It's like we learned nothing about arming and training Al-Qaeda, or the do-nothing Iraqi Army that supplied the tanks, equipment, and money ISIS is now using.
Somebody stop this crazy ride, I just want to get off.
Posts: 14316 | Registered: Jul 2005
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The trick is, wait a few years for fighting to get really nasty, for the lines to get really blurry, and for the international entanglements to get really deep before you start throwing money and resources on things.
This helps guarantee you'll be able to exert the most influence possible on your proxy fighters!
Posts: 17164 | Registered: Jun 2001
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quote:Originally posted by Rakeesh: The trick is, wait a few years for fighting to get really nasty, for the lines to get really blurry, and for the international entanglements to get really deep before you start throwing money and resources on things.
This helps guarantee you'll be able to exert the most influence possible on your proxy fighters!
This is pretty much exactly right.
Posts: 891 | Registered: Feb 2010
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quote:Aides said that there would be no money attached to formal authorization for training and equipping fighters, because the Pentagon would be able to draw from current funding. The administration has told lawmakers that at least $500 million will be needed initially for the training programs, House and Senate aides said.
Reid said Wednesday that “there is money” already to pay for training and equipment and that a vote authorizing new spending wouldn’t be necessary.
So, there are the obvious areas of "easy-win" spending that are held up by partisan differences, improving access to healthcare for the poor, getting clean water out to people in Detroit, improving funding for education, etc.
But there are also the ones that don't seem to be held up by partisan differences but simply don't have enough money. Things like improving healthcare for veterans or fixing up America's decaying roads/bridges/infrastructure (special call-out to La Guardia) are deprived of money.
But a dubious venture into a three-way war with many possible ways of backfiring? $500 million? Sure no problem. Don't even need to ask for a vote.
Posts: 7593 | Registered: Sep 2006
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It's either this, having our own troops continue fighting, or not get involved. I don't see anything that can be done that we won't regret at some point.
Posts: 2054 | Registered: Nov 2005
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That's one of the worst things about useless wars like Iraq, they steal from us the ability to do the right things when it *really* matters.
We're war weary as a nation, and the only reason we are even involved in this crisis is because Iraq is a problem of our making. Were this East Timor rebels making trouble again, we'd be happy to sit back, send advisers, maybe a few special forces units, and that would be that.
Instead we are dealing with a massive insurgency bred because of Malaki refusing to create a coalition government, financed with *our* money and using *our* equipment.
Why our we spending *our* money to equip and train rebels that the only thing we have in common with is they hate ISIS? They couldn't care less about our other interests. All the moderates in Syria we *might* have considered helping are dead or defeated. The only people left are tribal war lords, Assad's forces, and rebels.
No man, we support the Iraqi army and the new government of Kurdistan with air support, and we get used to the fact that we spent the money already that would have enabled us to do more.
No administration in the last 30 years has put one dollar towards our debt principle. When that happens they can talk about ramping up for war again.
quote:Originally posted by BlackBlade: Instead we are dealing with a massive insurgency bred because of Malaki refusing to create a coalition government, financed with *our* money and using *our* equipment.
Can you elaborate on this?
Also, granted that the mess in Iraq is entirely our fault, do you think doing nothing is a better option than training these proxy fighters along with our continued air strikes?
Posts: 2054 | Registered: Nov 2005
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quote:Originally posted by BlackBlade: Instead we are dealing with a massive insurgency bred because of Malaki refusing to create a coalition government, financed with *our* money and using *our* equipment.
Can you elaborate on this?
Also, granted that the mess in Iraq is entirely our fault, do you think doing nothing is a better option than training these proxy fighters along with our continued air strikes?
Obama has been telling Maliki for years that he needs to create a unity government, after he has repeatedly pushed other factions out in favor of his own Shiite cronies. It's why Kurdish breakaway fears have only increased for years, and why a vote has never been held in Kirkuk over who would get the city.
He's been pushing for years, and now everyone is surprised when Sunnis, fed up with being sidelined for years by Maliki, have a second uprising?
A lot of the vehicles, tanks and heavy weapons ISIS is using in Iraq and Syria came from posts, bases and cities overrun in Iraq, when Iraqi units with our vehicles tanks and heavy weapons simply abandoned them and threw them down in their haste to retreat.
I think we need to be engaged over there. I don't think arming anyone in Syria will serve our long term interests. As Rakeesh said, any group that might have been a worthwhile power player and friendly to us has been degraded. There are literally hundreds of factions. The closest I could come to picking one would be the Kurds in the north, but they've mostly been staying on the sidelines when they can.
I mostly support helping the Kurds as much as possible. Other than that, it's too complicated to get involved with.
Posts: 21898 | Registered: Nov 2004
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quote:Originally posted by BlackBlade: Instead we are dealing with a massive insurgency bred because of Malaki refusing to create a coalition government, financed with *our* money and using *our* equipment.
Can you elaborate on this?
Also, granted that the mess in Iraq is entirely our fault, do you think doing nothing is a better option than training these proxy fighters along with our continued air strikes?
Adding to what Lyrhawn said, there was hundreds of millions of dollars (much of it from the US government given for rebuilding efforts) in the banks of cities like Tikrit. When the Iraqi army fled, the rebels confiscated those monies, making them overnight the richest terrorist organization in the world.
Now of course a lot of that money will probably be stolen by terrorists who will enrich themselves with it, but 450 million dollars is really hard to dilute down to $0.
Posts: 14316 | Registered: Jul 2005
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