Hatrack River Writers Workshop   
my profile login | search | faq | forum home

  next oldest topic   next newest topic
» Hatrack River Writers Workshop » Forums » Open Discussions About Writing » here's a question...

   
Author Topic: here's a question...
kwsni
Member
Member # 970

 - posted      Profile for kwsni   Email kwsni         Edit/Delete Post 
ok, here's a question for all of you technilogically knowlegeable people.

I'm writing a story set in the near future on earth (the next century or so). The world weather is rapidly detiriorating(sp?), due to pollution, global warming, and loss of ozone.Governments have sent up weather sattelites to try to control it.

What I want to know is if this is even possible, whether it would work, and to what extent.

thanks for your help.
Ni!


Posts: 177 | Registered: Mar 2001  | Report this post to a Moderator
Kathleen Dalton Woodbury
Administrator
Member # 59

 - posted      Profile for Kathleen Dalton Woodbury   Email Kathleen Dalton Woodbury         Edit/Delete Post 
deteriorating

There are already weather satellites up there tracking storms and such.

What would your weather satellites do?

I think that first you have to come up with something for them to do to reverse the problems you're talking about.

For example, to replenish the ozone layer, you could have satellites that would send bolts of electricity (lightning) into the upper atmosphere (I leave it to you to find out why that would produce ozone).

What kind of pollution are you talking about, and what has caused it? It might be cheaper (weather-changing satellites would be very expensive--really a last resort) to try to prevent the pollution and reverse it from the earth's surface. How would you reverse pollution from space?

Do you know all the causes for global warming and what could be done here to slow it down and maybe even reverse it without an expensive satellite?

(You see, the ozone-creating satellites are the only ones I think might even be feasible, and the logistices of that system would be a challenge even so.)

If you really need the satellites for your story, it might be better if you only concentrated on the ozone-creating ones?

Anyway, I hope this helps. The point is, you have to be sure you know what exactly the problem is that you want to fix and how your satellites would be used to fix it (and that satellites would be the best way to do it).

If they're not the best way, but you really want them for your story, then you have to come up with circumstances that force them to be the best way.

The things in your story have to make sense. You have to convince your readers that this is the way it has to be, or your story won't work.


Posts: 8826 | Registered: A Long Time Ago!  | Report this post to a Moderator
chad_parish
Member
Member # 1155

 - posted      Profile for chad_parish   Email chad_parish         Edit/Delete Post 
I don't think using "lightning" would work well -- you would need lot. I've not worked out the math, but trillions of strokes might not be enough.

Also, lighting jumps because there is a potential between the ground and the cloud; it would be hard to build a potential between the atmosphere in general and a rapidly moving tiny object far above it.

Third, lightning jumps fairly easily because the "breakdown potential" of air is only on the order of ~1M volts. I'm not sure if sparks can be sent through vacuum like this.

Perhaps: use high-altitude, long endurance aircraft flying in formation and strike sparks between them. Run a superconduting wire between the craft, too. If you keep shooting spark from A to B, eventually B gets such a huge charge it repels any nearby flow. The wire completes the circuit. (This is why non-conductive samples are so hard to image in a scanning electron microscope: they quickly charge to the same potential as the beam.)

Here's my suggestion: Dump fine dust into the stratosphere (or higher?). Nuclear-winter-like cooling.

Use lunar regolith (soil), grind it into a powder of the proper size, and lob it to your space stations in LEO. (This shipping is cheap -- all downhill). The space stations are bases for satellites, or small shuttles servicing the sats, etcs. They refill the sats with ground regolith.

Good problems to inflict upon characters:
-how to keep the dust in the air, instead of setteling, etc.
-dust blocks the light plants need for photosynthesis (sp?)
-if a ship, satellite, etc., spills its load, the cloud of dust will immolate any nearby spaceships, etc, as they pass through it at orbital velocities.
-dust in the stratosphere might (might! I've not done the math) chew up reentering space craft.
-raindrops, etc, nucleate on dust particles. More dust might make clouds, rain, etc, easier. Less humidity is needed. (Note: global warming will increase evaporation of water, increasing global humidity. It'll be damn rainy! See _World Building, by Gillett)

Feel free to email questions, or inform m of mistakes.

[This message has been edited by chad_parish (edited June 14, 2001).]

[This message has been edited by chad_parish (edited June 14, 2001).]

[This message has been edited by chad_parish (edited June 14, 2001).]


Posts: 187 | Registered: Jun 2001  | Report this post to a Moderator
kwsni
Member
Member # 970

 - posted      Profile for kwsni   Email kwsni         Edit/Delete Post 
I'm still working the story out in my head...I don't have anything down on paper yet, so there is room for me to change...

I'm gonna have to look at this closer, and figure something out. thanks!

Ni!

[This message has been edited by kwsni (edited June 14, 2001).]


Posts: 177 | Registered: Mar 2001  | Report this post to a Moderator
Doc Brown
Member
Member # 1118

 - posted      Profile for Doc Brown   Email Doc Brown         Edit/Delete Post 
I am confused. By "controlling it," do you mean solving the global problems, or just controlling local weather?

Arthur C. Clarke had sattelites micromanaging the weather in "The Fountains of Paradise." They used powerful lasers to create a warm front here or there, preventing violent storms and bringing rain to places that needed it. They literally controlled the weather all over the Earth, all the time. It was sheduled like programs on television.

The idea seemed implausible to me, but it was just a side element to the story.

A bunch of really enormous orbitting mirrors could do all sort of things to the climate. In theory they could put extra light and heat on cold places or cast shadows over places that got too much heat or radiation. This could lead to even greater disasters, or humor, depending on how the system was managed.

It would probably be a lot cheaper and easier to repair the atmosphere than to build space mirrors hundreds of miles across . . . but big mirrors could be fun. A society that would choose such an unwieldy and expensive solution might make for a good black comedy.


Posts: 976 | Registered: May 2001  | Report this post to a Moderator
srhowen
Member
Member # 462

 - posted      Profile for srhowen   Email srhowen         Edit/Delete Post 
Highlander Two had a weather control shield of some sort that was the basis for much of the plot--I don't think it was ever quite explained though the idea was that thigns had become so bad, from the very things you listed that something drastic had to be done. Life under the shield was not very fun.

You may want ot see if you can find out the idea behind that shield.

Shawn


Posts: 1019 | Registered: Apr 2000  | Report this post to a Moderator
JP Carney
Member
Member # 894

 - posted      Profile for JP Carney   Email JP Carney         Edit/Delete Post 
For the record, Highlander II was a terrible movie and perhaps one of the worst sequels ever to be made, and I never got any real sense of what the atmosphere shield was all about -- but heck, I may not remember simply because I thought the movie was so bad, I blocked out all the details.

But hey, if you can sit through the flick with attention focused on how the shield was supposed to work and why, and it gives you ideas for your story, go for it. Just don't expect much of anything else.

[This message has been edited by JP Carney (edited June 14, 2001).]


Posts: 151 | Registered: Feb 2001  | Report this post to a Moderator
srhowen
Member
Member # 462

 - posted      Profile for srhowen   Email srhowen         Edit/Delete Post 
I never said the movie was good. It was just one place where I remembered they had shield.

Shawn


Posts: 1019 | Registered: Apr 2000  | Report this post to a Moderator
JP Carney
Member
Member # 894

 - posted      Profile for JP Carney   Email JP Carney         Edit/Delete Post 
Shawn, I never would have assumed otherwise.

The way I look at it is this...you probably saw it because you are a fan of the first, and no one who's seen the first before the second could possibly think itwas any good at all (I suppose there are a few out there who could have seen the second movie first, liked it, and don't like the first because it "didn't jive") . I just make that assumption right off the top, so you were never in any danger of being labeled a fan of Highlander 2.

I was merely wanting to warn Ni that the movie smells of elderberries.

Ciao!

[This message has been edited by JP Carney (edited June 15, 2001).]

[This message has been edited by JP Carney (edited June 15, 2001).]


Posts: 151 | Registered: Feb 2001  | Report this post to a Moderator
srhowen
Member
Member # 462

 - posted      Profile for srhowen   Email srhowen         Edit/Delete Post 
LOL it was bad though wasn't it? My husband never fails to say hey that realy sucked--even if we walk past it in a video store.

It just didn't fit---

Shawn


Posts: 1019 | Registered: Apr 2000  | Report this post to a Moderator
JK
Member
Member # 654

 - posted      Profile for JK   Email JK         Edit/Delete Post 
There was never an explanation of the shield in Highlander ", not even a Trek-ish one ("it's all to do with ion reverse-polarisation, Captain!"). It was that bad.
Although some of the dialogue between Connor and Rameirez (SP?) was okay. And Highlander 3 wasn't too bad, though a bit of a 1 rehash.
Anyway, shifting back to kwsni's question. I believe that satellites would be a very difficult thing to use in turning Earth back into a sunny beach of fun. A lot of the causes for pollution, global warming, etc. come from the ground, and so the solutions would probably come from there too. Removal of greenhouse gases (slight, not fatal) would slow the greenhouse effect, and reinstating any ozone would definitely have to come from the ground. chad had some really good points which almost seem so techy I felt a need to accept them without thinking about it first! The nuclear-winter thing sounds too unpredictable; we don't want a dinosauroid fate facing us (and think of the asthma sufferers!)
I wonder if I've helped any...
JK

Posts: 503 | Registered: Sep 2000  | Report this post to a Moderator
chad_parish
Member
Member # 1155

 - posted      Profile for chad_parish   Email chad_parish         Edit/Delete Post 
Yeah... it would be very difficult to control the dust; think of it as a measure of last resort. As Doc Brown said, "black comedy." The government would certainly be in charge; therefore, screwups are guaranteed.

As for Highlander 2: it was fantasy, not SF. As such, I liked it. Certainly, however, not to be taken seriously!

However: "space mirrors" (Doc Brown, above) might not be too hard. They're weightless -- so you can make them very thin, and light. Speculations for solar-sail ships involve Texas-sized sails weighing (correction: massing) practically nothing. Microns -- perhaps just molecules -- thick.

Of course, the easiest way to make our planet a garden spot -- while improving the standard of living -- is to put all our industry in orbit or on the moon. I'd like one ticket to Vesta Mining Base, please!
(See _The Third Industrial Revolution_, by Stine. Published in the 70's, a little dated, but still right-on.)

Also: this occured to me after my first post. Lightning might produce chemicals other than ozone. Nitrogen oxides (NOx, x=1 or 2), if formed, would eat the remaining ozone alive, I think. (Anybody remember?) That would be a good way to kill everybody off, I suppose.

[This message has been edited by chad_parish (edited June 18, 2001).]


Posts: 187 | Registered: Jun 2001  | Report this post to a Moderator
   

   Close Topic   Feature Topic   Move Topic   Delete Topic next oldest topic   next newest topic
 - Printer-friendly view of this topic
Hop To:


Contact Us | Hatrack River Home Page

Copyright © 2008 Hatrack River Enterprises Inc. All rights reserved.
Reproduction in whole or in part without permission is prohibited.


Powered by Infopop Corporation
UBB.classic™ 6.7.2