posted
this is one of the many stories i have, perhaps my fav. its fantasy oppose to sf. i havent really thought of a summery for it yet and this is such a small part of what it will be. its a three book series called Promised.
the story is filled with magic, enemies, demons, heroes, jealousy, family, religion, other dimensions and more... all of this in the midst of planning an unwanted wedding and an unwanted life together.
writing it comes fairly easy, explaining without much detail i'm finding isnt very easy. i'll have to think about that one.
i'm looking for any kind of ctritique, so be as bad as you want. thanks.
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My name is Riley. When I was four, my parents died and I was adopted by my new parents, Eleanor and Julian Delpheki. They’re great to me. We live in a nice sized house and I always have new clothes and plenty of food to eat. They adopted me because they couldn’t have children of their own. I’m grateful to them. I wasn’t just put in some foster home until I was of age to be kicked out on my own. They really wanted me. I am their only child.
I love almost everything about my life. What I don’t love is the religion that I was brought into. It was fine at first, until I turned 13. Then I was informed of a giant twist in my becoming their daughter. I was to marry next year. One week after my 14th birthday. Marry someone I was promised to when I
~Crea
[This message has been edited by Kathleen Dalton Woodbury (edited July 03, 2006).]
I'm not opposed to the idea of using an arranged marriage as a complication in a fictional story, but you have to sell it. You really have to make it hang together, show why the child doesn't accept arranged marriage yet the parents are willing to be insistent. And if this is happening in a country where the parents really can force a child (adopted at four, no less) to marry without consent, you need to mention that first. Otherwise, part of the setup has to deal with the fact that the child partly does want to go along with the parents' wishes, for whatever reason.
posted
The subject matter doesn't bug me, but my problem is no one is doing anything, (which can be done), but also the prose needs to be tightened.
My name is Riley.(Ok, this tells me nothing) When I was four, my parents died and I was adopted by my new parents, Eleanor and Julian Delpheki. (Tighten this up. A bit slow. Maybe move this until after the revelation.)
They’re great to me. We live in a nice sized house and I always have new clothes and plenty of food to eat. They adopted me because they couldn’t have children of their own. I’m grateful to them. I wasn’t just put in some foster home until I was of age to be kicked out on my own. They really wanted me. I am their only child.
I *love* almost everything about my life. What I don’t *love* is the religion that I *was* brought into. It *was* fine at first, until I turned 13. Then I *was* informed of a giant twist in my becoming their daughter. I *was* to marry next year. One week after my 14th birthday. Marry someone I *was* promised to when I *was* adopted. Normally this is planned when the girl is born. Within a month of her arrival, she *is* promised to a son of another family.
Look at how many times you use was. (I starred them for effect.) The other thing is, besides tightening it up for repetition it sounds ackward. Spice it up a bit. maybe start with the Giant twist. And what Is the religion. Or, better yet, SHOW us all of this let us see their life and THEN tell us the downside. Right now I don't love the main character. And until I got three quarters of the way down I didn't even know that Riley was a girl.
posted
You haven't given me any reason to care. Riley's adopted, stuck in a religion she doesn't like, and promised to be married to some bum she doesn't want to tie the knot with. So what? I don't know who she is. I've got a summarized history of her but that doesn't trigger an emotion, because for all I know, she can either be a sweet, introverted child; an outgoing, fun playmate; or a petulant brat.
I need to know who she is quicker before I'd read on.
posted
I think i want to know more about what this character loves and why. Bring the surroundings alive through the character's eyes, and that will put me in the setting and tell me about the character. Maybe walk us through the house in the character's shoes and start a conversation or mull over a conversation about the marriage. Perhaps bring us in right at that place where everything has changed and unfold it from there. Or right before, or right after. But show us.
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First off, with a fairly non-gender-specific (if that's the phrase) name like Riley, especially in 1st-person POV, you have to be careful with gender. I assumed it was a guy, so "I was informed of a giant twist in my becoming their daughter" took on a completely different meaning!
Second, if you're going to use very similar names to those found in published novels, try not to do it on the forums of said-author's site . Julian Delphiki is Bean. We've all done such things by accident, just be careful.
Again, I must reiterate to show what's going on rather than telling. This would hook me far more if you threw the reader into, for example, an argument between the MC and one of the parents, or a friend within the religion, debating the unfairness of an arranged marriage. Then you could go back and explain the background once the reader was hooked.
posted
thank you for all the feed back. this is exactly why i dont understand the posting of just the first 13 lines. because within the next two or three paragraphs it answers all of what everyone was just asking/stating. she does get into a discussion/arguement over this marriage. and she does state why exactly she is so oppose to it.
i understand the name thing. i never considered the issue with unisex names. i'll have to change that. or mention that she's female sooner rather than the second paragraph.
i can completely understand wanting to know more about the character's history. i sort of tie that in to the story as i go. she doesnt know much of her 'real' past. she just knows what shes been told. and only what shes been told by her adoptive parents. slowly as the story progresses she learns the truth about a lot of things, including her own history.
i like the idea of beginning the story right when she finds out about the sudden change, Louiseoneal. i hadnt really thought of that.
this story originally started out as a fanfic a long time ago. since then i've been rewriting majorly. so some of the names hadnt been switched over yet, Julian Delphiki being one of them. my apologies. and thanks for catching that. i might not have.
the arranged marriage is vital to the story because of who it brings into her life. without them, there wouldnt really be any story. she'd just be some miserable character with nothing to tell except that of her sarrow. yet again, that is explained a few paragraphs further.
i hope this clears a few things up. thanks for everything, any more is greatly appreciated.
posted
We're telling you that you've put all the wrong things in your opening.
Also, if you're going to do scenes, then you might not want to start off with the conceit of a first person narrative. First person narratives are very restrictive in how much direct portrayal you can get away with unless we can be convinced that the narrator has both the ability and a compelling reason to recount events in such accurate detail.
posted
Too much exposition at the beginning. Nothing is happening. While all this info might be important to your story, it's too...boring--for lack of a better word--to read it all at once right off. You should show us these things happening as they happen--Riley finding out that she is to be married, for instance--instead of telling us these things happened after the fact (if what I just said makes any sense).
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posted
ok, i think i get what you're all saying... so let me see if this makes it better. this is part of her short first person POV, and the only time in the story there is a first person POV.
“I don’t want to marry him.” I pleaded.
“There is no discussion about this anymore, Riley. You have been promised and so you will marry. He is a nice young man. You’ll like him.” My mother told me.
“I don’t care how nice he is. I didn’t choose to marry him. Did you ever consider asking me what I want?”
“It is God’s will for you to marry him.” She answered simply.
“I don’t care about God’s will. What about mine?” I screamed.
Almost as soon as I got the words out, my mother slapped me across my face. “You will care about God’s will. His is more important than your own.”
“To you maybe, but not to me.”
“Eleanor, calm down.” My father had just come into the room to
would something along these lines be better to open with?
[This message has been edited by Kathleen Dalton Woodbury (edited July 03, 2006).]
posted
A bit. At least we have conflict to start with but there is no connection to the MC so I'm not sure I'm upset she's being forced to marry. Also, the end is still an info dump.
Why is this the only section that is a first person POV? Wouldn't it make sense to keep the same voice rather than moving from 1st person to presumably 3rd person?
You are starting as the life is interrupted. Try starting just before the MC's world changes especially for something longer than a short. Show us who Riley/Raven is and then her mother telling her that she is to be married. IMHO, starting with Raven's response to the news is not the best place to do so.
During the conflict with "her mother" why wouldn't a 14 year old hurl out "You're not my real mother!" and other such sentiments? I said some horrid things to my mother when I was that age. My friend, who is adopted, said a lot worse to her adoptive mother at the same time.
Also it seemed a bit too formal and stiff for the MC to call these people "my mother" and "my father." I can't tell if that would be appropriate for the relationship because I have nothing to base it on except this conflict.
Where are they? What actions are they taking? Throwing hands in the air? Pacing? Backing away from her mother?
Watch the punctuation after the dialog.
quote: Almost as soon as I got the words out, my mother slapped me across my face. “You will care about God’s will. His is more important than your own.”
The "almost as soon as I got the works out" is unnessary.
quote: “Eleanor, calm down.” My father had just come into the room to intervene. “Raven, you will marry this boy one week after your next birthday. There is no more discussion about it.”
I assume Eleanor is the mother. Where was Dad? Where did he enter from? Where are you? The last line might read better as "There will be no discussion about it" rather than implying there was a discussion rather than an ultimatim about it before this point. You can have Dad comment on her lack of standing to object in this society. The "I'm the man and I win" approach.
quote: I thought about arguing that I’m not their real daughter. That I wasn’t born into this religion; into this family. But even if I was, it should be my choice, not theirs. But I couldn’t do that. They had given me a home for so many years. They gave me unconditional love throughout everything. I’ve had a good childhood, even if it has to end early. Not to mention, no female can counter a male. It's highly discouraged.
You need to work this information into the story rather than just tell us. Isn't this level of detachment and logic out of place in a 14 year old or is she telling us the story years later? The last two sentances don't seem to fit because they move from her life to society in general.
posted
My biggest problem with the snippet is the complete refusal to use the word "said" at all. You instead employ a bunch of word that are like said, but stick out and draw the reader out of the story. The reason people use the word "said" as a tag and not screamed, or shrieked, or pleaded, or ejaculated is that the word "said" is invisible to the reader. It doesn't show any signs of the author trying to cram home how he wants the reader to interpret dialogue.
People are screaming and pleading, and intervening, and answering simply all over the place in this piece.
Another thing that ircked me was how melodramatic the dialogue was. We don't know or care anything about these characters yet, and you expect us to feel the same emotions they do at the very beginning of the story. I think you started in the wrong place.
quote:“Eleanor, calm down.” My father had just come into the room to intervene. “Raven, you will marry this boy one week after your next birthday. There is no more discussion about it.”
Why did he call her Raven if her name is Riley? Is it a nickname? How do you get Raven from Riley?
quote:I thought about arguing that I’m not their real daughter. That I wasn’t born into this religion; into this family. But even if I was, it should be my choice, not theirs. But I couldn’t do that. They had given me a home for so many years. They gave me unconditional love throughout everything. I’ve had a good childhood, even if it has to end early. Not to mention, no female can counter a male. It's highly discouraged.
Huge tell. Boring.
Also, I'm not sure if anyone mentioned it, but this plot is pretty absurd. Since when can adoptive parents force their child to marry at the age of 14? Who is this kid's social worker?
Maybe this is the way it works in this fantasy universe you've set up, but this beginning doesn't really show this is as any type of fantasy universe so I read it as an urban fantasy.
[This message has been edited by Swimming Bird (edited July 03, 2006).]
posted
If you're not doing a first person narrative, then dispense with the first person.
In any first person narrative, the reader immediately identifies the person labeled "I" as a potential source of bias. Why wouldn't she portray herself as a little more virtuous and innocent than she really is? It's our universal experience of humans telling stories that involve themselves or their own interests, they always bend (or ignore) the truth to gain advantage. The moment you use "I" as the POV character, you tell us to distrust what is being said.
This effect can be put to very good literary uses, but when you're portraying the POV character as a victim right off the bat, it's a losing proposition. I don't have any reason to believe what she says.
Also, you haven't addressed any of the concerns I have about your basic setup. How can she be surprised by this if it's part of the religion she's been raised in since childhood? How do her adoptive parents have the power to enforce this if she's adamantly opposed? How could she have been adopted by these people if her parents hadn't been relatively similar in culture? How can she be this rebellious if her parents are really that strict (don't make the juvinille mistake of confusing "strict" with "harsh")? Does she simply not want to marry at all, or has she decided on someone else?
Between the unreliable POV and the unbelievable scenario, we have no reason to find anything about this story remotely plausible.
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. Julian Delphiki is Bean. We've all done such things by accident, just be careful.
