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Author Topic: The Nostalgia Chick reviews Ender's Game
Tinros
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So, because of the east coast power outage recently, Nostalgia Chick (Lindsay Ellis) had no time to find and watch a movie before her review was due, so she chose a book. Ender's Game!

She does go into the controversy surrounding Card's views, especially concerning gay rights, but manages to keep it pretty neutral, I think.

This is the link to the video.

Even though this wasn't one of her funnier reviews, I still enjoyed it.

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Szymon
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Nostalgia Chick is a very annoying chick.
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AchillesHeel
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Her exposition about becoming a fan only to realize she has huge issues with the author makes me appreciate Patrick Rothfuss even more. I first read his books because he is such an awesome person.

BTW Rothfuss is creating a show to be produced by Felicia Day's youtube channel, it'll be a round table-esque discussion with other authors and creative types.

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SteveRogers
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I'll have to check this out after work.

Also, +1 for telling people about Patrick Rothfuss's youtube show, Achilles.

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AchillesHeel
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He opened up the naming process through social media, and apparently he actually read through all the responses. All of them. He linked it to facebook, and read every suggestion.

It isn't difficult to be a proud Rothfuss fan.

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Jeff C.
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Who is this Rothfuss person?
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SteveRogers
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Jeff. Read this book immediately.
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AchillesHeel
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quote:
Originally posted by Jeff C.:
Who is this Rothfuss person?

God, an awesomely bearded man, father of Oot, an author so fantastic that when he only had one publication to his name he got to ride the carousel that no one ever gets to ride (the real one, from Niel Gaiman's American Gods) with Niel Gaiman, the only man to read aloud a sex scene from Amber Benson's own book with Amber Benson. And possibly your father.

In short, he is the most interesting new author alive.

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SteveRogers
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In all seriousness, he's a very talented writer who seems to be an all-around decent human being.
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Jeff C.
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Hm...once I'm done with Sirens of Titan, I'll check it out. I'm assuming it isn't your typical fantasy novel?
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advice for robots
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No, it's not your typical fantasy novel. It's in 1st person.

In that way, Rothfuss feels a lot like Robin Hobb to me. But he writes in a way that makes it impossible to put the book down. Be prepared for some sleepless nights with that book.

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Teshi
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(Being in first person makes something "not your typical fanatasy novel?"

Well, that was easy.)

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rivka
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quote:
Originally posted by SteveRogers:
Jeff. Read this book immediately.

Tsk!
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SteveRogers
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Why are you "tsk"-ing me, rivka? [Wink]
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rivka
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Where did you link to?

Now, where SHOULD you have linked to?

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Jake
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quote:
Originally posted by Szymon:
Nostalgia Chick is a very annoying chick.

Seems fairly cool to me.
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SteveRogers
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quote:
Originally posted by rivka:
Where did you link to?

Now, where SHOULD you have linked to?

Ummm. . .here? Or here?
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rivka
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quote:
Originally posted by SteveRogers:
quote:
Originally posted by rivka:
Now, where SHOULD you have linked to?

Ummm. . .here?
Exactly!
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Jeff C.
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What else besides the "first person narrative" aspect is different? What else sets it apart? I understand sometimes that's hard to pin down, but I'm just curious. I want to get excited about it, but I need more of a hook.

As for the first person narrative, I do find that interesting. I don't think I've read a fantasy novel in that kind of voice before.

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rivka
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quote:
Originally posted by Tinros:
So, because of the east coast power outage recently, Nostalgia Chick (Lindsay Ellis) had no time to find and watch a movie before her review was due, so she chose a book. Ender's Game!

Meh. I usually like her reviews, but this was barely about the book at all. It was about the various controversies surrounding and tangential to the book. None of which was news to me, or presented in a new or unique way.

The only thing I got out of it was discovering I've been saying "apologia" wrong for years.

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Dan_Frank
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quote:
Originally posted by rivka:

The only thing I got out of it was discovering I've been saying "apologia" wrong for years.

Eh, I dunno. Whether she's technically correct or not, pronouncing it to rhyme with "Appalachia" sounds really dumb.

And I concur with your meh about the review itself.

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Jeff C.
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Yeah, but at least it was interesting to see her admit to being such a huge Ender and Speaker fan.
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Kwea
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quote:
Originally posted by Jeff C.:
What else besides the "first person narrative" aspect is different? What else sets it apart? I understand sometimes that's hard to pin down, but I'm just curious. I want to get excited about it, but I need more of a hook.

As for the first person narrative, I do find that interesting. I don't think I've read a fantasy novel in that kind of voice before.

It's in first person, which is great if done well, and HORRIBLE if it isn't done well. It has a really interesting magic system, one that takes from a couple of common ones but makes changes. In fact, there are two different magical systems, one that is almost scientific and one that is more of an art.

It's a coming of age story, and the writing is quick and easy, but the world-building is fantastic.

One of the better series I have read in years, and I read like mad. [Big Grin]

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Juxtapose
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quote:
Originally posted by Jeff C.:
What else besides the "first person narrative" aspect is different? What else sets it apart? I understand sometimes that's hard to pin down, but I'm just curious. I want to get excited about it, but I need more of a hook.

As for the first person narrative, I do find that interesting. I don't think I've read a fantasy novel in that kind of voice before.

The thing that set it apart for me initially was how solid the world felt as soon as you start reading. It's really well fleshed out, and the author rarely, if ever, forces you to look at it just for the sake of showing that off. The characterization is strong in a similar way.

Another thing I like about it is that it has multiple systems of magic, all co-inhabiting. There's a sort of lower magic, which is more like an additional feature of of nature - it is limited by laws similar to the laws of thermodynamics. It can, however, be used to achieve dramatic feats with some creativity. Then there's a higher magic, which is less intelligible, but vastly more powerful. The author mentions, but does not go into great detail about others.

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rivka
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quote:
Originally posted by Dan_Frank:
quote:
Originally posted by rivka:

The only thing I got out of it was discovering I've been saying "apologia" wrong for years.

Eh, I dunno. Whether she's technically correct or not, pronouncing it to rhyme with "Appalachia" sounds really dumb.
I am trying to force myself to say it the right way. And you are NOT HELPING. >_<

*wanders off to listen to the m-w.com lady some more*

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odouls268
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I've never seen her reviews before. But I like her, I think she's interesting. I had no intention of sitting through the whole video, but she kept my interest so well that I watched it by accident LOL

However, I have to say that if "writing stupid shit on the internet" is enough to knock someone off the 'approved good person' list, then we are ALL really screwed. [Razz]

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millernumber1
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I am a fairly regular viewer of her videos, but I found it rather hilarious (if sad) that since I actually tend to agree with OSC politically, I had the same problem watching her movie that she does when reading OSC's books - do I fund something (by viewing the advertisements) that I fundamentally really disagree with.

Thankfully, the review was very temperate, and quite worth watching. Still, there's definitely irony there...

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TomDavidson
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quote:
since I actually tend to agree with OSC politically
You monster.
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rivka
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[Roll Eyes] [Roll Eyes] [Roll Eyes]
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SteveRogers
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According to her video, I must be in a minority of sorts. I'm aware of and disagree with much of OSC's personal political opinions, but I still enjoy reading his books and will continue to buy them as they come out. And I don't think my knowledge of his political opinions has really altered the way I read or interpret his books.

There are a lot of authors who I might not have agreed with. I still like Rudyard Kipling, and he had some controversial opinions.

I'm still going to enjoy a hamburger somewhere if it's a good hamburger, even if it's made by a racist.

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rivka
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quote:
Originally posted by SteveRogers:
According to her video, I must be in a minority of sorts.

I'm quite certain she's wrong about that. I think it is not the minority; it's just a far quieter segment of OSC's readership, what with no bewailing about how he has betrayed their childhood and all.
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SteveRogers
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That's sorta how I've felt. A lot of us disagree with his views, but we still read and enjoy his books. And can still enjoy rereading his books.

People have different opinions. It happens. I'm not going to let that get in the way of me enjoying his books.

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BlackBlade
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I agree with rivka's earlier comment. I kept waiting for her to seg back into the book and actually, ya know, review it. It never happened.
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advice for robots
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quote:
Originally posted by Teshi:
(Being in first person makes something "not your typical fanatasy novel?"

Well, that was easy.)

Honestly, that's what made the book feel different to me. It's the first thing I noticed once I got past the opening scene setting up the narrative. I mean, the novel is handled really well in many other aspects, but what made it different initially was that it was in 1st person. Which really isn't that typical in fantasy.

Beyond that, for me, while it was a great story with great characterization I didn't find it particularly groundbreaking in terms of fantasy. Maybe my opinion will change with the 3rd book where everything gets tied together, I don't know. I find it to be a "stupid kid getting himself into trouble" type of story, although I didn't find myself yelling at Kvothe quite as much as I would at, say, a Spielberg character, because Kvothe is so darn lovable.

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AchillesHeel
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I thought this would be the least improper place to share this link.

Story Board with Patrick Rothfuss

The first episode will be live tonight, the subject is urban fantasy.

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SteveRogers
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I'm hoping I can watch it live tonight. I think it's going to be pretty cool.
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Dan_Frank
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quote:
Originally posted by advice for robots:
quote:
Originally posted by Teshi:
(Being in first person makes something "not your typical fanatasy novel?"

Well, that was easy.)

Honestly, that's what made the book feel different to me. It's the first thing I noticed once I got past the opening scene setting up the narrative. I mean, the novel is handled really well in many other aspects, but what made it different initially was that it was in 1st person. Which really isn't that typical in fantasy.

It's not exactly super-rare either, though. Jacqueline Carey, Steven Brust, and Glen Cook have all done it. Oh, yeah, and Bujold too!

And that's just keeping the criteria as traditional pseudo-historical fantasy. If you allow for modern fantasy, then 1st person is not only thick on the ground I think it's actually the norm.

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DustinDopps
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For what it's worth, Patrick Rothfuss might be a really, really nice person, but he's sort of a jerk about politics. His blog post about Scott Walker (http://blog.patrickrothfuss.com/2012/06/of-thee-i-sing/) shows that he thinks you're less intelligent or "less informed" if you don't agree with him politically. Here's a quote:

"But for someone to say they voted for Walker in the primary. That is to say, they voted for him *after* all the things he’s done this last year. That’s not like mentioning you like cool ranch Doritos instead of nacho. It’s more like like saying, “I’m actually a big fan of female genital mutilation.”"

That's a bit harsh, if you ask me. Walker was obviously supported by the majority of voters, but instead of accepting that his opinion is the minority, Rothfuss assumes everyone who voted for Walker was tricked because they aren't smart enough.

His books are fantastic, though.

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TomDavidson
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I wouldn't say Rothfuss is a jerk about politics. I would say that he's entirely right, and that it's possible to trick a whole lot of people because people are stupid.

If you voted for Scott Walker, you are stupid.

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advice for robots
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quote:
Originally posted by Dan_Frank:
quote:
Originally posted by advice for robots:
quote:
Originally posted by Teshi:
(Being in first person makes something "not your typical fanatasy novel?"

Well, that was easy.)

Honestly, that's what made the book feel different to me. It's the first thing I noticed once I got past the opening scene setting up the narrative. I mean, the novel is handled really well in many other aspects, but what made it different initially was that it was in 1st person. Which really isn't that typical in fantasy.

It's not exactly super-rare either, though. Jacqueline Carey, Steven Brust, and Glen Cook have all done it. Oh, yeah, and Bujold too!

And that's just keeping the criteria as traditional pseudo-historical fantasy. If you allow for modern fantasy, then 1st person is not only thick on the ground I think it's actually the norm.

No, it's not super rare, but it's still not typical. Stack up the books of fantasy in 3rd person next to those in 1st person, and 1st person is definitely not typical in the genre. 1st person still stands out in fantasy. I notice it immediately in a book and it colors my reading of it. To me, 1st person is a lot more typical of literary fiction, with what it tends to reveal about the POV, and that adds an interesting flavor to fantasy.

Modern fantasy is pretty much a separate genre, IMO. [Razz] I wouldn't put Twilight next to something by Joe Abercrombie or Daniel Abraham as two examples of straight fantasy. ETA: That is to say, there's modern or urban fantasy and then there's more mainstream fantasy, both being written today. Not sure if that's what you meant by modern fantasy, come to think about it.

[ August 07, 2012, 02:53 PM: Message edited by: advice for robots ]

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Dan_Frank
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quote:
Originally posted by TomDavidson:
I would say that he's entirely right, and that it's possible to trick a whole lot of people because people are stupid.

Imagine the consequences for your worldview if most people weren't that stupid, though... [Eek!] The possibilities!
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Synesthesia
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I thought that review was amusing, bt it's depressing as hell that folks beat the being gay is wrong dead horse when there are bigger issues. I gave up on OSC not only because of the vitriol in his articles but because he can't stop possessing characters and nagging about marriage and babies.
I'm sorry, but it's just as annoying to have a character nag and lecture about global warming *coughJamesPattersoncough*. I want to read a good book, not be preached at.

Also, I love the folks from That Guy With the Glasses. They crack me up. I wish they had their own cable channel or something.

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TomDavidson
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quote:
Imagine the consequences for your worldview if most people weren't that stupid, though...
If, for example, they were drugged or otherwise misled? Or perhaps they're actually malevolent?

I suppose that'd make things more exciting.

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Dan_Frank
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quote:
Originally posted by advice for robots:
quote:
Originally posted by Dan_Frank:
quote:
Originally posted by advice for robots:
quote:
Originally posted by Teshi:
(Being in first person makes something "not your typical fanatasy novel?"

Well, that was easy.)

Honestly, that's what made the book feel different to me. It's the first thing I noticed once I got past the opening scene setting up the narrative. I mean, the novel is handled really well in many other aspects, but what made it different initially was that it was in 1st person. Which really isn't that typical in fantasy.

It's not exactly super-rare either, though. Jacqueline Carey, Steven Brust, and Glen Cook have all done it. Oh, yeah, and Bujold too!

And that's just keeping the criteria as traditional pseudo-historical fantasy. If you allow for modern fantasy, then 1st person is not only thick on the ground I think it's actually the norm.

No, it's not super rare, but it's still not typical. Stack up the books of fantasy in 3rd person next to those in 1st person, and 1st person is definitely not typical in the genre. 1st person still stands out in fantasy. I notice it immediately in a book and it colors my reading of it. To me, 1st person is a lot more typical of literary fiction, with what it tends to reveal about the POV, and that adds an interesting flavor to fantasy.

Modern fantasy is pretty much a separate genre, IMO. [Razz] I wouldn't put Twilight next to something by Joe Abercrombie or Daniel Abraham as two examples of straight fantasy. ETA: That is to say, there's modern or urban fantasy and then there's more mainstream fantasy, both being written today. Not sure if that's what you meant by modern fantasy, come to think about it.

1st person fantasy is definitely less common, I agree with you there. But there's some great stuff done that way! I'm not personally a huge Brust or Cook fan, but they're popular (or were) and by no means bad.

I think I have to retract Bujold, though. I think I'm misremembering single-viewpoint 3rd person as being first person. Oops!

And Carey's stuff (The Kushiel series) is definitely 1st person. And despite some systematic flaws in her writing (particularly pacing), and assuming you can get past all the S&M sex, they're really good and well worth a read.

I actually tend to, by default, have a low opinion of 1st person (despite often writing in that style myself) and associate it with both typical literary fiction (which I mostly find stupid and pretentious) and really hacky modern fantasy, romance, crime dramas, etc.

Which is not to say I don't sometimes like things in those genres. Just that I tend to have a default assumption that they'll aggravate me in some way.

By modern fantasy I meant, broadly, anything taking place in the modern day and classified as fantasy. So I'd include at least a couple of eminently enjoyable writers like Jim Butcher in that category. Maybe that's called urban fantasy or something? I dunno.

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advice for robots
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Yeah, I'd classify Butcher that way, at least the Dresden books. He's written some mainstream fantasy as well. Not sure what the current term for the genre is. I've always thought of it as "urban fantasy." But "modern fantasy" works well.

I love 1st person when it's done well. What's by far my favorite short story is in 1st person. It wouldn't work any other way. But a story that relies on formula, like a mystery or romance often does, makes a 1st person narrator seem almost like a sellout unless the author twists the formula a bit.

In an attempt to prove myself wrong about the prevalence of 3rd person vs 1st person in fantasy, I found some authors that hadn't made it onto my radar yet, that I'm going to check out: Mark Lawrence, Doug Hulick, and Elspeth Cooper. [Smile] Always nice to see new blood in the genre. Anyone read these authors?

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DustinDopps
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quote:
Originally posted by TomDavidson:

If you voted for Scott Walker, you are stupid.

Wow.
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Carrie
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quote:
Originally posted by rivka:
quote:
Originally posted by Dan_Frank:
quote:
Originally posted by rivka:

The only thing I got out of it was discovering I've been saying "apologia" wrong for years.

Eh, I dunno. Whether she's technically correct or not, pronouncing it to rhyme with "Appalachia" sounds really dumb.
I am trying to force myself to say it the right way. And you are NOT HELPING. >_<

*wanders off to listen to the m-w.com lady some more*

Wow. Wow. My mind has been boggled. I've always said apologia with a hard "g"; it never even occurred to me to pronounce it otherwise. I'm certainly not going to change how I pronounce it, but now I know how it's "supposed" to be.
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rivka
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quote:
Originally posted by Carrie:
I've always said apologia with a hard "g"

I'm having trouble picturing this. I've always said it as apology-uh.
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Blayne Bradley
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I had a good romp with the Kushiel series.

Currently picked up "Forerunner" of the 'Forerunner' series just because it had a Dark Elf on the cover, all I know is it is scifi and takes place somewhere on some trade planet; is it good?

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Dan_Frank
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quote:
Originally posted by rivka:
quote:
Originally posted by Carrie:
I've always said apologia with a hard "g"

I'm having trouble picturing this. I've always said it as apology-uh.
Ditto.
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