Hatrack River Writers Workshop Post New Topic  Post A Reply
my profile login | register | search | faq | forum home

  next oldest topic   next newest topic
» Hatrack River Writers Workshop » Forums » Fragments and Feedback for Short Works » Working title: Instagram Killer (approx. 1200-1500 words)

   
Author Topic: Working title: Instagram Killer (approx. 1200-1500 words)
WarrenB
Member
Member # 10927

 - posted      Profile for WarrenB   Email WarrenB         Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote 
Title is way too on-the-nose, but does say what it's about. Sort of. This is something I scribbled as an amusement on New Year's Day – having spent some time with a few twenty-something Instagram fans the week before. It's in first draft and not quite finished. Any and all feedback welcome. If anyone wants to read the whole piece that should be possible in a week or so, once I have time to do a bit of tidying. (P.S. I have added the line breaks below -- in courier, 12pt, MS format, this is 13 lines.)

* * * * * * * * * * * * * * *
VERSION 1:

She was as plastic as a Kardashian, and twice as fake.

A dark curtain of hair swept down her back to brush the top of her ample ass. Impossible eyelashes grazed finely drawn brows. She posed and pouted, teal fingernails flashed a black AMEX card at a shirtless bartender.

She had to die.

I sidled up to the bar on rubber soles, the needle concealed in my loosely closed fist. Nearly there...

Her drinks arrived -- three bottles of Moët on a silver tray. Slumming it tonight. She waved her credit card like a wand over the console. A bright beep signaled payment received. An inch or two more…

The bartender turned to me, hand extended, thick tribal [line break]

************

VERSION 2:

I hated the bitch. She was plastic as a Kardashian, and twice as fake. Watching her felt like a dental abscess, a deep burn, ground glass in my eyes. She had to die.

A coal-black curtain of hair swept down her back to brush the top of her ample backside. Unlikely eyelashes grazed finely drawn brows. She posed and pouted, teal fingernails flashing a black AMEX card at the shirtless bartender, while a pretty boy in skinny jeans hovered nearby, ready to ferry drinks.

I sidled up to the bar on rubber soles, the needle concealed in my loosely closed fist. Nearly there...

Her drinks arrived -- three bottles of Moët on a shiny tray. Slumming it tonight. She waved her credit card like a [line break]

[ January 04, 2019, 12:10 AM: Message edited by: WarrenB ]

Posts: 70 | Registered: May 2018  |  IP: Logged | Report this post to a Moderator
MerlionEmrys
Member
Member # 11024

 - posted      Profile for MerlionEmrys   Email MerlionEmrys         Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote 
You had me at "shirtless bartender" [Wink]

Kidding, kidding.


Send it to me when it's ready.

Posts: 181 | Registered: Oct 2018  |  IP: Logged | Report this post to a Moderator
WarrenB
Member
Member # 10927

 - posted      Profile for WarrenB   Email WarrenB         Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote 
Thanks for the offer, MerlionEmrys! I'll see if any feedback is forthcoming then produce a second version. (Should come to you next week sometime.)
Posts: 70 | Registered: May 2018  |  IP: Logged | Report this post to a Moderator
WarrenB
Member
Member # 10927

 - posted      Profile for WarrenB   Email WarrenB         Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote 
Hmmm. Awoke this morning expecting grammatical butchery, etc. and found... none.

Slightly relieved, but mostly, a little disappointed. Perhaps it's a time zone thing? Or the fragment is just uninteresting? Or practically perfect, like Mary Poppins? (Absence of hysterically-laughing emoji cramps my style at this point.)

Anyway, just posting so that anyone willing to give it knows I'd still like feedback on these 13 lines. Have a good one. W.

Posts: 70 | Registered: May 2018  |  IP: Logged | Report this post to a Moderator
Meredith
Member
Member # 8368

 - posted      Profile for Meredith   Email Meredith         Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote 
I don't usually comment on first thirteens. There's just not enough there for me. But, since no one else has . . .

The only comment I would make is that the beginning is confusing. The first line would lead me to believe that this is a third-person narrative about "she", whoever she is. It's only in the fourth paragraph I discover that it's a first-person narrative in somebody else's POV entirely.

A sentence or two at the beginning in that first-person POV could alleviate that confusion.

Posts: 4565 | Registered: Dec 2008  |  IP: Logged | Report this post to a Moderator
extrinsic
Member
Member # 8019

 - posted      Profile for extrinsic   Email extrinsic         Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote 
An individual and a violence target.

Nope, no grammar and punctuation blast per moi.

Diction and syntax considerations, though. The viewpoint agonist's perceptions and thoughts somewhat imitate a noir hard-boiled cynic, mascule fatale, rogue operant in bleak and sleazy social situations. Consider all the way there and beyond, such that a satiric commentary about noir meat markets enhances appeal? Illustrations:

"She was as plastic as a Kardashian, and twice as fake."

//She was plastic as Kardashian, twice as phony.//

"A dark curtain of hair swept down her back to brush the top of her ample ass."

//Dark hair curtained down her back slope and flicked her bubble-ball ski jump.//

"shirtless bartender"

//naked chippendale bowtie//

"I sidled up to the bar on rubber soles, the needle concealed in my loosely closed fist."

//Barbital needle concealed in loose fist, gum rubber soles tread me up to the bar.// (First sentence or similar, maybe, to introduce viewpoint persona in first position?)

"Her drinks arrived -- three bottles of Moët on a silver tray."

//Her slut-lush glugs -- bowtie plopped three Moët magnums into frosted silver buckets.//

Plus similar diction and syntax for much of the rest and whole? Or similar or other and more, not purple, per se, though at the limit or beyond of ruthless internal sarcasm and emotional commentary about the victim that as much or more exposes the viewpoint agonist's personality?

The working title, yeah, telegraphs the dramatic movement, maybe the outcome, too. Probably a straightforward target selection, to stalk, to kill, or cop capture, minor problems interfere momentarily until the end of whatever outcome. Fifteen hundred or so words after all. "Instagram," though, strong appeal potentials, say if "Instagram Grazer," "Instagram Romance," "Instagram Barbituate," "Mass Instagram Opiate," or similar or other? And commentary about social media hazards and -- and -- corruption of meaningful in-person social interaction.

I might could read further as a somewhat engaged reader, left somewhat unengaged, though, by unsupported diction and syntax sophistication. I would be hopelessly engaged, though, if the diction and syntax showed forth exquisite personality traits of the "Barbital" stalker. Barbituate, GBH, opiate, atypical psychoactive, pentathol, etc.?

[ January 04, 2019, 12:29 AM: Message edited by: extrinsic ]

Posts: 5834 | Registered: Jun 2008  |  IP: Logged | Report this post to a Moderator
WarrenB
Member
Member # 10927

 - posted      Profile for WarrenB   Email WarrenB         Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote 
Thanks, Meredith - helpful. Agreed. A new version posted above, which tries to address the POV issue.
Posts: 70 | Registered: May 2018  |  IP: Logged | Report this post to a Moderator
WarrenB
Member
Member # 10927

 - posted      Profile for WarrenB   Email WarrenB         Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote 
Thanks, extrinsic -- thought provoking feedback, as ever. I'm not sure I can pull off the hardboiled thing... though it was in the back of my mind, as reference, if not aspiration.

Satire is the intent -- of a culture built on false (or, at least, heavily curated) reflections, and people's, often obsessive, attachment to them. Would be nice to add the layers you reference though -- i.e. "satiric commentary about noir".

The stalker is female -- and twenty-something -- so I need to think through her frame of reference a bit more to figure out how far I can push that angle without stretching credulity. But perhaps she's a hard-boiled crime novel buff...

Will certainly consider in next rewrite.

Posts: 70 | Registered: May 2018  |  IP: Logged | Report this post to a Moderator
Grumpy old guy
Member
Member # 9922

 - posted      Profile for Grumpy old guy   Email Grumpy old guy         Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote 
Too early to work, 5am and too hot to think clearly about prose. It's on tomorrow's to-do list, along with Emma.

Phil.

Posts: 1791 | Registered: Sep 2012  |  IP: Logged | Report this post to a Moderator
WarrenB
Member
Member # 10927

 - posted      Profile for WarrenB   Email WarrenB         Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote 
Cool. Thanks, Phil. I'll probably only go back to revisions at the weekend anyway -- it needs a little focused time which I am out of for today. Unseasonably chilly here at the moment -- should be around 35˚C, but hovering in the low 20s. I'm missing summer a bit, though not envying your 40˚ oven...
Posts: 70 | Registered: May 2018  |  IP: Logged | Report this post to a Moderator
Grumpy old guy
Member
Member # 9922

 - posted      Profile for Grumpy old guy   Email Grumpy old guy         Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote 
Remember, WarrenB, this is all about the words on the page, nothing else. It’s just my opinion and, unfortunately, neither fragment works for me; being essentially the same.

They are too busy with description and too light on character and motivation, “She had to die.” Why? Just who is the viewpoint character? That she wishes to kill the object of her disgust is obvious, she ‘tells’ us so. But, why? Is she a serial killer, or is she simply outraged by something this person has done, and her only solution is attempting to kill her?

Let’s look at the opening fragment:

A predator stalks her prey. That’s pretty much it. So, what does the reader need to know in order to understand what’s going on?

Does the reader need to know who the viewpoint character is? Well, not her name, or what she looks like. Anything else? Not really.

Does the reader need to know why she’s there? That all depends on how you want to time things but, is it absolutely necessary? Not really.

Does the reader need to know what the viewpoint character is feeling? Here we come to it. This is where character and motivation get their first introduction in my opinion. Is she nervous, or isn’t she?

If she is focused and totally intent on her prey; this would indicate she is no stranger to murder. And this would seem to indicate the reason she is there should be made clear right up front. If she is nervous, just how nervous, how many mistakes is she making? If this is the case, then revealing what is causing her nervousness, murder, may not be necessary right away. There is so much fuel for character development I’ll leave it all up to you. But I think you get where I’m coming from.

Hope this helps.

Phil.

Posts: 1791 | Registered: Sep 2012  |  IP: Logged | Report this post to a Moderator
WarrenB
Member
Member # 10927

 - posted      Profile for WarrenB   Email WarrenB         Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote 
Thanks, Phil. Right now my stalker/would-be murderer is bit of a cipher. And I agree: her feelings matter and they're largely missing right now (and not just from the first 13).

I also think my satirical/comedic intent (because the scenario is supposed to be funny -- and perhaps a bit sad) is not clear enough to me; there's fuzziness there, so diction and syntax aren't creating the desired effect.

Your comments about backstory are helpful. Has she done this before? And how often? I have suspicions, but not answers. And I need to better understand why she's sufficiently fixated on the Instagram starlet to want to off said starlet. Will think on it and on her -- and my -- motivation, and aim for a revision of the whole thing in the coming week.

(Aside: I finally, got my poetry collection back from its editor yesterday -- and that now needs revision too... Cutting dead wood, restructuring, another detailed copy edit, all the while searching for a title that serves... So, please bear with me if it takes a little longer to get this story to draft 2. Learning how to keep several narrative balls in the air at the moment.)

I'll post Version 3 of the fragment ASAP, once the whole story is more ready for critical review. Thanks again to all for your feedback.

Posts: 70 | Registered: May 2018  |  IP: Logged | Report this post to a Moderator
Jay Greenstein
Member
Member # 10615

 - posted      Profile for Jay Greenstein   Email Jay Greenstein         Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote 
quote:
She was as plastic as a Kardashian, and twice as fake.
In general, to provide necessary context, and place the reader on a self-guiding trail, they should know who they are, where they are in time and space, and what’s going on, which is why those three things should be addressed early in a scene, and reinforced as necessary. But here, we have none of them. The one observing is an unknown in all respects. The place and time are unknown. And, what happened to have made the protagonist react in this way is impossible to guess. So while the line is a slick turn of phrase it lacks context. You’ve provided effect—the protagonist’s reaction to viewing her (or knowing her…or something she did?)—before the cause of that reaction. Add to that, the reader may not be a fan of People Magazine, and so not be aware of the significance of the reference, and you have an opening line that I’m guessing might be where an acquiring editor would be reaching for the rejection sheet.

But suppose you rearrange it a bit and give the reader a view of what the protagonist is basing their judgment on. In other words, provide cause before effect.
quote:
I sidled up to the bar on rubber soles, the needle concealed in my loosely closed fist. Nearly there...
Again, I’m hampered by not knowing what kind of bar it is, where it is, or anything that would give a mental picture. But that said…

Why do we care that this unknown person has rubber soles? It seems meaningless to what’s happening. The location of the “needle” seems irrelevant, too, given that we don’t know if you mean a sewing needle or hypodermic (and what it contains). The fact that it can be concealed within a fist seems to indicate something other than a hypo. And who cares if it’s held loosly, chenched tightly, or...?
quote:
Her drinks arrived -- three bottles of Moët on a silver tray.
Is the material of the tray relevant to the story? Were it just a tray would the story change? And how can this person tell it’s silver, and not, say, silver plate, or chrome? Specifying it seems to give unneeded importance as something the reader must notice and remember. Remember, she ordered the drink, but probably didn't specify the material of the tray used to carry it. So that should be irrelevant to the unknown protsgonist. And it it's not relevant to that person, why does the reader care?

You’ve told the reader some externals of her appearance. But we know nothing about her, or the protagonist, that would hint at even what country they’re in, or the year. You refer to Moët as if every reader knows what it is, and how large the bottle is. Personally, my reaction is that if she plans to drink three full bottles of Champaign that night this mysterious unknown stalker has no need to kill her, she’s doing it nicely for him/her,

But all that aside, what hit me is that you’re thinking visually, and presenting a stream of consciousness focused on describing what the reader would see were they on the scene and knew what was going on. What’s missing is all trace of emotion and viewpoint. The writing is fact-based and author-centric, a nonfiction approach. Fiction’s goal is to entertain, an emotional goal. So the writing should be emotion-based and character centric.

The person with the needle has decided that this unknown woman must die. Why? Does s/he see it as a public service—ridding the world of her type? Is it because she reminds him/her of the Kardashians? Is s/he enraged by the woman’s appearance, or by something she did to him/her? How can I, as a reader, identify with our protagonist if all I get is a chronicle of events dictated as they happen, plus some odd references to pop culture?

To better understand my point you might want to take a look at this article on one way of providing a strong protagonist’s viewpoint.

Sorry my news isn’t better. I hope this helps.

Posts: 159 | Registered: Dec 2016  |  IP: Logged | Report this post to a Moderator
WarrenB
Member
Member # 10927

 - posted      Profile for WarrenB   Email WarrenB         Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote 
Thanks, Jay. And as usual, the news is fine: this is a first draft, so I'm unsurprised that it needs work.

Received and taken on board the feedback around viewpoint and emotion already. And I agree that it would be better to start with some movement.

Will be digging a bit more into the POV character's motivations this week, while fiddling with structure, and playing with diction and syntax to try to get the tone and feel of the piece closer-to-right. Hoping to share a new version by/at the weekend.

Thanks also for the link - I've seen it before, but will reread it before rewriting. I found Ingermanson's stuff really helpful early last year when I was first beginning to learn the language of story structure from yourself and other Hatrack regulars - it helped me feel less at sea at the time. So, worth revisiting now, especially since I've been focused on things other than prose fiction for several months.

Wishing you a good week. W.

Posts: 70 | Registered: May 2018  |  IP: Logged | Report this post to a Moderator
WarrenB
Member
Member # 10927

 - posted      Profile for WarrenB   Email WarrenB         Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote 
P.S. Just on the references to brands, celebrities, etc.

I have to assume some knowledge of global, and in particular US, pop culture. It's pretty ubiquitous -- and I'm sticking to people and brands that have very high public recognition: Kardashian, Moët et Chandon, Versace, etc.

If some readers don't at least know these names and a little about their 'aspirational' backstories, the story simply won't work for them as intended. (It'll just be an odd -- and hopefully, mildly amusing -- tale of a few failed murder attempts by an obsessive sociopath). Most satire lost, in other words.

I don't see a way around that, since the satire is focused on a particular cultural milieu and the social dynamics it produces... And this milieu is most efficiently referenced by the products it reveres (including celebrities). It's also a global phenomenon -- you can find the Kardashian clone in Johannesburg, Sydney, Nairobi, London... She's a meme, of sorts -- or a costume -- or a performance. (Hmmm -- those words are worth thinking about a bit more...) Anyway, while the specific settings -- like the bar for example -- matter because they're an opportunity to signal a specific (sub-/super-) culture, the geography isn't critical.

(When I say 'efficiently'... I really want to keep this story short -- less than 2000 words. I'm trying to work against my tendency to needlessly expand things and figure out [for a change], what is enough to produce the effect I'm looking for.)

Posts: 70 | Registered: May 2018  |  IP: Logged | Report this post to a Moderator
Grumpy old guy
Member
Member # 9922

 - posted      Profile for Grumpy old guy   Email Grumpy old guy         Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote 
Less is generally more. Parse each sentence for meaning and intent, then try again for maximum impact.

Phil.

Posts: 1791 | Registered: Sep 2012  |  IP: Logged | Report this post to a Moderator
WarrenB
Member
Member # 10927

 - posted      Profile for WarrenB   Email WarrenB         Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote 
Woke up with a head cold and throat infection, so parsing anything feels a bit challenging today. There's nothing quite like a summer cold for sending the message: Slow Down. But on we go... Just a little more gently.
Posts: 70 | Registered: May 2018  |  IP: Logged | Report this post to a Moderator
extrinsic
Member
Member # 8019

 - posted      Profile for extrinsic   Email extrinsic         Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote 
Kardashian is a brand icon, so are Moët et Chandon and Versace, each culturally about opulence and ostentation displays -- Materialism. Incidental mentions of such names do hold broad name exposition magic, exposition to mean its true creative expression meaning: introduction. How, though, those relate to curated effortless, immediate social media self-gratification might consider irony and reciprocal connection.

However, name exposition allegory or metaphor is shortfall of sensory detail and attendant missed occasion for charged commentary.

Anymore, due to video and photo snapshot inclusions in human correspondence, "faces" and apparel are self-curated to appear at one and the same time neutral emotional charges and false façades of higher-than-actual status. Feral grins, sarcastic sneers, patently unpracticed smiles, over-self-curated appearances, assumed "airs" and meaningless status mobility ambitions and social territory aggressions -- those facets, to me, are an entry to event, setting, character, and discourse developments, noir-like diction, for example, that reflects false status façades. About the phoniness, more for ill effect than good, social media promotes?

Say, the narrative is expressed through a sequence of selfie-like snapshot photos, episodic, that is? The picaresque form differs from noir somewhat, though either can be the other, too. Picaresque: episodic adventures of a roguish protagonist in social situations fraught with human vice and folly, dramatic bases for event, setting, and characters.

Posts: 5834 | Registered: Jun 2008  |  IP: Logged | Report this post to a Moderator
Grumpy old guy
Member
Member # 9922

 - posted      Profile for Grumpy old guy   Email Grumpy old guy         Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote 
Or, the ultimate irony: serial killer (ultimate predatory narcissist) stalks vapid socialite (ultimate ephemeral narcissist). Who gets who in the end?

Phil.

Posts: 1791 | Registered: Sep 2012  |  IP: Logged | Report this post to a Moderator
WarrenB
Member
Member # 10927

 - posted      Profile for WarrenB   Email WarrenB         Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote 
Extrinsic:
"Say, the narrative is expressed through a sequence of selfie-like snapshot photos, episodic, that is? The picaresque form differs from noir somewhat, though either can be the other, too. Picaresque: episodic adventures of a roguish protagonist in social situations fraught with human vice and folly, dramatic bases for event, setting, and characters."

Yes! Thanks for that, in particular... Most helpful -- frames something I was reaching towards, but not able to articulate yet, and offers some useful stylistic pointers. (And yes, the "shortfall of sensory detail noted"... Shouldn't shorthand too much or lean too heavily on the labels.)

And Phil: In the current version, the vapid socialite triumphs... Though that changes nothing much.

And now for more aspirin. And a little hunting for accessible examples of the picaresque in short form.

Posts: 70 | Registered: May 2018  |  IP: Logged | Report this post to a Moderator
extrinsic
Member
Member # 8019

 - posted      Profile for extrinsic   Email extrinsic         Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote 
Picaresque is traditionally long fiction; short fiction, labeled an experimental form more so than picaresque. However, Mark Richard, "Strays," (~ 3,000 words, evergreen.edu hosted image PDF) and "Her Favorite Story," The Ice at the Bottom of the World, 1990, fit the general criteria.

Most any William Faulkner short story, and early Cormac McCarthy's three short stories exhibit his struggles to grapple with the form he mastered for novels once out West, and, like Faulkner, Southern Gothic: "Wake for Susan," 1959; "A Drowning Incident," 1960; and "The Dark Waters," 1965, (2,400 words, The Sewanee Review).

Noble antihero rogues' episodes all.

[ January 07, 2019, 10:57 AM: Message edited by: extrinsic ]

Posts: 5834 | Registered: Jun 2008  |  IP: Logged | Report this post to a Moderator
WarrenB
Member
Member # 10927

 - posted      Profile for WarrenB   Email WarrenB         Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote 
Thanks for the links, extrinsic. Will check them out. All I could find yesterday (aside from full-length novels) was a doctoral thesis. It's a little heavy, but does contain some useful ideas (characteristics of the picaresque, picaroon, etc.).

The cold persists. (I haven't had one in ages -- and don't recall them involving this much discomfort -- or this much mucus.) Anyway, the meds I'm taking don't seem calibrated to maintain editorial judgment, so reading might be a good way to spend the day.

Posts: 70 | Registered: May 2018  |  IP: Logged | Report this post to a Moderator
WarrenB
Member
Member # 10927

 - posted      Profile for WarrenB   Email WarrenB         Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote 
While I'm fairly certain that no one is holding their breath for version 3, a little update (just on the off-chance).

The dreaded lurgy is not quite gone -- it's been dragging on like a thing that drags on while preventing one from generating apposite similes.

And now, clients demand their pound of flesh (or at least some attention, if I'm to pay the bills). And, I have begun to imagine a series of themed short stories of which this is one. And, I am suitably overawed by having read some Faulkner short stories -- I'd managed to avoid him until this point in my life. (And, I'm beginning to twig that much of the above is my devious little mind's way of preventing me from ever finishing anything... One thing leads, always, to the next, more exciting, thing... Discipline issues, in other words.)

Anyway, give me a few more weeks. And please, stop holding your breath -- it does no good. :-)
XO, W.

Posts: 70 | Registered: May 2018  |  IP: Logged | Report this post to a Moderator
WarrenB
Member
Member # 10927

 - posted      Profile for WarrenB   Email WarrenB         Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote 
While I'm fairly certain that no one is holding their breath for version 3, a little update (just on the off-chance).

The dreaded lurgy is not quite gone -- it's been dragging on like a thing that drags on while preventing one from generating apposite similes.

And now, clients demand their pound of flesh (or at least some attention, if I'm to pay the bills). And, I have begun to imagine a series of themed short stories of which this is one. And, I am suitably overawed by having read some Faulkner short stories -- I'd managed to avoid him until this point in my life. (And, I'm beginning to twig that much of the above is my devious little mind's way of preventing me from ever finishing anything... One thing leads, always, to the next, more exciting, thing... Discipline issues, in other words.)

Anyway, give me a few more weeks. And please, stop holding your breath -- it does no good. :-)
XO, W.

Posts: 70 | Registered: May 2018  |  IP: Logged | Report this post to a Moderator
Princesisto
Member
Member # 11113

 - posted      Profile for Princesisto           Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote 
1. You know no one will ever publish it. The editors are so paranoid about lawsuits they want no mention of any identifiable person. And to start out with a brazen defamation of the Kardashians which would keep their army of lawyers busy . . . .

2. I like Version 1 better than Version 2, if only because of waving the credit card like a wand.

3. If it is murder being planned, I still don't understand the motive. Readers cannot tolerate, let alone identify with, a character who wants to kill a woman because she is fashionable.

4. It's a nice description but does not clearly introduce the plot.

Posts: 13 | Registered: Feb 2019  |  IP: Logged | Report this post to a Moderator
Princesisto
Member
Member # 11113

 - posted      Profile for Princesisto           Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote 
Sorry, P.S. Yes I am happy to read when it is ready.
Posts: 13 | Registered: Feb 2019  |  IP: Logged | Report this post to a Moderator
   

Quick Reply
Message:

HTML is not enabled.
UBB Code™ is enabled.
UBB Code™ Images not permitted.
Instant Graemlins
   


Post New Topic  Post A Reply Close Topic   Feature Topic   Move Topic   Delete Topic next oldest topic   next newest topic
 - Printer-friendly view of this topic
Hop To:


Contact Us | Hatrack River Home Page

Copyright © 2008 Hatrack River Enterprises Inc. All rights reserved.
Reproduction in whole or in part without permission is prohibited.


Powered by Infopop Corporation
UBB.classic™ 6.7.2