2) How do you balance working out your plot vice writing segments of a novel? Especially at the beginning. I’ve waffled back and forth, doing some of one and then the other, but it seems I had better complete my plot outline to be sure I know where its all headed end-to-end, and how the characters fit. Without a clear idea of where I am going, I may wind up thoroughly confused. But its hard not to jump in and write!

I’m holding off on the first 13 of chapter one, because I started with a character who probably is more a support role than MC. His intro may not be quite enticing enough for the first chapter. My real MC is still under development, and I don’t like him enough yet! Lol.

3) What I do is allocate time for certain tasks and then get those tasks done in time, in theory at least. By only working on 2-3 pages a day, for instance, I can spend a nice hour working on flow, power and expression -- making the writing work. If you make an effective time schedule then follow it, accomplishment will come.

Waffle, yes. I had a PoV shift in a major work of mine. But push forward in a brutally effective effort that you refuse to abridge for any reason, any day.

Yes, I believe it is, or at least to 13 total for a single piece. I believe the thing to do is to ask for volunteers to review/critique other material (ideally the entire work) outside of the forum. Or, there may be other sites on the internet with sufficient privacy protocols that would allow for handling of larger blocks of material.

2) How do you balance working out your plot vice writing segments of a novel?

I only have one data point when it comes to novels, but I could only work the plot so far without just sitting down and writing the story. Different writers handle this differently, and my only advice would be to write anytime you have the urge to jump in and write. If that is after you have some amount of plot worked out, all of it, or none of it, it's fine any way. There are successful authors who approach it all three ways.

3) when is enough, enough in polishing a passage?

If there was an objective answer to that question, you could probably bottle it and make a fortune. Ive heard of anecdotes of famous authors reworking paragraphs 60 or more times. I try to get it too the point where I "think" it's the best I can do at my present skill level, without worrying to much about how many times or how long. I think for us beginners, it's probably best to do too little rather than too much. I think you learn faster by completing a lot of stories relatively quickly than by laboring excessively over just a few.

#2. I don't understand the question.

It seems that that's when I do the greater part of my work as an author. It's not just whether to use said or shouted. Or to cut a sentence into two separate thoughts.

The 13-line rule is based on Damon Knight's offer to read the first thirteen lines of a short story manuscript and tell people if he would want to keep reading.

It is also based on the idea that if you post too much of your story, you are essentially publishing it here on the Hatrack River Writers Workshop forum, and 1--we're not a publisher and 2--we don't want you to use up your electronic rights by "publishing" your story here.

Since thirteen lines of a short story are basically half a manuscript page (the first thirteen lines of a short story is the first page of a manuscript), that is our limit for short stories.

For novels, it is okay to put more than one set of thirteen lines if you feel you need more feedback. We recommend staying with the idea of the first thirteen of a chapter or a scene so that you can ask if people will volunteer to have you send them the whole chapter or scene in email so they can give you feedback.

These blend together for me:

2.) How detailed do you make your outline before starting to write?

Here’s my current process: So far my outline accounts for about 10,000 words (including plot section headers with scenes sketches, back-story, my world, lore, and character definitions).
Then I have another main area for the actual story text, where I can flesh out scenes (about 3,000 words now). That’s where I really want to continue working, but my gut tells me I should KNOW the ending before I work much here! I see substantial holes in my plot and in a couple of characters. It would be inefficient to write a lot of story text and then realize it has to be re-done. If I craft text about a character that I don’t know much about yet, the way I create him may not fit into the plot later on.

3.) Yes. Write and re-write is what I need to do, focusing on what matters to the story (I need to resist the urge to fuss over word choices). Its hard for me to let go of something once its written, especially if it should be scrapped or ripped apart. I have two completed (hah!) character introductions that need to be changed significantly, because the characters changed as my plot outline filled out more. (One letting-go trick I use on myself is, I put a copy in a slush file and then hack away at the original text.)

Technical details on my outline: I use a Table of Contents that is hot-linked to section and sub-section headers (MS Word tools), so I can see a snapshot view of the whole outline and move around in the details quickly. If I have a scene idea I sketch it out where it goes in the outline, to be completed later. (The story area is organized under the same section headers.)

Remember that you are probably going to be rewriting your novel even after you've finished writing it, whether you do an outline first or not.

Some people need the outline, others just write and figure out what the story is with the first draft. So the first draft is a kind of elaborated, ultra-developed outline.

So write, if you feel ready to. You can go back and forth between the outline and the text as needed.

You are the only one who really knows the story you are trying to tell, so you are the only one who can really decide whether the manuscript (which, being mere words on paper, is a poor attempt to convey your beautiful story even when it is the best it can be) is good enough.