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My son recieved a posable Han Solo action figure for his birthday. While peeling it out of its box for him to play with (and yes, ruining its collector's value) I noticed the similarities between the outfit worn by Han Solo and Captain Mal Reynolds of Firefly/Serenity. In fact I doubt that their action figures could be told apart, except for the weapons they are given.
That got me thinking, comparing the crew of the Millenial Falcon with the Crew/Passengers of Serenity.
Mal=Han Inara=Princes Leia Jayne=Chewbacca Kaylee=R2D2 Simon=C3PO River=Luke Book=Obi Wan Kenobi
And the villian The Operative = Darth Vader The Alliance = The Empire The Sandman = The Reavers
The only one that didn't fit smoothly was Wash, a bit too playful for Lando (Lando's more like the Mr. Universe). He reminds me most of the lead Ewok.
Then again not.
Compare those two lists above and consider, for just a moment, what the first Star Wars film, or all of the Star Wars films would have been like had the Characters from Serenity, in all their adult depth, been used instead.
I did and it gave me a Star-Wargasm.
How much better the dialogue, the depth, the story.
Are these just a selection of stereotypes that Whedon fleshed out better than Lucas?
Did Whedon purposefully take the Star Wars gang and add his own self (in the form of Wash) into the mix? If so what does this signify about Wash's death?
Is "Serenity" just that, a retelling of "Star Wars Episode IV" or perhaps a symbolic retelling of the entire Star Wars IV-VI with the symbolic death of the Empire/Alliance at the end, including Darth Vader/The Operatives unmasking and moving on?
Anyone want to write the Star Wars script, as performed by the cast of Firefly?
Posts: 11895 | Registered: Apr 2002
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One of the easy ways to describe Firefly, back in the day, was to tell people it was like Star Wars if it had been about Han Solo instead of Luke Skywalker.
Posts: 7790 | Registered: Aug 2000
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I think Leia, Inara and Zoe would have more in common as a team. Leia is Han's love interest, but she's a rebel and a fighter before she's a lover. In that, she's much more like Zoe.
I like both the dialogues. Quite frankly Firefly is what I imagine Star Wars would be if they had lost to the Empire. It's also a bit of what I imagine Star Wars would be like if it had been a series and not a movie. Movies have certain limitations of fleshing out characters that tv shows most assuredly do not.
I'd love to see more Firefly, hell, I'd LOVE to see a Star Wars show based on a young Han Solo. Maybe AC Crispin could get a pilot together.
Posts: 21898 | Registered: Nov 2004
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If Zoe and Wash were combined into one, you would get the same combo if you combined Lando Calrissian and Wedge Antilles. Minus the whole married and sex thing.
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Obviously every main character from Firefly and Serenty was fleshed out better, more believably, and more artistically than even the main characters of any Star Wars film.
To be fair, though, Joss Whedon was working on the foundations George Lucas helped to create. Standing on the shoulders, so to speak. Just because I think he's a better writer and creator on his worst day of a crack binge than George Lucas on his best day doesn't change that Posts: 17164 | Registered: Jun 2001
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quote:Originally posted by Chris Bridges: One of the easy ways to describe Firefly, back in the day, was to tell people it was like Star Wars if it had been about Han Solo instead of Luke Skywalker.
While this may be true, it obviously shows the influence on Serenity by SW, the tradition from wence it sprang. I have trouble with these backwards associations because we lose focus on the creative climate in which SW was made and released. Ironically, Serenity might have made a killing at the box office if it HADN'T been for the SW culture, which became such a cult that geek-fandom scares alot of moviegoers away from space/frontier sci-fi.
Posts: 9912 | Registered: Nov 2005
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I have to say, I am angered that you would compare Jayne to Chewbacca. He's stronger, better with a gun, and has a much better vocabulary! Not that I dislike Jayne, of course... Posts: 3852 | Registered: Feb 2002
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Aw Lisa you beat me to it! I was going to post that link.
Orincoro, without Star Wars, it's entirely possible Joss Whedon would be working at a Burger King right now.
Posts: 21898 | Registered: Nov 2004
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Without Star Wars, Trekkies would run free. Unchecked fandom, running amok, with only the LotR nerds to counter the balance.
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Without Star Wars, the original pilot for Battlestar Galactica would have been a feature film, and would have easily filled the gap in a Star Wars-less world.
What I remember from when BSG first came out, it was originally planned as a feature film. It was changed because of Star Wars. They didn't think there was room for two major SF epics in the theaters in a single year.
A lot of people, particularly younger ones, can't imagine the utter dearth of SF movies that weren't schlocky B movies back then. We were lucky if we'd get a decent one every few years. Logan's Run was a huge treat when it came out. Star Wars was miraculous. But any good SF on the screen would have been just as wonderful.
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Anyway... I don't think Star Wars and Firefly can really be compared -- sure the characters and setting are similar (kind of...) but the whole overall feeling and the intention of the filmmakers is/was totally different.
George Lucas was like "Let's make an awesome movie with spaceships and robots! and...oh, well I guess we need some characters here...ok here's some random people that will work...oh, and we need a plot....ok well let's have this happen...that will hold it together. ummm...so, space ships and robots!!!"
Joss Whedon was like, "I wonder what would happen if humanity lived in a galaxy in stead of a planet?" and then he created a world that was as accurate as possible to what he thought (based on our world now) the future in such a situation would be like. And he knew the most important part of the story was the characters, and spent most of his time working them.
If you can get past that difference then MAYBE we can talk about the possible similarities...
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Put you have to admit, some of those scenes would be hillarious and much more deeply moving with these replacements.
(Mal would definately have shot first. Jayne 2nd, third, and fourth.)
Instead of R2 and C3PO going their separate ways in the desert, imagine the tiff between Kaylee and Simon. SImon being just as big a jerk as C3PO. I just love this idea and wish I had the time to write it out.
Posts: 11895 | Registered: Apr 2002
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Alright SOME of this I can avoid, but I can't avoid:
quote:George Lucas was like "Let's make an awesome movie with spaceships and robots! and...oh, well I guess we need some characters here...ok here's some random people that will work...oh, and we need a plot....ok well let's have this happen...that will hold it together. ummm...so, space ships and robots!!!"
I'm not going to get into it, only to be shouted down by the Lucaphobes, but you're horribly wrong. Sure, the man likes his space battles and robots, though there were relatively few space ships in the original trilogy, actually, Firefly takes place more in space than Star Wars does, but that wasn't the original foundation. He pulled his influences and ideas from Kurosawa, Campbell, his own mind, and put it all together rather spectacularly. And he brought his own technical flare to it. Movies wouldn't look much like they do today if not for the strides he's personally overseen over time.
I'm not in love with the man, I think he's actually rather horrible at script writing, but I'm just sick of him so constantly being attacked that I feel a need to defend him. I'm not of the opinion that just anything scifiish would have filled the existing hole that would have been there without Star Wars, not that NOTHING could have, but don't underrate or underappreciate the influence.
Joss Whedon deserves the praise he gets. I don't think Lucas deserves the primarily, vehemently neative attention he gets. Not even half of it.
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The best way to describe Firefly/Serenity is "A space western like Star Wars, except done well."
Posts: 317 | Registered: Feb 2005
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quote:He pulled his influences and ideas from Kurosawa, Campbell, his own mind, and put it all together rather spectacularly.
I loved the original three movies, and I have to agree with Lyr here. Lucas stood on the backs of giants and saw farther than anyone had until that point. He created a modern mythology that will still be talked about twenty, thirty, even likely a hundred years from now. The original trilogy of the story of Luke will be around a loooong time, because it resonates with the same power of the story of Arthur, Odysseus, etc.
quote:Movies wouldn't look much like they do today if not for the strides he's personally overseen over time.
This is unfortunately true, as well. As great as Star Wars was, it showed Hollywood that there was as much or more money to be made from merchandise than there was from the film itself.
It also changed the way films were paced, with SW throwing in a "kick in the butt" every ten minutes or so. Movies like the Godfather or Apocalypse now, with longer drawn out characterization and mood sequences, became far more rare.
Lucas deserves praise, but for his early work far more than his later work.
Posts: 3960 | Registered: Jul 2001
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See, Pun, Star Wars was done well. And it wasn't ever meant to be a space western. And putting Eps 4 or 5 against Serenity, they still hold up remarkably well for movies made nearly 30 years ago.
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Zoe is a mix of Lando and Wedge in one, just like Wash is a mix of Lando and Wedge. Zoe's character fulfills more of a Wedge persona, and Wash fulfills more of a Lando persona. But Zoe will occassionally have a hint of Lando, and Wash will occassionally have a hint of Wedge. Which tastes of lemon.
Posts: 9754 | Registered: Jul 2002
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Star Wars was THE AWESOME SCI FI MOVIE. It IS an awesome sci fi movie...but it's awesome because George Lucas was one of the first to make such a movie, a movie taking place in outer space, with all the cool technology.
Firefly is great because of its characters, and because of how realistic is it. (Yes, it is realistic, despite taking place 3000 years in the future).
Star Wars is great because of something completely different....therefore, the two can't be compared.
But matching up the characters is always fun. Like, Jayne=Chewbacca. Posts: 464 | Registered: Jul 2004
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quote:Originally posted by Dan_raven: Everybody likes Jayne=Chewbacca. Nobody likes Simon=C3PO?
Ok. Simon occasionally shows backbone, and may be useful, but still--their even both lanky.
Are you kidding? Simon actually is quite toned, if not buff. Go watch the end of serenity or the last episode of Firefly, you see Simon with a shirt off. He is definately vising the gym.
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If you HAD to pick a Star Wars equal to Simon, the obvious choice is C3PO, but the fact that I LIKE Simon as a character makes the comparison painful to me. Posts: 464 | Registered: Jul 2004
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Could Wash be Talon Karrde? I haven't read the Zahn books in a *long* time, but if Zoe=Mara then Wash=Karrde?
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