Hatrack River Writers Workshop   
my profile login | search | faq | forum home

  next oldest topic   next newest topic
» Hatrack River Writers Workshop » Forums » Fragments and Feedback for Books » Virgin Sacrifice

   
Author Topic: Virgin Sacrifice
lehollis
Member
Member # 2883

 - posted      Profile for lehollis   Email lehollis         Edit/Delete Post 
This is a fantasy. I have about 20,000 words written so far. The planned total will be 100,000 or so.

I'm not looking for readers just yet, but I will be soon.

Mostly, I want to know:

- Hooked?
- Problems or questions left open?
- Too little emotion / too much information?

But any feedback at all is welcome.

*************************
Hanna, the avatar of the sun goddess Kalvesh, was first to see the plume of dust drifting into the sky above the canyon. She stood on her temple balcony watching it progress toward the city, knowing only one thing could cause such a dust cloud--an army. She had last seen the eastern sky filled with dust like this before when her father, the commander of the army, left to invade the barbarian Haan to the north.

"What is it, Holiness?" her servant Miriam asked.

Now Hanna could see a second plume, farther back and larger than the first. Two armies, she thought, and her grip on the stone balcony wall tightened. "Commander Barash has returned," she said. "But something is wrong. I think he has brought the Haan back with him."
*************************

[This message has been edited by lehollis (edited June 14, 2007).]

[This message has been edited by lehollis (edited June 14, 2007).]


Posts: 696 | Registered: Sep 2005  |  IP: Logged | Report this post to a Moderator
Marzo
Member
Member # 5495

 - posted      Profile for Marzo   Email Marzo         Edit/Delete Post 

I can't find anything to nitpick about this! For me, it was clear, straightforward, and cleanly written.

You let us know:
-Who the MC is, or at least who one of the major MCs will be
-What her profession is
-2 of the other characters that will be involved (Miriam and Barash)
-A driving force of the novel (if not the driving force), inter-territorial conflict of some sort

And, the final line neatly hooked me. It makes me want to know who the heck this Barash is that he's brought back the enemy army, and how things have changed amongst the Haan that he can do this. Are they coming willingly? Are they hostages? Or is it perhaps the Haan who are bringing Barash's army back?

These are all good questions to put in a reader's mind!

I'd say, well done, and on its own I wouldn't change it. In the greater context of the work it might require adjustment later, but as it is as a first 13, I'd be content with it.

Good luck! :)


Posts: 201 | Registered: May 2007  |  IP: Logged | Report this post to a Moderator
Antinomy
Member
Member # 5136

 - posted      Profile for Antinomy   Email Antinomy         Edit/Delete Post 
Frankly, I could not get past the first 8 words: Hanna, avatar, sun goddess, Kalvesh --maybe too many nouns too soon causing me to think about them. IMHO a lot of this can be said later and the opening sentence simplified just a bit in order to smoothly seduce the reader.
Posts: 147 | Registered: Mar 2007  |  IP: Logged | Report this post to a Moderator
Wolfe_boy
Member
Member # 5456

 - posted      Profile for Wolfe_boy   Email Wolfe_boy         Edit/Delete Post 
I'm going to give this a hefty thumbs up.

I disagree with Marzo - the first sentence is clear to me even though it carries a wealth of information. There is a hook here for me - the fact that a Goddess is present and active in the world, and that she is made nervous by an approaching army - this is not an ordinary army, if it hopes to take down a Goddess. There are hints of a deeper history and mythology that I'm interested in, and that will keep me reading as much as the hook.

The only quibbles I would have are with particular wording. Let me digress...

quote:
...knowing only one thing could cause such a dust cloud--an army. She had last seen the eastern sky filled with dust like this before when her father, the commander of the army, left to invade the barbarian Haan to the north.

This is redundant. remove an army, because the meaning behind the dust cloud is much more effectively relayed by the line referencing her father.

quote:
"What is it, Holiness?" her servant Miriam asked.

I personally find her servant Miriam asked to be cumbersome. Possibly work Miriam's name into Hanna's dialogue in the next paragraph, or find another way of working it in. Other than those two nitpicks... it's good. Very good. If you can sustain this for 100K, congrats.

Jayson Merryfield


Posts: 733 | Registered: Apr 2007  |  IP: Logged | Report this post to a Moderator
InarticulateBabbler
Member
Member # 4849

 - posted      Profile for InarticulateBabbler   Email InarticulateBabbler         Edit/Delete Post 
My take:

quote:

Hanna, the avatar of the sun goddess Kalvesh, was first to see the plume of dust drifting into the sky above the canyon. She stood on her temple balcony watching it progress toward the city[. She knew of only one thing could cause such a dust cloud--an army. She had last seen the eastern sky filled with dust like this before[,] when her father, the commander of the army, left to invade the [barbarian Haan<--this sounds like ONE barbarian, maybe ad something like nation of between the words] [to the north<--this should be -- IMHO -- just the word northern before the word barbarian].

"What is it, Holiness?" her servant Miriam asked.

Now Hanna could see a second plume, farther back and [larger<--this seems wrong to the perspective. Usually, thing further back are smaller -- even if they are ACTUALLY larger in reality.] than the first. Two armies, she thought,[Is this clarivoyance, or is she guessing? Why would an army send everybody at once? Most commanders or generals would send scouts in or an advanced party.] and her grip on the stone balcony wall tightened. "Commander Barash has returned," she said. "But something is wrong. I think he has brought the Haan back with him."


Overall, I like it. I would read on, were this cleaned up a bit.

The first paragraph is more of an info-dump. Of course, it's free, but you could immerse in her PoV and make it richer from the start.


Posts: 3687 | Registered: Jan 2007  |  IP: Logged | Report this post to a Moderator
Hunter
Member
Member # 4991

 - posted      Profile for Hunter   Email Hunter         Edit/Delete Post 
Overall seemed good. I stumbled a little on, "the avatar of the sun goddess Kalvesh". Like InarticulateBabbler says, this is sort of an info dump, also avatar has saturated the web so much that seeing the word used here makes me groan a little. I'd prefer priestess to avatar, though if she is a true avatar, ignore me. Or maybe save mention of the avatar thing 'til I've gotten to know the character a little more.

I don't know if you need to pluralize Haan as suggested. I get that it's a group without trouble. Haans sounds a little strange anyway. The only other group I can think of that doesn't pluralize their name is the Foot from Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtles or possibly the Mafia or the Navy.

Good luck with the rest of it.

ETA: You may want to differentiate you names more--Hanna and Haan are pretty similiar. Using them both close together in the text is going to sound and look confusing.

[This message has been edited by Hunter (edited June 14, 2007).]


Posts: 83 | Registered: Feb 2007  |  IP: Logged | Report this post to a Moderator
InarticulateBabbler
Member
Member # 4849

 - posted      Profile for InarticulateBabbler   Email InarticulateBabbler         Edit/Delete Post 
Lol - the Foot is really the Foot Clan, the latter part being the plural.

And, I wasn't suggesting to add an "s". I was suggesting:
She had last seen the eastern filled with dust before, when her father -- the commander of the (nation's name) army -- left to invade the barbarian nation of Haan.

Just to clear that up...

[This message has been edited by InarticulateBabbler (edited June 14, 2007).]


Posts: 3687 | Registered: Jan 2007  |  IP: Logged | Report this post to a Moderator
lehollis
Member
Member # 2883

 - posted      Profile for lehollis   Email lehollis         Edit/Delete Post 
Thanks to everyone for the feedback. I've used many of the suggestions. Others, I am still pondering--or pondering how to best implement.

Concerning the phrase in the first sentence, "...the avatar of the goddess Kalvesh..." Can that be omitted entirely? Or should it be worked in more smoothly somewhere in the 1-13? I think it can wait until the second page, myself

Here is the revision without that phrase at all:

**********
Hanna was first to see the plume of dust drifting into the sky above the canyon. She stood on her temple balcony watching it progress toward the city, knowing only one thing could cause such a dust cloud. She had last seen the eastern sky filled with dust like this before, when her father, the commander of the army, left to invade the northern barbarians. Was this his triumphant return?

"What is it, Holiness?" asked Mira, her servant.

Now Hanna saw a second plume. It was farther back, but even larger than the first. Two armies, she thought, and her grip on the stone balcony wall tightened. "My father has returned," she said. "But something is wrong. I think he has brought the barbarians back with him."
*************


Also, for kicks, I tried a different approach. It's more rough because I didn't go over it as close. Is it better? Which one would you choose?


*************
Hanna watched the two dust clouds approach the holy city from her temple balcony. She pondered what it could mean.

"What is it," asked her servant, Mira. Like all of Hanna's servants, Mira was blind. For no mortal could see the flesh of the avatar and live.

"Soldiers, I think," Hanna said. "Two large groups."

"Your father has returned from the invasion?"

"If so, it did not go well," Hanna said. "But even my father is not so stupid as to let them chase him back to the holy city. He knows the high priest won't open the gate for him."

"Unless you order them to be opened?"

Hanna's lips pursed. She didn't want to make that decision.
She could see the first soldiers now. They rode hard towards the.....
***********************


P.S. I hope it's okay to post two acceptable to post two possible openings to see which is liked better. If not, I will remove the second.


Posts: 696 | Registered: Sep 2005  |  IP: Logged | Report this post to a Moderator
Marzo
Member
Member # 5495

 - posted      Profile for Marzo   Email Marzo         Edit/Delete Post 

The only thing I liked about the alternate beginnings - the second one, specifically - is that I learn her servant is blind. I think that's a cool detail. But, admittedly probably not one for the first 13, if we're focusing on plopping down a sense of the conflict.

For me, the very first opening you posted is still the most effective.


Posts: 201 | Registered: May 2007  |  IP: Logged | Report this post to a Moderator
darklight
Member
Member # 5213

 - posted      Profile for darklight   Email darklight         Edit/Delete Post 
I like the second one the best (the first of the two re-writes). Its much better with the description of who Hanna is.

The only thing I would suggest is this:

quote:
She stood on her temple balcony watching it progress toward the city, knowing only one thing could cause such a dust cloud.

I would split this into two sentances, for example: She stood on her temple balcony and watched it progress toward the city. She knew only one thing could cause such a dust cloud.

Leaving the avatar of the sun goddess Kalvesh until later wouldn't be a problem for me.

Otherwise, its very good.

[This message has been edited by darklight (edited June 15, 2007).]


Posts: 626 | Registered: Mar 2007  |  IP: Logged | Report this post to a Moderator
kings_falcon
Member
Member # 3261

 - posted      Profile for kings_falcon   Email kings_falcon         Edit/Delete Post 
Okay, the problem with posting two approaches is comments go everywhere. Try to pick and choose what works for you.

Personally, I'd combine the two versions you have now. I liked most of first paragraph of the "first" never version but dialog better in the "second" new version.

Something like:

Hanna , the sun goddess' advatar saw a plume of dust drifting into the sky above the canyon. does it matter if she's the first? How does she know she's the first? She stood on her temple balcony watching the cloud progress toward the city. The last time the eastern sky had filled with dust was when her father, the commander of the army, left to invade the Haan nation. You can tell me in a few lines that they are barbarians but give me a name here Was this his triumphant return?
Then Hanna saw the second plume, farther back and larger than the first.
"What is it?" asked Mira you tell me she's blind in the next line . Like all of Hanna's servants, Mira was blind for no mortal could see the flesh of the avatar and live.
"Soldiers," Hanna said. "Two large groups."
"Your father has returned from the invasion?"
"If so, it did not go well," Hanna said. "But even my father is not so stupid as to let the barbarians chase him to the holy city. The high priest won't open the gate for him."
"Unless you order them to be opened?"
Hanna's lips pursed. She didn't want to make that decision.
She could see the first soldiers now. They rode hard towards the.....

It's a bit more than 13 now but you can trim the extra words and get all this into the first 13.


Somehow you are going to have to reword/re-write so you don't say "dust" (cloud/plume/ filled with) three times in three sentances.

The nice thing about the second version is the "telling" is In the Dialog but no one is saying things that they would take for granted. Mira can't see the clouds but she can sense Hanna is upset. The conversation between them is natural although Mira doesn't have a servant's deference. I suspect that the familiar relationship gets explored later and can wait for it.

I HATE the "knowing only one thing could cause . . . " because more than one thing could.


Posts: 1210 | Registered: Feb 2006  |  IP: Logged | Report this post to a Moderator
InarticulateBabbler
Member
Member # 4849

 - posted      Profile for InarticulateBabbler   Email InarticulateBabbler         Edit/Delete Post 
I think you should finish the story. If you only concentrate on the first thirteen, you'll drive yourself nuts, and won't get it finished.

Now, that having been said:

I agree with kings_falcon in that a combination of the three would probably be best.

1) If she is too holy to gaze upon, why is she standing outside for all to see?

2) How does a blind servant do her duties?

3) Why would a barbarian army chase another army to their home? Most barbarian armies, throughout history, are at best tentatively bound. Usually, they are made up of tribes and/or clans, that only unite to drive a greater evil from their lands. (Or what they perceive as a greater evil.)

When you are using an Avatar -- a god's form on earth, not just his/her vassal -- there is the opportunity to use full-omni, and know what is in the minds of all he/she surveys. This is why I don't write these types, it's difficult to accomplish smoothly.

[This message has been edited by InarticulateBabbler (edited June 15, 2007).]


Posts: 3687 | Registered: Jan 2007  |  IP: Logged | Report this post to a Moderator
   

   Close Topic   Feature Topic   Move Topic   Delete Topic next oldest topic   next newest topic
 - Printer-friendly view of this topic
Hop To:


Contact Us | Hatrack River Home Page

Copyright © 2008 Hatrack River Enterprises Inc. All rights reserved.
Reproduction in whole or in part without permission is prohibited.


Powered by Infopop Corporation
UBB.classic™ 6.7.2