Okay. Book One (The Shaman's Curse) is finished and looking for an agent. Book Two (The Ignored Prophecy) is currently in revision. I'm starting again to look towards Book Three. Here's my dilemma.
At the end of Book Two, some major changes are set in motion. A significant part of this world is going to be altered forever. Political systems will change. The turmoil will cause economic upheavals, which will cause more political changes. And my MC is positioned to be deeply involved in all of it.
What is currently Book Three (untitled) is set to start a few years after the end of Book Two, when many of these changes have already taken place. In order to be a complete story unto itself, that's where it has to start--when the problem it solves surfaces.
But now I'm wondering if that's really Book Four. Is there a story in the turmoil between Books Two and Three? Given that I haven't even started to outline such a plot, would that story even be interesting to a fantasy reader?
It wouldn't have a lot of action, although I can think of some (bandits taking advantage of the situation, for example). There could be a certain amount of intrigue, as a subplot (MC would not be involved in that).
It's so different from the story in the first book (when the MC was younger). I guess I'm just not sure if it would work. Or if I'd be cheating the overall story to just skip over it and go to Book Three (well, what's currently Book Three).
posted
I might have a hard time accepting that this MC is in a key position and then just stalls for years, and then is still in that key position when he’s needed. But no, that's not true. Tom Clancy showed Jack Ryan climbing through successively more important roles, with gaps of time between most of the books where he just kept doing his current job as the world rolled on. And that series rocked.
Did he go to another country for a while, or was he somehow involved in the evolving sitaution? What did your MC do in the interim? Are you sure there’s no story for him in that turmoil? I'd hope he was somewhat interesting, even if you skip book 3. And how is he suddenly thrust back into the spotlight? (A vacuum where he has to take over someone else's job, or some such?)
I have a very similar gap in time within my own novel, but my MC was in another land playing the hero. It’s just not important to the plot, except to see her leave wet-behind-the-ears and then return with experience and greater confidence. Does THAT seem okay to you folks? (I could come back later and write about her adventures in that other land, as a separate stand-alone book.)
This question makes me realize that if the story skips ahead, I had better understand what happened in the interim, and be able to communicate relevant changes (about the world and the character) to the reader.
But your real question is, can you skip over major political and economic upheaval? Do fantasy readers want to read about all that? It can’t be the main focus if you write book 3, because I want to see the speculative element maintained. You would have to invent another subplot and make it the plot for book 3, tying in the upheaval somehow. I suspect you are better off skipping book 3, and just make it clear in chapter 1 how much the world has changed.
If you want books 3 and 4: Is your series completely focused on this one MC, or are there other strong characters? Could another MC step to the fore, with less focus on your current MC, for book 3? (If you do that, then both characters will have to be important in book 4. And readers may feel cheated during book 3, if they prefer MC1.)
[This message has been edited by MrsBrown (edited July 30, 2009).]
posted
I think political turmoil and upheavals can be quite interesting, and would make for a good third book. Of course, I'm something of a political junkie, but there can be good political stories in a fantasy setting as well. One of my WIPs has a heavy political hand.
As to the issue of there not being any action... well, politics through the years is filled with action. Even positive political change can have physical violence, no matter the age - look at the last few months in Iran. And violence isn't the only type of action they drum up. There is plenty of work to go around for spies, be they the assassinating kind or just the snapping-pictures kind.
Even something so relatively tame as an election not marred by violence can be an incredibly interesting story - no matter which side of the American political spectrum a person was on in 2008, it was hard to deny that the election was political theater at its best, and a character living through that narrative would be quite a story.
I know not everybody reads fivethirtyeight.com as religiously as do I, but I still think that the environment of a political revolution can be a fantastic setting for a very interesting story. How does it affect your MC? How does he/she fit into the new order? Did anyone oppose the MC's ascendancy/fall to the new position? Did rapidly changing economic situations encourage widespread bandit problems, or did a new technology suddenly require the new government to play catch-up in regulation?
[This message has been edited by micmcd (edited July 30, 2009).]
posted
Oh, he'll be in it up to his eyeballs, whether he wants to be or not--and he won't want to be. And there are a couple of major characters and at least three or four minor characters I can see taking a hand in what's going on.
I know at least the main elements of what happens during that time. Though I haven't thought out details, since I was planning on skipping it. I've already thought of at least one possible subplot that would involve an old enemy who's already been defeated once.
As for the last book (whether it turns out to be three or four), it starts just as everything stabilizes. A new enemy (actually an old one from book one) threatens to overturn the applecart again and MC has to respond. He's in a unique position to take this problem on and find the solution.
My question is: Is the idea of a story mostly built around the disintegration of a (small) empire and the system that supported it and the creation of a new system and new alliances very interesting? It will necessarily be a very different kind of story than the first and last. The second book is already different than the first in some ways, though.
I suppose the answer may be that I need to write it anyway, at least in draft, so that I really know what happened in the interim. How much time and effort I invest in subplots and such may depend on whether I think it's going anywhere, though.
posted
I think it's pretty rare to see a series where between one book and another you have several years passing. A lot of a reader's connection with a character will be broken by how he's changed in those unwritten years, while the reader wasn't brought along to see it.
A simple solution would be to shorten the timeline. There's a few years of turmoil and then things come to a head? Why not make it a few months? Show him scrambling while the world disintegrates around him and chaos reigns, until finally we get to the final dilemma.
A lot of inconsistencies in plot can be solved by shuffling around how long things are taking. Case in point: the Lord of the Rings movies. In the books it's taking them days and weeks to get anywhere. In the movies the plot can't take the luxury of such gaps in action, so Minas Tirith is a few hours away from the Black Gate, it only takes a few minutes to retreat from Osgiliath to Minas Tirith, Frodo and Sam are are stumbling around the plains of Gorgoroth for an hour or so, etc.
posted
Based on your expanded description, I'd guess its almost begging to be written, or at least sketched out to make sure its worth it.
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quote:A simple solution would be to shorten the timeline. There's a few years of turmoil and then things come to a head? Why not make it a few months? Show him scrambling while the world disintegrates around him and chaos reigns, until finally we get to the final dilemma.
I did look at shortening the timeline in one of the prior incarnations of The Ignored Prophecy. The thing is, I have to drop a sub plot I really like for the last book, if I shorten the timeline. It just won't work. Plus, things just naturally fall into place better with this timeline.
It's a series, not a trilogy, so there's nothing against making it four books, if there's enough story. MC is going to be in a position to help keep order during the transition and willy-nilly be a part of the new order. So, I suppose I should show how he got there.
posted
I guess there's no problem with just summarizing months worth of events. I've seen plenty of books that have months pass between chapters, times when there's no action worth telling of. As long as the reader knows the time has passed and nothing of interest has happened it doesn't really matter.
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posted
I think Natej11 made a good point, that the reader may want to see the character's development across those years and might feel disconnected if they weren't allowed to watch him reach his new position. On the other hand, I think it would be fun for the reader if the last book seems to be set in a "new" world. It could be a lot like starting a completely new story and discovering the world for the first time. I think having a book showing the transition may take some of that milieu component away from the last book. Just something to think about.
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posted
I think you should at least consider writing it. If books 1 and 2 are good readers will follow you for book 3. You'll have earned it. Even if it is different, some people may find it's their favourite yet.
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posted
Another idea to throw into the mix: Write book 3 as originally intended, and perhaps close the main character's story with that volume. When the first series is completed and published, fans and consequently publisher may demand more, and you can easily reward them with a new standalone book set in that political struggle - one that adds to the milieu, perhaps follows new characters in parallel with your original work, perhaps hints and offers perspective to the machinations of the original books' MC. So in the meantime you don't need to worry about it, but you've got a promising bit of IP on which you can build further works later. Posts: 921 | Registered: Nov 2008
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posted
Did a little brainstorming on this tonight.
So far, I've got a conflict between former allies that may lead to war. The birth of a rogue city/state (which will actually help the plot in the last book). A breakdown in trade possibly leading to bread riots. Smugglers and bandits. A crisis in religion. A spy. Relationships and marriages blooming and breaking up. And the MC in the middle of most of it, trying to hold things together when he'd rather be doing almost anything else.
And that's in about an hour.
I think there just might possibly be a story in there.
posted
Since the question of theme was raised in another post of mine:
The overarching theme of all (probably) four books is alienation. If you have to pretend to be something you're not in order to belong, do you really belong at all? That will appear in all four books, but most strongly in the last, where the MC ultimately will have to decide that in some sense he really can't go home again.
The first book (The Shaman's Curse) has some of that theme, but the stronger theme is the futility of revenge. That vengeance is a pursuit more likely to harm the pursuer than the pursued. The alienation theme in this one is more about the MC accepting himself than about how others percieve him. That comes later.
I have to thank extrinsic for bringing this up in the Dreamer's Rose thread, because it made me realize that I have almost lost the first theme in Book Two (The Ignored Prophecy). It was stronger in earlier versions. I'll have to go back and work on that. I don't think it has a secondary theme. Possibly another weakness.
Book Three (Untitled) will have a strong secondary theme regarding responsibility. Almost the Spiderman theme: With great power comes great responsibility. Or, better: All that is necessary for evil to prevail is for good men to do nothing.
What now looks like being Book Four (also Untitled) will have the first theme (alienation) and the last (responsibility) interwoven. Accepting responsibility will force the MC to "come out" (not that way) and either be accepted for what he really is--or not.
[This message has been edited by Meredith (edited August 03, 2009).]
posted
Perhaps don't be too quick to write in more thematic elements? I have read (can't speak from experience) that authors are often surprised by the themes readers pick up on in their work. You may already have covered the bases on this one without realizing it. What do your readers say?
BTW I want to read your stuff; this series sounds great! Someday, when I'm not trying to get my own novel up and limping again...
[This message has been edited by MrsBrown (edited August 05, 2009).]
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