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Belle is having fits where she has trouble walking, she falls over, and shakes. It's happened twice - once yesterday and once today.
She's had all her shots,hasn't been away from the house or exposed to any other dogs, I haven't changed her food, she seems to have no other problems or symptoms. She's gaining weight and doing well.
I looked up information on canine epilepsy, but this doesn't seem to be the same thing - she never falls over and loses consciousness. It's almost as if she forgets how to walk for a while. When I pick her up after she's fallen, she trembles in my arms for a few minutes and then she seems to be fine.
But I'm scared, really scared because if there is something seriously wrong I don't know how me or the kids will take it.
I'm going to call the vet tomorrow. Any advice?
[ June 22, 2005, 12:16 PM: Message edited by: Belle ]
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Are her eyes crossed, or rolling upwards, and then going back down, or when she stands, and looks at you, is her head slightly crooked?
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Didn't notice any of that during the episode, when I picked her up and she was trembling, she was making eye contact with me fine.
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Puppies can have narcolespy. I gather it's not that uncommon and they do grow out of it. I don't know the technical details, but that might be worth looking into.
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Okay, Mom asked me to add more details as she has witnessed both episodes in their entirety and I only caught the end of one.
Puppy begins staggering like drunk, walking sideways and flopping over. She gets up immediately when she falls and staggers some more. Never loses consciousness, never whines or cries, no drooling.
When puppy is picked up she trembles for a few seconds, then is fine. When puppy gets back on the floor she romps and plays as if nothing ever happened. No recovery period, no fatigue like you'd expect after a seizure.
First time it happened, I assumed she was just being a clumsy little puppy. But twice in two days has me concerned.
Thanks for the hint on narcolepsy - I found a video online of a dachsund with narcolepsy and Mom said it looked very similar to that, only Belle didn't stay asleep, it was as if she fell asleep, hit the ground and immediately woke up.
I'm hoping the vet can shed some light for us.
[ June 19, 2005, 08:26 PM: Message edited by: Belle ]
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I would reccomend taking the puppy into the vet as soon as possible. It could be any of a number of things, but the vet might want to check for Distemper to rule it out.
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Do you know when the puppy had shots? Typically the appropriate vaccine (DHLPPC) is given at 8 weeks, 12 weeks, and 16 weeks, but some breeders start shots as early as 4 to 6 weeks and they don't impart the proper immunity. Posts: 137 | Registered: May 2005
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A similar thing has happened to Seven the Lab mix. It was diagnosed as "idiopathic" (no known cause) epilepsy. I think the seizures are "partial seizures." She had two seizures in October, then one a few months ago. During the most recent one, she finished her breakfast during the beginning of the seizure (she may be losing control of her body, but her food is still HERS and the other dog can't have it ), then staggered over to my husband and huddled next to him for the rest of it. Our other dog moved in next to her on her other side (offering comfort, probably). The vet doesn't think treatment is necessary for now.
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I believe there are some other genetic diseases that can cause the symptoms you are discribing, but I've never heard of them occuring in aussies. Sounds more like mild seisures to me. Definitely get it checked out. Sometimes it can be a viral type thing causing it.
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If you have access to a video camera and the seizures happen often enough, being able to show a vet exactly what happens during one of them can be really valuable for them.
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My vet is out of town, be back Wednesday. I talked to the office and they have an appointment for me at 10:00 Weds morning, and told me to observe her as closely as possible between now and then and take notes if anything else happens.
I've had her with me all day and she's been romping and playing and absolutely no sign there is anything wrong with her. Man, I hope I'm over-reacting.
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Okay, I've been doing online research all morning.
Epilepsy is an identified problem in the breed, but it's idiopathic epilepsy with grand mal seizures and the descriptions of the seizures don't fit her at all.
The closest fit in the epilepsy "family" is partial seizures since it only affects part of her body. The good news is that most partial epilepsy is secondary cause, and usually it's cured when the primary cause is determined and treated.
The most common cause in young puppies is hydrocephalus. It is most common in toy breeds and I can't find where it's a problem with Aussies. She doesn't really fit the other clinical signs. She is definitely small - but I think that's because Shadow is so big. When we picked them up, there was another littermate there and he was comparable size to Belle, so she isn't really small, I think Shadow is just big. The vet also told me he thought Belle was the more normal-sized of the two. Her head is not domed or doesn't look abnormally large either. But that might be something the vet has to rule out.
My vet gave her the distemper/parvo shot, he asked me if I wanted it done or did I want to wait because the breeder said he had given them shots and I had both of them vaccinated, because I've learned from experience that just because a breeder says "I gave them all their shots" doesn't mean it was with vaccines that have been kept at the right temperature and everything else. A long time ago before we had kids, my husband and I got a registered German Shepherd and the breeder gave her a shot before we left and it was from vaccines that had been stored in a cabinet outside on the front porch. In an Alabama summer.
So I doubt it's distemper, plus she shows no other clinical signs of distemper.
I'm just scared for her, and can't seem to reassure myself enough. I can't imagine losing one of these guys after the few weeks we've already had with them, and it would devastate the kids. Oh who am I kidding, it would devastate ME.
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Okay, when I was posting my other question, the one about the water bowls and the tick thread - I made a connection.
The puppies constantly knock over their water. They then drink from mud puddles in the yard, or have done that when we've had rain.
We haven't had rain for a while now, all the puddles are dry. The only available water in the yard besides the water bowl, is the water that drains from the laundry room.
See, we put that laundry room in the basement at the last minute, when my mom moved in. Wes was going to take the drainage line underground, and he hasn't had a chance yet. So, when she washes clothes, the water drains out and it puddles up on the ground.
It's quite possible Belle has been drinking water with laundry soap in it. And toxins are one secondary cause for the type of seizure she's been having.
That also explains why it's only happened on the weekend - we don't use that laundry room during the week, normally my mom only washes clothes on the weekend. During the week I use the laundry room upstairs, and it drains into our septic tank.
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Oh! Good thinking! Hopefully this is the cause for her seizures and it can all be taken care of without any lasting affects to your poor little Belle.
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Saw the vet. He is wonderful. If I weren't already solidly in love with my husband I could fall in love with him.
He said she could have had an epileptic seizure, he said she could have had a seizure due to hypoglycemia, though that is normally seen most often in toy breeds. She could have had just some weird imbalance that will never happen again.
Either way, there's no need to worry about it unless it continues and/or increases in frequency. He said he wasn't worried about it, and that all the normal stuff he'd do like check for parasites, etc. he would do next week at our 9 week visit, so since she hasn't had any more and she looked wonderful to him on this visit, he sees no need to do anything to her right now. He did suggest splitting her feedings out into three times a day, instead of twice a day, in case the hypoglycemia was a factor - because both episodes happened late in the day, far from the morning feeding. If she's very high energy (which she is) she could be burning up all those calories and get low blood sugar in between feedings.
He doubts the laundry water is an issue at all. Says drinking water diluted with laundry soap is more likely to just cause diarrhea, he'd worry if there were a high concentration of bleach in the water but my mom said she only washed kids clothes and bedding this weekend and none of it can be bleached, so she's certain there wasn't a lot of bleach in the water.
Sooo...he did nothing and told me that I was a good Mommy but not to stress myself out too much over it, just watch her, write down in a calendar anytime one of these occurs again, if ever and we'd continue to just check up on her as needed. He reassured me that even if it did turn out to be canine epilepsy he had many dogs doing fabulously on monthly medication that wasn't very expensive.
So I thanked him and we left and I waited in line to pay for the visit and talked to a woman who was there to adopt a free kitten and answered all the typical questions. She's an Australian Shepherd. No, it's not the dog that was in Babe, those were Border collies. Yes her tail is docked. No, not too big, she'll be around 40 pounds or so full grown. Yes, I have a cat and she gets along great with her, they even play together outside. From Riveroaks Kennels in Ashville.
Well, we finally got up to the counter, and the clerk told me no charge. I said "Are you sure?" and the vet who had just come up said "I'm not going to charge you just for talking to you and petting her."
Like I said, I love him.
So anyway, I'm a bit relieved, just going to keep watching her, change the feeding schedule, and if all goes well, she won't have any more. He told me he's seen quite a few pups that had a few seizures their first months of life and never had any more, so that made me feel better.
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), then staggered over to my husband and huddled next to him for the rest of it. Our other dog moved in next to her on her other side (offering comfort, probably). The vet doesn't think treatment is necessary for now.
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