posted
So monday night, I went to a political protest by the Knesset (equivalent of Israeli parliament building, for those of you who don't know), in favor of Sharon's plan for disengagement from the Gaza strip. I was really excited, because I'd never been to a protest before, only heard about them from my parents. Of course, my parents and my little sister went to this one as well, it wasn't just me.
We got there (having followed my friend Dorit who lives in the same building as my parents), about 15 minutes before it was about to start. Dorit had connections in the Youth Protestors Group (or some such, I'm not entirely sure what the group was), so she got us some signs to carry (which we dumped shortly after, since they were a big pain, and we were getting splinters from the wood). My sister and I also bought some t-shirts that say "Shalom Achshav" (which means "Peace Now"), and put them on over our regular clothes.
It was really interesting to go into the fray, and see all the people there... not as many, unfortunately, as we had hoped to see, but interesting nonetheless. The speaker there said proudly that there were 30,000 people at the protest, but that's utter nonsense... there were probably about 6,000 at most. Some people were taking advantage of the huge audience and yelling "TIME OUT! Time out from protesting! Come and buy some of my ice cream!" or other such things. Simon Perez (a major left-wing political leader in Israel) was there, and spoke, as well as other speakers who were less eloquent, and due to high noise level from the crowd, we could not understand a single word they said. But we clapped and cheered at the end of each one anyway.
We left about two hours or so after we got there, but we could hear "Hatikva" (the national anthem) playing as we headed out. So it must not have last that much longer! So yeah, it was interesting, and I just felt like sharing with Hatrack. Posts: 7877 | Registered: Feb 2003
| IP: Logged |
posted
"What she was able to do, is not allowed in the Palestinian side."
Well, that's not technically true, Chad. I'd imagine that it's perfectly safe to endorse disengagement from the Gaza strip on the "Palestinian side." Posts: 37449 | Registered: May 1999
| IP: Logged |
posted
You know, I've heard of a few successful peace marches on the Palestinian side, too. But that said, I don't disagree with the larger argument -- that the wealthy, educated, and free members of world society are often better able to indulge in the luxury of fairness than the desperate and downtrodden -- so I won't. *grin*
Posts: 37449 | Registered: May 1999
| IP: Logged |
I'd go further than that... I think that we won't have peace until the settlers are withdrawn from the Gaza strip. It's not often I agree with Sharon's views, but this time he's got the right idea.
muppet: *hugs muppet* Aww, don't cry! I'm sorry you're jealous. But if I go to another protest, then I'll wave a banner in your honor!
As for what the rest of you were saying, it's complicated to say... the view is completely different from the right. I have to agree though, it would be more dangerous that way... right-wingers are often religious, orthodox Jews who take the whole matter very seriously, and believe that their cause is justified, because God is telling them what to do. Once it's on a religion basis, it's dangerous.
Posts: 7877 | Registered: Feb 2003
| IP: Logged |
We have been trying to follow what is happening on this issue in Israel, but it has been hard to follow. We went to the Jerusalem Post online and got some information, but some things are still unclear:
1) it appears the Israel legislature came down to a vote on the pull-out last Tuesday, and it was approved, but then
2) there was something about a referendum? Are they taking it to referendum and a vote of the people?
posted
Members of Sharon's coalition want there to be a referendum. Sharon is resisting. If Sharon doesn't give in its possible the government could disolve.
Posts: 3446 | Registered: Jul 2002
| IP: Logged |
posted
Okay - that is more confusing. If it is Sharon's plan for disengagement -- and that plan was approved last Tuesday by his legislature -- then why does his coalition ALSO want a referendum?
posted
Similar to how the Labor party in the UK is against the war in Iraq even though Blair is for it. Despite the fact that Sharon has aligned himself with the religious right parties they don't agree on the Gaza withdrawal. Sharon was only able to get it passed through the Knesset because he got support from outside his coalition government. When he held a referendum within his own party, the Likud, it was soundly defeated, but he has proceeded anyways.
Posts: 3446 | Registered: Jul 2002
| IP: Logged |
posted
Also, its natural to be confused about Israeli politics. Not only is their system completely alien from ours (as much as one democracy can be alien from another) but they hardly have a clue what they're doing. For example, they once had to make a deal that one canidate would be prime minister for a certain period of time, and then the other canidate would be. Imagine if Bush made a deal with Kerry that he would be president from 2005-2006 and Kerry could be president from 2007-2008.
Posts: 3446 | Registered: Jul 2002
| IP: Logged |
posted
Not really related to the topic, sorry, but this title reminded me of my first political protest...
It was after the Tiananmen Square Massacre in 1989. I was six years old, my brother was three. My dad always talked with us about what was happening in the world. When we heard about the Massacre, we were very upset and wanted to do something. We went to the Chinese Embassy building in LA to participate. We sang "We Shall Overcome" and "Give Peace a Chance" and "Blowin' in the Wind". (We already knew all the words to those songs; there were others sung, I think, but I didn't know them.) A television crew covering the event caught sight of my brother on my dad's shoulders and me standing on a bench, and came over to talk to us. I think they were a bit surprised when they asked if we understood what was happening and I said, "Some people in China were protesting but they got killed. Their government doesn't like it when people say things they don't want them to, and they ran over them with tanks and shot them with guns. It's not right to hurt people who aren't hurting you. The government should let people say what they want and change things that are bad." My brother added, "Jesus said not to hurt people. In China lots of people believe in Buddha and he taught not to hurt people too. We should love people, not hurt them, even when they hurt us." A two minute snippet of us made it onto the news that night. We thought it was very cool.
posted
Oh sorry Farmgirl, I didn't see this earlier... here you go:
Bulletin from Jerusalem!
The first part of that is true... the Israeli parliament (Knesset) voted with a large majority to approve Sharon's plan for withdrawal from the Gaza strip, and a few settlements in the West Bank (out of many others that this plan does not yet touch). The right wing inside likud (which is Sharon's ruling party) is rather upset and is trying to force him to take this to a national referendum (even though Israel does not have a legal structure for a referendum). This is a delay tactic on the part of the right wing because every poll shows a massive majority of the people in favor of this plan.
Posts: 7877 | Registered: Feb 2003
| IP: Logged |
posted
"Right wing" is a bit complicated in Israel right now... Sharon himself is the main figure in Israel's right wing. But he is what can be called the "pragmatic" right wing, which realizes that Israel cannot hold onto all the occupied territories and all the settlements that have been built in them since 1967. To the right of him are the "messianic" settlers who believe that it's God's will that no settlement will be evacuated. So they want to hold to every settlement, and they do not really have a political plan to hold to this. They feel extremely threatened by Sharon's insistence to remove some of them.
Posts: 7877 | Registered: Feb 2003
| IP: Logged |
posted
The Israelis to the right of Sharon are largely the ones who don't a two state solution and believe Israel should retain control of all of Bibical Israel.
Posts: 3446 | Registered: Jul 2002
| IP: Logged |
posted
I see.... so are these on the far-right -- are they wanting a total re-location of the Palestinians, or are they wanting an annihilation (Xeonicide) of them?
posted
Neither... they just don't want to be relocated themselves. A few of them want relocation of the Palestinians, but those are definitely a minority.
Posts: 7877 | Registered: Feb 2003
| IP: Logged |
posted
Israel has one of the lowest thresholds in the world for minimum voter support for a party to gain a seat in the Knesset. So while I wouldn't be suprised if there were people in the right who wanted a whole scale extermination of the Palestinians it is necessary remember that such a person would need virtually no mainstream support. My guess is that most of the people on Sharon's right just want the Palestinians to leave the territories although I doubt that they would be willing to forcibly deport them.
Edit to add: The settlers themselves, of which there are very few in Gaza, are another story.
posted
The settlers are really afraid now... because instead of the whole dispute being in between the right and left wings, it's now somewhere in the middle of the right wing. The odds are much farther in the leftists' favor for disengagement from the Gaza strip. The settlers are aware of the fact that they could really lose everything now.
Posts: 7877 | Registered: Feb 2003
| IP: Logged |
Printer-friendly view of this topic
![[Smile]](smile.gif)
![[Cry]](graemlins/cry.gif)
![[Frown]](frown.gif)
I'm sorry you're jealous. But if I go to another protest, then I'll wave a banner in your honor! 
