the years go on, and Masters students less so. I got lucky as all get out.

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Itsame
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Having been universally rejected from by PhD programs, I'll assume my writing sample wasn't as good as I had thought. No big deal--I'll work on it for next time. [Dont Know]

Well, Lyrhawn, let's have fun applying again after our profiles have improved!

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Destineer
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quote:
Originally posted by JonHecht:
Having been universally rejected from by PhD programs, I'll assume my writing sample wasn't as good as I had thought. No big deal--I'll work on it for next time.

This is definitely the right way to look at it.

Looking back, I'm not sure if the advice I gave you about your sample was much help. There's definitely one thing I wish I'd said, which can hopefully be of some help down the line. My sense of your work style (which may or may not be at all accurate given how little I've really seen) is that you tend to have a lot of different projects going in a lot of different areas.

I certainly know how awesome that is. But if you're getting evaluated on the basis of samples of your work, I can't stress enough how important it is to have one really good paper. If you have one amazing paper you can show around, especially at the graduate admissions stage, the rest of your work isn't going to matter that much either way. This means that focusing on one piece of work and honing it to perfection, or as near as you can get it, can be a huge advantage for you -- even if it means ignoring other things you want to work on.

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Itsame
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That sounds about right as a description of me. Heck, right now I am:

a) Working on a paper on how counterfactual semantics informs certain accounts of know-how in a way that avoids potential pitfalls.

b) Abductive reasoning conjoined with, oddly, semantic externalism (!) can lead us to a strange yet effective form of skepticism.

and

c) I'm trying to learn Greek as well as gain some degree of understanding of various non-classical logics.

This is in addition to touching up papers that are already done. Looking over this, it seems clear that I am doing too much at once instead of just trying to hone one thing. I think you are right that it is in my best interest to work on just honing one or two papers. As it is already past the point where working on a new project would be a good idea for grad school applications for next year, I think I'll work on trying to make my post-skepticism paper as strong as possible.

The other stuff can be put on hold without too much anxiety on my part.

I guess I know what I'll be doing this summer.

Cheers!

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Strider
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So, so far I've only heard back from two schools (both negative), and nothing from the rest. I'm trying to figure out if this is good or bad.
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Lyrhawn
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Two emails this week. One from University of Michigan rejecting, another from University of Chicago rejecting from their PhD program, but offering me admission to their Master of Arts Program in Social Sciences, with a one third tuition waiver.

I think the Chicago program is better than Nebraska, but not enough to justify spending an extra $50K to pay for it.

Still waiting on three more programs.

quote:
Originally posted by JonHecht:
Having been universally rejected from by PhD programs, I'll assume my writing sample wasn't as good as I had thought. No big deal--I'll work on it for next time. [Dont Know]

Well, Lyrhawn, let's have fun applying again after our profiles have improved!

Indeed! I really do wish I had applied to more MA programs, and the more I've been thinking about it lately, the more I'm excited to only do my MA now, rather than the whole package. I think I'll emerge in two years as a much stronger candidate for the PhD than I am now.
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Strider
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Lyr, I ended up adding two more MA programs the other week. I got rejected from Upenn, but the professor I had been conversing with there emailed me that she had been really enthusiastic about my application but that there were just too many applicants, and not enough spots (140 applicants, 6 spots) (and my background is suboptimal). She wrote to a few friends of hers at these MA programs asking them to take a look at my application. If I can get funding at any of the MA programs I applied to that would actually be optimal, as you say, I'd emerge in two years an extremely strong candidate. As it is, I think any of the PhD programs that I still do have a shot at currently, are not really high on my list of places I'd like to be. But if it came down to a funded PhD program at mediocre school or an unfunded MA program at a strong program, I'm not sure I could justify the mass amount of loans I'd have to take on.
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Lyrhawn
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I'd have to really think about it I end up getting a funded PhD offer from one of my three remaining schools. If it's from Rutgers, it's a no brainer, I'll go. If it's from Ohio State or Indiana, I might go. I can't help but wonder if I could get into a better school than those last two once I have an MA, but, on the other hand, it might be just plain stupid to turn down a funded PhD offer at a perfectly good, but not fantastic, school.

It seems unlikely that I'll have to worry about making that decision since I have yet to be accepted to a PhD program, but, it would cause me grief. Most everyone I've talked to in my department at school has said to go where the money is. Unless you're going into some high paying field, it's not worth taking on a massive amount of debt just to get through an MA. So if the only funding I end up being offered is the money at Nebraska, then I'll go there. It's a perfectly fine school to get an MA at, and if I can get in good with some of the big names there, I can step up to bigger things.

It's riskier from a career standpoint, but almost 100% safe financially.

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Tstorm
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Congrats to everyone seeing success in this thread. I just wanted to pop in and off verbal support. And I wanted to add, that I can't believe you're having this much trouble. Ya'll are a lot more intelligent and capable than some of the individuals I've recently met who have masters and doctorate degrees.
[Smile]

Lyrhawn, no matter what my opinion of UNL's athletic endeavors, I think their academic programs are quite worthy of respect. Though I'm a Kansas guy through-and-through, I have a few connections to the Lincoln area. Good luck!

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Lyrhawn
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quote:
And I wanted to add, that I can't believe you're having this much trouble. Ya'll are a lot more intelligent and capable than some of the individuals I've recently met who have masters and doctorate degrees.
All about timing really. I've been told my a half dozen different professors from three different universities that this is the worst time to be applying for a grad degree in decades. The economy has sent thousands of people back into the education system which means more competition at a time when funding for liberal arts programs has been cut to its worst position in decades as well. More people competing for fewer positions and fewer dollars.

I've also talked to a lot of grad applicants who have been in the system for a couple years, applying for their third time, and using the exact same application three years in a row, they were stymied twice, only to get into several programs this year. It comes down to timing. I'm going into a specific sub-field of American history, which means they need to be looking for someone who fits that description, and it might only mean one spot is open for me, or none. Timing is everything.

quote:
Lyrhawn, no matter what my opinion of UNL's athletic endeavors, I think their academic programs are quite worthy of respect. Though I'm a Kansas guy through-and-through, I have a few connections to the Lincoln area. Good luck!
I had to do some digging to really get an idea on UNL. I really have no idea what their reputation is for academics, except that their agricultural program is one of the best in the nation. But I know they are really making some strides to improve their history program, and an up-and-coming history program is, I think, an exciting place to be.

Have you ever been to Lincoln? I've only ever even been on the other side of the Mississippi maybe twice or three times in my life, to visit Houston. I'm told it has the feel of a large suburb, and despite the insane college football aspect, it's actually relatively quiet. That's what I'm hoping for anyway. My undergrad institution is small, and nestled into the burbs. I really like the small town feel. I've given up on the small college feel, as I know I'll have to get over that at Nebraska, but it'd be nice if the city wasn't overwhelming.

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Itsame
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All my official rejections are coming in now. I have to say, hats off to Michigan. They sent a nicely worded letter on high quality paper and what appears to be *gasp* a real signature! This is the most personal attention of any rejection I've received.

Edit: By comparison, the worst two are Yale and Berkeley. Yale had a rejection from the graduate school as a whole. And Berkeley... they just linked me to this: https://gradadm.berkeley.edu/gradapp/gradadm_deny_letter.html

[ March 12, 2011, 03:57 AM: Message edited by: JonHecht ]

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Lyrhawn
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Heh, looks like UCB was pretty harsh, though, that's a pretty nice gesture from Michigan. I've gotten a couple halfway decent letters, but, most of them were solidly impersonal.

The one that really pissed me off was Penn. Something along the lines of "Dear Applicant, we are sorry that, though you were a strong candidate, there were many strong candidates this year, and we're sure you'll find placement in another institution of your choice." I'd have rather just had a letters saying "Sorry, too many applicants for too few spaces."

I'm still waiting for my last three responses. Rumor is that Rutgers is waiting to send out their flood of rejection letters, but it's game over there. That's the last of my heavy hitters.

Word is also out that Indiana should have letters out in the next few days, and Ohio in the next week as well. Hopefully I'll know all my answers by March 15th, which was the latest I was planning to know anyway.

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