I'd like your opinion about whther or not you'd be interested in reading on with this as the first 13 lines.

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No one had expected it. After all, it had been twelve long years. Certainly nobody expected it to happen at a sword school. But it did.

The sword school was made up of four connected rectangular buildings that were roofed with red tile and built around a courtyard. In that courtyard, six dark-haired, dusky-skinned students practiced their sword work. The slap of sandal against paving stone and the clack of wood striking wood echoed briefly off the school's white-washed stone walls before dissipating into the darkening sky above.

Five of the students were young men varying in age from eleven to twenty, but one was a young woman who was seventeen. Though not all of the students intended to become mercenaries,

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I'm not normally given to writing prologues or cinimatic pull-ins, but it fits this story. The prologue is 844 words, and the omnscient view lasts for 4 short paragraphs (180 words). My non-writer readers loved the prologue, but some aspiring writers felt I should get rid of the omnscient part. I wanted to get a wider range of opinion on this one. Thanks.

The sword school was made up of four connected rectangular buildings [AT THIS POINT I'VE LOST INTEREST. I DON'T CARE ABOUT THE SHAPE OF THE BUILDINGS; I WANT TO KNOW WHAT YOU WERE TALKING ABOUT IN PARAGRAPH 1.] that were roofed with red tile and built around a courtyard. In that courtyard, six dark-haired, dusky-skinned students practiced their sword work. The slap of sandal against paving stone and the clack of wood striking wood echoed briefly off the school's white-washed stone walls before dissipating into the darkening sky above.

Five of the students were young men varying in age from eleven to twenty, but one was a young woman who was seventeen. Though not all of the students intended to become mercenaries, [I DON'T HAVE A REASON TO KEEP READING: WATCHING OTHER PEOPLE STUDY JUST ISN'T THAT INTERESTING, AND THE COOL THING THAT WOULD MAKE ME WANT TO READ YOUR STORY, I HAVE NO INFORMATION ABOUT.]

No one had expected it. What? After all, it had been twelve long years Since what? . Certainly nobody expected it to happen at a sword school. What? But it did. What? Now so completely annoyed and frustrated that it goes in the round file.

The sword school was made up of four connected rectangular buildings that were roofed with red tile and built around a courtyard. I don't care yet about the layout. I might have forgiven the first paragraph for withholding if you were telling me something now. Alas, no luck. In that courtyard, six dark-haired, dusky-skinned students practiced their sword work. who are they? Who is the POV? The slap of sandal against paving stone and the clack of wood striking wood echoed briefly off the school's white-washed stone walls before dissipating into the darkening sky above. This entire paragraph is cinematic

Five of the students were young men varying in age from eleven to twenty, but one was a young woman who was seventeen. Wait did an important bit of information slip in? One of them is a 17 year old girl? Though not all of the students intended to become mercenaries, Naw, must not have been important, we are on to something else

The advantage of a prologue is that you get a short glimpse of generally an action scene that: (1) is out of time from the main story; and (2) informs the main plot. You aren't using your advantage.

Don't be tricked into thinking that being mysterious about what IT is can be a hook. It's not. Just tell me.

Stephen Horn has a great prologue in Law of Gravity . It's about a page. It's a legal thriller. There is a description of a body falling off a building.
It ends with:

The medical examiner crouched and pointed. "Look at that," he said shaking his head. "I tell you, there's no justice."

And that's it. It takes most of the book to figure out how that scene - the detective visualizing the woman's fall from the building and the ME's comment - fits into the rest.

If you are going to use a prologue - drop me right into the action. Starting with exposition is deadly.

Assuming seventeen-year-old girl is the MC:

Babbler, your review helped me see exactly why the more standardized opening I've written is the better one--your expectations of what happens next are way off. Thanks for the help.

I.E. = In Example.

But, I do babble.

No one had expected it (#1). After all, it (#2) had been twelve long years. Certainly nobody expected it (#3) to happen at a sword school. But it(#4) did.

"it"s #1 and 3 and 4 seem to refer to an event while "it" #2 refers to a passage of time, totally different thing and that is somewhat distracting as you have them lined up.

I think the first it works okay, but #3 and 4 really could give some slight hint about the nature of the #1 it.

No one had expected it. After all, twelve years is long enough to forget most things. Certainly nobody expected (the same accident to occur twice, especially) to happen at a sword school. But one fair day it did.

Crude, but you see what I'm getting at?

and,

Five of the students were young men varying in age from eleven to twenty, but one was a young woman who was seventeen. Though not all of the students intended to become mercenaries,

It seems to me that you could start the later paragraph with the business about the mercenaries and then go to the girl, rather than list the boys, then the girl and THEN the general statement.

Babbler, I realize that you were giving an example rather than trying to guess what came next. What I meant was that you made me realize that the opening IS too vague. The reader has no idea what comes next, and a great variety of things could come next. I was too close the material. I felt that I had given a strong hint of what to expect so was confused by those who said I was coyly withholding information with it. That was never my intention. Let's see if this new opening gives enough information.

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The throne of Santor had lain empty for twelve years. After so much time, no one expected that to change. Certainly no one expected the next ruler to be a chosen from a sword school for orphans--but she was.

The sword school was made up of four connected rectangular buildings that were roofed with red tile and built around a courtyard. In that courtyard, six dark-haired, dusky-skinned students practiced their sword work. The slap of sandal against paving stone and the clack of wood striking wood echoed briefly off the school’s white-washed stone walls before dissipating into the darkening sky above.

Five of the students were young men varying in age from eleven to twenty, but one was a young woman of seventeen.

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Does this provide enough information to hook you? What questions do you expect to be answered in the rest of the prologue based on this new opening? For that matter, what do you think the prologue is about? I'm trying to determine if I gave enough information to build the right anticipation and have a strong enough hook to get people to read the prologue.

However, now I have a whole new line of questions:

ps IB, we don't need to know her name yet.

Babbler, thanks, those are the questions I thought would be brought up. As we discussed via e-mail, only one of those questions ('how are rulers chosen') is answered in the prologue since it's so short. The other two are answered or begin to be answered in chapter 1.

wbriggs, you might not be interested in the school layout, but knowing how it's layed out is important in understanding what comes next. So it stays. However, I have cut two sentences from the 'omni viewpoint' paragraphs in consideration of the impatient people like you. Serrica's intro still doesn't quite make it in the first 13 lines, but it would make the first page of an actual mass market paperback. Hopefully it's enough since I'm not willing to change it more. (By the way, Serrica wanted to make you Lord Wbriggs over the Robot Monkeys, but I warned her that the Monkeys have flawed programming and might get out of hand. )

arriki, it's funny, but you seem to think the same things I do. I was already considering dropping the 'but she was' since it's not really needed and gives the surprise away. Most people already guessed that the sole female was the MC, so I left it in, but I've been wanting to drop that bit ever since I posted it.

The audience that reads the book to learn who the next monarch will be?

Or the audience that is intrigued by a girl in a predominantly male sword-school who is destined to become a queen?

Serrica is chosen as Queen by the end of my short prologue. The point of the prologue is to give the reader a sense of what her life was like before she became Queen (which explains why she acts as she does later) and to show how she was chosen as Queen. Chapter 1 starts seven months later with her having a frustrating day at the palace. You know, frustrating in the sense of highly unhelpful high ministers and an assassination attempt against her. The story is mainly about her v.s. her lords/ministers and her determination to bring the bad ministers/lords to justice while she's on the run for her life. More or less. Chapter one has it's own hook.

Since anyone reading the back cover of the book will know who's going to be chosen as ruler and that this is not a 'girl studying at a sword school' story, it seems a bit ridiculous to spend much more time worrying over three little words. I guess that's what we do best in F&F, though.

It's boring after an interesting bit before.
Now, the big question is WHY is it boring?

The sword school was made up of four connected rectangular buildings that were roofed with red tile and built around a courtyard.

This is just not interesting description. My suggestions to pump it up -- just suggestions, mind you

Name the school. Be specific about the buildings. Give them interesting characteristics.
The largest was the dormitory, Old Hardcase, with floors of cold stone and straw beds the rats burrowed through.
Not probably one of your buildings but it gives a flavor to the description whereas -- to me -- yours is just a plain list. Yes, my way would put more verbiage between the opening and the plot but you could use the descriptions to show the reader stuff, stuff that colors the reader's impressions of the setting and what the characters he meets in the next paragraph have to face.

Is that making any sense?
You see, for me, your buildings don't give me a picture of the place. Not of any specific place. Red tile roofs doesn't do much. Four buildings with a central courtyard. Bland.

Built with a glacis still around and chunks of wall showing repairs from cannon fire twenty years ago.

Put some color in maybe people won't complain about the description.

I was just reading Christopher Buckley's new novel, BOOMSDAY. He started a section with a description of the house one of the main characters lived in. Totally description, but interesting. It gave a flavor to the story. He said it was a Federalist style and had been home to -- list of people -- and ended with a real twist of a woman who had had affairs with a king of england, Haile Sellassi (sp?) and listed several others -- affairs with all of them at the same time. She died of exhaustion he says int he last sentence of the paragraph.

And the students practicing – (as an example)

The day was heavily overcast. The stone gargoyles on the buildings surrounding the courtyard stared even more ominously down at the five students practicing parry, spin and lunge with their swords. It had been two hours and the straw man attacking them from behind still hadn’t died. The pig’s bladder filled with water that he had in place of a heart remained intact.

“You’re moving him too fast,” complained one of the students.
“No faster, m’lad, than if it were me sneaking up on you.”

The new first thirteen is still a bit rough, but I'm impatient and want to see if I'm going in the right direction. It's not at all what you described, arriki, but I shuffled things around a bit and changed a few things.

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The throne of Santor had lain empty for twelve years. After so long, no one expected that to change. Certainly no one expected the next ruler to be chosen from a sword school for orphans--but she was.

Classes had ended an hour earlier, and laughter and good-natured ribbing filled the air as those who remained outside practiced the craft they loved. Six dark-haired, dusky-skinned students practiced their sword work in a courtyard surrounded by the single-story school building. The slap of sandal against paving stone and the clack of wood striking wood echoed briefly off the white-washed stone walls before dissipating past the red tile roof into the darkening sky above.

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The next sentence is the "five students...ages..." one. The sentence after that introduces my MC in action. Any better?

You addressed the things I was noticing in the drafts as I read the whole thread at once. Arriki and I share some similar observations, though she (assumption) articulated them better than I was able to. Yes, the stone building description dragged me down in the first few versions. Too bland, I suppose. I find myself in this trap a lot - I want to quickly paint the setting for my reader, so I just revert to short fact-based physical descriptions. Arriki's examples and ideas were great, cannon holes, perfect! Course I'm more into space stories, not so much on the cannon holes, but I'll find something similar.

So, nice work, and I learned a lot from this thread.

1. Throw out the second "stone" in your last sentence so it reads "...the white-washed walls..." so that "stone" doesn't sound too repetitive.

Thanks, Zero, for telling me what you particularly liked.

Of course, thanks again to Arriki for making this "celebration party" possible.

gooeypenguin, I'll take your comments into account when I do my last 'smoothing' of the lines in a day or two. Thanks.