posted
No, this is not a thread about my good looks and charm - those can be discussed as matters of universal appeal elsewhere.
I'm thinking right now about art and literature and what makes something good. It seems that people think find the most humor in the things that relate most specifically to them. This explains why mormon teenagers enjoy movies like Singles Ward and The RM. But really, to anyone else on the planet, it's total second-rate cinema.
Gauguin and the symbolists, and later the abstractionist artists of the 20th century, sought to create an art with universal appeal, and as the years went by, art was deconstructed further and further until we ended up with minimalism and abstract expressionism. Both styles were about as stripped of any cultural significance as possible.
Is a universal aesthetic truly possible? If we found a form of art or literature that people in all cultures would enjoy, would it be of any quality? Will we keep laughing at inside jokes as long as culture continues? What do you think?
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posted
Classical music has universal appeal because (1) much is very familiar, and we often like what is familiar, and (2) classical music can run the gamut of structured and prim to shocking and dissolute, so something in there should strike a chord.
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Forms and music with universal appeal:
Hogarth's line of beauty. Think of the curve of a english garden path or a coca-cola bottle.
blue/green combinations. I do believe that most of what we determine to be beautiful is conditioned by what we are familiar with and what evokes good feelings, reproductions of the colors and sounds of universal experiences are the only pieces of art that could have universal appeal.
[ January 14, 2004, 01:17 PM: Message edited by: Javert Hugo ]
Posts: 1753 | Registered: Aug 2002
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posted
That story was great, Mike. I wonder why ducks are so funny.
I've recently found that the funniest joke I know is the interrupting starfish knock-knock joke that Mr. Funny (appropriately) shared with us. It elicits hysterical laughter from most adults I've tried it on, and rates very high with 5 year olds, who then spend the next week imitating it.
I think, as kat pointed out, that a lot of what an American would consider to have "universal appeal," such as classical music, has merely to do with familiarity. My Chinese friend, knowing that I liked opera, shared some Chinese opera with me once. Even I, who listens to a lot of world music, found it hard to enjoy.
I've also noticed that people from my hometown have a tendency to dislike anything "different" from what they're used to, from science fiction (a friend's mom told me that "Star Track stuff is just too weird. It's not real") to authentic chinese restaurants where they (appalingly!) don't serve sweet and sour chicken. The more I meet people like this, the more despondent I get about ever finding something that will truly appeal to everyone.
And what about globalization? Are worldwide chain stores our only option for creating a universal aesthetic? That's sure a scary thought. What is in our global future - will we remain a world of fiercely nationalistic individual culture pockets, will we grow to a level of global understanding in which we can appreciate authentic chinese food but not lose our regional identities, or will we meld into one giant McDonalds/MTV culture?
posted
Why would we want to find something that appeals to everybody? I think that takes populism a bit far, neh?
-o-
sax, I'd seen that article before . . . I think you linked to it previously . . . but seeing it again got me to thinking. Like everyone, I think I have a good sense of humor. But I feel out of touch with current American comedy. I don't find currently popular sitcoms funny. Ditto SNL. Movies made by SNL alumni repulse me. I have a special hatred for Jim Carrey. I don't prefer physical humor, and that seems to be the current mode for movie and television comedy. I prefer verbal wittiness, sight gags, or "in-jokes" as Annie refers to them . . . not in that they are exclusionary, but in that they derive their humor from situations familiar to me. So my preferences run to Zucker-Abrahms(sp?)-Zucker movies, Britcoms, Dave Barry. In sitcoms, I liked Mad About You, The Simpsons, and Drew Carrey before they all started trying too hard. And I liked GalaxyQuest and Up the Down Staircase for the inside joke appeal.
So rereading this article got me to thinking of that. As Annie points out with her Singles Ward comment, there are different cultures even within one country or group. I wonder if I am no longer fully a part of the American culture when it comes to humor . . . possibly because I don't watch enough TV or something. I don't think it has to do with being Latino, because I don't feel that my brand of humor is particularly latin. Heck, what passes for comedy on Univisión and Galavisión is probably worse that any offenses Mike Myers or Chris Farley have perpetrated, in my eyes anyway.
quote:People from the Republic of Ireland, the UK, Australia and New Zealand most enjoyed jokes involving word plays.
Many European countries, such as France, Denmark and Belgium, displayed a penchant for off-beat surreal humour, while Americans and Canadians preferred jokes where there was a strong sense of superiority -- either because a character looks stupid or is made to look stupid by someone else.
Europeans also enjoyed jokes that involved making light of topics that make people feel anxious, such as death, illness and marriage.
I specifically don't like humor I find degrading, which seems to be what they're describing American humor as--a description I would pretty much agree with. Based on what they're saying here, I wonder if I've somehow become British, at least in this aspect of my outlook.
Another point that occurs to me is that the article seems to tacitly assume that these cultural humor preferences are static. Given that I didn't always feel out of step with American humor, I don't think so. I think our mass media give rise to trends, so that with the success of Ace Ventura, say, a certain type of comedy became the vogue for a good bit, but that these cultural preferences they describe are likely to be fluid. I wonder what would happen if they repeated the study in ten years or so.
posted
I definitely agree that our sense of fashion and taste in art and music are heavily influenced by the media, but if our senses of humor - what we laugh at - aren't static, that is a deeper physiological question.
What can make a sense of humor change?
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posted
I know what you mean about degrading humor. Many of the situations in sitcoms that are supposedly humorous actually make me physically uncomfortable. There's just something about me that can't stand to see another person--even a fictional one--be humiliated like that. I can usually tell when it's going to happen, too. I'll turn to Juliette and say, "Here comes the part of the show that I can't watch."
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posted
I can't stand degrading humour. I can't even stand Mr. Bean, it makes me very sad. I can't see the humour in it...
I like humour in which no one is deeply embaressed or made to look very stupid in a coarse way and is then laughed at. Playing with words, and comic situations with intelligent characters are right up my street.
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posted
I can't think of any comedy I've seen in which a character wasn't in some way degraded. I'd say, if we're going to do "degraded the least," I'd say Seinfeld or Arrested Development. They're all degraded, but degraded equally, and each of the characters have some compassion.
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posted
saxon, I know just what you mean! I often turn off shows when I see they're going somewhere too painful to watch. (Incidentally, I did this with Meet the Parents as well.) Near the end, this happened a lot with Drew Carrey. Based on their commercials, this seems to be a staple at the moment with ABC comedies. Seems like a sign of weak writing to me. Can't think of anything funny, so they'll just do something humiliating. But then, as I said, I seem to be out of step.
Da Goat, that may depend on how liberally you define the word "degrade." But I would say that the types of humor I mentioned liking--verbal witticism, absurdism, sight gags--don't rely primarily or even extensively on degrading a character. I might seem that all humor relies heavily on degradation simply because that's the current flavor of American humor.
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