posted
Hi Here's my first thirteen. For now I just need you to tear them appart. I'm having trouble with the beginning of this story.
She would run out of food. It had been three days since the Emperor had sent her to Gehanna and the coast was nowhere to be seen. Queen Beyali gathered a pinch of sugar from her pouch and thrust it into her mouth with a handful of snow. It would have to do for now. The warmpads crept up from her neck, seeking out and neutralizing the cold in her cheeks. She scanned the horizon for signs of the panthger. Nothing. Not that it meant much. The Emperor in His Wisdom had ordered the animal bred for camouflage. The penal continent of Gehanna flaunted its glaciers and the panthger couldn't be far away. She panicked for a second and took three short breaths. _I'm running out of food_, she thought, _I know this, and this is all I know_.
posted
Firstly, I like the premise, but you spend so much time dwelling on who ordered what that I can't get the feel of it. Give me short choppy sentences, forget about who ordered what, concentrate on the fact that she is cold, hungry and freezing, give me those feelings. Then add on top of that the fear of this thing chasing her. After you have that set you can tell us how she got there, or have her tell someone else.
Posts: 151 | Registered: Jun 2006
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posted
Well, since you bribed me, here's the bonus!
Anyway. I suggest:
*Start with the name. *Tell us she's on a ship up front. *Gehanna sounds a lot like Gehenna, which means "hell." In paragraph 1 we know so little about the world that it's possible the Emporer is sending her to hell. (Or maybe this ocean is like the river Styx? Not sure.) Call it "the penal continent of Gehanna" in paragraph 1 and the problem is solved. *Is she alone on the ship? If so, how does she operate it by herself? Or is it a tiny ship? *She can't afford food, but she can afford sugar? *What's a panthger? *The continent flaunted its glaciers. I don't know what that means, or why it has something to do with panthgers.
But the main thing is: I don't know the *significance* of what's happening. I don't know why the Emporer sent her to Gehanna, why she's willing to go, what she intends to do there, whether it's reasonable for her to fear starving (if so, couldn't her ship be "lost" and she could go free?), or what the panthger thing is about. Those are the things I really want to know.
posted
She would run out of food. It had been three days since the Emperor had sent her to Gehanna and the coast was nowhere to be seen. Queen Beyali gathered a pinch of sugar from her pouch and thrust it into her mouth with a handful of snow. It would have to do for now. The warmpads crept up from her neck, seeking out and neutralizing the cold in her cheeks. She scanned the horizon for signs of the panthger. Nothing. Not that it meant much. The Emperor in His Wisdom had ordered the animal bred for camouflage. The penal continent of Gehanna flaunted its glaciers and the panthger couldn't be far away. She panicked for a second and took three short breaths. _I'm running out of food_, she thought, _I know this, and this is all I know_.
I've reread this a few times, tryng to get a better picture of what I think you might be describing.
Here are my assumptions drawn from the 13 lines.
The Emperor exiled her. Since her last scraps of food are sugar, she was probably sent off with some fairly regal food. Eating it with snow is kind of like scrapping the bottom of the barrel. The rest leaves me with two possible interpretations in m mind. 1) She's ON the continent already, looking for the coast, perhaps in order to escape. It's a frozen continent, with massive glaciers visible from where she is (a plain of somekind, or on high ground of some sort, so she can see the horizon.) In this possibility my imagination places her in some kind of desperate trip through a frozen desert (almost like the cliche of searching for water in a sand desert). There's a genetically engineered predatory beast, created to torment people on the penal continent and she's very aware that it may be stalker her at that very moment.
2) She's traveling TO the continent, on an unmentioned boat. The boat is covered in snow (a dismal image). From the water she can't see the coast of the continent, but far in the distance she CAN see the looming glacial peaks. Again the same concept of predator for the animal, except she's expecting to see it as she gets closer to shore, maybe to avoid it.
I think the first interpretation makes more sense, however I think by reading the second you might have a better idea of where your description may be too loose.
posted
Thanks. Chris V got it right in his first interpretation. You're all very right, the description is loose. Tightening up in process...
Posts: 507 | Registered: Jun 2006
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posted
[Edit: I started writing this before you posted yours. Emily Litella's ghost is laughing in my ear about my "ship" comments...]
Ditto wbriggs.
The first word, "She", could just as easily be "Queen Beyali", and that would help me know right away the significance of the Emporer exiling her.
Also, I don't think she "would run" out of food, but that she "is running" out of food. If you want to imply that she will run out of food before she reaches land, you should say that. Maybe that's how you work the ship in: "Queen Beyali was running out of food. Three days ago, when the Emporer had pronounced her sentence of exile, her ship had seemed well stocked; but the shores of Gehanna, the penal continent, were still nowhere to be seen." (That's kinda lousy, but you see what I mean.)
I'll be honest, I didn't realize she was on a ship until the second time I read it. "And the coast was nowhere to be seen" felt like she was traveling overland, looking for the seashore. I'm a landlubber, I guess. (I'd better not try to write for Shimmer's Pirate issue...)
Gehanna / Gehenna resonate as wbriggs said, and also panther / panthger. Aside from "panthger" being unpleasant to say, I'm expecting a large feline; it'll be weird through the whole story if it's not (like reading an old book with the so-called "long s" that looks like an "f" -- I know what it's supposed to be, but my brain can't help but say "Congrefs"), and it'll be pretty darned earthlike if it is (and if it's that earthlike, why not call it a "panther"?).
> the coast was nowhere to be seen.
[snip]
> The penal continent of Gehanna flaunted its glaciers and the > panthger couldn't be far away.
How can the coast be nowhere to be seen, but still have Gehanna flaunt its glaciers?
> She panicked for a second and took three short breaths. _I'm running > out of food_, she thought, _I know this, and this is all I know_.
Is running out of food really an issue in the story? If not, maybe there's something else that you can make her worry about? I'm guessing here, because you said you're struggling with the opener, that maybe the tension in the opening isn't related to the real story question. She's just been exiled, there's a story to be had here, but we assume she'll survive the boat trip. Maybe you're starting in the wrong place, or with the wrong concern?
Regards, Oliver
[This message has been edited by oliverhouse (edited September 28, 2006).]
posted
Alot has been pointed out about this and you had mentioned above you are working on corrections, but it definately has me interested. If I may be privileged to, I would love to read more of it once you have it worked out. So please feel free to email me with your finished the rework.
Posts: 35 | Registered: Sep 2004
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posted
Queen Beyali was running out of food. It had been three days since the Emperor had exiled her to the penal continent of Gehanna and the sea was nowhere in sight. She gathered a pinch of sugar from her pouch and thrust it into her mouth with a handful of snow. It would have to do for now. The warmworms crept up from her neck, seeking out and neutralizing the cold in her cheeks. She trudged on, scanning the horizon for signs of the panthger. Nothing. Not that it meant much, the animal was bred for camouflage. The glacier rolled on for as far as she could see, grey upon grey. From the distance, the landscape looked flat, but close up she could see cracks ready to catch her foot and twist it, chasms into which to fall and boulders that bared slivers of icy teeth.
Ok. Did any of you still think she is in a ship? Panthgers are white panthers with strippes like a tiger. Panthgers are scarrier than some robotic monkeys. Anything else I can call them? It _is_ a clumsy word. What do you think are warmworms? "Gehanna" is meant to play off on the word "Gehenna". It's sort of a hell frozen over, manmade punishment. Anything I've left unadressed?
[This message has been edited by Sara Genge (edited September 29, 2006).]
posted
"panthger" is a tricky word, because if you read it too fast, you have this "panther" feeling, with the nagging suspicion something is wrong with the word. "striped panther"? "panthiger"? "white panther"?
Posts: 1075 | Registered: Sep 2004
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posted
Oh, and since we're at the nitpicky stage: the only thing that bothers me is this
quote: It had been three days since the Emperor had exiled her to the penal continent of Gehanna and the sea was nowhere in sight
Thing is, it's a bit ambiguous. Are you referring to the time she was dropped on Gehanna (hence probably not by the Emperor, unless there's a thing I'm missing), or the time the Emperor pronounced her exile (which would have been a bit before she actually was set on a ship to Gehanna)?
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posted
I like the rewrite a lot more, though one nagging question is what exactly is she doing in the middle of nowhere?
Naturally I'm sure your story deals with that, but initially I'm wondering if she's running from the panthger or is she looking for a town? Is she escaping, running? Coming back to somewhere? Maybe a spaceship is going to rendevouz with her?
In my opinion my curiousity lies more with how she'll deal with the panthger than what her motivation for traveling in its midst would be. Because of that I think that could be explained a little. If anything doing that would focus my wondering and speculation onto the panthger.
As for the word "panthger," it reminded me of a weird conversion I was listening to about what might happen if you inter bred a lion and a panther and then inter-bred that lanther with a tiger.. would you get a "lanthiger"? I agree that it might be better served with a less familiar name :P
Maybe try using http://www.etymonline.com/ to splice an original, yet familiar word. If you really felt up to it you could have some hidden description in the structure of the word.
Bleh my geek is showing. Good luck!
[This message has been edited by Chris V (edited September 29, 2006).]
posted
Queen Beyali was running out of food. It had been three days since the Emperor’s exile order had landed her on the penal continent of Gehanna and the sea was nowhere in sight. She gathered a pinch of sugar from her pouch and thrust it into her mouth with a handful of snow. It would have to do for now. The warmworms crept up from her neck, seeking out and neutralizing the cold in her cheeks. The Emperor, in His Wisdom, had given her provisions for two days. Afterwards, His Will would be done. The queen trudged ahead, scanning the horizon for signs of the pantigre. Nothing. Not that it meant much. The animal was bred for camouflage. The glacier rolled on for as far as she could see, grey upon grey. From the distance, the landscape looked
Better, worst? Does anyone still think she's on a boat? I'm kindda worried about that. I want to make it ultraclear she's trying to reach the coast.
[This message has been edited by Kathleen Dalton Woodbury (edited September 30, 2006).]
posted
Sara, I'm not getting the impression she's on a boat at all. However, I think it would be a lot easier if you told us why she's trying to reach the sea (which, frankly, has me a bit puzzled).
Posts: 1075 | Registered: Sep 2004
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Either by starvation or by being eaten alive. Gotcha :P
Pantiger (or the others) seem too literal to me. In my opinion you might as well call it a Snow Panther if the name is going to be so obvious.
I played around with that dictionary and made up a completely fake word based on words your exerpt made me think of. I ended up with Ziranath. I just glewed "Ziro" an ancient verb for swallow and stuck it to "Anathema," "thing accursed or damned."
Do or do not, don't settle for an obvious inbetween name. IMHO anyway One thing I sometimes do too is choose random letters that sound good to me and use those. I actually made a simple computer program to spit these random words out at me for whenever I can't decide on a name.
[This message has been edited by Chris V (edited September 29, 2006).]
[This message has been edited by Chris V (edited September 29, 2006).]
posted
I no longer get any sense that she's on a boat, and I sorta know that she's headed for the coast; maybe if I understood why she was going there, I'd "get it" better.
The situation with the food is much clearer now: for example, we know she wasn't in a nice cozy Royal Prison from which she stole two days' worth of provisions; she only got two days' worth in the first place.
If the resonance with Gehenna is deliberate, then you're doing okay with that; if you want something tiger-like, I personally would rather not have something made up, like "Snow Panthers" or "Panths" (a nickname rather than an amalgam) or even "Sentry Cats". That's my preference; your mileage may vary.
Regards, Oliver
[This message has been edited by oliverhouse (edited September 29, 2006).]
posted
She's trying to get to the coast because there are fishingboats there and she might have a chance of escaping. I didn't want to throw it in at the beginning because I didn't want to infodump. Can this wait untill paragraph four, or should I throw it in in the first three lines, like this.
Queen Beyali was running out of food. It had been three days since the Emperor's exile order had landed her on the penal continent of Gehanna and the sea was nowhere in sight. It was whaling season and there would be fishingboats hugging the coast. She gathered a pinch of sugar...
Better? I tend to go for the subtle approach but I agree that maybe that extra line would make life easier for everyone
[This message has been edited by Sara Genge (edited October 01, 2006).]
posted
Hi, just read through all of this. I agree that as she is going to the coast, hoping to find some whaling boats there, the reader should know that at the beginning. Thus, this last beginning is on the right track. Dunno if it's stating too much, but could it be an idea to even put in those first lines WHY it matters that those boats are hugging the coast?
"It was whaling season, and fishing boats would be hugging the coast. With a bit of luck and a bit of charm, one of them might offer her a way out of here."
Another thing - if it's whaling season, the boats would probably be out at sea? So perhaps "end of the whaling season", or "beginning" instead?
As for the Panthger-debate - well, give it some other characteristics as well - sabre fangs or ridged back or taloned tail - and you can call it just about anything, right? Zircat? Something else?
posted
OK, so first off I'm going to come out as a fan of your stuff, so that may bias my opinion.
I think I liked your original post the best so far. There was a fragmented quality to it that I felt captured the Queen's distress. All the information was there, and all in approximately the right place, but a sentence or two off, and I felt that technique actually worked in your favor. For example, I know we all advise against it on a constant basis, but I really liked it when it started with "she." You got her name within 3 sentences anyway.
As you've tried to make things flow more smoothly I feel some of the heart of what you were trying to say has been lost. The sense of wonder I had when I first read your opening 13 is dampened in the later versions.
On an alternate note, I didn't get the impression she was on a boat, but, again, that's just me.
posted
Thanks Everyone Simon_S: Do you mind if I use "zircat?" I haven't made up my mind yet, but it's a strong candidate. I don't want to use two word names because I use the panthger thing at least 20 times in the story and that would just bog down the narrative. At the same time, I wanted to make this nice and obvious just from the name, that we're dealing with a large feline depredator. Ideas anyone?
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posted
If you're already alluding to earthly (or at least mythologically earthly) things with "Gehanna", how about doing the same with the cat? Use a prefix or suffix (from a foreign language?) that implies what you want to about it, or make a compound word from something descriptive.
"Zircat" sounds cool but doesn't mean anything to me; but "ur-cat" has a resonance: primitive, primordial, and (irrationally, perhaps, but here it is anyway) huge.
Maybe look up the words "sentry", "guard", "seer", "distorted", "fear", "anger", and so on in a few foreign languages (including Aramaic and Hebrew, if you're using "Gehanna") and see what you get. Then manipulate to taste.
In fact, since I'm having fun, I'll do it. Using babelfish here, so unfortunately I have no Hebrew, Aramaic, or Latin...
Panth-colere? Schildcat? ("sentry-feline" in Dutch is "schildwacht-katachtig" -- maybe "schildcat" would be an interesting derivative.) Wachtiger? Skopcat? Catskop? Pathskop? Thanther?
With that last one, you'll always think you're lisping, but you have to play a lot before you find things you like.
"Killing-cat" in Dutch is "moord-kat": interesting resonance with "moors" geographically and "morte"
"Double-cat" (because both tiger and panther) in German is "doppelkatze" -- maybe "doppelcat"?
"Predator" in German is "Raub": Raubcat?
Okay, I've procrastinated enough. Of the blather I've put out so far, I like "schildcat", "moord-kat", "ur-cat", and "doppelcat". But that's just me.
posted
By all means, use Zircat if you want to On the other hand, oliverhouse had some neat suggestions as well.
In Finnish, guard would be "vartija", fear "pelko" and anger "viha" , in Swedish on the other hand it's "vakt", "raedsla" and "ilska"... but writing it, I see it won't probably help you.
posted
I'd go for pantere, as Pantera is a fairly known metal band.. might give the wrong associations.
Posts: 12 | Registered: Sep 2006
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posted
I prefer names that seem to have some way they could have really come into being.
If your language is made up, make up whatever you like (as long as it fits the rules of your language -- if your language sounds like Hawaiian, the creature might be a "hoponumunumu," but not likely a "rozhikoff" or a "strungerhite").
This story has Gehanna, so it's clear there's some connection to Western culture. It need not be English. A corruption of a word for some kind of cat would work. Greek for "panther" is "πάνθηρας" -- "pantheras," if I read it right. Or then there's "γάτα" ("gata," for "cat").
If it's English, we can have deliberate invention, or corruption. "Painter" is a natural corruption of "panther"; "painters" with claws and teeth instead of easels and brushes exist in Appalachia.
"Birdle" is a Larry Niven invention for a birdlike creature. His creative explorers also came up with mobys, integral trees (shaped like integral signs -- so the explorers knew calculus), cotton-candy jungles (so they must know what cotton candy is).
If "panther" is naturally corrupted to "pantere," well, how is "pantere" pronounced? If it's "panter," I'd use "panter," as it's less ambiguous and it doesn't suggest the author is getting cute with the spelling, but rather that the *characters* speak this way. (Who wants to think about authors? ) If it's "pan-TEAR," maybe "pantare?"
If it *is* "panter," then we should expect people to take "bats" in "bat-tubs," and for these furry creatures to only die when they're down to the "ninet" life.
Oliver's ideas about words that don't mean, but do describe, panthers -- that's cool, too, I think.
[This message has been edited by wbriggs (edited October 04, 2006).]
posted
This is becoming such an interesting philological discussion: I was thinking more along the terms of a roman-revival. Latin taking the streets and so forth. Ideas? I like panter Will, I'll think about it, but so many of us around the world pronounce all of our sylables so that the ending "e" ìn "pantere" wouldn't be silent at all. How would you spell that in English?
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posted
Pff, so much too chose from... I still haven't made my decision but... I think I have another story. I liked moordcat enough to build another story with that word to describe another badass animal. Thanks oliver!
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One thing I sometimes do too is choose random letters that sound good to me and use those. I actually made a simple computer program to spit these random words out at me for whenever I can't decide on a name.
