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and we celebrated in proper fashion by watching Sense and Sensibility and Mansfield Park. We could have done Pride and Prejudice, but it was a school night.
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Annie, I had no idea! Hubby watched Pride and Prejudice with me last night, both of us totally unaware of the specialness of the day. I'll have to watch Sense and Sensibility and Emma in the next few days.
Hey, did you hear there is a new Pride and Prejudice out? www.prideprejudice.com I'd like to see it, though it doesn't look like it got very broad distribution.
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...and in solemn celebration people all across the world fainted, took tea, exchanged witty and urbane banter with someone who had a military title in his name (e.g., "Lt. Brigadier Col. Pfc. Lord Winston Alistair M.L. Chumsley Bottomstopper"), went to London, took a stroll, took tea in the garden, fainted in the garden while taking tea, died of consumption, got married after a long and intensely uninteresting debate about dowries, or had some sort of come-uppance.
<shudder> Seriously, what IS it about Stone Cold Jane Austen that makes you women giggle and sigh and speak in British accents? There's this stratum of women between the ages of about 16 and 40 that just seems to love her (my sister included), and I can't for the life of me understand why. She's just not--what's the phrase?--any good.
Okay, I'm done. Feel free to return to your party!
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Hmmm, I don't remember fainting being a prominent activity among Austen's heroines. The closest thing that comes to mind is Fanny feeling weak and having to rest inside the house when they were visiting that annoying suitor of her eldest cousin. Oh, and Marianne getting sick after being out in the rain at Colonel Brandon's estate. Nor do I remember anyone dying of consumption. I think you have your stereotypes slightly mixed up, Dante. And suggesting Austen isn't good is heresy, but I expect you know that.
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Jane Austen heroines are anything but stereotypical weak-willed corseted women. Only the ones who are treated abominably ill tend to faint. And with good reason!
She pokes fun at all those stereotypical Brits, you see? Lizzie Bennett transcends the tea sipping waif!
Anyway. Back to your regularly scheduled drivel.
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See, Dante is literature: grand, philosophical, exciting, poetic. Janey is, er, quaint. Big difference.
Tristan,
quote:I think you have your stereotypes slightly mixed up, Dante. And suggesting Austen isn't good is heresy, but I expect you know that.
I hope you will allow me a modicum of hyperbole in poking fun. If not, I understand--reading Jane Austen has probably turned you off to most types of literary devices (and humor). <grin> And I wasn't actually suggesting that she wasn't good...
Okay, so I'm a philistine. Please tell me, Friends of the Dull Goddess, why I'm wrong. Please help me understand what it is that people see in this woman. I remember having to suffer through at least two of her books in high school (I don't remember which ones; I do remember that they were pretty much the same book with differently named characters) and some other passages as an undergrad.
Obviously, my criticism has touched a nerve with some of you, so defend your heroine. What in the world is GOOD about Jane Austen?
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Dante, I understand. You had to read her in high school. And you're a guy. *pat pat* Poor thing. It was even hard for me to read her in high school and I'm a sappy girl!
But, now that I'm older and a little bit wiser, I've gone through a revival and have read her books and just LOVED them. I'm smarter, so I catch all the little subtleties of wit and all the insulting barbs that are bandied about. That's my favorite thing about the books. In the parlor party scenes or picnic scenes (which every book undoubtedly has) the dialogue is just brilliant and the compliments and veiled zinging insults are flying fast and furious. When I read Jane Austen NOW, I find myself laughing outloud at the sheer obliviousness of those being made fun of, and the cleverness of those doing the zinging. And of course, throughout all of this, there is a couple falling in love. (These are some of the same reasons that I'm going through a Dickens revival and having a blast!!)
She has a really good way of helping us intimately get to know the true character of the main characters through the dialogue and conversations. There's that quote "You can tell the most about a man's character when you hear him speak of the character of another man" or something like that. Well, that's how we learn about the main players in any of her stories.
Tons of fun. But, I do admit, it's usually centered around love stories, so it might not be fun for a guy. But, if you admire wit in a girl, you might just want to reread some of these books to make sure the girl of your dreams isn't insulting you without you knowing it. Posts: 6415 | Registered: Jul 2000
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Dante basically wrote a treatise to impress a woman and, at the same time either suck up to his friends/patrons or condemn his enemies. I've seen self-serving drivel before, but never in so many words.
The only people fainting from Dante's works are the people who have to lug them around.
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It is a truth universally acknowledged, that a single man in possession of a good fortune, must be in want of a wife.
However little known the feelings or views of such a man may be on his first entering a neighbourhood, this truth is so well fixed in the minds of the surrounding families, that he is considered the rightful property of some one or other of their daughters.
"My dear Mr. Bennet," said his lady to him one day, "have you heard that Netherfield Park is let at last?"
Mr. Bennet replied that he had not.
"But it is," returned she; "for Mrs. Long has just been here, and she told me all about it."
Mr. Bennet made no answer.
"Do you not want to know who has taken it?" cried his wife impatiently.
"YOU want to tell me, and I have no objection to hearing it."
This was invitation enough.
"Why, my dear, you must know, Mrs. Long says that Netherfield is taken by a young man of large fortune from the north of England; that he came down on Monday in a chaise and four to see the place, and was so much delighted with it, that he agreed with Mr. Morris immediately; that he is to take possession before Michaelmas, and some of his servants are to be in the house by the end of next week."
"What is his name?"
"Bingley."
"Is he married or single?"
"Oh! Single, my dear, to be sure! A single man of large fortune; four or five thousand a year. What a fine thing for our girls!"
"How so? How can it affect them?"
"My dear Mr. Bennet," replied his wife, "how can you be so tiresome! You must know that I am thinking of his marrying one of them."
"Is that his design in settling here?"
"Design! Nonsense, how can you talk so! But it is very likely that he MAY fall in love with one of them, and therefore you must visit him as soon as he comes."
"I see no occasion for that. You and the girls may go, or you may send them by themselves, which perhaps will be still better, for as you are as handsome as any of them, Mr. Bingley may like you the best of the party."
"My dear, you flatter me. I certainly HAVE had my share of beauty, but I do not pretend to be anything extraordinary now. When a woman has five grown-up daughters, she ought to give over thinking of her own beauty."
"In such cases, a woman has not often much beauty to think of."
"But, my dear, you must indeed go and see Mr. Bingley when he comes into the neighbourhood."
"It is more than I engage for, I assure you."
"But consider your daughters. Only think what an establishment it would be for one of them. Sir William and Lady Lucas are determined to go, merely on that account, for in general, you know, they visit no newcomers. Indeed you must go, for it will be impossible for US to visit him if you do not."
"You are over-scrupulous, surely. I dare say Mr. Bingley will be very glad to see you; and I will send a few lines by you to assure him of my hearty consent to his marrying whichever he chooses of the girls; though I must throw in a good word for my little Lizzy."
"I desire you will do no such thing. Lizzy is not a bit better than the others; and I am sure she is not half so handsome as Jane, nor half so good-humoured as Lydia. But you are always giving HER the preference."
"They have none of them much to recommend them," replied he; "they are all silly and ignorant like other girls; but Lizzy has something more of quickness than her sisters."
"Mr. Bennet, how CAN you abuse your own children in such a way? You take delight in vexing me. You have no compassion for my poor nerves."
"You mistake me, my dear. I have a high respect for your nerves. They are my old friends. I have heard you mention them with consideration these last twenty years at least."
Mr. Bennet was so odd a mixture of quick parts, sarcastic humour, reserve, and caprice, that the experience of three-and-twenty years had been insufficient to make his wife understand his character. HER mind was less difficult to develop. She was a woman of mean understanding, little information, and uncertain temper. When she was discontented, she fancied herself nervous. The business of her life was to get her daughters married; its solace was visiting and news.
Isn't this just the perfect way to begin a novel? Narnia is right. While _I_ would read Austen's books just for the love stories (I'm a sucker for romance), it is her sharp wit, social charicature and wonderful humour that raise her novels to great literature.
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My dearest Tristan, THAT conversation that you just quoted made me laugh out loud when I first read the book and immediately vaulted Pride and Prejudice into my favorite books category. It's truly one of the best examples of the zinging barbs and oblivious hearer. Way to quote!!!
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She is to England what Proust is to France. Only Proust is a man, so his books are venerated as subtle, smart social commentary, while Austen is a woman so her books must only be silly romances with little literary value to recommend them.
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I came up as Marianne Dashwood. Though if this is true, I am definitely the post-deathly ill, in love with Colonel Brandon version of Marianne. It was definitely my experience that you can only live life that way for so long before chaos overtakes you.
December 17 sticks in my mind as the date of the 1989 Winter Formal.
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quote:But, now that I'm older and a little bit wiser, I've gone through a revival and have read her books and just LOVED them. I'm smarter, so I catch all the little subtleties of wit and all the insulting barbs that are bandied about.
<dryly> Some might argue that I do have a certain amount of understanding and intelligence, so I'm not sure that explanation is going to fly very well.
quote:But, I do admit, it's usually centered around love stories, so it might not be fun for a guy.
Oh, I've got no problem with love stories. But I just want something to HAPPEN! I just can't get into books where people talk, then talk, then chat, then argue mildly, then exchange witty banter, then talk, then discuss, then get married, then talk. Gah, DO something already, will you?! I get no sense of depth of emotion...or anything else. Everything is "look how clever and sensible an Englishwoman I am!", which would be fine if it were accompanied by something that made me CARE.
Bob,
quote:Dante basically wrote a treatise to impress a woman and, at the same time either suck up to his friends/patrons or condemn his enemies. I've seen self-serving drivel before, but never in so many words. The only people fainting from Dante's works are the people who have to lug them around.
Usually you're more mildly amusing than painfully ignorant. I'll assume you're trying to be funny here and not attempting serious criticism, since you manage to include a surprising number of inaccuracies in such a short post.
Annie,
That's not a bad point, except I'm not particularly fond of Proust, either.
quote:Dismissing Jane Austen means you either can't understand wit, or you abhor it in women.
Yes, that must be it. Why didn't I see?! I'm either exceptionally dense or intensely misogynistic! No false dichotomy there! Thanks, Javert!
I think it's fascinating how some of you have tried rather sad ad hominem attacks rather than trying to explain what is morally, literarily or philosophically valuable about her work. Maybe that says something about the kind of people who like Austen...and why I don't. <shrug>
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I liked the prose on the bottom, charming and insightful, but the dialogue was so stuffy, not to be confused with witty, and slightly redundant.
"However little known the feelings or views of such a man may be on his first entering a neighbourhood, this truth is so well fixed in the minds of the surrounding families, that he is considered the rightful property of some one or other of their daughters."
""Oh! Single, my dear, to be sure! A single man of large fortune; four or five thousand a year. What a fine thing for our girls!"
"How so? How can it affect them?"
"My dear Mr. Bennet," replied his wife, "how can you be so tiresome! You must know that I am thinking of his marrying one of them.""
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