posted
Just something I wanted to throw out to the masses.
One of the things that bug me when watching a movie is when there's a climatic scene at the end of a show where the protagonist is dying in some way, typically cardiac arrest or something similar. Mission Impossible 3 comes to mind, even though I really enjoyed that movie.
These scenes bug me, as they're generally outside of the character's control. Sure they can perform CPR frantically, beat on the protag's chest, scream and cry and plead so loudly and fiercely that it seems that God Himself could not ignore. It's dramatic, sure. But the ending is pretty much up to the writer, and it takes the power out of the characters' hands.
That said, I'm thinking of doing something extremely similar in my book. It won't be at the climax; I'm using it to draw my protag and his ex-wife closer together, as she's the one struggling to save his life.
But my ultimate question is how you guys feel when you read or watch a scene like this. Ignoring stylistic concerns (IE: It's okay if it's written/performed well), do these kinds of scenes tick you off as a reader/viewer as well?
posted
Hmmm, not sure if I have used any "Acts Of God" in my writing, none at all in the NaNo novel. But they happen in real life so why not in fictional lives? I have read novels that used a sudden "Act Of God" to mess things up. It's usually counted as Murphy sticking his big nose into things. Some people might consider it cheating to resort to that but as I said they happen in real life. I think it depends on how it is done and what type of scene it is.
But as to taking things out of the control of the MC, that is good I think. Everything shouldn't go as planned.
I might use an AOG sometime. I wouldn't be opposed to it, depending on the scene of course.
posted
I find them particularly annoying for lots of reasons, which I could rant on about for so long I'd seem incoherent.
Suffice it to say that these scenes usually stray out of the cause-and-effect chain that has linked the story's plot together and pull me out of the story. The only case where I don't mind is when such events are foreshadowed significantly, such as when Larry Niven spends a large part of Ringworld pointing out that Teela is impossibly lucky so that when he springs some, well, impossibly lucky things in her favour I can accept it.
When a Hollywood blockbuster has its hero pay the ultimate price to save everyone and then he's brought back after too many minutes of CPR, or whatever, it just feels cheap and hollow - a happy ending pandering for the masses and his sacrifice rendered meaningless.
A story in which victory is achieved without consequence is not a story worth telling. Neither is a story in which the victory achieved was not a result of the protagonist's own decisions and actions.
quote:A story in which victory is achieved without consequence is not a story worth telling. Neither is a story in which the victory achieved was not a result of the protagonist's own decisions and actions.
I think there's a difference between the "Act of God" working for or against the protagonist. Too much in the protagonist's favor doesn't work. A little against him, like the guy just can't catch a break and we, as readers, doubt even more that he will prevail . . . well, that could work in the story's favor.
posted
And an Act of God may not really be an Act of God.
In one of my novels there will be three lightening bolts hit at the right time to help my MC. That is something normally considered an AOG but these won't be natural.
Then there's the MC who suddenly appear to stop a Bad Guy but she will spend time vomiting first. Kinda small thing to be an AOG but it is natural. Part of her carefully laid out plan to attack the Bad Guy. The last thing he would expect is for her to fall on her knees retching.
I have read a few stories where the ending happens during a rain storm. Sometimes it's just a minor inconvenience, sometimes it's like a cleansing wash but that's kind a cliche-ish. Sometimes it hinders both sides.
posted
Like everything else, it depends on how it is done.
I don't like it when the story makes me think the character is dead (unless it is done humorously) then reveals that he/she actually was saved. I think this kind of jerks the reader around.
I don't mind when the tension of whether or not the character survived is just suspended. Like when you think the character is dying, but you hear voices saying something like, "Hold on, help is coming," indicating that he/she may not die.
Of course the saving of the character needs to be believable and consistant with the world building. In real life, many people have been revived from death.
I think your senario is fine. It seems like an integral part of the plot. So go for it.
posted
I have read many stories and books where it looked like the MC was going or had died at the end. Sometimes he was faking, sometimes he was revived-usually with more than chest thumping or mouth to mouth and sometimes at a cost to others-sometimes after spending time in a hospital or some such. Sometimes it fits with the story plot and sometimes seems a little contrived. Usually I don't mind that much even when it's contrived because I don't want the good guy to get killed. But at times it fits if he does.
[This message has been edited by LDWriter2 (edited November 21, 2010).]
posted
Death scenes are what ruins a movie for me. No matter how mauled the character is, he/she will still have 2-3 minutes to say something deep and profound, probably in a state of total tranquility even though their spleen is hanging out and they should be in a lot of pain. The most idiotic death scene that comes to mind is in the third installment of the Matrix. I won't give out the spoiler in case someone still hasn't watched it but I was seriously about to leave the theater and that doesn't happen often.
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posted
Pretty much what I was thinking. "Act of God" against the characters equals "life sucks", which makes drama. "Act of God" for the characters equals dues ex machina, which is bad.
quote:I think your senario is fine. It seems like an integral part of the plot. So go for it.
It's fairly important, I think, for character development, so I might run with it. Though I don't plan on jerking the reader around too much with it.
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posted
Actually, took the chance to make things even worse for my characters by giving them no choice but to seek medical aid in the enemy's camp. Thanks for the feedback, guys. This helps ratchet up the drama even more. Posts: 487 | Registered: Mar 2008
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posted
I tend to agree with you guys, but I do note there are exceptions in nearly every case. I think it has a lot to do with how you approach it. The "Act of God" scenes I find to be irritating, yes, but if there are foreshadowing events I can be swayed.
In relation to monologues before or during death, and one exception to this. The film American Beauty has someone die, whereupon a monologue is started narrated by the very same man that dies. If done incorrectly, this scene would have irritated me beyond all reason. Had the start not begun with the same man narrating, it wouldn't have worked. The writer, however, sets it up very well.
posted
I'm reminded of the old cartoon...a guy's drawn a complicated mathematical equation on the blackboard, but right in the middle of the equation are the words, "Then a miracle happens."
I think, in reading and in writing, I might want characters to do something extraordinarily heroic, or even out of character---but I'd rather not have them saved by divine intervention. (Unless the divine-in-question is a character in the story.)
(I always felt a little cheated by the ending of H. G. Wells's "The War of the Worlds," actually.)
posted
I took the topic title a little too literally when I clicked on it; one of my stories climaxes with the Biblical Plague of Hail raining down on my protagonists.
Posts: 180 | Registered: Jul 2007
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posted
Well, since G-d is a minor (so to speak) character in my novel The Kabbalist, an "act of God" was a different sort of issue for me as a writer: how to make the omnipotent impotent. >smile< This was not only important but, leaving the word play aside, essential. Otherwise, there is no conflict, no opportunity for dramatic tension. My protagonist, the unordained Rabbi Cane, has to find the means to save the world without direct Heavenly intervention--and this requires not only overcoming external demons but also his internal (personal) demons as well.
Thus, removing G-d, whose existence is undeniable in my created world, from playing G-d was key.
Writing fantasy permits great lattitude in the utilization of power, of magic, of supernatural forces. I believe you only need make certain that whatever use of deus ex machina (in the literary sense) you employ, that it be consistent with the rules you have created in your story.
posted
One reason I abandoned my last-stab-at-a-novel after a hundred thousand words was that I kept giving my heroine superpower after superpower, under the guise of "nanotechnology" but really just to keep things moving along. (Curse me for not writing up an outline beforehand.) Reached the point where I didn't believe any of it. If I ever get back to the novel---it's not looking likely---I'll have to crop some of those superpowers, and also come up with a better explanation for them.
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The last thing he would expect is for her to fall on her knees retching. 
