Hatrack River Writers Workshop   
my profile login | search | faq | forum home

  next oldest topic   next newest topic
» Hatrack River Writers Workshop » Forums » Open Discussions About Writing » Formatting

   
Author Topic: Formatting
Lynda
Member
Member # 3574

 - posted      Profile for Lynda   Email Lynda         Edit/Delete Post 
Okay, I'm losing my tiny little mind here. I wrote my novel in a novel-writing software (WriteItNow which has some good features, but I'm about to try yWrite, which was a free download and looks more intuitive than WIN). WIN wants you to write with block, single-spaced paragraphs, with a double-space between paragraphs. Unfortunately, I've been writing since pre-computer days and I usually write with indented paragraphs, so I had to fight that problem to start with. Then I exported the WIN files into Word as .txt files so my beta readers could read and comment on my story. I worked on the edits in Word, saving the files as .doc files. The files got all bolloxed up formatting-wise, putting in extra blank lines between paragraphs, indenting at random even after I'd made everything block style, etc. I wrestled it to a standstill, hand-formatting the entire 115,000 word novel. Sent anything from the first five pages to the first 100 pages to a variety of agents (none of whom have bitten yet). Now I'm back in editing mode and fighting the formatting AGAIN! Now the "find" function doesn't understand that "chapter" is a word it can find! (I'm trying to save it chapter by chapter again, rather than as one file. I never said I was a genius at this.) And now it's lost all my underlining because I saved it as .txt files, which my hubby told me would hold their formatting better than .doc files. But I'd already gone through and changed all my _underlined_ words into words that really WERE <u>underlined</u> for submission. So now I have NOTHING underlined (I do have tons of backup copies, but that's all hand-labor to reformat again. grrrrr). Do any of you have suggestions for ways to speed up this process and save the stupid thing so it stays formatted properly? I haven't tried it in yWriter yet - I have to send the files there as .txt files too, I think. So they'll lose the underlining again, right? And before I submit it, I have to change all the _underlined_ words to really <u>underlined</u> words AGAIN - all by hand unless somebody can figure out how I can avoid that!

How do you handle formatting? In plain English, please? I'm not that techie-minded, as you can probably tell here. . .argh. Thanks.

Lynda


Posts: 415 | Registered: Jul 2006  |  IP: Logged | Report this post to a Moderator
mikemunsil
Member
Member # 2109

 - posted      Profile for mikemunsil   Email mikemunsil         Edit/Delete Post 
can you not use the Search/Replacefuction in Word to do most of the changes?

yWriter is a good project tool, but I prefer RoughDraft (also freeware) for writing in.


Posts: 2710 | Registered: Jul 2004  |  IP: Logged | Report this post to a Moderator
Robert Nowall
Member
Member # 2764

 - posted      Profile for Robert Nowall   Email Robert Nowall         Edit/Delete Post 
A little hard labor never hurt anyone. (Maybe it never helped anyone either, but that's another story.)

If all else fails---and wait for the others to chime in, 'cause I'm computer illiterate, too, and there may yet be an easier solution---just start retyping it in whatever new format you want to use. (I had that problem when I moved from a one-lung word processor to my first full-fledged computer---I retyped a whole novel, but I was also throwing out whole chapters).

When I've put things in .txt, I wind up losing a lot, and wind up having to go over it again to fix---and computer generated typos wind up in there despite my best efforts.

And at the very least, retyping makes you reconsider every sentence and word and phrase you've written...


Posts: 8809 | Registered: Aug 2005  |  IP: Logged | Report this post to a Moderator
Lynda
Member
Member # 3574

 - posted      Profile for Lynda   Email Lynda         Edit/Delete Post 
Oh, no, Robert, I'm not retyping it!! I'm editing and polishing it scene-by-scene, chapter by chapter, but retyping the whole thing? NO, that's the typewriter way, not the computer way!

And Mike, I've even got the "Word for Dummies" book, but there's no way to search for extra lines (such as when it decides to put two blank lines between paragraphs every so often for no discernable reason) and I can't figure out how to search for the indents which are erratic in places!! Argh. . . . And the lost underlines will have to be searched for in a chapter-to-chapter comparison and replaced with an underline before and after the section that should be in italics. In SUBMISSION format, these need to be UNDERLINED (not in italics). In .txt (for working with writing software and in submitting to crit groups) you have to put the underlines before and after the words or they don't stick where they're put (.txt format erases them).

I'm a bit thick-headed about techie stuff, so I seem to learn things the hard way. I guess I'm just going through one of those "hard way" lessons.

Oh, and Mike, my Search and Replace function works when it darned well feels like it (I have Windows XP and my Word is 2002 version, I think - it just isn't that "old"). Yesterday, it was certain there was no word "chapter" in my file at all! "Chapter" (upper case "C") or "chapter," it refused to find either one so I could copy and paste the chapters into individual files. So I'm having to scroll and look for them that way. ARGH!!!!!!!!!! I'm so sick of this. I'd rather be writing. Well, I'd rather be doing nearly anything - having my flu shot, even! - than reformatting this stupid thing AGAIN! argh.

Thanks for the ideas.

Lynda


Posts: 415 | Registered: Jul 2006  |  IP: Logged | Report this post to a Moderator
EricJamesStone
Member
Member # 1681

 - posted      Profile for EricJamesStone   Email EricJamesStone         Edit/Delete Post 
> I saved it as .txt files, which my hubby told me would hold
> their formatting better than .doc files.

OK, run the following find & replace in Word:

Find what: [^13^11][ ^s^t^13^11]{1,}
Replace with: ^13
Check the box for "Use wildcards."

That should remove all the blank lines from your document. It may also, as a side effect, deal with some of the indenting problems by removing tabs.

By the way, any novel-writing software that formats paragraphs as blocks with an extra line between them rather than indented is pretty useless, as proper format is indented.

[This message has been edited by EricJamesStone (edited October 04, 2006).]

[This message has been edited by EricJamesStone (edited October 04, 2006).]


Posts: 1517 | Registered: Jul 2003  |  IP: Logged | Report this post to a Moderator
Beth
Member
Member # 2192

 - posted      Profile for Beth   Email Beth         Edit/Delete Post 
There's no need to worry too much about formatting until you're at the point where you want someone else to read it. Then, dump it into word, and do:

find: ^p^p
replace with: ^p^t

to go from blocks of text with an extra line between them to indented text with no extra lines btwn paragraphs.


Posts: 1750 | Registered: Oct 2004  |  IP: Logged | Report this post to a Moderator
Robert Nowall
Member
Member # 2764

 - posted      Profile for Robert Nowall   Email Robert Nowall         Edit/Delete Post 
quote:
Oh, no, Robert, I'm not retyping it!! I'm editing and polishing it scene-by-scene, chapter by chapter, but retyping the whole thing? NO, that's the typewriter way, not the computer way!

I just past the fifty-thousand-word point in my new novel, and am still planning on rewriting-as-described. I think it improves the work when I do. (I figure somewhere between one hundred thousand and one hundred fifty thousand for a final total, depending on what I decide to do.)

I read once that James Joyce would spend eight hours at work and remove a comma, then spend another eight hours at it and put the comma back in. (I never could get into Joyce, either way.) Writing is often a matter of discipline. Don't pass up the hard way for the easy way. It's not wasted effort if it makes the work better.


Posts: 8809 | Registered: Aug 2005  |  IP: Logged | Report this post to a Moderator
autumnmuse
Member
Member # 2136

 - posted      Profile for autumnmuse   Email autumnmuse         Edit/Delete Post 
I find it's best not to picture rewriting when you are in the throes of the first draft as the idea can be pretty daunting.

That said, I very well may end up printing out my manuscript, penciling the changes, and typing it back in in order to tighten as I go. I don't think it will be that hard.

I read on her site that Robin McKinley, one of my alltime favorite authors, retypes each manuscript not once but three times. By the time she finishes the third, that sucker is lean, mean, and gorgeous. (My words not hers, but you get the point). She's definitely doing something right, cause I love her stuff. Makes me more willing to do that kind of work to my own drafts.


Posts: 818 | Registered: Aug 2004  |  IP: Logged | Report this post to a Moderator
Lynda
Member
Member # 3574

 - posted      Profile for Lynda   Email Lynda         Edit/Delete Post 
Thanks, Eric and Beth, for the tips on how to fix my problem in Word! Wonder why those instructions aren't in the "for dummies" book I spent $25 on???? argh. . .or maybe I just didn't find them yet?? *sigh* I don't see why techie stuff has to be so difficult! :-P~~~~~

Lynda


Posts: 415 | Registered: Jul 2006  |  IP: Logged | Report this post to a Moderator
Robert Nowall
Member
Member # 2764

 - posted      Profile for Robert Nowall   Email Robert Nowall         Edit/Delete Post 
I'll add this to my off-topic musings on revision, that I'll always be editing and reediting as I go, both times. So it'll be changing as I pass through it.
Posts: 8809 | Registered: Aug 2005  |  IP: Logged | Report this post to a Moderator
Julia Walton
New Member
Member # 4126

 - posted      Profile for Julia Walton           Edit/Delete Post 
Re: WriteItNow. The latest version released in September '06(3.1.0j)can be downloaded from their website (www.ravensheadservices.com)and allows you to suppress blank lines when outputting RTF.

Once you have finished your writing in WriteItNow, without worrying about formatting (although you can use bold, italic and underline), you output to Word or equivalent and you can tick boxes to choose whether you want to indent paragraphs etc.

If you need to make any further amendments or re-writes to your story, you do it in WriteItNow using the original .wnw file, before outputting once again to your word processor. Outputting as RTF is a one way process and you can't then reload it into WriteItNow.

Hope this helps clear up a few queries people have had.


Posts: 1 | Registered: Oct 2006  |  IP: Logged | Report this post to a Moderator
   

   Close Topic   Feature Topic   Move Topic   Delete Topic next oldest topic   next newest topic
 - Printer-friendly view of this topic
Hop To:


Contact Us | Hatrack River Home Page

Copyright © 2008 Hatrack River Enterprises Inc. All rights reserved.
Reproduction in whole or in part without permission is prohibited.


Powered by Infopop Corporation
UBB.classic™ 6.7.2