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Author Topic: "Where can I find a hoe"-Ender
Descolada Survivor
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I'm reading CotM now and I got to the chapter where Ender is going to visit Nohivia(sp?) in the monastary and the old teacher tells him that she doesn't want to see him and the always presistant Enders replies "Where can I find a hoe".
When I heard this I was listening to it on tape and as soon as I heard it I cracked up. I actually had to stop the tape and look at my book. I was after I was done laughing I started thinking, "No Ender would'nt do something like that....Or would he.... [ROFL]
-DS

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Ender12
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[Big Grin]
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ketchupqueen
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*snortgiggle*
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Jeesh
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[ROFL] [ROFL] [ROFL]
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Ramdac99
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i believe there was a thread similar to this a while ago......somwthing about bashing her face in with a piece of wood [Wink]
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SoaPiNuReYe
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I remember one time in class some dude was reading a book and then alla sudden he was bustin out laughing. Everyone was lookin at him and junk, it was so funny omg. good thing you weren't at school reading when that happened lol.
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Jeesh
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My cousin has a Powerpuff Girls book, on one page it's a school yard, one of the kids is named "Harry Pit" I didn't get it for a while...
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A Rat Named Dog
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quote:
I remember one time in class some dude was reading a book and then alla sudden he was bustin out laughing. Everyone was lookin at him and junk, it was so funny omg. good thing you weren't at school reading when that happened lol.
Holy crap. People really do talk like that. I thought Jeff K was a fictional character ...
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Lucky_Sean
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Hey! Foraa supper I err aa wanna party platta!
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Orincoro
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There are quite a few little word plays in OSC's work, I always wonder at the intent.

For instance:

Your analysis is flawed
reads as:
Urinalysis is flawed

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Kin
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quote:
wonder at the intent
Whim? Spur-of-the-moment kind of humor? ... hm.
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I Am The War Chief
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In romeo and juliet almost the exact same line is used. i Remember this because whilst in gr 12 our teacher had the class read it aloud its in the beggining of the book when Romeo's father hears that the families have been fighting he turns to his wife (i was reading the part of the husband) and said "fetch me my longsword hoe" while looking right at this poor girl i nearly busted a gut laughing
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RunningBear
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we were reading macbeth and a friend of mine was reading one of the battle sequences and at the end he had to yell Ho! and the whole class started laughing...

good times.

I suppose you had to be there.

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RunningBear
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He was referring to his wife...

who died...

AHEM.

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I Am The War Chief
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any way u slice it when u have to yell Hoe in a public setting in this day and age its pretty funny
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Jimbo the Clown
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You should come to my school. I shout Onward, Ho! every day before I leave. Except for the days I shout something else. Or don't shout anything at all. Those are good days, too.
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RunningBear
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Read, Ho!

yeah, I was talking to you...


take that bioatch.

(a compilation of assorted insults derived from a term for a female dog in heat)

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I Am The War Chief
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ahahahahahahahaha so many euphenisms so little time in a day
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Orson Scott Card
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Alas, sometimes it's not wordplay, just linguistic coincidence, like the name of the planet Uranus, which can be read either of two ways, both of them crude.

No intention with "hoe" - I was thinking only of the garden implement. Only when it is read aloud, and only then if someone perversely ignores the context, is there a problem. You have to remember that when I wrote Children of the Mind, the usage "'ho'" for "whore" was nowhere near as prevalent as it is now. And it is still the word for a garden implement - do we have any euphemistic workarounds for it? I didn't think so.

Ditto with "Your analysis" - how else would I say it? "That analysis of yours"? Ick. We have to count on readers being cooperative in receiving the plain sense of the story. Otherwise you end up with the dumb reactions you hear when writers use the perfectly legitimate statement "Her eyes fell upon the paper on his desk," which is quite clear in its meaning, but still provokes deliberately perverse or hostile readers to respond, "Plop plop."

[ April 02, 2006, 01:42 AM: Message edited by: Orson Scott Card ]

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Sergeant
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Plop Plop [Smile]

Thats funny

Sergeant

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Icarus
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It's only clear so long as it's not a science fiction (or horror) story. [Wink]
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Orincoro
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quote:
Originally posted by Orson Scott Card:
Alas, sometimes it's not wordplay, just linguistic coincidence, like the name of the planet Uranus, which can be read either of two ways, both of them crude.

Ditto with "Your analysis" - how else would I say it? "That analysis of yours"? Ick.

Alright but this doesn't explain the line in Ender's Shadow, when Bean and the other launchies are headed for the barracks for the first time, I think the line was:

"Bean had never done it with a smooth shaft before"

I know your not trying to do anything wierd with this, but its just good and funny all the same. Frankly OSC I think your analysis is definetly flawed.

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opiejudy
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hmmm, i never read it that way, especially given the spelling of hoe and not "ho". I am positive that Shakespeare did not wish it to read that way and hopeful that OSC did not. It is a fairly juvenile assumption to make upon reading or hearing one word, especially when there is context there that definitely clarifies the meaning.
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Orincoro
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If you think Shakespeare didn't have a penchant for dirty word plays, your mistaken opie. The plays are packed with sexual inuendo, disguised dirty words and foul double meanings, it was all intentional. The plays weren't what one would call "high-brow" in their day.


As for "what ho," that term didn't mean the same thing to Shakespeare, so your right on that count, but just cause he's old doesn't mean he wasn't hip.

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Orincoro
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quote:
Originally posted by Orson Scott Card:

"Her eyes fell upon the paper on his desk," which is quite clear in its meaning, but still provokes deliberately perverse or hostile readers to respond, "Plop plop."

Perverse and hostile? Some people's minds just scan at a different speed. I am always coming up with hilarious (to me) double meanings and alternative connotations. Now actually saying them is a different thing, maybe that IS hostile, but thinking them isn't perverse. Its the fault of the author if his work is misenterprited by the average reader. In this case your correct, the intended meaning is clear, but if the author wishes to avoid the innevitable reaction, then he should avoid the phrase. Since you noticed it, I doubt you use that phrase for exactly that reason.
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opiejudy
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quote:
Originally posted by Orincoro:
If you think Shakespeare didn't have a penchant for dirty word plays, your mistaken opie. The plays are packed with sexual inuendo, disguised dirty words and foul double meanings, it was all intentional. The plays weren't what one would call "high-brow" in their day.


As for "what ho," that term didn't mean the same thing to Shakespeare, so your right on that count, but just cause he's old doesn't mean he wasn't hip.

Oh I know that he had quite a sense of humor and that he wrote very provocatively. There is a difference between provocative, sensual and sexual and being downright lewd.
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Orincoro
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quote:
Originally posted by opiejudy:
[/qb]

Oh I know that he had quite a sense of humor and that he wrote very provocatively. There is a difference between provocative, sensual and sexual and being downright lewd. [/QB][/QUOTE]

Yah, I think he crosses that line plenty of times. "Heads of maidens or their maiden heads" pops to mind. or "her Cs, her Us, and her Ts" is another fairly lewd word play, (12th night). Aside from that, its all in the staging of the play; your likely to see some pretty lewd interpretations of alot of seemingly benign stuff at a performance at the Globe. Not to mention nudity, and improvized jokes, its pretty saucy stuff alot of the time, definetly on the leud side.

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opiejudy
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see i still disagree, put it this way if you are comapring say the song cherry pie and the song by eminem that has the lyric "two trailer park girls..."(sry I dont know the name of it) they both are saying the same thing, only the eminem song says it very lewdly...this is my point with shakespeare, he works around it, he says it without literally spellign it out..... apparenly I am not being clear, and I certainly must not know how to be clearer, as I have tried twice now.
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Orson Scott Card
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"The bawdy hand of the dial is now ..."
"Thou wilt fall backward when thou hast more wit."
"Great ape ... his bauble in a hole ..."

Oh, I think Shakespeare can be crude enough for any taste. That's just Romeo and Juliet. Think what he writes when he wants to be lewd!

He wrote in a time when people could and did talk quite candidly. There was a reason why the Puritans wanted to close down the theaters!

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Orincoro
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quote:
Originally posted by opiejudy:
see i still disagree, put it this way if you are comapring say the song cherry pie and the song by eminem that has the lyric "two trailer park girls..."(sry I dont know the name of it) they both are saying the same thing, only the eminem song says it very lewdly...this is my point with shakespeare, he works around it, he says it without literally spellign it out..... apparenly I am not being clear, and I certainly must not know how to be clearer, as I have tried twice now.

No no, I completely get your point, that's why I added the C, U and T joke from Twelfth night. That isn't much of a workaround, its very much a setup for a great stage gag. Actually in this case he IS literally spelling it out.

Yep OSC's right, different sensibilities. You may not want to believe it, you may romanticize Shakespeare and want to think he's just too noble a spirit to stoop to a "cunt" joke, but no such luck.

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Icarus
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He said perverse or hostile, not perverse and hostile. [Wink]

I simply decided that since I'm not hostile, I must be perverse.

I can deal with that. [Big Grin]

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Orincoro
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Me too. [Wink]
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