posted
This was fun! I think this proves the whole "it doesn't matter if (IF) there are no new ideas - there are fresh ways to tell a story."
Considering the stories I read, we all kept the basic elements to some extent - some closer than others, some obscure, some in your face. Creativity simply oozed out our fingertips. But I laughed when someone mentioned how all the editors are going to wonder where all the 3BGG stories are coming from...
posted
I did! It was my first attempt at a short story (I know, I know, it s@#$ed) and it was both more fun and more challenging than I had imagined.
But... how do we discuss the stories? I know that sounds dumb, but what can we say that is substantive without being just personal opinion? I like that, I didn't like the other etc.
Do we say things like, " I think that "asdsd" was the most creative, whereas "wersdeew" was the most tightly written?
Not.
Somebody who knows what they are doing, please step in here so that I can slink out the virtual door. Please?
quote:For no good reason, I watched the movies The Angry Red Planet and 2010: The Year We Make Contact, one right after another. Of course the level of sophistication of the movies themselves, and the acting -- oh my word, the acting! -- was eons apart, but I was floored by the similarity of storylines, especially the endings. Both had aliens telling us to leave that planet or moon and never come back. Now I'm familiar with the idea there are really only so many plots, but watching these two movies in such immediate juxtaposition with each other still hammered home that there are myriad ways to tell a tale. Cliched is only that if we mishandle our material.
Just some food for thought.
What better way to stimulate discussion than to reprint the post that this all going in the first place. Kolona's post (and if you're out there I hope I'm reading this right ) talks about how you can do the same basic story several different ways without it feeling tired or clichéd. I think that we've sort of proved that with the challenge.
In the last few weeks, several people have started posts voicing concerns about story similarities. Well, here we are purposely using the same plot (3 "goats" have to get from A to B and somehow have to bypass a "troll"), and not one story was the same.
I read all the submissions (I think/hope ) and I didn't get bored doing it. Some of us chose to make the goats the whole story (like Keeley and HSO), for others they were just a bit in a bigger picture (like Newsbys and Punahougirl).
As far as discussion goes, I wouldn't mind hearing some personal opinions. After all, what is it that we normally do in F&F anyways?! I don't think we need to get full critques going, but we can talk about what worked/didn't work, use of voice, character motivations, milieu, etc.
posted
One thing I'd like to know is where all your ideas came from. Your inspirations. Your thought processes.
I'd also like to know how much you struggled to come up with something, or if it came easily.
From the start I intended to stick to the original story (the goats and the troll), just wanting to find some unique twist that I could ride with. I pondered a courtroom drama, a story told from the troll's POV. But then those types of stories have all been done (The REAL Story of the Three Little Pigs by Whatshisname). And since the first few ideas are very seldom the best I kept thinking.
When it finally came it came like a landslide and was written in a few hours with edits taking just a few hours more.
I wonder why? Generally I agonize over a story. I suppose having the spine of the story already written helped, but I've never written a more clean story, one that garnered so little criticism from those who critiqued it. I guess that means it's a success?
There have also been questions concerning posting the stories in their entirety online. Would it hurt chances of paid publication later on? Should we try to publish as a group elsewhere? How do we want to handle this and who might we seek for advise on the matter?
posted
I think one of the things that came out of this for me is how important character motivation is. It's something that I struggle with since I like holding information back from the reader.
As for how I came up with my story, I read the provided link and was really caught by the phrase the last Billy Goat says about crushing the troll to bits. The way it's worded reminded me of a phrase from the Lokasenna (one version anyway) where Thor states he'll crush Loki with Mjollnir. Plus, the overall story reminded me of the myths about Andvari's ring and Idunne's apples.
posted
My inspiration came from the wrangling over how to title the challenge.
quote:Robyn_Hood Member posted August 05, 2004 01:15 PM
Sounds good but this is the "first ever" challenge, not "first annual". You can't have a first annual, it isn't annual until the second one
(Okay, okay, my journalism instructors pounded that into my head and I just can't shake it. I'll be quiet now )
For some reason I focused on journalism and the wrangling, and that went to having a young woman getting into trouble regarding journalism, and since it was about the Goats Gruff and they were billys, then since I had a woman character she had to be "Billie", etc. And obviously a woman named Billie who is into journalism is going to try and interview a troll... And I don't know WHERE all the creepy stuff came from, except that I've always been a Gahan Wilson fan http://www.lowbrowartworld.com/gahan_wilson.html .
posted
I was in and out so much last month; I wanted to participate, but couldn't. I would love to see another challenge, based upon an existing story. Except this time maybe do a "what if" type of spin. Like a "what happens next" continuation of that story. It could be any story, but one with a wide enough base to allow for various "continuations". Just a thought, I am open to whatever the majority comes up with.
Posts: 471 | Registered: Sep 2003
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posted
I did such a "what if" with Rapunzel. It explained why the witch wanted a "daughter" and what Rapunzel and the prince did about it once they were reunited.
Haven't sold it yet. Maybe I should offer it in F&F....
posted
The inspiration for my story is probably obvious enough: all these ninja that have been running amuck on Hatrack of late! One of them apparently made his way into my house and inhabited my computer in the directory where my stories are kept. He got out before I could stop him! *g*
Mine is probably one of the more obscure tales, keeping only the bare bones elements. The troll of the bridge transformed into two thieves in a darkened alleyway. While the three "goats" are present, they are hard to spot, and seemingly turned upside down. The first person to traverse the path is the largest of the three, but the one with the smallest purse. The second has a larger purse, while the third is the wealthiest but also the smallest and seemingly most frail. In my story, then, it is the size of the purse-- the wealth-- and the apparent vulnerability of the traveler, that directly corresponds to the goats.
My tale will end up being but one chapter of a longer work, one in which fairy tale rewrites are threaded throughout. Seems like a fun challenge to me!
With one chapter written, I have only two more to go to meet my goal of three chapters of a novel length work by mid-December.
Meanwhile, I'm learning more fairy tales, legends and myths than I EVER heard as a child!
posted
Inspiration came to me about 8 hours after saying, "I haven't got time for this."
In fact I had two ideas but only used one of them. I have now forgotten what the other one was...doh!! But I do remember it was quite good.
Actually I think mine is the shortest, probably because I kept to the main theme, with only some changes in the setting. I also tried to keep it short because the original is a simple short story.
But it was good to see how you guys think. I may never understand how Keeley thinks, but it's all good
Do you think Kathleen would tell us to professionally submit if she had read them?
posted
Inspiration - I've been doing a lot of research on black holes and worm holes, and was stalling on a current WIP that has nothing to do with them.
Black holes gobble stuff up, destroying it. Kinda troll-like. So how do you get a black hole to give you up? Hawking recently recanted his old belief, and now black holes can give up their mass (yeah, oversimplifying - watch my hand wave and make it so). And where does it go? Maybe wormholes and black holes don't open up to alternate universes, but maybe a black hole gobbles our up, and pours it out - it has to go somewhere. I've been toying with having my black hole power a wormhole - a ha, have the mass go out a wormhole (a bridge from here to there). Why would someone want to cross that bridge - what would be so good on the other side?
Also, I was reading about a possible ends of the universe (open version in this case) and was having a discussion about it and existence with my mother's helper (she's 12.5, and goes to a private church school). In a way, I don't want to die - I don't want to stop existing. So what would someone with that feeling do about it?
Throw in some sleep deprivation, and go to sleep thinking of your ideas.
Yeah, kind of bare bones. I plan to rewrite based on some great critique and ideas I received, and hope to send it somewhere. I also like the idea of us doing something with the stories - but maybe we can give shots at publishing them...
I really enjoyed reading all the stories people sent, and was happy so many wanted to read mine! This place is good for the soul (or eats it, time-wise!) - it felt good to do the story.
posted
I was just teasing a little Kathleen. To be honest this challenge has reinspired me in my ability to write a short. Thank you for the idea. You confounded and tempted me into actually producing the goods.
And thank you to those who have followed this thing through. Just shows you how a group can support and inspire each other. I definitely think some of these stories are worth submiting for publication. So HAtrack away at them and then go for it. Not sure about the anthology idea. Anthologies don't really pay well and if you can get some dollars for your work then why not.
posted
I found that this is making me reconsider the idea of outlining because I knew the plot of the story, but also discovered it as I was writing. Where did my inspiration come from? The phrase "trip, trap, tripping" and recent time spent in NYC with a constant awareness of neighbors.
posted
I enjoyed all of the stories I read. Several of them seemed worthy of publication.
I was totally stuck on my WIP and didn't know where to go with it. I had a general idea, but it was not working out the way I planned. The rewrite triggered an amazing series of events, which got me back on track.
Overall, Hatrack has helped me immensely. This workshop might be the best thing I ever got addicted to. Maybe better than chocolate! Ok, now I'm just talking crazy, but I think you get the picture. Thanks to everyone. I can't wait to do another exercise like this. Bring it on!
The really intriguing bit is that it is possible this actually happened, or something happened to 130 children of the town, anyway.
What do you all think?
On a separate note, I'm a bit lost as to what to do with Big Bob. I know the story needs a couple more revisions, but I have no idea what markets to submit to when I'm done with it (and I am quite doubtful that it will ever be publishable). Any ideas?
I'm not even sure what inspired my story. I know Kathleen's comment about not confining ourselves to goats and trolls struck something. Around the same time I think I read something from someone else about how there were no dwarfs in sci-fi; I figured this wasn't so as there are red ones, white ones, brown ones, etc. all over the universe. Dwarf-Troll, I started to make the stretch. I guess it kind of evolved grom there and I ended up setting it in a milieu I've been developing for a few years.
Overall this was a great experience and I look forward to more. Perhaps in October?!
posted
Every other month for a short story challenge, or something similar, sounds doable. Perhaps in the discussion month we can continue to have smaller challenges like Mike's.
Pied Piper sounds good to me, too. But will this be a straight rewrite, like the last, or something different?
You guys are terrific. Thanks for letting me play with ya!
posted
SPOOKY! I'd been thinking of the Pied Piper story myself last night!
Lots of possibilities there, I think.
Now if we're going to do this every other month, that presents a semi-dilemma--the challenge would fall in December. But then again, a challenge focused on a Christmas story might be amazing. But then again, December is an awfully busy month for most folks.
We could wait until November for the next challenge and have that one be a Christmas Challenge? We could do the Pied Piper in September to shift ourselves to odd numbered months?
There I go being the anal retentive organization freak again!
Someone shut me up!
[This message has been edited by djvdakota (edited September 02, 2004).]
posted
The only problem with a November challenge is for those who are participating in NaNoWriMo. I'm not, but I know some people are. I do agree December would be a tough month too. We could do October and then skip to January.
I don't know. Either way it is unlikely that we could satisfy everyone, so, I guess as long as we post a September challenge soon, that would work.
posted
The Pied Piper works for me! Tailor made for Bridgetown...
I'm not averse to doing it again this September. With rewrite challenges due every other month, that would make this one due September 30, and the next one due November 30. Then we could take December off and start a new challenge with the new year.
Or not, if it conflicts with the No, No, No Mr. Bill! or whatever that was...
[This message has been edited by mikemunsil (edited September 02, 2004).]
posted
I vote that we keep the momentum with monthly challenges. If we put it off and wait several months, we will probably forget about it and not revive it. If someone is busy, or not interested in the assignment, they always have the option of skipping it for a month and catching up on the next one.
I do understand if it becomes a problem for dakota, because she is our unofficial\official project leader. I've been in a position like that before and it can be time consuming. Dakota - Just let us know if it becomes a problem. Since it is established and fairly low maintenance, I'm sure any one of us would be willing to take it over for a few months to give you a break.
posted
I just had a thought for a Pied Piper re-write. With the first challenge we had three re-write options: basic, as [insert author], combine with a different tale.
How about if we had the options: basic, prequel, sequel?
The prequels would end more or less like the old Paul Harvey radio show "...and now you know The Rest of the Story..."
Again not limiting ourselves to rats, children or pipers.
posted
Hadn't thought about that. But I don't think it would be much different than the last challenge. Those who wrote under an assumed voice/style, stayed closer to the original milieu and I think the only one to even remotely combine the tale with an existing story/legend was Keeley (I could be wrong ).
It was just an idea. I can see where there could be some limitations/problems.
posted
I'm OK with heading up this thing on a monthly basis if that's what everyone else wants. It hasn't taken a huge amount of time on my part.
But I have no intention of taking control of it, like a tight fisted tyrant. This will only work and only keep going with everyone's input. The MINUTE I feel like I'm turning into a motivational speaker (trying to keep everyone excited about it), or the minute I feel like everyone's sitting around waiting for me to make all the decisions (I HATE making decisions) is the moment I step out of it. NOT that anyone's doing that. I'm just projecting into the unknown, just worrying about possible yet improbably outcomes. See? Anal retentive and the organization freak. SO type 'A'. Didn't I tell you?
Which is why I wonder if a monthly challenge is too much. Might we more effectively maintain the high pitch of excitement if we go bimonthly instead? Would Quarterly be even better? Any fanatics out there voting for weekly? Maybe we could have a different kind of challenge each month to stoke the interests of those who just didn't get all fired up about this one--a three month rotation kind of thing? For instance, mikemunsil's 30 word character challenge is fascinating and the time between Rewrite Challenges could be filled with things like that--not to mention more of the woes of poor MaryRobinette.
posted
I'm about to go home, but I like the bi-monthly idea. I wouldn't mind doing this on a monthly basis, but I don't know as I would have time for all the reading and writing and other reading and writing. (I know , I don't have to be involved with it every time, but who can pass up a good challenge?)
As long as it happens more than just annually, I'll be happy
posted
Quarterly would be fine, bi-monthly I could probably still manage... I'd vote for not doing it in November (thinking about NaNoWriMo), but a Christmas Pied Piper could be fun.
Posts: 465 | Registered: Aug 2003
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posted
I think it should be monthly for several reasons: 1. Maintaining pace 2. Some challenges some people may not wnat to do, which would mean a long wait if anything other... 3. We can always opt out if too busy with other things. 4. I'm getting old and hate waiting...
Posts: 575 | Registered: Dec 2003
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posted
My vote is every month as well, because I for one need the constant stimulation to keep the fire under my butt lit. I tend to write a lot when I write. Conversely, I tend to write nothing for long stretches as well. I'm kind of all or nothing. Anyone can opt out any month that it is too much for them, or post something to the effect of, "I'll only read but not critique this month" or something.
Posts: 818 | Registered: Aug 2004
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posted
And again, time in between challenges, whether they are bi-monthly, quarterly, what have you, can be filled in with "mini challenges" like the wonderful exercise Mike came up with.
His character challenge was interesting enough to attract a new member to post in it. *waves a welcome to Lizm*
*Monthly rewrite challenge beginning with The Pied Piper (great theme for back-to-school, I think) for a Sept 30th deadline (which I will post today).
*Skip November for the NaNoWriMo folks (And could someone please let those of us in the not-know, know what it is and where we can look into it?)
*Next challenge deadline December 24th for a Christmas story challenge.
*And another thought, for October it might be fun to do a rewrite of The Headless Horseman. Any other ideas for October? Any ideas for a story to rewrite for December?
I like Headless Horseman/Legend of Sleepy Hollow for October.
December, hmm. Lets NOT do something based around the nativity. Yes it is a great story, but it already feels far too overdone and re-done. What about the story of Saint Nicholas (not Santa)?
posted
Rather than a re-write, why not come up with our own Christmas tales? Who knows, perhaps one day we'll be seeing our own stories on TV, right along with "Rudolph" and "The Gift of the Magi"!
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) talks about how you can do the same basic story several different ways without it feeling tired or clichéd. I think that we've sort of proved that with the challenge.
) and I didn't get bored doing it. Some of us chose to make the goats the whole story (like Keeley and HSO), for others they were just a bit in a bigger picture (like Newsbys and Punahougirl).
