posted
There is a neighborhood cat that I'm about 80% sure is a stray, who has decided that my wife and I are her humans, and I haven't found myself liking a cat so much in years. When I'm outside doing yard work, she's always there, either "helping" me, dashing from tree to tree as though she were a skateboarder on a half-pipe, or sitting companionably on a tree branch that is at the same height as my head. We've been feeding her more and more (originally it was just a treat, but now it's a twice a day thing), and a couple of times we've let her into the house. When she's inside, she follows us from room to room, and if at all possible climbs up on our laps. I have mixed feelings about this--my wife and I are both allergic to cats--but it's seeming more and more like we've got a cat.
While I've had cats before, I've never had to train one to use a litter box--they've generally come from other people, and have come into my house already knowing all about boxes. Do adult cats (this one is probably about a year old) just know about litter boxes, or do you have to teach them? If you have to teach them, how do you do so? Also, how do you teach them to only sharpen their claws on a scratching post? A lot of our furniture came with the house, and if it's clawed up, that'll be fairly conclusive proof that we've violated our lease by having a pet.
I'm taking her to the vet tomorrow to see if she's been spayed (and spay her if she hasn't), and to get her vaccinated and dewormed (she's got tape worms, I'm fairly sure).
Posts: 16059 | Registered: Aug 2000
| IP: Logged |
posted
Most cats actually LIKE using litter boxes, as they prefer being able to hide what they've done. If you just pick up the cat and drop it in the litter box a few times, to get it familiar with where the box is located, it'll figure out that there's some convenient bathroom-quality sand.
If you have a cat who refuses to use a litter box, for some bizarre reason, I think you're pretty much stuck with diapers.
As to the scratching: nope. There is nothing you can do that will teach your cat not to scratch. You can buy catnip-scented scratching posts and diversionary scratchy things in hope that the cat will use them instead of the furniture, and you can try "corrective training" like spraying or smacking the cat if it scratches up your stuff, but the only really effective way to avoid having all your furniture reduced to wispy shreds is to luck out and get a mellow cat, or else pay a vet money to break all your cat's fingers and surgically extract the nails -- which is ridiculously cruel, IMO.
Posts: 37449 | Registered: May 1999
| IP: Logged |
posted
Well, most kittens get used to a litter box right away, but I think it's a bit more difficult with a wild adult cat.
About a year ago, a stray cat decided to adopt my family. One night he walked up to the door, meowed until we opened it, then just walked right in and hopped up on my sister's bed and went to sleep. After the shock passed, we decided to try to keep him. So we ran into the same question you have.
The vet told us to lock the cat up in a room with a litter box and not let him out for a week. It didn't work. The stubborn cat would go just outside the box, but had some kind of crazy litter box phobia. So, we eventually had to settle for letting him outside whenever he started crying. It works quite well, much like having another dog.
But, your vet probably has some suggestions for you. Posts: 4292 | Registered: Jan 2001
| IP: Logged |
posted
So far she hasn't tried to sharpen her claws on anything, so maybe I'll luck out and she just won't be doing it much. I certainly wouldn't be willing to have her declawed. I agree that it seems like an incredibly cruel thing to do; in her case it would be life threatening as well, since I don't expect her to become an exclusively indoor cat.
She also hasn't tried to go to the bathroom indoors, so I have no idea whether she'll have a problem with the box or not--I was just thinking ahead.
I really didn't want a cat (primarily because of allergies), but I think I have to face the fact that I've got one.
Posts: 16059 | Registered: Aug 2000
| IP: Logged |
posted
We try to put scratching posts in front of favorite spots for scratching furniture.
As for litterbox...if urinating in one area becomes a problem, I've heard you should put the food there and move the litterbox elsewhere. The cat is not likely to urinate where she eats.
quote: Also, how do you teach them to only sharpen their claws on a scratching post?
If anyone knew that they could make a fortune...
It sounds like you won't need this but if the cat does start regularly urinating in one (non litterbox) area such as the couch cover it with tin foil for a few days. The noise it makes when the cat steps on it should freak her out enough that she won't try to use it as a litter box again.
Posts: 3420 | Registered: Jun 2002
| IP: Logged |
posted
Out of curiosity, Tom, you comment on the declawing being "ridiculously cruel," yet make no mention of spaying. I'm honestly not attacking, but I'm wondering if you see these in different lights. I'm relatively ignorant in regard to cats -- I don't even know how long or at what temperature they need to be cooked -- but what is seen as the difference between the two procedures as it relates to owner convenience versus animal cruelty?
I think somewhere in my mind, I'm also preparing to relate the "spaying cats/dogs for health reasons" to circumcision, but with my limited knowledge I'm sure I won't be able to overcome the flaws in the analogy. Can anyone else pick up that one and run with it, or is it just too flawed from the onset? Also, with a son who just required a circumcision for medical reasons and another who's slated to have it done anyway, I'm not entirely sure it's an argument I'm willing to put my whole heart into, lest I get overly defensive and subsequently overly offensive. Phrases like "ritual genital mutilation" get to me, just as they're intended to.
posted
We didn't neuter our cat until we had to either. I don't like the neutering, but I see it (especially for male cats) as a lesser tortured surgery. Although, I sure did feel guilty for a day or two seeing kitty on those pain medications. Female spaying is more dubious to me because it is a much more involved surgery and the cats usually are in a good deal of pain for quite a while (up to months).
I also don't let my cat outside because I think it is a nuisance to neighbors and don't want it getting run over or into any numerous troubles.
With the declawing, they really break the cats feet/toes to dig the claws out. The cats have to relearn how to walk and there really is no reason that you can't keep the claws trimmed to prevent damage. Now, in practice, we don't trim our cats claws as much as we should, so some of our furniture looks a bit ragged in places.
Also, don't go for the tendon clipping for the claws either. That's worse and they relearn to extend their claws pretty quickly.
Guess I'm pretty opinionated.
Edit: I think spaying/neutering is also a bit more pc because aside from some of the health benefits, we don't want to see a bunch of unwanted kittens end up being euthanized or end up run-over on the street.
Again, though, I wouldn't have neutered my cat since he doesn't go outdoors, but his attention to cats outside meant that he was yowling all through the night. Perhaps it was mean of me not to let him out, then, but I would have neutered him then anyways.
Edit again: Vana beat me to it. Guess I should've just waited. *grin*
posted
Pop, the reason that I advocate spaying and neutering but not declawing is because there is a vast number of homeless pets out there in the world already, and spaying and neutering helps to control the pet population. I think it is much, much better to prevent more cats and dogs from being born than to have to put them down later because no one will take them. It's a temporary harm to the pets, and they're always given plenty of pain killers (at least, they are at good vetrinary offices!), and it in no way affects their daily lives after they recover from the surgery. Declawing does affect a pet's daily life, but doesn't benefit them or the general pet population in any way. It only leaves them with one less form of defense, and is especially harmful if the cat (I've not heard of dogs being declawed, so I'll just use the cat example) is an outdoor or even partially outdoor cat, or if there are other animals in the house as well. Spaying and neutering don't cause any such problems.
Also, I'm not sure why you're using the words "ritual" or "mutilation," - I guess I can kind of see neutring (which is basically castration) as "mutilation" of a kind, but it's very clean and precise. And when a cat is spayed, it's basically a hysterectomy - everything is removed.
Edit to add, after reading Christy's entry, that Valentine is showing no signs of being in pain, or even uncomfortable, now that her stitches are out. Probably some kittens don't fair as well, and maybe it helps that she is quite young, six months, and therefore likely to recover more quickly than an adult cat. I don't know. But basically, I think Christy and I agree.
quote:Also, I'm not sure why you're using the words "ritual" or "mutilation,"
Well, I can't speak to the mutilation part of the equation, but I can say that the "ritual" part is spot on. I know that my vet and his assistants dress in black robes, mutter something or other about Baal, toss in a few "So mote it be's", and then start cutting.
It's also a pain always having to bring my pets in on "the dark of the moon", but it seems to be the only time they ever have appointments open. Well, that and Beltane.
Posts: 16059 | Registered: Aug 2000
| IP: Logged |
posted
There are large numbers of homeless people, too -- do we need to start spaying and neutering people? And as a person, would you rather someone broke your fingers and removed your fingernails, or that someone give you a hysterectomy?
I believe it's rather presumptuous of us as humans to declare which has the greater and longer-lasting effect on animals. That doesn't mean I'm for or against either, just that I think we need to face such choices with humility and awe.
It could be argued that the neutering of a male cat, in reducing his aggressiveness, also robs him of a defense mechanism. I'd agree that declawing a cat who spends any of its time outdoors is probably dangerous to it, but who are we to declare that cats must be kept indoors anyway?
I'm playing a bit of devil's advocate here, and I readily admit that I'm not spending the time necessary to fully defend views for which I'm at least temporarily being a proponent, but for me it's one of those consistency issues. I'm not necessarily for or against a given position -- I only hope that people arrive at such positions thoughtfully. I'm also one of those people who believes that two people can take the exact same set of facts and information and reasonably and logically come to different conclusions, which helps me to understand an opposing viewpoint, but can detract from my effectiveness at standing firm on one side of an issue. So often my willingness to grant the logic of a differing argument is seen as granting the conclusion -- foot in the door, camel's nose in the tent, give 'em an inch, I suppose. Different argument, though. I always wander. What were we talking about?
Oh, and regarding the "ritual genital mutilation," that's how some people refer to circumcision (for or against? You decide). I don't think I've heard of anyone referring to spaying/neutering in that manner. Except for Noemon, apparently.
posted
Papa, it's not like that unfortunately. Due to the perhaps misguided expediencies of society, if there are too many cats the excess are killed. Spaying cats is a considerably more humane alternative.
Posts: 15770 | Registered: Dec 2001
| IP: Logged |
And because the pets cannot make the decision for themselves, it us up to their owners to do what they believe is the most responsible thing for them.
I agree that each pet owner needs to make that decision for their own pet, but if asked, I'll give my opinion (since I obviously think that my decision is the best one, otherwise I'd have a different opinion!).
Posts: 2661 | Registered: Apr 2002
| IP: Logged |
posted
If I'm willing to grant that spaying is more humane than killing the excess (which is my gut reaction, but I haven't though it through all the way, and I'm not sure it would be my gut reaction with humans, so I have to ask myself if it's fair with cats), that still doesn't mean it's humane empirically -- it'd be like saying stealing isn't as bad as murder so let's just allow stealing. Not very much like saying it, I admit, but there is a slim thread of similarity.
So how do we approach the "perhaps misguided expediencies of society" then? Is it, like racial equality, something for which the best solution cannot be legislated, but must simply be the free choice of all involved? But since all involved make different free choices, some legislation, however imperfect, is put in place? Ah, the glories of cross-thread unrelated debates....
posted
In regard to spaying a female pet: this decreases her chances of getting breast cancer and eliminates her chances of contracting cervical, uterine, or ovarian cancer. Also pyometra, which is a really nasty uterine infection that most older unspayed females will eventually succumb to.
Our dogs are both spayed. (Weirdly enough, this does not discourage unneutered male dogs from trying to seduce our older dog, a beautiful chocolate lab. They never bother the younger one, just the older one, who must be a paragon of canine gorgeousness or something. She communicates very clearly to the male that she is NOT INTERESTED, NOT TODAY OR ANY OTHER DAY, BECAUSE SHE'S NOT THAT KIND OF GIRL, but sometimes the male pesters her for ten or fifteen minutes, at which point she gets really pissed off and bites his butt. Then he usually gets the message.)
[ October 27, 2003, 03:04 PM: Message edited by: Yozhik ]
Posts: 1512 | Registered: A Long Time Ago!
| IP: Logged |
posted
Wouldn't it do the same for young girls, though?
On a less controversial (perhaps) issue, should we encourage the forced removal of the appendix for all children because it eliminates the chance of appendicitis? Or tonsils to eliminate tonsilitis?
Posts: 6213 | Registered: May 2001
| IP: Logged |
posted
More on our personal experiences with spaying:
Our older dog was not spayed until she was two and a half. She is a purebred chocolate lab, and we had originally planned to breed her. Then we learned more about the complexity of breeding purebred dogs (purebred dogs are all inbred--that's how you DEVELOP a separate breed--and there are a lot of genetic problems that you have to know how to compensate for by choosing a particular mate for your dog). My brother in law bred his dog and ended up with a badly crippled puppy. (Six thousand dollars and three operations later, she is no longer crippled, but very few people will spend that much money to help a dog.) So, we decided to leave dog breeding to the experts and have our lab spayed.
We felt HORRIBLY guilty when she came home from the vet with a long row of stitches. She was in visible pain for a day or two (she got up on the bed and made herself a nest out of our pillows so that she didn't have to put any weight on the incision). After that, she recovered rapidly -- her biggest beef with the whole thing was that she wasn't allowed to climb the stairs for two weeks. She is used to having free roam of the house and does NOT like to be confined.
Also, our dog was upset when the vet removed the stitches, because she wanted to eat them and was not allowed.
When our younger dog, the mix, was spayed, a month after we got her from the pound, it was much the same story, only the recovery period was faster. The visible pain lasted only a half day, and we had to confine the younger dog in a pen to keep her from playing with the older one and tearing her stitches. (This annoyed both of the dogs, but they got over it.)
The older dog is now seven years old, and the younger one is almost four. Their favorite activities include running around the house like nuts, knocking over furniture, running around the yard like nuts, clobbering each other, grooming each other, barking at the UPS truck, sleeping on the bed, sleeping on the papasan chair, sleeping on the couch, and eating various food and non-food items. They show no ill effects from the spaying.
Posts: 1512 | Registered: A Long Time Ago!
| IP: Logged |
quote:Wouldn't it do the same for young girls, though?
Well, in our society, a human being is allowed to be in charge of its destiny, including its own reproductive functions. Our dogs are not--as their caretakers, we are in charge of their lives and reproductive functions.
(By the way, when we selected our younger dog from the pound, I had to sign a statement promising to have her spayed. We don't know for sure, but we think that she probably ended up homeless in the first place because she ran away from home during her first heat: unspayed female dogs get restless during this time.)
Posts: 1512 | Registered: A Long Time Ago!
| IP: Logged |
posted
I think that, really, the difference between a cat or dog and a person is that the pets can't make these decisions for themselves. It's up to the human owners (because they are owners, which is not the case with children) to do for their pets what they think is the most responsible thing.
Posts: 2661 | Registered: Apr 2002
| IP: Logged |
posted
So I'm back to the original question. Why is de-clawing different, if that's what the owner considers the responsible thing to do? Is there a right/wrong beyond the owner's opinion, and if so, is it possible to know what it is, and mightn't it be the responsibility of society as a whole to overrule owners' choices at times? (Let's see if we can relate it to another unrelated thread....)
Posts: 6213 | Registered: May 2001
| IP: Logged |
quote:Papa, it's not like that unfortunately. Due to the perhaps misguided expediencies of society, if there are too many cats the excess are killed. Spaying cats is a considerably more humane alternative.
Says who exactly? I guess I don't see it quite as clear cut.
You have to decide whether the effects on the neutered/spayed animals quality of life will be worse than killing (don't waste my time mincing words), the unwanted offspring.
The thing is, who decides which offspring are the unwanted? You don't know that ahead of time. So can you decide that neutering/spaying your animal is the best choice?
The solution as generally presented seems to be, that since there are in general more cats (for instance) than are wanted, i won't contribute to the problem. I'm not sure I agree with that approach, but i'm kind of at a loss as to what would be a better approach.
I don't think that a comparison to humans is valid. The value of a human is much greater than that of an animal, no matter how loved the animal maybe. The number one consideration when treating animals, and deciding whether to treat them at the veteriany hospital where i volunteer is quality of life. We consider much lower levels of quality of life in human health, why? Because people have other ways of increasing their quality of life. Interpersonal interaction can do a great deal here, as can environment (see hospices). Not all of these paths apply to animals, no matter how much we say that our pet is a full fledged member of our families.
I believe they try to spay larger dogs before they go into heat for the first time, this way they don't ever realize that they have 'lost' something. Just a interesting side note.
Posts: 1621 | Registered: Oct 2001
| IP: Logged |
quote:Why is de-clawing different, if that's what the owner considers the responsible thing to do?
Because there are no health benefits to declawing, as there are to spaying/neutering.
quote:I believe they try to spay larger dogs before they go into heat for the first time, this way they don't ever realize that they have 'lost' something.
Actually, they recommend early spaying for ALL breeds, not just large ones, and not for the reason that you stated. Click on the "Myths" section at this website.Posts: 1512 | Registered: A Long Time Ago!
| IP: Logged |
Is it possible that the difference between declawing your cat and spaying your cat lies in the motivations for the procedure?
When a cat is declawed, the cat is suffering for the sake of human convenience.
When a cat is spayed, the cat is suffering for the sake of felinekind.
Of course de-reproductivizing a pet is done as much for human convenience as it is for felinekind, too; it just happens that those two goals coincide.
OTOH, I'm sure that if you asked a CAT, were they able to respond in kind, you wouldn't find a single one that wouldn't object to either procedure. Cats prefer to have claws and cats prefer to make kittens, as a general rule.
Posts: 1307 | Registered: May 2000
| IP: Logged |
posted
Follow-up question: if you were abducted by aliens that wanted to keep you around as a house pet, how would you want to be treated by your owners?
Posts: 1307 | Registered: May 2000
| IP: Logged |
posted
Yozhik, I'm still not convinced that's a legitimate response. If a daughter were born with such a severe disability that she was unable to express desire, would it be within the parents' rights to force her to get a hysterectomy, and legitimize that decision because there is now no chance the girl will get uterine cancer?
Let's say I'm a cat owner, but I also have an inordinate fondness for my leather couch. If the cat claws up the couch, I'm gonna kick it, so is it now ok to have the cat de-clawed for its own sake?
Again, I'm not against you (nor do I honestly hate cats as much as I sometimes indicate), but I'm just not convinced that it's as simple as you're making it out to be, whether the conclusion is the same or not. I've also seen how cute your dog is, and I'm jealous that you made it into OSC's acknowledgements before I did, but that is all neither here nor there.
posted
Most cats seem to have an innate desire to use a litter box (we didn't really even have to train the tiny kittens they raised, they figured it out on their own). I would wait and see if this particular cat has any problems adjusting to one. If so, the tin foil on the carpet for a week, followed by covering the spot with a food or water dish does work well. Since it is a semi-stray you are adopting, other behavior modification (ie. scolding) probably wouldn't work well (it only works when you have the complete trust of your pet).
As for spaying/neutering, I believe it is in my pet's best interest. I do not want to contribute to the cat/dog population of the world, since I am not in a position to care for dozens of animals. I prefer to do it at a young age, so as to be less traumatic for them. Up until recently, I have only had male animals as pets, and they seemed to feel little discomfort. I worried about having our little kitten spayed (since the operation is much more complex), but did have it done. She also seemed to experience little pain. Spaying/neutering makes animals (especially when they are young when they have the operation) more docile, which I think is a good thing in a pet. I feel bad that they must suffer pain, but I think that the pain is in their own (and my) best interest.
I have always agonized about declawing my cats. Each time I have had it done has been for different reasons. Any cat that is declawed must be an indoor only cat. I would never declaw a cat that went outdoors, or had a propensity towards sneaking out. Although I know it is selfish of me, like Moose said, if their clawing is such a problem that I become angry with them, I think they need to be declawed. I know that they don't have much say in the process, but I would rather get rid of the claws than get rid of the animal. With our little kitten, I also felt she needed to be declawed so she did not have an unfair advantage over our other cat (who is declawed).
Posts: 5879 | Registered: Apr 2001
| IP: Logged |
The big difference, as I see it, is this: some men voluntarily have themselves neutered, for their own reasons. I can't think of ANY man who's ever asked to have his fingers and toes shattered by medical professionals. Posts: 37449 | Registered: May 1999
| IP: Logged |
posted
I think the question becomes: At what point does human convenience become less of a priority than animal preference/rights?
Obviously we cannot expect cats to control their own population. But doing so is in human and feline interest.
Also--and I'm not sure exactly to what extent this is true for cats, if at all--we should keep in mind that we are talking about domesticated animals. Most domestic animals cannot survive without the care of their human counterparts.
But living as a part of human society often requires sacrifice, for us and our pets alike. For human beings those sacrifices are behavioural rather than biological, but for human beings it is possible to direct and manage behaviour, which is not the case with an animal in your keeping (for the most part--directing and managing behaviour is dependant upon the existence of accountability).
Is it reasonable to provide humane and mutually beneficial living conditions for an animal in return for forcing it to be domesticated to the point that it no longer functions as an active member of its species' gene pool? Does it not seem reasonable that a pet owner accept responsibility for a pet's well-being while ensuring that they won't be responsible for the well-being of litter upon litter of its offspring? Does the fact that the cat cannot be held accountable for its natural impulses justify our preempting of those natural impulses, with the assumption that that is done to preserve the acceptability of the owner/pet relationship without which a domesticated animal would be unable to survive?
My premature answer is yes, but I'm not sure cats would agree.
Posts: 1307 | Registered: May 2000
| IP: Logged |
posted
I actually think my cat is happier declawed than he would otherwise be.
He was a climber, and he could (and did) claw himself up and down my leg or my back or the furniture. He didn't like getting reprimanded/squirted, and I didn't like claw marks on my back. Plus my clothes were getting marked up. After the surgery his wounds were glued shut so I didn't have to worry about infection getting into the wounds from his litterbox. There were no stitches to worry about either. After the first 36 hours he was back to his usual self although he walked rather gently for about 5 days.
Now he can pretend to scratch his claws on anything in the house without getting punished. He loves to "claw" at things all the time. He can knead his paws on me without causing me any pain. And he is a totally indoor cat, there is no way (NO WAY) he is getting outside other than on a harness. It is true, he can't climb anymore, but considering he can leap from the floor directly onto my shoulder I don't think that is really a problem.
Posts: 1990 | Registered: Feb 2001
| IP: Logged |
quote:If a daughter were born with such a severe disability that she was unable to express desire, would it be within the parents' rights to force her to get a hysterectomy, and legitimize that decision because there is now no chance the girl will get uterine cancer?
No, but in some cases, parents have been allowed to have their mentally disabled daughters undergo sterilization if (a) pregnancy would be a severe health risk to the daughter or (b) there are serious problems with hygiene.
Also, there is a difference between a child and a pet. A human's sexuality is a part of their identity in a way that a dog's isn't. For most of the year, even unspayed female dogs have no sexual identity. The personality that the Wonderlab had after spaying is the same personality that she had 11/12ths of the year before spaying.
(When the Wonderlab was in season (twice a year), she would get very, very, very depressed. She moped around the house in her blue polka-dotted doggie pants (she had to wear sanitary napkins, because she got a period just like a person). If we were a few minutes late with her dinner, she would go and hide in the windowless bathroom and lie there, in the dark, with her back turned toward us. If she could have written angst-ridden poetry, I'm sure she would have.) --------------------------------
By the way, one in four unspayed dogs will contract breast cancer. For people, it's closer to one in ten. That's a big difference.
[ October 27, 2003, 05:17 PM: Message edited by: Yozhik ]
Posts: 1512 | Registered: A Long Time Ago!
| IP: Logged |
posted
Tom -- if humans had claws instead of nails, I personally think such a procedure would be made available by someone, and people would take advantage of it. Actually, are there not still countries where the penalty for theft is the loss of a hand? Can we draw no comparisons there, either? (Yeah, creating that comparison doesn't necessarily bolster my "cause" much, does it....)
Well, despite my lack of hatred for cats, I still have enough of an aversion to them that I'll never own one, so I don't have to worry about the de-clawing choice. But I think the topic is fascinating....
posted
Declawing is cruel and uncalled for. If you need a pet without claws, you need to look for some other species besides a cat. It's amputation of the fingers. It renders a cat totally helpless should it ever be confronted with another animal, or should it ever accidentally get outside.
Neutering is really just necessary for the cat to be a pet. If a male indoor cat is left unneutered he will spray urine all over everything (walls, furniture, carpets) to mark his territory. If he's an outdoor only cat and left unneutered, he can look forward to a short brutish life fighting, roaming, and accumulating terrible injuries and diseases, then an early death. Tom cats (unneutered males) almost never live more than a few years. Write me if you want a complete list of the terrible diseases to which he will be prone, given that sort of life.
Females if unneutered and allowed outside at all, will get pregnant and have litter after litter of kittens. Nobody can possibly take care of all the kittens that will result from this practice. You will either start neutering or soon be overrun with cats. Even if your cat is a female indoor cat, if you want to leave her unneutered she will spend day after day, night after night, calling and crying and trying to escape. Her times of being in heat will last a week or so each time, during which she will drive you absolutely nuts. I've heard that if not allowed to breed, some queens (female unneutered cats) will stay in heat almost continuously.
I usually let my male cats get to be about 4-6 months old before neutering them. (I like to give the tiny things a chance to grow and be strong before doing any surgery on them.) You should not wait too long on the boys because their adult behavior pattern, if ever established, (spraying), may not change with neutering. So you need to neuter them when they're still juvenile. Females I like to wait until after their first heat, because it seems to make them more affectionate, and also because they have so much more invasive a surgical procedure that I like to give them more time to grow first.
Noemon, a female cat will be fine as a pet if neutered as an adult. If she's not pregnant and she's fully grown, then she may have already been neutered. Ask the vet to check. I've never had to do anything to train a cat to use the litterbox besides provide one, show it to them, and keep it clean. They like using a litterbox. When any cat has ever gone outside the litterbox in my cat family it has without exception been because of a medical problem. This is almost never a behavoiral problem.
Do your best to keep your new cat indoors. They have much longer healthier lives that way. They are not susceptible to intestinal parasites, fleas, feline leukemia virus, feline aids virus, being torn apart by dogs or coyotes, or being hit by cars when kept indoors. My vet kept after me to keep mine indoors all the time and he finally convinced me. Since I started doing that, I've become a true believer. Mine are much healthier and safer than ever they were before. I urge everyone to keep their cats indoors.
Posts: 968 | Registered: Sep 2003
| IP: Logged |
posted
Our family cat got spayed when she was pretty young, and she got declawed when we got leather furniture when she was about 7. She was pretty miserable for about a week and a half, but now she's completey fine. She already spent most of her time inside, so going to all-inside wasn't a big adjustment. As for being defensless, ak, ever since she got declawed, Raja has been biting way harder than she used to, sometimes drawing blood. She compensates just fine for an indoor cat. Yes, I know it's not the same thing, but mostly she just lays on my bed or in my dresser drawer and sleeps anyway, so why does she need claws for that?
For my parents, it was pretty much get rid of the claws, or get rid of the cat.
Posts: 4089 | Registered: Apr 2003
| IP: Logged |
quote: With the declawing, they really break the cats feet/toes to dig the claws out. The cats have to relearn how to walk and there really is no reason that you can't keep the claws trimmed to prevent damage.
Raina's had her toes broken? My poor, poor kitty! *hugs Raina tight* (I did not know Raina was declawed until after I had signed the adoption papers.)
quote:It renders a cat totally helpless should it ever be confronted with another animal, or should it ever accidentally get outside.
What about biting? Raina bites, although no where near as much as she used to. When I first got her, I was always getting bitten. She was also a stray, so she managed to do just fine even though she was declawed.
She's a completely indoors cat. I actually have a leash and harness for her, but she doesn't like it. Also, she slips out too easily. Otherwise I'd take her out for walks.
Posts: 1805 | Registered: Jun 1999
| IP: Logged |
posted
Yeah, I've got both old and fresh scratches all up and down both arms from my cat's teeth and possibly from his back claws (most declawed cats still have back claws) from his more hyper moments of playtime. Considering how fast he runs, how high he jumps, and how well he bites, I wouldn't consider him completely helpless either. Not that he is ever, ever going to be in a situation where he'll need to protect himself. Ever. He manages to get his paws into everything without any trouble, even clawless. His new game is to open the kitchen cabinets and bang them shut. Over and over.
Posts: 1990 | Registered: Feb 2001
| IP: Logged |
posted
noemon, i'm going to try to keep it simple and noncontroversial. here is my opinion regarding scratching.
i have a 14 year old cat who spent most of his earlier life as an indoor/outdoor cat. while he did do a bit of scratching inside, he did even more outside. i'm not sure if you could train her to "want outside" when she needs to scratch (somehow, i doubt it), but if you give her plenty of time to wander and such outside, you might be ok. as for her contracting diseases and such by being outside, if you're serious about taking responsibility for her, you should have her checked out regularly. in the 14 years i've had my cat, he's had fleas once after another cat got them, and he's only had worms once as well. in the country the main concern was ticks, but even they weren't that big a deal. i don't know what your environment is like, but as long as you're willing to take care of her, you will figure out soon enough what she's able and willing to do nd go from there.
Posts: 1090 | Registered: Oct 2003
| IP: Logged |
posted
A cat with claws can climb to get away from danger. If cornered, it can sometimes save itself from a dog by slapping it on the tender nose parts, if the slap has sharp claws in it. That will discourage dogs who aren't serious about killing cats. A lunging bite is not nearly as fast as a swipe with the paw, and also leaves the neck vulnerable to being grabbed. A cat without claws is helpless outside. This is the cat's life at stake. You go out in the yard and are usually not in deadly danger but the same is not true for your cat.
When you deprive a cat of its claws, you severely handicap it. There are quite a few vets who won't even do this procedure. The comparable thing for a human would be cutting off all your fingers between the second and third joints. If you need a clawless pet, then please choose a species other than cat.
Posts: 968 | Registered: Sep 2003
| IP: Logged |
Printer-friendly view of this topic
![[Smile]](smile.gif)
![[Blushing]](graemlins/blushing.gif)
![[Angst]](graemlins/angst.gif)
If she could have written angst-ridden poetry, I'm sure she would have.) ![[Cry]](graemlins/cry.gif)
*hugs Raina tight* (I did not know Raina was declawed until after I had signed the adoption papers.)![[Frown]](frown.gif)
Otherwise I'd take her out for walks.
