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Author Topic: Advice on Human Courting From Non-Suitable-232(SF aprox.5k)
Bent Tree
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I know this one is a bit unorthodoxed, but I had a good feeling about it. I think this story is one of the best I have ever written and it weighs in at about 5k if anyone would be so kind as to have a gander. I would gladly return the favor.


quote:
Tetrahydrangian names do not readily translate into human language. The oneIt sought, for example, may have gone something like: Mature Being from our home, same species, yet two genetic enhancements prior to my generational batch. 232nd being from our home that I met upon our third wave arrival on Earth that had arrived upon the first wave. NOT SUITABLE for group coupling reproduction or Myotic batch hosting. Similarly, there is no Tetrahydrangan name for the one that sought it. Therefore they will be refered to from this point forward as, It and the one It that sought as, Non-suitable-232, or simply 232.
It sought Non-Suitable-232 because 232 was an authority on human behavior, the very subject which was Its primary interest

[This message has been edited by Bent Tree (edited March 04, 2010).]


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CharityBradford
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I don't think I'm smart enough to comment on this post.

quote:
322nd being from our home I met upon our third wave arrival on Earth that had arrived upon the first wave.
That is where I got lost. 322nd being? (Did 322nd arrive on the first wave and it arrive on the third wave?)

I think I started to understand again here:

quote:
Therefore they will be refered to from this point forward as, Itand the one It sought as, Non-suitable-232, or simply 232.
It sought Non-Suitable-232 for 232 was an authority on human behavior, the very subject which was Its primary interest

So, It is looking for 232 because 232 knows about humans. What happened to 322?

Am I close?


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TaoArtGuy
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First of all, I am confused by this although I suspect that is part of the intention. If I encountered it in the wild I wouldn't bother going any further. However, despite occasional threads which might indicate otherwise, we're not in the wild so I will take a stab at it if you'd like.

I know I've written more than my share of "out there" stuff and I'd like to help others who are pushing things too.

- Mark


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Bent Tree
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Oops 332 was a typo.

As if this weren't confusing enough. I am fixing it now


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Bent Tree
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quote:
So, It is looking for 232 because 232 knows about humans. What happened to 322?

As I mentioned that was a typo.

The intention was to confuse the reader, but not in a pretentious way. I wanted them to know that the reason for this narrative point was to show how confusing the names were, while introducing just enough of the story elements to get them interested. If you were to read this story from the beginning of the last line, you wouldn't even recognize it, but you would also wonder why It was being refered to as It and Why 232 was named that.


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JSchuler
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Not sure if confusing the reader is a good way to start, but to each his own

I will tell you, I might be able to understand this except for the name bit, mainly because I'm not sure where the name stops, and where the narration comes back in.


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MAP
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I think I get this.

quote:
Mature Being from our home, same species, yet two genetic enhancements prior to my generational batch. 232nd being from our home I met upon our third wave arrival on Earth that had arrived upon the first wave. NOT SUITABLE for group coupling reproduction or Myotic batch hosting.

This is the translation of the name of 232, right?

Some nits. Tetrahydrangian sounds like the name of a molecule, like tetrahydrofuran. Was that intentional?

quote:
The oneIt sought for example may have gone something like:

shouldn't there be a space between one and It?

quote:
Itand the one It sought as, Non-suitable-232, or simply 232.

Shouldn't there be a space between It and and? Or was this intentional?

quote:
It sought Non-Suitable-232 for 232 was an authority on human behavior, the very subject which was Its primary interest

Why not just call it 232 instead of non-suitable-232 at one place and 232 in the other. I think it would be more clear if you stuck with one name for 232.

That is all I got. I like this, but I am a little swamped right now, so if you're not in a rush, I could look over it.


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genevive42
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I'm sure it's one of those that will start to make sense shortly - and I mean that in a good way. I'll give it a read.
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Bent Tree
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quote:
Not sure if confusing the reader is a good way to start, but to each his own

I completely agree with you if were an instance where the narrator was intentionally witholding information or to cause misdirection. Such a device is almost always negatively recieved.

But by saying this is why we name the characters so-and-so, because they are alien and really have abstract views we would not readily identify, for example, get ready to be confused. this is waht they would name themselves if it were directly translated into your language...See why I am naming them so-snd-so?

I think this adds one of those corny old-fashioned SCI FI narrations that I used to love reading as a kid, but also since this is the last of it, there is a less gimmicky story ahead. That is what I was aiming for anyway.

Thank you all for tolerating my typo's and nonsense


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Bent Tree
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MAP,

your email isn't available, perhaps you could send me an email and I will respond to that.


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JSchuler
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I don't think that's a flag for "prepare to be confused," so much as "prepare to read slowly and pay attention." And I don't think it's that bad as long as you give formatting cues for where the description begins and ends (can you do blockquotes in a submission?).

Beyond that, you might want to ask yourself if the language really does need to be that technical. Can you put "Adult" in for "Mature Being," "Two previous generations removed" for the whole genetic enhancement thing, etc? This kind of goes back to the bicycles in Egypt post in the writing discussion forum. If the alien's concept of "Mature Being" really is alien to the meaning of our term "Adult," then by all means, don't use it. But if it's close enough... you do say you are translating it to English, after all, not transliterating


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Dame
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Hi there,

I found this too confusing to read on as it is, although it did intrigue me enough to want to. I love stories dealing with the alienness of aliens and this looks set to be an interesting exploration.

Should there be a space between "The one/It sought?"

Is the word "that" a mistake to be cut, in: "and the one It that sought as?"

I like the concept of opening by explaining the names, and I see how that prohibits explaining much else until you get those terms sorted out, but I might try nevertheless to make the reader at ease before launching in. You might say something to define the two characters, such as Hunter (or Seeker?) and Hunted. If you establish something, then I personally would be more engaged in sticking around.

You set yourself a difficult challenge by calling one "It." It means you can't use the word for normal sentence construction, leading to strange things like: "It sought Non-Suitable-232 because 232 was..." Here it would be a smoother sentence if you could replace that second 232 by an "it." You may find it easier to play with its name - while it is Seeking, call it the Seeker, when that role changes, point the change in motivation/action by changing its name.

There is an odd meaning shift in the first two sentences. You begin talking about names, then say, "The oneIt sought, for example, may have gone..." The one, following the meaning of the first sentence and the latter part of the second, should be a name, but it is in fact a being. You might find the sense comes out clearer if you unify the two sentences. Perhaps - "The name of the one It sought, for example..."

"232nd being from our home that I met upon our third wave arrival on Earth that had arrived upon the first wave." Oooh, I struggled with this sentence. if there was a comma and a but in between "earth" and "that," it might be clearer. Another thing that makes it hard is the repeated "arrive."

One way to clarify the meaning could be to use paragraphs. I might be radical and start a new para after the first sentence, just to really separate out that chunk of meaning. This may be going too far, though. I definitely would pop in a para break before, "Similarly," if I was using para's to tidy it up, and I might even stick another before "therefore," for good measure.

Or perhaps you could put everything from, "Mature being" to "batch hosting," in italics. That might help instead.

I think there is a new para before, "It sought Non..." but it is not too clear with no extra line break between paras.

"Its primary interest" is the reason why the reader will care so you should perhaps take care to make sure the character's motivation is placed prominently as soon as possible.

I hope some of this is interesting. Good luck editing the story.

D

[This message has been edited by Dame (edited March 05, 2010).]


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Phobos
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While it does apear to be a bit "gimmicky" I think I know your work well enough to know that this isn't a device. There are a few kinks perhaps in the description that could be smoothed out to make it easier to read, but the abstract nature of the naming process seems to be clearly stated, so I don't feel I am being intentionally confused. There is a certain element of humour in this description, which I feel was the intent. Send it along. I know I still haven't returned your otherone, but I promise them both soon. Kenyon went up into the mountains to see his family, so I am all alone for a few days.
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satate
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I found this confusing, but not for the reason you might think. I'm fine with the explanation of what the alien names mean. I get that part. What I want clearer is who is who. 232 and 322 are too similar. I will always get them confused.

I also found this part confusing. "Therefore they will be refered to from this point forward as, It and the one It that sought as, Nonsuitable-232, or simply 232." The next sentence after that completely loses me because I don't get this previous part. How about something like Thing 1 and Thing 2. (I don't mean that seriously since that's from The Cat and the Hat but something similarly easy.)

So I liked the translation and the complicated name. That part was cool and made me want to learn more about the alien species. The next part where you explain how your naming them and who is searching for who, loses me.

I'll read as long as you don't mind it taking a little while. I have two crits in line and I'm supposed to finish a story by the fifteenth.


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jonesias
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Hi, Jon here. I recently registered to this forum, and looking through some different stories, I found your theme interesting to me. I just posted the first 13 lines of my Short, "A Day of Reconciliation." If you don't mind looking at it, maybe we could swap stories.
Thanks

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Nick T
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Hi Jon,

Bent Tree has temporarily left the forum to concentrate on writing...you're not likely to hear back from him.

Regards,

Nick


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MistWolf
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The opening was a struggle for me and I didn't want it to be. Part sounds like a "We met briefly and I can't stop thinking about you. No games" Personals Add- "Mature Being from our home, same species, yet two genetic enhancements prior to my generational batch. 232nd being from our home that I met upon our third wave arrival on Earth that had arrived upon the first wave. NOT SUITABLE for group coupling reproduction or Myotic batch hosting."

Not sure if that's intentional


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