The sky-scrapers bent down with demonic gleams in their windows, begging and chanting for new skin. It was the flesh of men they desired; the insatiated passion for glory seen when they franticly thumbed between pages of sweltering hot newspapers. A glass door opened, and one of the bodies came out.

John was only 20 years old, but he had lost his venomous urges. He stood on the street corner waiting for the right time to cross through traffic. A park with grey trees and blue benches waited on the other side. He had a gun in his vest; he kept drawing his arm close to his side – making sure it was still there and hadn’t slipped out. The traffic light turned green and he crossed. A woman carrying a cardboard box with six kittens in it passed him, going the other way. He walked into the park and took a seat next to a yellow garbage can. He removed the gun from his vest and placed it in his lap.

Everyone within four blocks’ radius heard the shot. John had a hole in his chest but nothing came out. As he fell off the bench, some who were close heard words escaping his throat in the brief moment before his finality. Some heard “where am I,” others heard “nothing there.”

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[This message has been edited by rogozhin (edited February 27, 2004).]

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[This message has been edited by rogozhin (edited February 28, 2004).]

[This message has been edited by rogozhin (edited February 28, 2004).]

[This message has been edited by rogozhin (edited February 28, 2004).]

quote:

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He walked into the park and took a seat next to a yellow garbage can. He removed the gun from his vest and placed it in his lap.

Everyone within four blocks’ radius heard the shot. John had a hole in his head but nothing came out. As he fell off the bench, some who were close heard words escaping his throat in that brief moment before his finality. Some heard “where am I,” others heard “nothing there.”

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That part hooks me. I would read on to find out what happened after that. I'd want to know who this guy was and why he killed himself.

There are 2 parts I don't believe.

1)It's a nice idea and intriguing that a dying man would say something before he gives up the ghost. But it's not realistic. A man who shoots himself in the head is dead. Instantly. Now, if someone saw him and tried to stop him so the bullet didn't go right through his brain...that'd be a better set up for his 'final words'.

2)He just shot himself in the head and nothing came out? I'm not into blood guts and gore but honestly...that's not realistic. Cut the sentence or somewhere, somehow, tell us why 'nothing came out'.

The beginning also needs some work. What's with the demonic buildings? If you're trying to create some symbolism then you need to spend more time describing them. More than two sentences Otherwise it'd just weird me out.

On the other hand, I think most readers would not be too concerned with these exceptions, and perhaps rather rely on familiar scenes dramatically depicted in movies that they might all ready have in mind.

I think that you want to have the 'demonic buildings' as indicative of John's POV. Recast it to lose the ambiguity by introducing John as the POV first, and having him see the buildings that way.

"their brail-like tension seen..." introduces two sources of confusion, first an unclear use of 'their' to refer to something other than the 'they' immediately preceeding it, and then the use of brail, which is not a common word and doesn't seem to be used well here in any case. I'm barely able to tell a brail from any other sheet, and I've done a fair amount of sailing (okay, that's an exaggeration, but not a huge one). Besides, most of the time the brails aren't particularly tense...or tense at all compared to the other sheets on a sailboat.

The last paragraph isn't in John's POV and couldn't conveniently be cast in his POV with the information you provide. This highlights another problem that isn't huge if this is going to be more of a prologue deal (which it should be) but would be huge for a short story (which this isn't).

Perhaps this is the wrong kind of forum to post this type of material. I enjoy reading science fiction, and enjoy Card's writing very much - but this peice is not of the same genre.

Is it pretty much a given that the writing posted here is fantasy or sci fi?

[This message has been edited by rogozhin (edited February 27, 2004).]

However, I do agree with Survivor about the caliber of the weapon. A .22 cal. bullet has been known to bounce around a human body and never exit, (Pres. Reagan for instance). But a point blank shot to the head with a .357, .38, .44 or 9mm or shotgun for example would most likely cause a gory mess (Curt Cobain). I do know that a shot to the head is not always fatal, but with larger caliber handguns, permanent damage(of some sort) is uaually the case, depending upon the entry and exit sites.

I am unsure how the first paragraph ties into the next two, and I agree with Christine on her point about that.

quote:

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With a strong tendancy towards S.F.

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Clearly this opening isn't supposed to make literal sense--not even in the most fantastic fantasy do sky-scrapers literally bend down with demonic gleams in their windows and beg for new skin (well, I recall something of that sort happening in one of the Ghostbuster movies--but it isn't the norm).

But at least the sentences have to make some sense, otherwise the reader will have no confidence that anything you say is supposed to do more than sound interesting.

What emotion or image is "braille-like tension" supposed to convey? Right now, it just seems like nonsense. Are we supposed to have the idea that people that read Braille do so under enormous strain? Well, I didn't have that idea...I'm not sure anyone does, except maybe people that are just learning to read Braille and are under a lot of pressure to do it quickly (which seems like an unusual case).

Look, we're getting off the subject. This subject material may have some interesting potential, I simply don't know. Go back to my first post.

As far as the POV, I really don't think its a problem. I can't see any benifit from changing it to John's. In fact, if the POV was from John's, I think it would alienate the reader when he kills himself.
Besides, John as a character is almost entirely inconsequential, I don't think his POV really matters.

I want the reader to be slightly uncomfortable with the narrator. Not enough to be repelled, but just enough to highten a level of mystique and intrigue. Not from the events that happen or what is said necessarily, but merely but how the story is told.

I really don't know if that makes much sense, or if it is important - maybe it should be changed.
I will think about it.

For me personally, a narrator is either repellent or interesting, pretty much a bright line distinction (I include uninteresting narrators as being repellent). Several things can make a narrator interesting to me.

First and foremost, the narrator can be highly intelligent. A large vocabulary doesn't count, unless the words are all used correctly or only used incorrectly purposefully (meaning, for a definite--usually humorous--purpose). If the narrator has intelligible and intelligent things to say, particularly original ideas, then that hooks me quickly.

Secondly, the narrator might be virtuous. If the narrator seems like a person that I would like to have around in real life because of his or her good moral qualities, then this encourages me to read. I put this second because it is more important to me personally that a narrator be intelligent than virtuous...after all, I can actually benefit from the intelligence of the intelligent narrator and can only imagine benefiting from the courage or compassion or whatnot of the virtuous narrator. And writing a virtuous narrator is much harder than writing an intelligent narrator, since really virtuous people don't narrate events with an ongoing protestation of virtue. But they do narrate things a certain way, and it is an attractive viewpoint.

Third, and this is sort of a weird catagory, I enjoy (and I'm not proud of this) narrators that feed one or more of my predatory instincts. The most obvious is the narrator that is clearly a pothead...who gives the reader the same pleasure as partygoers derive from the drunken clown. Some other examples would be; the fanatical idealist, the sexually exploitable ingenue (or harlot for some), the pompous fool, etc. Basically, the kind of person you would like to meet for the purpose of a little harmless evil But I generally avoid seeking out or indulging myself in narrators of this class, because the tendency to do that is...well, evil.

Narrators can be any combination of the three, of course (though either or both of the first combined with the third is still an appeal to the reader's evil side). But a narrator that is none of the above is not going to interest me very much. Add it up for yourself. If the narrator is dull or incohate, depraved, and not even good sport, then why on Earth would I be interested?

But let me see if I can phrase it in my own voice in case it helps. I read the new version of your intro and I have to say that it was a different experience. You cleaned upa little of the language I had trouble with the first time, that was good, but it is still missing something.

And then I realized that at the end there was a certain amount of shock value in the only character (and therefore the main character) killin himself. BUT, other than that the passage was empty. I do not know your main character, he is a faceless man who took his own life for reasons beyond my ability to either know or empathize with. You use poetic language to try to turn up the heat, which may work in literary circles but if you want real people ot read your story they want to know what you're saying, not spend hours interpretting what they think you're saying. Real people do appreciate depth, but not strange wordings that seem a little forced.

- Have I really written something that appeals to the potential evilness inside my would-be readers? I don't think so. I like to think I am not evil myself, and neither do I believe that 'evilness' exists in all of us. Sin, yes - with the potential to lead one into evil acts and thoughts, but sin alone does not automatically dictate evilness.

But I guess this is not a forum on theology!

But I find her logic on the point a little sloppy...I mean, surely it would be possible for her to agree with me about some things, yet disagree with my stated belief that the world will end...right?

Rog, I don't know whether your story will have evil tendencies, and I wasn't saying it did. I'm saying that one workable method to create an interesting narrator is to appeal to your readers' evil instincts...but it's kind of an evil method.

Right now you have a worse problem (as a writer, not as a person) than concern over being 'evil'...your narrator isn't particularly interesting. Taken as a narrative voice rather than an unsuccessful attempt at POV, your text is incohate. It doesn't promise any particular virtue, and it isn't even fun to mock (but remember, making something so bad it's 'good' is bad).

Remember, there is a difference between making readers think and forcing them to guess. You're forcing the reader to guess...and you aren't promising much in the way of reward.

"Oh look, a slot machine! But wait, it has a coin slot, and a handle, and the little spinny things, but I don't see any payout tray. Hmmm...maybe not today."

Don't ever put yourself in the position of a required text (even if you're actually writing a required text, I would advise against writing that way). Don't write something that people will only read if they're forced to read it.