Most, if not all, undergraduate and graduate writing programs require their professors to have published and continue publishing. So at least the professors have crossed the transom.

In my experience and through reading articles evaluating writing programs, form and function isn't particularly emphasized in undergraduate writing programs. They're generally organic in process through studio exposure. I have my doubts whether any professor or anyone really grasps the intricacies of plot sufficiently to be able to teach to it. In some writing professors' opinions, plot isn't important at all, or if it is, it's an unnecessary tyrant.

In one article I read, the writer said of MFA and MA writing programs, the average time elapsed for graduates to succeed in breakthrough into the publishing game takes ten years. Occasionally, more than fluke, less than ideal, an undergraduate creative writing degree might ostensibly lead to a successful writing career.

If looking into such a program now, I would ask a couple of questions.

First, look at the classes offered and what classes are required for the degree. Are those classes what you want? In my case, the program was fairly heavily slanted towards screen writing, which isn't what I want. But, I did learn to write dialog. So, not a total loss.

Second, look at the instructors. What are their REAL credentials. Have they sold a novel, short stories, screen play? Or have they worked in the industry? If not, I'd want to know more about the program before enrolling.

The only thing I remember writing for those classes that wasn't my own story, were things like proposals and queries. And that's probably not bad practice.

Dean Wesley Smith and Kristine Kathryn Rusch in their writers workshops say that the best degree for a writer is a business degree. Since writing is a business, if you know what you're doing business-wise, you actually have a better chance of making a living and doing well as an author than someone who only knows the creative part.

Now, if you're not looking at a college degree as a bridge to employment, then perhaps this is just what you want/need. However, I think that in general it's best to consider what one studies in college to be the thing that not only you are passionate about, but that you can also make an income from. If nothing else, you'll have all those nasty college loans to pay back.

I guess what I'm trying to say is that creative writing isn't a profession like others where you can leave college with your degree and have somewhat good odds of landing a job in your field. Even the people I know today who are employed as writers universally all have other degrees. One has a radio/tv/film degree (and is a Hollywood writer/producer), one has a journalism degree (and is a newspaper editor in a moderately big market), one has a marketing degree (and has an advertising/PR business.) They all write as part of their job, but only the Hollywood one writes fiction for her job. The marketing guy writes novels on the side. I don't know if the editor does any fiction at all, but she writes essays.

I don't mean to dissuade you, because I think there are a lot of things you can learn in college-level coursework in creative writing -- many things I feel I have had to learn on my feet, making many spectacular mistakes along the way, because I had no creative writing in my college career. But then again in my college career I took a lot of computer courses and education courses and made a great living as an instructional designer and technology project manager for many years (semi-retired now while the wee folk are wee.) So while I may have missed out on creative writing courses, I've managed to make up for it (at least in my "happy place" that's what I tell myself) by reading a lot of books on writing, attending in-person writers groups, this one and others online, and of course writing, writing, writing.

There you have it - a couple thoughts. Good luck in your decision. If you were looking for suggestions - technology degrees are highly marketable these days, as are most anything in the healthcare field - pharmacists, health care aids, physicians assistants, medical records technology, health care administration, etc. Accredited/credentialed/degreed teachers can almost always find a job (they may have to move, and the pay may not be great, but we always need teachers.)

The OOH lists 300,000 full-time employed, salaried writers and editors in 2006 at $48,000 median annual income.

However, from another source, I determined that only 8,000 novel writers in the US make a living from their writing.

A very fortunate few writers come out of undergraduate study with a book contract. Stephanie Meyer and Annie Proulx come to mind. Nicholas Sparks didn't study creative writing, and languished through two novels before he hit the big time with his third. The game is worth the candle, only, E pluribus, unum, not many make the breakthrough to the big time.

I make my living from writing-related employment. Employment which benefits from my studying creative writing.

Looking at the required classes more, I think it might actually frustrate me. As much as I love old literature, I really don't want to study it. I'm sure there are great things I could learn from it, but I prefer to learn through experience.

Maybe a writers workshop would work better for my current goals.

Does anyone know of a great writers workshop out there?

Furthermore, does anyone know if OSC is doing his boot camp in Utah this year? I couldn't find anything.

Thanks, everyone.

I am sure I have told my story before, so I will not recount it here. Let's just say he and I did not see eye-to-eye on something, and I ended up changing my major to sociology. I was still able to graduate within 4 years, though I had to take some courses during the summer sessions.

I would recommend a degree other than creative writing. There are many number of degrees offered by colleges that would be helpful to an aspiring science fiction or fantasy writer. One thing that I would recommend to anyone wanting to become a writer is an advanced grammar and composition course.

I stopped writing soon after I left college, and I have just recently renewed the endeavor within the last few years. I actually found this forum while investigating information about a possible Ender's Game movie that was supposed to be in production, and I was checking on whether OSC was conducting any writers' workshops in my area - I live near Greensboro, NC.

One of the best things about creative writing programs is that you are somewhat compelled to write on deadline. The worst thing is that you might end up being "processed." And that's another can of worms, altogether.

The one professor who didn't care for the fanatastical wasn't a very good professor anyway. Fortunately, the course was a survey of Early American Literature up through Melville.

Two of my literature professors and I occasionally discussed the canons of science fiction and fantasy. The thing isn't whether they dislike it, it's whether they're prepared to teach/mentor to it. Many aren't. But the study of writing and literature is nonetheless applicable to all genres.

However, by and large, most MFA and MA writing programs advise applicants interested in dedicated "genre" study to apply to programs where their prefered genre modes are covered. There aren't that many.

My writing sample that got me selected for undergraduate writing study wasn't in a fanatastical mode, nor are any of my graduate school application writing samples.

I recall that the magazine, THE WRITER, listed conferences, so I just checked for a website, and they have a list of upcoming writers conferences here .

You can probably find lists of other conferences as well. Some writers, on their blogs, have links to such things as "writers resources" which may include conferences.

As far as a getting together for a workshop, sounds good at some point, although I don't actually live in Salt Lake yet. I currently reside in Logan, though I plan on moving there (Obviously) if I go to the U of U. We'll see how things turn out. In any case, its not too long a drive to make a couple times a month.

There are panels and other presentations being given most of each day, and there are also ways for teachers to earn recertification credit, I believe.

If you haven't ever been to a science fiction convention, it may give you an idea of what one is like.

This is a link to the website, and there should be contact information there, so you can ask someone.