posted
My husband, Abhi, is apparently getting his wisdom teeth in a bit later in life. And he's in a lot of pain from it, which makes us worried that one or more of them may be impacted or otherwise coming in wrong, despite a family history of no problems.
I had my wisdom teeth come in perfectly when I was 17, with just a little pain - I just wanted to put pressure on the gum and chew things a little. But, then, I have a freakishly high tolerance for pain, while Abhi is pretty sensitive. Right now he doesn't have dental insurance, although we can get some relatively quickly. Would rather not do that if possible, though, since, you know, it costs money.
So how painful was it for you guys to have your teeth come in? Anyone have experiences of having them erupt out of position or impacted?
Also, feel free to share horror stories of getting them out as well, a la pH's thread. I eventually had to get mine taken out, since I literally didn't have enough room in my mouth for four more teeth. It was a pretty easy procedure for me - I just slept most of the next two days, and then was fine.
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posted
Mine are still coming in. It is extremely painful, moreso for the ones that are coming in the wrong way.
I really need to get them taken out, but have no insurance. I've been meaning to look into getting on the list for a dental school, but I have so many allergies and other conditions that could cause serious complications I'm kind of scared to let students operate on me.
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As you mentioned ( ), mine were very, very painful coming out. What I was told though was that if they need to come out (you might want to get an X-ray to see if there is any infection or other potential problems), it's better to do it sooner because later, it will be even worse. I think I got totally ripped off by my first dentist, but the surgeon who did the second procedure charged me next to nothing, so I'm not sure exactly how much of a bill you'd be looking at.
posted
Looks like getting them removed at the UCLA School of Dentistry would be about $360, plus $300-ish for anesthesia.
Ick.
And USC doesn't list a fee schedule but charges $80 for a consultation and x-rays. Hmmm.
If I check out local oral surgeons' fee schedules, I bet they will be similar, if not worse, though. And I can see the value of having it done somewhere with world-renowned people on hand as opposed to the local surgeon who is probably good but doesn't have as much "backup" available...
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I had one wisdom tooth come in last year. I remember it being a pain initially, but once it was out the pain went away. I found it odd though that the dentist didn't even mention it when I came in the next time (since it came in in between visits).
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There have been a few threads on this topic, as well as the aftermath of getting them pulled out.
Does ANYONE know why they are called "wisdom teeth?" I mean incisors and molars even, "12 year old molars" makes perfect sense. So why wisdom teeth?
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They're called wisdom teeth, I believe, because when you get them you are an adult. So like "two-year-old" and "twelve-year-old" molars, they are tied to a certain time in your life, a time when you are starting (generally) to develop "wisdom" (as opposed to the headstrong, heedless, wanton pleasure-seeking of youth, I guess.)
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quote:Originally posted by ketchupqueen: They're called wisdom teeth, I believe, because when you get them you are an adult. So like "two-year-old" and "twelve-year-old" molars, they are tied to a certain time in your life, a time when you are starting (generally) to develop "wisdom" (as opposed to the headstrong, heedless, wanton pleasure-seeking of youth, I guess.)
See that was my guess but I wonder if there is more too it then that.
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First time I knew I had them was when I went to get my teeth cleaned and the dental hygienist mentioned it. I never even noticed them coming in.
Then she tried (unsuccessfully) for about 15 minutes, on and off, to talk me into having them out. She said they were nothing but potential problems. I've heard that they used to remove tonsils and appendices for the same reason until it occurred to someone that taking things out just because they might someday cause a problem was a Dumb Idea.
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quote:Originally posted by Lisa: First time I knew I had them was when I went to get my teeth cleaned and the dental hygienist mentioned it. I never even noticed them coming in.
Then she tried (unsuccessfully) for about 15 minutes, on and off, to talk me into having them out. She said they were nothing but potential problems. I've heard that they used to remove tonsils and appendices for the same reason until it occurred to someone that taking things out just because they might someday cause a problem was a Dumb Idea.
My dentist found that one of my four wisdom teeth did not need to be pulled out and I asked he leave it alone because I had images of an 85 year old BlackBlade who might need all the teeth he can hold onto.
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quote:Originally posted by ketchupqueen: Looks like getting them removed at the UCLA School of Dentistry would be about $360, plus $300-ish for anesthesia.
Ick.
And USC doesn't list a fee schedule but charges $80 for a consultation and x-rays. Hmmm.
If I check out local oral surgeons' fee schedules, I bet they will be similar, if not worse, though. And I can see the value of having it done somewhere with world-renowned people on hand as opposed to the local surgeon who is probably good but doesn't have as much "backup" available...
Based on my experience, $80 for X-rays is standard. But $300 for anaesthesia? What kind? That sounds pretty cheap, if it's for general anaesthesia.
quote:Originally posted by Will B: Mine didn't hurt, but I knew they were going to mess up my dental work.
Yeah, that's why I had to get mine out - the upper ones were going to completely mess up the nice work braces had done on getting my teeth straight, and the oral surgeon wanted to take the bottom two out (which didn't have much room either) because he didn't want to have two teeth in which wouldn't have another tooth to push against or something like that. Weird dentist stuff.
ketchupqueen, I hadn't thought of dental school discounts, but now that you've brought it up, we'll look into that to see if they're much cheaper. Between Stanford, Berkeley, and UC San Francisco, we ought to be able to find something.
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posted
Mine are all impacted. And they really hurt.
But when the dentist took the x-ray, he said that they're really near a nerve, so if the surgery went wrong, I could have a numb lower face... and also
I have stupid teeth.
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quote:Originally posted by ketchupqueen: Looks like getting them removed at the UCLA School of Dentistry would be about $360, plus $300-ish for anesthesia.
Ick.
And USC doesn't list a fee schedule but charges $80 for a consultation and x-rays. Hmmm.
If I check out local oral surgeons' fee schedules, I bet they will be similar, if not worse, though. And I can see the value of having it done somewhere with world-renowned people on hand as opposed to the local surgeon who is probably good but doesn't have as much "backup" available...
Based on my experience, $80 for X-rays is standard. But $300 for anaesthesia? What kind? That sounds pretty cheap, if it's for general anaesthesia.
-pH
Yes, the $300 is for general. Because of complications I've had with several kinds of local and the severity of my problems, I'd bet they'd want to do general. Sedation can run considerably less.
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posted
I'm reminded of the story Feynman tells about the draft board. He's gone through all the physicals, and comes up to the psychologist. They do not get on well; Feynman quite accurately thinks that psychology is mumbo-jumbo, and (reading between the lines) he's in a bit of a hostile mood anyway from being poked at. So the shrink asks him "How much do you value life?" and Feynman replies "Seventy-eight". The shrink just blinks at him, and says "Seventy-eight what?", and Feynman comes back "You tell me! It's your stupid question, so it's up to you to have a unit for it!" (I paraphrase from memory, but you get the gist.) The point being, what unit do you suggest we use to measure the pain of wisdom teeth?
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posted
KoM, do you generally use present-tense verbs for dead people, or only for famous physicists? (My dad knew him personally. You may now grovel at my feet.)
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KoM, generally when speaking of pain, the unit is "a scale of one to ten, one being no pain and ten being the worst pain imaginable." At least, so I have ascertained the many times I've been asked that question at the hospital. (I got to a 9.5 when they were giving me 18 units of pitocin and no painkillers once...) In any case, the pain from the teeth coming through, I would put at a 7.5. Definite pain for me. The pain in my jaw as a result (TMJ, lovely stuff), I would put at about a 6.5.
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posted
I have no interest in trying to quantify pain with some artificial unit of measurement. What I will say is that my wisdom teeth make periodic attempts to come in, then give up after awhile and recede. It's never all of them at once, thankfully, because when it happens it hurts so bad I can't chew on the relevant side of my face.
Last time it happened, I almost made an appointment to get them taken out, but my mother told me that hers had done the same thing until she was about my age, and then they gave up altogether and never did come in. I'm hoping the same thing happens to me. . . .
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quote:Originally posted by rivka: KoM, do you generally use present-tense verbs for dead people, or only for famous physicists? (My dad knew him personally. You may now grovel at my feet.)
I use the present tense for authors, since their books are still available and saying things at any given time.
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posted
I cannot remember having them out, or every having any pain associated with my back teeth, and I have a screwed up mouth.
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Mine hurt like a sonofagun. Really really really bad. All four were impacted, caused infection to surrounding tissue, and erupted at the same time. My face swelled up a LOT before surgery, and I couldn't eat solids, but after surgery, I was back to normal.
Mine had to be removed. No quibbling over it. I had them removed on a holiday Monday because it was either that, or wait another two weeks to get in. But the surgeon did a fantastic job. I had only one very tiny bruise, which is excellent considering a. I bruise fairly easily and b. they had to smash 'em to bits to get 'em out.
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Mine never formed on the top and are currently growing in on the bottom. There's room for them and the teeth are healthy, so the dentist sees no reason to pull them out. Some days they hurt a bit, the ache you get whenever you have a molar coming in (though those days were long ago it seems) but nothing excruciating.
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I had no dental insurance when mine were giving me trouble, so I had to have them removed one at a time, as I saved money to pay for them. they only used local anesthetics, and only one was a problem - it was a bottom one that was impacted and required about four-five stitches. About halfway through the ordeal, the dentist said "I really should have sent you to an oral surgeon for this' Too late at that point,though.
It hurt, badly, and I had a bruise on my jaw that looked for all the world like I had been punched. A co-worker asked me if I needed the name of a battered women's shelter. Posts: 14428 | Registered: Aug 2001
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posted
I'm too old to remember my wisdom teeth coming in! Except for the last one, which was horizontally impacted and was never going to come in. It was growing straight towards the tooth next to it.
It made my mouth hurt. The dentist seemed to think this was just me being silly and it did not hurt and didn't need to come out. But once my mouth healed from the surgery (which was awful), that pain was gone and never came back, so if it wasn't caused by that impacted tooth then I don't know what on earth was causing it.
I made the oral surgeon knock me out for the surgery, and I'm so glad I did--when I heard how hard that thing was to get out of my jaw, I was very relieved that I hadn't been awake for all the hacking and yanking.
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My wisdom teeth hurt like the very devil, but nothing bucketloads of ibuprofen couldn't sort out.
I'm lucky in that by some woerd genetic quirk I only have three. Maybe a I just aren't that wise.
The SI unit for Pain is the Stubtoe (St). A splinter may be between 5 and 20 millistubtoes (mSt),whereas a corker of a migraine may reach 100 to 150St. Watching Married with Children while sober is measured as 4.5KSt...
Posts: 892 | Registered: Oct 2006
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umm yeah... i'm on a lot of ibuprofen right now. I don't know if i'm especially susceptible to pain, but it's been hurting like nothing I've experienced before... and I've had a few. [horror soccer stories anyone?]
I think it'd be easier if there was some sort of cut or bruise to go with it... it'd give me something to look at.
Anyway, as far as I can tell with my tongue and in the mirror, it's more or less in the right place... there's only one of them coming out... I'm exceeding the "safe" daily dose of ibuprofen by a cpl of pills, but still breathing.
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quote:Originally posted by rivka: KoM, do you generally use present-tense verbs for dead people, or only for famous physicists? (My dad knew him personally. You may now grovel at my feet.)
*grovel*
*grovel grovel*
KQ is that cost with or without health insurance?
(I ask because Tony and I pay about AU$350 each for full hospital and ancillary cover per year [my wisdom teeth were completely covered] - but I suspect health insurance is very much cheaper in Australia than it is in the US.)
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quote:Originally posted by King of Men: I use the present tense for authors, since their books are still available and saying things at any given time.
quote:KQ is that cost with or without health insurance?
(I ask because Tony and I pay about AU$350 each for full hospital and ancillary cover per year [my wisdom teeth were completely covered] - but I suspect health insurance is very much cheaper in Australia than it is in the US.)
That's the cost to patients. The dental school serves mostly the uninsured, because the only insurance I think they take is state insurance. That's why I'm looking into it-- the dental school keeps patient fees as low as they can and remain solvent, while many other places are in the habit of charging uninsured patients more, just because they can.
Dental insurance, for me, would be almost $200/mo. (last time we checked) and might or might not cover my wisdom teeth extractions (because they have already erupted.) Yay.
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Mine never came out, but after a routine visit and X-rays my dentist said they were turning the wrong way and encroaching upon my molars, so he suggested I get them out. I had IV sedation and don't remember a single thing of the procedure, which is good considering all four of my teeth were impacted. The recovery was fairly easy for me, aside from mild bruising and swelling on my face.
quote:Originally posted by ketchupqueen: And I can see the value of having it done somewhere with world-renowned people on hand as opposed to the local surgeon who is probably good but doesn't have as much "backup" available...
KQ, you bring up a good point. The only thing to keep in mind about the places you've mentioned before is the fact that when having anything done at a place affiliated with a School of Dentistry or any professional school in general means there is a pretty good chance of there being a student or resident working on you. If that doesn't bother you, I say go for it. If it does, a private practice oral surgeon may be another option.
By the way, I'm still in training myself, so the reason I say this is that some people don't understand the concept of "backup" you are talking about. Some patients are just difficult to convince that there is ALWAYS somebody there supervizing, and they aren't just being a "practice" object for students and residents. Besides, like you mentioned, it is cheaper to have some procedures done at academic institutions than it is in private practice.
posted
I've been to UCLA School of Dentistry before, for specialty TMJ treatment (which was not covered by my insurance.) The quality of care was excellent, and when there was a problem that the resident didn't know how to handle, he wasted no time calling in senior doctors to help.
I don't mind a resident working on me at all, especially because their stated policy in the Oral Surgery dept. is that a resident does the work with a senior oral surgeon standing by, ready to step in. Posts: 21182 | Registered: Sep 2004
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Your good attitude is much appreciated! It's never pleasant when the first thing the patient asks when I introduce myself is "will there be a REAL doctor helping you put me to sleep"? Luckily those situations are rare.
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Dark as Night-- one question, since you seem qualified to answer. Will they do it on a pregnant woman? (Just hypothetically.) What if she needs general anesthesia (suppose, hypothetically, that she has had bad reactions to IV sedation of a few types and is not to have the most common kinds ever again, so has been told that most similar procedures in the future will have to be done under general anesthesia?) Will it depend on what's happening and how urgently she needs them out?
(I'm not pregnant. I'm asking because, by the time we can afford it, I might be.)
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Dark as night, I may be more enlightened because I have a father who is a doctor and have had discussions with him about things he learned in his residency and how much training he had had before that and things, and it may also be because I have been to some of the premiere teaching hospitals in the area and the residents have always done excellent work. Posts: 21182 | Registered: Sep 2004
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KQ, sorry this is delayed. My computer is being SLOW today. To answer your question, I'm afraid I'll have to ask another. What types of bad reactions have you had to sedation? Was it an allergy to a particular drug, or did they tell you that for some reason you did not tolerate sedation well? (you can email me if you'd rather)We use some of the same drugs for IV sedation and general anesthesia, so if it's an issue of drugs (which I doubt from your description), appropriate adjustments can be made for general. If, hypothetically speaking, one did not do "well" under sedation, or preferred to be "out all the way", it's a different story.
General anesthesia is administered to pregnant women quite safely and quite frequently, when as I said before, appropriate adjustments are made and precautions taken. (Some drugs we simply avoid.) Pregnant women often have gallbladders and appendixes that need to be removed. Like you said, a lot of it depends on how urgent the procedure is and how badly it needs to be done.
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I've had paradoxical reactions to Versed and another that I can't remember the name of right now. Organic hallucinations for 4.5 hours with the Versed, among other things.
I was told never to have benzodiazipans (probably misspelling that) or one other class (that, again, I can't remember right now, I'd have to look it up) ever again.
I have safely and effectively had two epidurals during childbirth. I had no bad reactions to general anesthesia when I had it, either.
My other main fun thing when going in for procedures is that I'm allergic to rubbing alcohol, which is used almost everywhere. They have to put signs all over the room not to bring in any rubbing alcohol and keep a big bottle of betadyne by me, lol.
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quote:Originally posted by ketchupqueen: I've had paradoxical reactions to Versed and another that I can't remember the name of right now. Organic hallucinations for 4.5 hours with the Versed, among other things.
I was told never to have benzodiazipans (probably misspelling that) or one other class (that, again, I can't remember right now, I'd have to look it up) ever again.
I have safely and effectively had two epidurals during childbirth. I had no bad reactions to general anesthesia when I had it, either.
My other main fun thing when going in for procedures is that I'm allergic to rubbing alcohol, which is used almost everywhere. They have to put signs all over the room not to bring in any rubbing alcohol and keep a big bottle of betadyne by me, lol.
But of course because your immune system is so hyper defensive you NEVER get sick either right?.......right? Posts: 14316 | Registered: Jul 2005
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Hmm, bad reaction to Versed... That's unfortunate. Benzodiazepines are great amnestics, which is why they are used so frequently for IV sedation. Did they just stay away from Versed with your general anesthetics? There are many other drugs that can be used for sedation, though, aside from Versed. If the other drug you mentioned isn't called Propofol or Ketamine, I can't see why IV sedation is an improbability for you.
Sorry to hear about the alcohol. Let me venture a guess: latex is a NO also?
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Actually, latex is fine, so far. Although I've started itching and burning under... certain circumstances... and sometimes when using latex gloves while cleaning. So I'm thinking of getting tested for that allergy, too. (I have an annoying tendency of developing new allergies, at least one a year since I turned 18.)
Ketamine? I think it might be ketamine. I really ought to go find the paper that says what it is. I am not entirely sure what they used with the general anesthetic. I know for darned sure it wasn't something that made me hallucinate! All I remember is a mask and being scared, and then waking up and my eyes were too heavy to open for a minute, and I felt cold and heavy in my limbs, and then I was so sleepy that I would "blink" as I thought, and actually had fallen asleep for another hour or so. But once it wore off, not a bad experience.
I also had a bad reaction to... I want to say sodium pentethol? Something I took orally to relax me (not a sedative) before going in for my last dental procedure. Fun.
If you name a drug, you can probably find someone in my family who can't have it. We just do NOT tolerate most of them well.
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I have two of mine. The ones I let come in have not caused me pain, but the extraction of the other two was worse than the 25 hours of unmedicated back labour I had with my first.
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Wow, I am sorry to hear that. Ketamine sometimes can make people hallucinate, but then it is a very different drug of its own kind. I like using it though, because it definitely works great in certain situations. As for your general anesthetics, you most likely had some type of an inhalational agent (gas) and I would bet you've had propofol.
Sodium thiopental (pentothal) is not used very often these days, at least in the hospitals I've been at. As a matter of fact, I've only used it once, and that was for sheer experience sake. It is however a sedative, and doesn't come in oral form, so that probably was not what you took to relax before your dental procedure. That could have possibly been Valium (in the same benzodiazepine class as Versed), which may explain your bad reaction to it.
So, to wrap it up, KQ, you would be somewhat of an anesthetic challenge, but it doesn't mean that you couldn't have a good anesthetic experience. Believe me, you are not alone in this. Also, odd as it sounds, people like you, who've had bad reactions to different drugs used in anesthesia, present a refreshing possibility for creativity! If you were ever my patient, I would discuss your past anesthesia experiences and history with you at length and then present you with different possible options, suitable for the type of surgery. There are many ways to safely do what we do. Ultimately the choice of the anesthesia is between you and your anesthesia provider. I've done general for procedures that are usually done under local/sedation, just because the patient, having been presented with options, chose it. Same can be said for regional (spinal, epidural, etc.) That said, I hope your list of allergies doesn't keep growing and that your next anesthesia experience is better than the last. Posts: 155 | Registered: Jul 2006
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I'm sure it will be fine. And my last anesthesia experience was an epidural that let me feel NO PAIN but just enough sensation to push effectively and know when it was time. And the anesthesiologist even remembered not to use rubbing alcohol (unlike the first one.) I seriously wanted to buy the man dinner. Or chocolates. So I'm quite fond of my last anesthesia experience.
I was also told last time I discussed extraction of my wisdom teeth that they would prefer to go it under general if they did it because my TMJD is so severe and the impaction is so radical that they may have to dislocate or break my jaw to extract one of them, anyway. *winces*
And I'm told all the time that I'm a "fascinating case." I go in for something simple and they call their colleagues and residents to come see me. Posts: 21182 | Registered: Sep 2004
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Ah, now that you say that about your TMJ, it does make sense to do general. Either way, good luck. I hope it goes well. And look at it this way, Versed is generally avoided in pregnant women, so if hypothetically that was the case, a pregnant person with a previous bad reaction to it would be safe! Posts: 155 | Registered: Jul 2006
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), mine were very, very painful coming out. What I was told though was that if they need to come out (you might want to get an X-ray to see if there is any infection or other potential problems), it's better to do it sooner because later, it will be even worse. I think I got totally ripped off by my first dentist, but the surgeon who did the second procedure charged me next to nothing, so I'm not sure exactly how much of a bill you'd be looking at.![[Smile]](smile.gif)
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