Weird, I know.

But I was a major tomboy growing up. I never played with barbies or dollies. I played war with the kids in the neighborhood and could hold my own against the boys until nature screwed things up with puberty. Even now I get along better with men than with women. I just don't get all that Chick Flick stuff, the shopping, the makeup, the head games. I don't have anything to discuss with most women--except childbirth. All they want to do is trash men or talk about other girlie things.

So most of my MCs are men and I sometimes enlist the help of a girlie woman to read over the scenes involving women. But since I avoid writing about stereoptypical girlie women (totally uninteresting!), it usually isn't an issue.

I, too, was a tomboy growing up. I still refuse to wear makeup even though I've had several nosy *itches tell me that I should. I wore makeup on my wedding day and wish I hadn't. My face looked all white and ghastly.Plus, it wasn't me.

In part, I have grown out of being a tomboy. Like I said, I'll still beat you with a 2x4 if you suggest wearing makeup to me and I HATE to shop. Wait, that deserves some more emphasis...

I HATE TO SHOP

That's better. I'm not sure it quite conveys how strongly I feel about this. One time I told someone I didn't like to shop and they actually had the nerve to NOT believe me because I'm female. <cracks knuckles menacingly>

But in other ways I have grown out of the tomboy thing. Part of it, I think, is realizing that a myth (the bane of my existence) is utter bull:

Women all like to shop, do their hair, talk about men, giggle, and watch chick flicks.

Women are not all alike, just as men are not all alike. I finally realized that part of the reason I wanted to be a tomboy was that I felt that I could either be a person or I could be a woman. Now I realize that's not true. I can be a woman and a person all at the same time! I don't have to like all the things women like although I can like some of them. (I don't mind the *ocassional* chick flick that's well done.) I can be proud of my curves and still have a brain.

My wife agrees.

Interesting though--in my experience, the women who DO fit the stereotype (and they're out there, but maybe they force themselves into the stereotype because of the social/media reinforcement of it) marry men who fit the testosterone MALE stereotype (same as above parentheses), and neither seem very happy.

On subject:

I wonder if a woman writing about men puts readers off. That's why Andre Norton used that pseudonym, so her books would be appealing to her target audience--boys.

The only one I ever read that seemed to nail-it (sorry) was in a short story by Joanna Russ. I will see if I can remember the title.

BTW: Joanna Russ' writing is a bit of a favourite of mine, so be nice.

If you get me into a rock and mineral shop, I can windowshop and daydream for at least an hour before getting bored. I can't last longer than about five minutes in a clothing store.

I have a male character as a protagonist, and a female one as well. I feel I can write equally well for either, and at the point I'm uncertain, I run questions past male friends.

quote:

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I tend to think (correct me if I'm wrong) that mostly males and females can have similar ways of thinking.

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I don't know if you are wrong, but I believe that while our motivations and/or goals are similar, men and women do not think similarly. Sure, we all have our similarities, but there are a lot of studies which suggest (I'm not saying those studies have proven anything) that men and women think and react differently to any given scenario. If true, this is not a bad thing, as it provides a good balance. Perhaps we are supposed to be different -- a necessary survival of the species trait.

But it's also culture and society that shapes how we think. Women in the Middle East are unlikely to think like Western women.

So, when it comes to writing believable characters, I feel those characters need to respond accordingly to their experiences, culture, and upbringing. A rich girl is likely to approach things (rationalize and solve problems) far differently than a poor girl. Or they might not. Everyone is different after all. Really, you just have to consider who your characters are and their environment.

I find it easy enough to write either gender. Whether I do a good job is a question for another day.

I am reminded of Chelsea Quinn Yarbro, who wrote a story (it's in "Cautionary Tales" but the specific title escapes me) with fourteen characters, each of whom had a name that could have been male or female, and in which no personal pronouns were used. One (male) editor rejected it because the idea was preposterous and besides it was obvious that the lead character was a man. One (female) editor rejcted it because the idea was preposterous and besides it was obvious that the lead character was a woman.

I'm fairly confident that both sexes can write both sexes convincingly - which isn't to say they always do. Almost any character is convincing so long as they are fully rounded and "real". They may be "atypical" for their sex (many people perceive women who don't want to have children, or men who don't want to have sex with as many attractive women as possible, as atypical)(we won't even go into the realm of women who don't like to shop...), but if they are presented as a consistently behaving character with a full emotional range, they are still likely to be accepted. Some authors can do this, and not just the ones who (for whataver reason) masquerade under another gender (James Tiptree Jr, for example). Others, however, are fairly hopeless writing genuine credible characters of either sex, but it tends to be that when they write characters of the opposite sex they are mostly picked up for it. I'll mention Heinlein at this point, and then run screaming from the room.

Ah, there's the thread. Thanks for bumping it up.