posted
I may be a little off-topic, but how about architecture? Having visited many places in Italy, I was absolutely amazed at the various types of architecture and art. None of it was designed with computers. It was pure brain power and talent. To me, that's an amazing feat. I'm sure people could do it today, but I don't know how many actually do. Maybe in the realm of art and sculpting, some do it the "old fashioned" way.
Look at movies also - Ray Harryhausen was a master at stop-motion animation. Even The Empire Strikes Back as high-tech as it was for its time had SM sequences. Today, it's all done in computers and few (if any) use the traditional techniques.
I think someone from 2,000 years ago visiting our world would be overwhelmed with what would see. Perhaps they would view it as "magic"...
Any sufficiently advanced technology is indistinguishable from magic. --Arthur C. Clarke, "Profiles of The Future", 1961 (Clarke's third law) English physicist & science fiction author (1917 - )
posted
The greeks had what amounted to robots. i saw a program where the Greeks, using "clockwork", cams, gears, weights, springs, to have a "case" roll out to the middle of the arena, and then do a display of things spinning around, coming up lowering again, telling one of the great stories they all knew, then roll itself back out of view again, all without human interference. We are only now fully understanding what all they were doing. Posts: 1008 | Registered: Feb 2006
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posted
Clarke also said it was five hundred years from that to the spaceship, and that we'd be at Vega by now if development had been linear.
Clarke also also said that the last time he saw the gizmo, it was in a cigar box in the basement of the museum...I guess others don't see it as important an artifact as we science-fictiony types do...
i heard something along the lines that if the dark ages never happened that we would be traviling through space at faster than light speeds by now. i dont know where Vega is or yet what it is. but yes we would be.
HAPPY NEW YEAR I HAVE LESS THAN 6 HOURS LOCLE TIME TILL 2400 01JAN 2008. AND I AM NOT DRUNK.
posted
Of course, had humans obtained nuclear capability a 1000 years ago, most likely none of us would be here.
Posts: 1275 | Registered: Mar 2004
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posted
I watched a program once about ancient Egypt and they apparently had light bulbs and batteries. Very interesting.
Posts: 141 | Registered: Feb 2007
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posted
Unfortunately, one has to watch these programs with a degree of skepticism. While there might be a grain of truth, often the drive for sensationalism distorts it with much slight of hand.
I remember watching a special about the "untold story" of the moon landing. They, in essense, made it appear that Buzz Aldrin was saying that a UFO was following the Apollo. In reality, what they saw was debris from the craft that traveled in the same direction due to inertia. They were uncertain of what it was at first. Later they figured it out. But the way they cut Aldrin's description, interspersing it with the narration, they drew an inevitable conclusion.
[This message has been edited by ChrisOwens (edited January 01, 2008).]
posted
yes they had batteries and primitive light bulbs but to say as i have heard by consperisy theriost that the moon landings never happened is BS. with a high powered telliscope you cen see the moon landing sights.
posted
People that long ago would probably be horrified by what they see today. Immorality, crime, poverty, warfare, all the bad things are at an all time high. For all the good that advances in technology and science have brought us, more harm has been caused, even on small scales. Just look at the general laziness of the average person living in an "advanced" country. Some will point out things like life expectancies increasing worldwide, or higher standards of living in most countries. But with those you see corporatisation of medicines, food, more deaths from easily treatable or curable diseases, and even in small town Georgia where I'm from, homelessness is starting to become a problem.
quote: People that long ago would probably be horrified by what they see today. Immorality, crime, poverty, warfare, all the bad things are at an all time high.
This begs the questions:
1) What people? How long ago?
2) Define the "morals" of said people.
3) As for poverty and crime, the numbers are higher, yes, but so is the population, and the methods of detection. We have no accurate way of accounting the percentage difference.
4) Warfare? More today? Than which "long ago peoples"? Surely not the Romans? Greeks? Medieval Europeans? Perhistoric Vikings? Saxons? Germanic tribes? African tribes/Egyptians? Israelites under Joshua? Muslims under Saladin? Maians? Aztecs? Native Americans? France, England, and The United States in the 1800s? This only leads back to Question No. 1.
However, I will agree with:
quote: Just look at the general laziness...
Eerily enough, this is the theory whose aftermath the Dune novels were the distant future of.
Mind, before they got that far, they'd have to acquire modern language, learn how to avoid being run over by a truck and survive several breathless interviews by ignorant TV journalists. ("Where's your club? Do you really drag women around by the hair?")
Pat
[This message has been edited by TaleSpinner (edited January 08, 2008).]
posted
I'm sorry. I forgot my post said "People from the past were perfect." My bad.
The very fact that
quote:the methods of detection
have advanced simply means that people would see thing they perhaps heard about or maybe even witnessed firsthand, that they may or may not have already been unsettled by, being performed around the world. Advances in technology have led to easier and more impersonal ways of killing vast amounts of people. The Romans and Greeks were bloodthirsty in their conquests, but they never dreamed of waging wars on the scale that have been fought in the last hundred years. I didn't say that there was no warfare. I said that there is more now than there was previously. Two World Wars- that means, if my understanding is correct, wars in which all the major militaries on the earth were invlovled- kinda proves that, don't you think? Yeah, you throw all the deaths during the conflicts you pointed out together, you might exceed the total number killed in those two wars. But you're talking about hundreds of conficlts spanning a period of a few thousand years. The total time between the start of the first World War and end of the second is 31 years.
And as far as morals go, yes, it would depend on what person that came from which time period. But the vast majority of civilizations have at least attempted to have some kind of moral/ethical code that all of the citizens stuck to. Even fifty or sixty years ago in the US- despite the corrupt people and bad things going on other posters are going to point out- people still believed in common decency. Ask your parents, grandparents, aunts, uncles. There were these things called "family values" that weren't just topics of political debate.
The only point I was trying to make in my previous post was essentially this: Yeah, we have some cool gadgets (see, mp3 players and cell phones). We have access to an almost unlimited supply of information (see, Wikipedia). And we can get almost anywhere in the world in a few hours, plus/minus flight delays.
But we also have violence caused by politics (see, 600-1000 estimated killed in Kenya "civil unrest"); increased financial worry (see, Oil $100 per barrel); and lack of real values and morals among the general population (see, Police: Teacher exchanges nude photos with freshman at CNN.com).
But we have the future to look forward to, right?
[This message has been edited by MasterTrek (edited January 08, 2008).]
[This message has been edited by MasterTrek (edited January 08, 2008).]
posted
i wont go into my far past memories but war has come a far way in the last 2000 years. he!! the last 50 years have changed the way we fight.
morals of people 2000 years ago and behond are only slightly different than how they are today. however they would find some of our beleaves somewhat odd and strange.
dont even get me started on genetically altered viruses; nanomachines; possible terrorist-led nuclear attacks, etc. every one here should know my standing. i dont want to start more troble please leave it out for my sainity and yours.
quote:Advances in technology have led to easier and more impersonal ways of killing vast amounts of people.
This has always been the case, ever since the first bow and arrow, or a catapault launched a boulder at a castle and defenders responded with cauldrons of hot oil.
(And, war always provokes the fastest, most significant technological advances, including micro-chips, radar and all the spin-offs from Kennedy's race to the moon. Paradoxically, war develops us.)
War mongers have always demonised the enemy to create "impersonal killing". (Whatever "impersonal killing" is, I doubt it has a more acceptable opposite.) How else do you get decent people to go kill?
Leaders like Julius Ceasar, Genghis Kahn and Sun Tsu sought to dominate the entire known world by force long before Hitler thought of it. If they had had the weapons he had, would they have held back?--No, of course not, they would have used everything at their disposal. Technology has changed, but humanity hasn't.
And MasterTrek, the question was, "What would someone from 2000 years ago think of today's world?"--not, "What would someone who thinks as I do think of today's world?" The first question is an interesting one for us as aspiring SF writers for it might lead to some story ideas; soapbox speeches on the second question instead will lead to a lock on this thread, methinks.
posted
Here's my attempt at answering the question.
Let's assume an ancient Roman from around 2000 years ago gets transported into today, that he learns modern language and figures out enough about our technology not to get electrocuted or run over by a truck.
His first question on arrival at the transporter baggage claim will be, "Where's my slave?" Carrying his own stuff will be a novel experience--assuming of course it didn't get mislaid in another time or place.
When he sees modern technology, like most people he will not wonder how it works and will simply accept that "If you press this button here, it works." Mastering TV, a microwave and a car will not take our visitor long. (Programming a DVD recorder might take a bit longer.) Nor will it be hard to fire up a browser and start communicating with people all over the world.
Quite soon he'll wonder why everyone smells funny. Then he'll realise that in fact, it is he who smells disgusting and he'll discover a shower and deodorant. He'll also wonder what a knife and fork are for, and limit himself to eating burgers and ribs. He'll learn quickly he can get as drunk now as he could in ancient Rome--but also that we have pills that can reduce hangovers and other kinds of pain. He'll marvel at modern dentistry and get a complete set of golden teeth just for the heck of it.
He'll notice that everyone has an opinion and can freely say what it is, without worrying about having to drag a heavy cross through town in order to get crucified on it. When he realizes that although crucifixion is a thing of the past there is still capital punishment in the USA he'll wonder why it isn't televised--and why the condemned doesn't drag his electric chair through town before sitting in it. He'll find European, Canadian and Australian attitudes towards capital punishment a complete mystery and wonder how, sans the ultimate intimidation, civilization can possibly be maintained. (If he's attentive he'll see that the moment of death isn't shown in Western TV news coverage of wars and accidents.)
He'll notice that status depends somewhat upon knowledge, skill and education, less on accidents of birth and inheritance--though if he's astute he'll see that nobility still matters more than us locals care to admit. He'll observe democracy and ask himself why the most dishonest, sleazy and universally mistrusted individuals get to rule and what more they have to offer than dishonest, sleazy and universally mistrusted monarchs.
He'll wonder what has happened to sport. None of those shows where the lions get to eat the Christians. Gone too are the gladiators--but wait, there's wrestling and boxing ... he'll wonder where the "thumbs up" and "thumbs down" buttons are on the remote and be disappointed that nobody dies for sport and spectacle any more. He'll also be surprised to see women playing games. http://www.crystalinks.com/romerecreation.html
Bored, he'll turn to sex and that too will be a surprise. He'll be shocked and disappointed to find that homosexuality is regarded as immoral or worse by many: "Ancient sexuality [..] finds its basis in status. The active partner, i.e. the partner of a higher social status, assumes the role of the penetrator; whereas, the passive partner, i.e. the partner of inferior social status, takes on the penetrated position." More at http://ancienthistory.about.com/cs/sexuality/a/aa011400a.htm
I think our visitor will be bemused by many things in our modern society--but not our technology; we will be the big surprise.
Just 2c, Pat
[This message has been edited by TaleSpinner (edited January 08, 2008).]
[This message has been edited by TaleSpinner (edited January 08, 2008).]
[This message has been edited by TaleSpinner (edited January 08, 2008).]
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