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Author Topic: Life Without Cars
Sterling
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I've been loud[mouthed] enough when I disagree with one of Card's essays; I rather feel I should speak up when I agree with one of them.

I remember being in San Jose for a convention in 1994 and being astonished that it was impossible to walk more than about three blocks from the convention hotel. There were heavy traffic, multi-lane streets on both sides of that little plot, with no crosswalks or steetlights nearby.

One set of in-laws lives in L.A., and I remember my brother-in-law commenting on a time when he thought nothing about driving an hour or more to go to a new restaurant or see a movie.

In my recent return to California, it seemed (on an admittedly limited viewing) that San Jose has become significantly more pedestrian-friendly in my absence. Many crosswalks even have audible signals for the blind, and the Technology Museum there happily trumpets that California's new LED-based traffic lights use a fraction of the energy of the old ones, and have to be replaced after several years, rather than several months.

Perhaps some of California's new focus on the environment has paid off.

But...

Meanwhile, here in Vancouver, Washington, we have new big-box stores springing up in areas that used to be pristine land. Doubly strange are these aliens, in that they neighbor vacant buildings where grocery stores and smaller retail spaces have failed; someone has been lured by the idea that all that is required for success where others have failed is a shiny new building. I have been to two of the new stores, and based on my (again, limited) perspective of the number of customers coming in, I do not think this idea will be proven correct.

I love walking. It's one of the few times when I can sort my thoughts without distractions. I've put hundreds of miles on our stroller in two states. Yet as my daughter grows from a helpless infant to a rambunctious child, I find that more and more I have to take the car to go anywhere; the thought of my daughter running into traffic is too terrifying, the desire for a protective shell of steel and airbags too great. Having a bicycling friend struck down and killed by a drunk driver at the age of twenty makes me all too aware of the hazards of traffic.

I would happily live in a community such as the one Card describes. And I'm saddened that as the area I live in makes a seemingly inevitable change from the rural to the suburban, we seem to be racing away from such an ideal. And I know we're not the only ones.

Why is it that, in so many ways, we seem willing to turn our backs on real quality of life in favor of illusions of cheapness and convenience?

[Small spelling edit]

[ May 14, 2007, 09:15 PM: Message edited by: Sterling ]

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Lyrhawn
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I wouldn't really have a problem with putting grocery stores in more accessible locations. I could easily walk to my local grocery store, but I'd never be able to make it back home with the groceries.

I've been saying for years that I wish there was better mass transit around here. There's almost no way to get to Detroit from here without driving. I wouldn't take bus down there if you paid me a hundred dollars. And even to get to the People Mover (our monorail) you have to drive miles and miles, and it's just a ring around the city. We need more, better buses, and we need a subway that reaches into the suburbs, where most of the money that comes into the city comes from. We're sick of paying $20 to park, we're sick of driving down there, and we're sick of having to pay so much for gas.

Cars aren't going to disappear, we still need them to get to work every day, that isn't going anywhere. But for our other activities, like going to the movies or dinner, or to a show in the city, they could come up with something better for us. I'll be leaving Detroit in a couple years, but if I ever hear about a subway project in Detroit, it'd be a big draw to bringing me back.

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Roseauthor
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I live in a small community outside Fort Worth, Texas. I believe in simplicity. Most of what I need to exist is within a few miles, (this due to our newly acquired Wal-Mart).

Perhaps I have an ideal world of a closed community. Romantic as it seems: To work in an area close to home. To do business with people who are our neighbors. To barter and swap with our neighbors. To interact with my fellow man; in their needs and mine. To be co-dependent with my world and cognitively aware of this fact.

Romantic? Yeah, probably. But seriously, I can go without a car right now. It would alter my reality, make me work a little more going to work and buying more stuff that I don't really need to exist.

I can do it.

I have chosen to live a simple life though. (Mainly, because I hate traffic though. HEH)

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Lyrhawn
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I'd probably settle for an increased availability of bicycle racks in better locations all around the city.

Speaking of which, I need to get new tubes for my bike.

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Bokonon
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Move East, young man!

It's not uncommon to have people around here (Boston) not own a car, and not just because insurance is outrageous. I lived 5-6 months without a car pretty easily a few years ago.

If you are single, lots of people around here get "granny carts" to put their groceries in to carry back home too, rather than drive the 2 minutes to the store (and fight for parking!)

-Bok

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Diskdoctor
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I usually end up shaking my head after reading OSC's latest article but I must applaud him for making a lot of sense in "Life Without Cars" and "Walking Neighborhoods". I'm so used to cycling to and from work (and other places) that when I have to drive, especially during rush hour, the futility and stupidity of it makes me nuts. If it weren't for having two pre-school children at home our car would be out. Even so if we could find a suitable car-sharing opportunity we'd jump on it.


"There's something wrong with a society that drives a car to workout in a gym." -- Bill Nye

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Diskdoctor
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quote:
Originally posted by Sterling:
Why is it that, in so many ways, we seem willing to turn our backs on real quality of life in favor of illusions of cheapness and convenience?

One word for you: consumerism
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Lyrhawn
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One would hope that with the death of the American auto industry, there is no longer a reason to force Americans to drive so many cars.

Not only do we not profit from the purchasing of so many foreign cars, but we actually lose billions as well. Billions of American dollars flowing into the oil wells of other nations, billions of American dollars spent because we're too sedentary and unhealthy, and the money we spend on healthcare because of that lifestyle is evident.

Any real move away from an autobased system of transportation in this country would require BILLIONS of dollars however.

I think we need a massive upgrade to the rail system in this country, and we need to start building electromagnetic trains for travel. Their speed will make them a valuable low cost alternative to planes, and considering how busy are skies are going to become in the next two decades, it might very well save lives, time, and money in the long run to start building them now.

But I don't for a minute believe this is all going to happen. The government is paralyzed by inaction, and grand domestic projects are way beyond their capabilities. This country has been so focused on foreign affairs for the last seven years, we've totally lost sight of what needs fixing at home. And it's a shame that we won't take the steps now that will make us a better nation in the near future.

It's things like this that make me want to run for a House seat, even in the State government. At least I could help make Michigan a better place to live. More and more state governments are choosing to take the lead on issues the Federal government is lagging far behind on. One can hope this will either spur the Fed to action, or that it will mark the rise of a newly empowered state government, one that will ignore the Fed entirely and will spearhead the way to a better quality of life for all.

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LoveOfWorthing
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Re: Life without cars

On two separate occasions I had the opportunity to live overseas. I spent about five years in each non-US location (once in Europe, once in Asia). Each time I'd return to the States, I'd be frustrated by the inability to walk anywhere! When I moved from Germany to North Carolina, I was determined to continue my European habits (and figure, actually), and decided to walk to the grocery store (which was only a mile away). I say "only" because I'd become accustomed to walking to my part-time job in Germany. That was two miles away or a bit more. Took me exactly an hour and twelve minutes one way. I'd walk both ways (no car, no license) a few times a week. Maybe three times a week.

I dropped thirty pounds **without dieting** in less than a year. Came back to the US: gained thirty right back. No difference in diet at all.

Now I'm in New Jersey, with the ability but not the will to walk. I've given this exact issue a lot of thought over the years. Here are my conclusions. And the conclusions frustrate me, but this is what I think the reality is:

The ideal way for people to live is as Roseauthor mentions: smaller, more tightly-knit communities that are walkable.

Now here's the reason why I think they'd have trouble working.

It's not only the layout of our communities that make walking difficult, although that is certainly a huge factor. It's also the way we live--how we've structured the landscape of our lives as well as that of our communities.

I really, really, reeeeeally hate to mention this, and I have to preface it with the statement that back in the Sixties and Seventies I was an old-style feminist liberal type (I'm 48). Since then, and since going back to teaching, I've done almost a 180 on a lot of that. Here it comes (deep breath, as she ducks from potential flying tomatoes).

Walking to shops will not work in the USA because in Europe and in Asia, at least when I was there, married women did not all head out to work outside the home. They comprise the bulk of the walking shoppers. That is not to say that men did no walking: far from it. They walked a lot. But the women did the shopping.

I don't know if any bright sociologist has done any research on this, but it seems to me that the smaller, traditional communities gave way to the 'burbs and cars blight when several trends came together: more women in the workforce (who has *time* to walk to the store anymore??), and, on a macroeconomic level, the global economy and rise of the big box discount superstores like Walmart, Home Depot, etc drove the local mom & pop shops out of business.

I was primarily a housewife in Germany. I had that part-time job (which meant more walking), but mostly I did the Hausfrau thing. On any given day, during "working" hours, you'd see the streets filled with women walking. It was the prime means of transportation! If you needed to go further, you'd walk to the local train station, then take the train, get off the train, walk to the next location. Once I pretty much "walked" to PARIS. I started at the local train station outside Frankfurt, and by a combination of train and foot, eventually wound up in another country. Try that in the USA.

This country is so big that public transport has never become terribly viable. There almost seems a resentment against trains here--that's the feeling I get.

I did try to maintain the walking in NC, but a few things put the kaybash on that: the heat, and the neighbors. I could probably have dealt with the heat, but as I'd make my way down to the local Food Lion, just about every neighbor I'd see would stop me with "Y'all are WALKING???" They finally convinced me that it just wasn't safe (this was in Charlotte).

It's forty pounds and ten years later. I'm in NJ in a smallish town where I grew up. I'm close enough to walk to work, and close enough to walk to ShopRite and Walmart--if I go on Saturdays (time constraints). I'm determined to start walking again.

Tomorrow. ;-)

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BandoCommando
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quote:
Originally posted by Lyrhawn:

But I don't for a minute believe this is all going to happen. The government is paralyzed by inaction, and grand domestic projects are way beyond their capabilities. This country has been so focused on foreign affairs for the last seven years, we've totally lost sight of what needs fixing at home. And it's a shame that we won't take the steps now that will make us a better nation in the near future.


I wouldn't say that the government is always incapble of 'grand domestic projects'. Take a look at the history of the U.S. Interstate system. Eisenhower, as a Lt Colonel, was part of the army caravan that traversed the US from D.C. to San Francisco. It took a ridiculous length of time, and they dealt with uncounted logistical nightmares. Later on, Eisenhower witness the Autobahn when on campaign in Germany and realized how much of an economic and strategic benefit the system would have. Thus, when he achieved the presidency, he was able to bring about the U.S. Interstate system.

If we had an administration with a similar vision of a need for domestic change, progress COULD be made. But Lyrhawn, you're absolutely correct in saying that our focus (not just the administration, but the US as a whole) is in foreign affairs at this time.

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Dagonee
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One other problem is that it's a lot harder to be within walking distance of work when two people in the house work. If the choice is two medium-length commutes or one long and and one short commute, many will settle on the two medium-length.
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LoveOfWorthing
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I have a friend who lives just outside Chapel Hill. I think he rather whimsically calls it "the peoples' republic of Carrboro." From what I recall (this was pretty close to the university), it was a very walkable town, with shops and other services well within walking distance of residences. I don't have a clear picture of Greensboro in my head, but it sounds like most larger towns (or smaller cities) these days, from the description in the article.

I've been thinking and saying the same things for years. We squander the space we have with huge lawns and awkward distances. This makes the average European or Japanese shake their head.

Some years ago I tried to mount a mini-internet campaign for solar, wind, and other renewable sources of energy because first of all, it's the logical and right thing to do, and secondly because Our dependence on oil plays into the hands of our enemies. This was over ten years ago. Maybe by now it doesn't sound so crazy anymore.

Or maybe it does, in a society far too much like Capitol.

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BandoCommando
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quote:
Originally posted by Dagonee:
One other problem is that it's a lot harder to be within walking distance of work when two people in the house work. If the choice is two medium-length commutes or one long and and one short commute, many will settle on the two medium-length.

That is an excellent point that I hadn't thought of. I mean, before suburbia, it was MUCH less common to have two working adults in the same household...
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NotMe
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Chapel Hill and Carrboro are definitely very walkable towns. Durham, the opposite. Greensboro and Wake County are in between, but a lot closer to Durham. (for different reasons, thankfully)

What really annoys me is that, even in a town full of greenways and bike lanes, all the shopping centers assume that kids on bikes mean trouble. That is a really stupid business move, because the kids on bikes are customers that largely CAN'T go to any other store because of the distance.

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LoveOfWorthing
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Getting the shops and services closer to residences is one part of the solution. I'm not sure how we get workplaces closer, but computers have to be a big part of that answer.

Another thing that bugs me is our outsourcing. Why couldn't we arrange for cottage industries and have our own people do a lot of that telephone work? Not long ago I wound up talking to a person in India for customer service for a store that is only fifteen miles away from my home. What the heck is that about.

I'm really quite sold on stay at home moms. It's because of what's happened to our children, who seem to have been raised by Jerry Springer-style television instead of by moms who can teach manners and values. Personal peeve, that one, because in a few short years they wind up in our classrooms and we somehow have to try to socialize them in addition to teaching them the lesson material.

What that has to do with techno-savvy cottage industries is this: give those jobs to US SAHMs so they can stay at home and raise the children. Even if they work part time or job share while other moms do playgroup, and then trade off. There are a lot of possibilities. Why am I phoning India to get service from a store that's in my own neighborhood?? (just about)

I just don't understand why I have to teach teenagers why it is Not A Good Idea, In General, to hike up your tights in full view of God 'n' everybody in a classroom.

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Todoni
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Very timely subject, Sterling, with the price of gas projected to top $4 a gallon on some US areas this summer.

A visit to London 2 years ago, we had no car for 10 days. The tube and the rails and the buses all worked with each other to provide fast and convenient transport. One time (one time!) the tube was running a little slow. A message replayed over and over apologizing for the FIVE minute delay, and promised another train would be by within in 1 1/2 minutes.

Hmmm...here in the Denver area, we usually have sidewalks, and we do have buses. I leave work at 5:25 to be at work by 5:50 so I can log in on time.
If I was to take a bus to work (which runs once an hour in my neighborhood, if it is not running late 30-40 minutes), I would have to leave the house by 3:00 a.m. to walk 20 minutes to the bus stop, wait 20-30 minutes for a bus to arrive, take a bus trip of 45 minutes (the bus has this habit of always stopping), to then walk a very dark road with little sidewalk to where my lovely new office building sits in once was a beautiful field, if I don't get run over by people speeding to work, and also the walk from this bus stop to the office is a little farther than the bus stop back home, so 30 minutes walking time. Total time for bus is 1 hour and 55 minutes versus car being 25 minutes.

So I drive a cheap small old car with a newish engine, and my last trip to gas station cost $30.00, when it is usually $17-21. I heard someone with one of those big SUV's spends $90 to fill their tank. Yikes!

I have always been a proponent of public transportation. I have voted for most increases of taxes to pay for expansion of said transport. (most, not all, I don't give a not a blank check, each proposol has to be logical and practical) However, the Colorado area has this reputation of 'we live in the wild west and it's every man for himself' attitude, and most transportation proposals are defeated at the polls. The rich guy doesn't feel like he should pay for some poor person to ride when they should be getting a job instead and buying a big car like he did. The middle class guy feels like why should he subsidize everything and why doesn't just the rich guy pay? The poor guy either doesn't vote or doesn't feel anything with the words "costs more" should be voted for. Perhaps I digress into socialism! LOL

We need Ideas!:
Neighborhoods with sidewalk requirements
.....more walking areas....better faster cleaner transportation for the public.....more limits for access for cars...so it is not so easy to drive everywhere....fewer parking spaces. All things that try to make driving a car everywhere both not as needed and less attractive.

One issue maybe not fully addressed...is safety. Lots of people drive to cool downtown areas and go to bars and restuarants and such....then they are in their car again. Who walks around their downtown at night?
Which woman of any age feels safe walking alone at night? Even a fat middle aged woman fears her purse being stolen, and in these days identity theft is the rape that keeps on giving.

More police presence and more PEOPLE on the street is the answer. To be in a crowd feels safer than alone.

I fear we will never leave our cars until either we can not afford the gas or we get some safe public transportation or the streets and sidewalks are made safer and more attractive.

One note though for Roseauthor...that seems a wonderful situation, wish I had it. Most people I know from outlying suburban towns in Dallas-Ft Worth area are not able to find full time employment in those little towns. How many of your neighbors have the same good luck and how many of them drive 30 or minutes each way to work? Are there buses that go ONLY to the downtown and back (like in Denver) or did anyone realize most new jobs are also in suburbs, and people now need suburb-to-suburb connections? Sadly, it is probably like around Denver...unless you are in an established neighborhood and work downtown and work a regular 8-5 shift, public transportation does not exist.

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scholar
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My sister lived in DC for several years without a car and rarely had problems (except church, but usually somebody would pick her up).
I don't have a link to this story, but in Houston, I think there was a push to stop construction and rip up the rail before it was finished. At that point, it would cost more money to rip it up then finish it. But it was the principle of the matter.

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LoveOfWorthing
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Roseauthor and Todori and all:

I actually grew up in a smallish town (about 15k people--in NJ, that is small). It was a lot like what Roseauthor visualized. I left just after high school ('77). Came back in '02, just about 25 years later. It had changed, but a lot of it was still the same, thankfully. (shades of the Bildungsroman, but hey...literary cliches don't get to be cliches unless there's some reality behind them)

Because we were always a bit of a backwater, trends caught up with us a bit later than they did elsewhere. Imagine my chagrin when, just as I arrived back, there was a push to move retail and services out of the town center and onto the highway. SHEESH. So I found myself writing letters to the local paper and showing and and speaking at town meetings on this subject. One point of contention was whether or not they were going to build the new town hall and police station (desperately needed) outside the center or within it. PLEASE don't do this thing, I said. Enough has moved out to the highway already. I've seen what happens to towns when they lose their center.

At one point I even waxed a bit poetic and dramatic and stood up in a meeting to say "A town that loses its center, loses its soul." Nobody laughed, which was a relief.

But I look around, wishing for the physical landscapes of the early Sixties and Fifties and before to reappear, and I realize: it's not so much that our physical environment changes the way we live; we've changed the way we live, and we change our physical environment to suit our habits. Nobody walks anymore. And why don't people walk? They don't walk because everyone is busy away, sometimes far away from home, working. My situation is unusual in that my current job is precisely one mile away from where I'm sitting now at the dining table typing this. And still I don't walk to work (yet). Which is ridiculous.

So we're shackled to the car, just like everywhere else. And our city planning reflects that.

A similar dynamic is at work among the many small Episcopal parishes, many or most of which were built in the 18th and 19th centuries here (and even before that). When those adorable little stone churches were built, people walked, and the church's planning was for a parish within walking distance. That added up to a whole lot of tiny, cute, adorable little stone churches all over the place. And each one struggles to keep its doors open, because a congregation has to reach critical mass to be able to afford to stay open. And if there's no parking available, or limited parking, they struggle mightily to stay open.

It's all about the car! This is awful and I hate it, but that's the reality.

Today, nobody walks to them (if they attend at all--another story) and they're having to close some and consolidate others. We have one in our town. It is located in what used to be a central and highly accessible spot, but there is NO PARKING for it. And I mean *no* place to park. Its congregation is struggling to survive and keep the doors open.

My husband, who's been involved in church planning and planting recently, says all the time that the most important thing in the health of a parish is PARKING. (And here we thought it was Jesus! Sheesh.) Well, it is Jesus, but you see what I mean. Parking, parking, parking. Without it, a parish won't make it, because that's how people get to your church. Or store. Or whatever.

And that is why Abner Doon (who was indeed the devil, but "he meant well!" LOL, I love that line) had to destroy Capitol completely in order to resurrect humanity. They were stuck. We are stuck. What to do.

Where's Doon? [Angst]

Doon might just take the form of our current enemies, who, I feel, are fairly soon going to cut off our oil almost entirely. Then things get interesting, for sure. We'll be crippled for a time, but hopefully something better will resurrect itself.

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AvidReader
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Here in Tally you get sidewalks in certain neighborhoods, but they don't go anywhere. Even the big roads with bike lanes don't give them enough room to really be safe. And I barely trust our drivers to be on the road with them in my car. I wouldn't dare try to cross a road here on foot. (We're notorious red light runners.)

Like LoveofWorthing, I'm also annoyed by how weird people consider walking. Back in the mid 90s, my stepsister forgot her lunch money while she was taking a computer summer class. It was just down the road and I wasn't doing anything, soI walked it up to her.

I got stopped by the cops who wanted to make sure I wasn't a runaway. Then they acted like there was something wrong with me for wanting to keep walking instead of getting a ride.

The whole perception of walking needs to change before most people will bother. Maybe we need a walking PR campaign.

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LoveOfWorthing
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AvidReader: I've also been stopped by cops!! (in the USA, of course, not overseas)

Offense? Walking. Unbelievable.

Maybe that's why we're still teaching "1984" in high schools....

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Orincoro
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Yep, in L.A. I've heard it's standard procedure to stop you if you appear to be walking for no reason.
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LoveOfWorthing
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My gentle, 25-year-old, wouldn't-hurt-a-flea son was stopped one night. He couldn't sleep, didn't want to wake the rest of us up; took a walk, and was promptly arrested. Granted it was late, but he wasn't *doing* anything wrong. Had to go to court and the whole thing.
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Permitheus
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Wait... LoveOfWorthing, are you telling me there is an actual law against walking? what was he charged with? I for one enjoy taking walks thru the city after dark, its fun to see what is going on.
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LoveOfWorthing
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quote:
Originally posted by Permitheus:
Wait... LoveOfWorthing, are you telling me there is an actual law against walking? what was he charged with? I for one enjoy taking walks thru the city after dark, its fun to see what is going on.

Well, he didn't mean any harm, but what he did was a bit, let's say, eccentric.

It was the wee hours of the morning in our rather small town; he couldn't sleep, didn't want to wake his father and me, and so he went out just to walk--at FOUR AM!! (Sheesh) He's so innocent that it never occurred to him that someone at the neighborhood bakery (the only folks up at that hour) might see him and wonder what he was up to. Which is what happened. So they called the police, who came and cuffed him and arrested him. The way they were able to charge him is that he was walking on the railroad tracks--so technically it was trespassing on private property (owned by the railroad).

The thing I found so frustrating is that our house is a whole block away from where they cuffed him. In my view, they overreacted, and should have simply brought him home with a warning.

It was the late hour that was the problem, I think.

In another city, a bigger one, I was stopped by a cop while walking around my apartment complex. I'd had a big dinner, and just wanted to walk it off, you know? But a police officer stopped me, asked me where I lived, then escorted me right to my apartment and waited till I produced a key that fit before he let me go.

And Americans wonder why they're so fat (myself included).

The weird thing was that as I was walking that evening, I was remembering a short story I'd read, a dystopian speculative fiction story, where it had become illegal to walk after dark. Everyone was *supposed* to be inside their homes watching television (that was **law** in this fictional world).

I was remembering that story, and this cop stops me. I tried to tell him about the story, but he hadn't read it. (smile)

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JLM
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Hmmmm... My wife and I often go for a walk together around the neighborhood at dusk. Often is it is quite dark by the time we get back, but we usually pass several people who are also out for a walk after dark.

What the police look for is someone who is "out of place". If you live in a neighborhood where nobody walks, and you are out walking, then you would be suspect. Particularly if you are a young male, and especially so if it is late at night. If I saw a youth walking around at 4:00 AM, I would be highly suspicious that he was up to no good. The last time I was "going for a walk" at that hour of the night, I certainly has mischievious deeds in mind.


.

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LoveOfWorthing
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quote:
Originally posted by JLM:
What the police look for is someone who is "out of place". If you live in a neighborhood where nobody walks, and you are out walking, then you would be suspect. Particularly if you are a young male, and especially so if it is late at night. If I saw a youth walking around at 4:00 AM, I would be highly suspicious that he was up to no good. The last time I was "going for a walk" at that hour of the night, I certainly has mischievious deeds in mind..

I know. I gave him what for the next day when I found out. But he's just that innocent and naive a person. He really just wanted to walk his insomnia off.

He had to go to court, but the judge let him off, fortunately.

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ambyr
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Back when I didn't live in a big city and didn't have a 9-5 job, I used to go walking regularly with a friend in the 3-5am range. It's an incredibly peaceful thing to do, if you live in a safe area. We would pass the occasional other insomniac, and other than that -- nothing. Not even cars, unless we went near the highway. Just wind through leaves and birds just beginning to wake up.

In retrospect, it is, indeed, lucky we didn't get a talking to from the cops. But then, they'd've had to have been awake at that hour -- and I never saw any evidence that they were.

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ricree101
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quote:
Originally posted by LoveOfWorthing:

The weird thing was that as I was walking that evening, I was remembering a short story I'd read, a dystopian speculative fiction story, where it had become illegal to walk after dark. Everyone was *supposed* to be inside their homes watching television (that was **law** in this fictional world).

I was remembering that story, and this cop stops me. I tried to tell him about the story, but he hadn't read it. (smile)

I definitely remember this story. Does anyone here remember what it was called or who wrote it? I tried looking it up with no success.
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LoveOfWorthing
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That's good to hear (that someone else remembers that story).

I second that: if anyone remembers what it's called, who the author was (I'm thinking Harlan Ellison, but I could be wrong), please let us know.

DS would get a kick out of reading that, I'm sure.

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Iain
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quote:
Originally posted by LoveOfWorthing:

I did try to maintain the walking in NC, but a few things put the kaybash on that: the heat, and the neighbors. I could probably have dealt with the heat, but as I'd make my way down to the local Food Lion, just about every neighbor I'd see would stop me with "Y'all are WALKING???" They finally convinced me that it just wasn't safe (this was in Charlotte).

That's just Charlotte. Many people walk in the town where I live. Much of the time the only people driving are tourists and people hauling stuff.

The only reason I don't walk to work is because sometimes I would have to leave the day before (I am an electician).

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Permitheus
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quote:
Originally posted by BandoCommando:
quote:
Originally posted by Lyrhawn:

But I don't for a minute believe this is all going to happen. The government is paralyzed by inaction, and grand domestic projects are way beyond their capabilities. This country has been so focused on foreign affairs for the last seven years, we've totally lost sight of what needs fixing at home. And it's a shame that we won't take the steps now that will make us a better nation in the near future.


I wouldn't say that the government is always incapble of 'grand domestic projects'. Take a look at the history of the U.S. Interstate system. Eisenhower, as a Lt Colonel, was part of the army caravan that traversed the US from D.C. to San Francisco. It took a ridiculous length of time, and they dealt with uncounted logistical nightmares. Later on, Eisenhower witness the Autobahn when on campaign in Germany and realized how much of an economic and strategic benefit the system would have. Thus, when he achieved the presidency, he was able to bring about the U.S. Interstate system.

If we had an administration with a similar vision of a need for domestic change, progress COULD be made. But Lyrhawn, you're absolutely correct in saying that our focus (not just the administration, but the US as a whole) is in foreign affairs at this time.

I have to disagree with you, the interstate system doesn't really seem to me to be a "Grand Domestic Project." It's primary purpose was to assist US Military in being able to quickly navigate our country to strategic defense points. You will notice that just about every Major military installation is located near the interstate. As an example, the only reason their exists a highway system on the Island of Oahu, Hawaii, is to connect the military installations. H1, H2, and H3 all begin and end with Pearl Harbor(Navy), Schofield Barracks(Army), and Kaneohe Bay(Marines). H1 also passes closely by Hickam Air Base(Air Force). This demonstrates that the interstate project wasn't really domestic, it was at the time considered vital to our nations defense. The fact that it exceptionally benifited our economy seems to simply be a nice side effect IMHO.
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lynn johnson
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The Lurker Sez: I have been biking to work lately, 10.5 miles (I measured it!) and aside from the occasional car hitting me*, it is great. I just called the newspaper and pitched a story - folks like me that save a gallon of arab gas a day. Elaine Jarvik said she might run with it.

What's the point? If we all pitch stories to local papers about walking / biking, we might create some movement. The Hundredth Monkey and all that stuff. Our current parties, both Republicats and Democrans, seem incapable of vision and are primarily focused on getting and keeping power. Let's take back initiative.

*OK it just happened once and it was a gentle bump and the driver apologized.

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LoveOfWorthing
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Lynn,

It's 10.5 miles in one direction or two?? (feeling very guilty indeed for not walking my measly ONE mile, one way).

How long does it take you?

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LoveOfWorthing
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I found it, I found it!!

The story we were thinking of was "The Pedestrian," by Ray Bradbury.

http://englischlehrer.de/texts/pedestrian.php

Google + persistence pays off!

I'm glad I found it, because things of this nature keep me up at nights.
[The Wave]

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