quote:Ok, here's another topic: If someone wants to be a star, why do their stylists dye their hair and dress them just like everyone else trying to be a star? The flat-ironed fake blonde with brown highlights is so unattractive, as is the fake tan and frosted lipstick. If you stuck her in a room with my high school choir kids she's blend right in. Boring. Blendy. Not even the most flattering thing for her.
That was exactly what I thought when I looked at her website. She looks like virtually every girl her age at the mall. If you're spending all this money on stylists and managers, you'd think she could be edgier or something. She's not a bad singer, but there's nothing remarkable about her, and with all the fluff around her, it's hard to tell how much is her and how much is the window dressing they've hired out. The saddest quote to me was how they didn't want her to even try out for AI because she wouldn't want to be tied to it for four years, like they assume she'd win. And from listening, I think she'd be lucky to get a gold ticket, let alone make the semis or finals.
Posts: 5948 | Registered: Jun 2001
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quote:"She's spoiled," Dubowy says, "but hopefully, it's a grounded spoiled."
This reminds me of a girl I went to high school with. She literally took up 5 minutes of English class complaining that her father could *only* spend half a million on her debutante party.
Posts: 484 | Registered: Feb 2006
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posted
I don't listen to radio anymore. Too many commercial breaks. This probably also explains why my music collection is a tad out of date.
Posts: 2208 | Registered: Feb 2004
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posted
Stan, have you tried satellite radio? Sirius came with my new car and I think I will have to re-up when it expires at the end of the year...I love that almost all the music channels are commercial free.
Posts: 5948 | Registered: Jun 2001
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quote:Squicky, it urks me because it represents everything that is soleless and wrong with society.
My first reaction was pretty much like yours. However, it would be incredibly easy for most of the people on this planet to talk about how spoiled and rich any of us are, based simply on the fact that we can divert enough time away from the pursuit of survival and energy sources away from growing food or obtaining clean water to complain about this girl on an internet forum.
I'm sorry but this is the approach to the world that would lead me to simply never feel justified in complaining or arguing about anything, simply because I was fortunate enough to be born in America and not the Sudan.
This girl is way beyond reason, and all sense of proportion, and just because I live in that society along with her, doesn't mean I don't get to criticise. In fact I think we should be more critical of all the idiots that give us a bad name as Americans, don't you?
I can understand why you would make such an argument, however I can't see how you can make such a statement in defense of the girl, given the amount of time you also spend on a forum. Meh, it doesn't take a genius to see where this girl is headed in life.
Posts: 9912 | Registered: Nov 2005
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quote:I'm sorry but this is the approach to the world that would lead me to simply never feel justified in complaining or arguing about anything, simply because I was fortunate enough to be born in America and not the Sudan.
Well, to me that approach just means that some things that other people do are not worth worrying about, especially if I could be guilty of the same thing, which gives me time to worry about things that I do feel are important.
quote:just because I live in that society along with her, doesn't mean I don't get to criticise.
What exactly is there to criticize her for? She's making decisions based on what she thinks she wants in life. Maybe she'll learn from them, maybe she won't. In either case, I don't really see how it would affect you or me.
quote:I blame the girl because she is obviously inherently selfish enough to believe this crazy world view that her parents have constructed for her
To be fair, children often times believe a lot of things their parents tell them. Even when they are older than 16.
quote:...then you can hold a 16 diva responsible for being a complete twit.
I laugh at some of my attitudes and ideas from when I was 16, or even last month, and am glad that most people recognize that we all change our views in life a few more times than we would have expected when we were young and knew everything.
Posts: 1256 | Registered: May 2005
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posted
I guess that's why we try 15 year olds for adult murder in this country. Your attitude, though understanding, is difficult to justify. You have to hold people accountable at some point for who they are and what they are worth. This girl invited critisicm by placing herself deliberately in public view; what's more, she is awful at what she claims to do. I've listened to the demo, I saw the show, she's a horrible human being.
Your can plead understanding all you want, but this guilt trip about how good we all have it is lame and beside the point. Give yourself a little more credit Camus, you were just never THIS stupid. Posts: 9912 | Registered: Nov 2005
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quote:Give yourself a little more credit Camus, you were just never THIS stupid.
I'm pretty sure most of us at some point in our lives were at least that stupid. I just thank God my vanity was never made that public. (I probably need to thank my parents for that, too.)
Posts: 9866 | Registered: Apr 2002
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quote:Then why are you arguing with me.... *facepalm*
It wasn't a defense of the girl so much as an indictment of her accusers, so if you feel the indictment isn't deserved, then...
Posts: 4313 | Registered: Sep 2004
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quote:this guilt trip about how good we all have it is lame and beside the point
It is absolutely not beside the point. The very first comment was "Wow. Think of what that money could have done."
I don't know your spending habits, but I'd bet a lot of money that from the perspective of large percentage of the people on earth, the money that you spend on frivolousness is obscene bordering on criminal. I say this based on nothing more than the fact that you reside in the first world.
Whether or not the amount of money spent on luxury is too much or not is very much on point.
Posts: 16551 | Registered: Feb 2003
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posted
Next time you think about buying a pack of oreos at the store then, I expect you not to do it, and give your money to save the children.
Posts: 9912 | Registered: Nov 2005
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quote: You have to hold people accountable at some point for who they are and what they are worth. This girl invited critisicm by placing herself deliberately in public view; what's more, she is awful at what she claims to do. I've listened to the demo, I saw the show, she's a horrible human being.
I'm not saying she shouldn't be accountable for her decisions. What I'm trying to say is that the decisions she makes are of absolutely no concern to me. It's not worth getting worked up over every single person that gets something they may or may not deserve. There are too many of them and too little time to spend on something so trivial.
Now, I do feel that you have every right to say that in your opinion she's a horrible singer. You have every right to not like her music or her career path just as I have every right to ignore her. However, I think it's, at the very least, a bit careless to label her a horrible person.
quote:Next time you think about buying a pack of oreos at the store then, I expect you not to do it, and give your money to save the children.
The point is not that we should abandon our lifestyles just because others don't have what we have, rather, the point is that it is a bit hypocritical to judge or condemn other people's spending habits when we do the same things ourselves but to a slightly lesser degree.
And as I mentioned earlier, it's not the money that's really the issue, it's the attitude that her parents are instililng in her. The money just makes visible the attitude that was already present.
quote:If you think the degree doesn't matter, you should examine it again.
I think the degree is of some importance, but not as much as some people make it out to be. I mean, isn't it just assumed that the more disposable income you have, the more money you will probably spend on frivolous things? If I were a billionaire, the percent of my wealth spent on unnecessary items is going to be much higher than if I were at the poverty level.
The idea that rich people are going to spend a lot of money on things they don't need and that I don't have doesn't really surprise or bother me. Sure, they could spend their money on more useful things, but I'm sure there are plenty of people that would say the same thing about me.
The amount of money they spent on the party, or the degree of extravagance, is not the problem, just evidence of the problem.
Posts: 1256 | Registered: May 2005
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quote:Originally posted by Orincoro: Next time you think about buying a pack of oreos at the store then, I expect you not to do it, and give your money to save the children.
What have I said that make you think this is a reasonable expectation?
Posts: 16551 | Registered: Feb 2003
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quote:Then why are you arguing with me.... *facepalm*
You ALWAYS DO THIS!!!!
You know... it's possible to argue against part of what you are saying without arguing against ALL of what you are saying. Posts: 8120 | Registered: Jul 2000
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quote:Originally posted by Orincoro: Next time you think about buying a pack of oreos at the store then, I expect you not to do it, and give your money to save the children.
What have I said that make you think this is a reasonable expectation?
Duh, its not. That is my point.
Posts: 9912 | Registered: Nov 2005
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quote:Just because YOU expect most very rich people to waste money doesn't mean it is a reasonable expectation.
I expect most people to waste something in pursuit of their desires or their search for happiness, whether that be money, time, friends, family, or other opportunities. Wasting any of those things could be considered overkill if you don't agree with what the person is seeking.
I may not agree with how this family is spending their money, but I do know that happiness is different things to different people and I do not expect my version of happiness to be consistent with everyone else's.
Posts: 1256 | Registered: May 2005
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This is true, especially for actors who haven't yet had their "big break." Most of the time actors will put their extraneous skills in that "Special Skills" section, including some things that might not seem relevant to acting at first glance. Even working professional actors do it, like this guy, for example.
Posts: 952 | Registered: Jun 2005
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quote:Originally posted by camus: I may not agree with how this family is spending their money, but I do know that happiness is different things to different people and I do not expect my version of happiness to be consistent with everyone else's.
The acceptance police making their rounds again...
This is pretty cheap I'll admit, but what was Hitler's idea of hapiness, and how can we fault him for that? Maybe because his idea of happiness weighed far too heavily on the world and society, just as this girl's "dream" does. I mean that in the loosest possible sense, because while this girl isn't out to harm society, people like her do ruin things for rest of us.
Posts: 9912 | Registered: Nov 2005
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I don't subscribe to internet forum weekly, sorry, I guess I'm just not current on the "rules" regarding saying the name "Hitler." After all he's hardly a relevent historical figure to reference. Shame on me. Posts: 9912 | Registered: Nov 2005
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quote:Maybe because his idea of happiness weighed far too heavily on the world and society, just as this girl's "dream" does. I mean that in the loosest possible sense, because while this girl isn't out to harm society, people like her do ruin things for rest of us.
While her motives may be misplaced, her dreams seem rather harmless to me. I can think of a few worse things to become than a famous entertainer.
I'm curious, though, about how people like her "ruin things for the rest of us." Would you care to elaborate on that point? My opinion, or more accurately, my indifference might change if I believed there was something important that I was overlooking.
Posts: 1256 | Registered: May 2005
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posted
Well if I completely overlook the degredation that our brains would suffer just by enduring her music, there is the small matter of the example this all sets.
Her parents are buying her this dream, and it tells her, and everybody else just as emphatically as Paris Hilton does every night on the E channel, that money is really all that matters. Hey, you don't even have to be particularly attractive!
As Douglas Adams once wrote, there are zero-sum media, and non-zero sum media. Despite the ubiquity of the internet, entertainment and music continue to be a zero sum media. This means that if this girl's dream can be had at a price which can be written in dollars instead of hard work, or talent, then there will be another talented and inspired performer who doesn't get that part, doesn't get that contract, and doesn't become part of the equation.
If you look at it this way, the entertainment "industry" may be loading itself rather top-heavy with these useless celebrity debutantes. Eventually, probably sooner rather than later, people are going to stop buying it. Period. I don't know, I think she just makes human beings look bad, as a group.
posted
I think you had a 'non' in that where you didn't mean to, which rather spoiled your point. Which, in any case, I don't think is accurate, because studio time and media attention can be bought, market share can't. So while the game may be zero-sum, it can't be subverted in the way you suggest, and therefore there is no talented singer losing out.
Posts: 10645 | Registered: Jul 2004
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posted
If you don't think the integrity of the entertainment industry is questionable, than you are more credulous a person than I will ever be.
Market share can in effect, be bought. Isn't that why a standard teen-age movie spends its budget over again on advertising alone? Certainly the success of the film has alot to do with that.
Posts: 9912 | Registered: Nov 2005
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posted
There's only so much radio time, so much shelf space in stores, so many ads in magazines, and so many possibilities for promotion.
Market share can be bought by making some acts so ubiquitous that other acts never get the exposure that they need to succeed.
Posts: 3950 | Registered: Mar 2006
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posted
Precisely. And if you think this isn't exactly what industries try to do.... remember that we have anti-trust laws for a reason, because companies have a way of doing this whether they mean to be evil or not.
The people aren't going to rebel against a product which is inferior, if you only provide the people with inferior choices. Things do run in cycles that way though; I think right now we may be at a creative ebb in our culture.
Posts: 9912 | Registered: Nov 2005
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posted
I'm sure the entertainment industry wishes it had that kind of control, yes. But in fact, there isn't an actual monopoly.
Posts: 10645 | Registered: Jul 2004
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quote:Things do run in cycles that way though; I think right now we may be at a creative ebb in our culture.
I don't think this is true. If anything, at least in the music industry, we are in a high period for creativity. Certainly much better than the years in the recent past during which boy bands and "pop" music dominated the scene.
Posts: 8120 | Registered: Jul 2000
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quote:Things do run in cycles that way though; I think right now we may be at a creative ebb in our culture.
I don't think this is true. If anything, at least in the music industry, we are in a high period for creativity. Certainly much better than the years in the recent past during which boy bands and "pop" music dominated the scene.
Let's all keep in mind that "pop" is short for "popular." In other words, "pop" music always dominates the music industry.
posted
"pop" in this context has taken on another meaning though. After all most people acknowledge a difference between Pop and Rock, even if both are popular. There is something else about the word, I think, that reflects upon the type of music it is. "Pop" music is a style which actively tries to be popular. Its still not a definite style, but there are some things which are "pop" and some things which are not, and whether any of those are "popular" is a different thing too.
I think the word has evolved through its connection in English with the verb "pop," so that there is a certain quality in pop music which is thought to be connected with something popping, or snapping, or whatever. There is also the other connection with youthfulness ie: Soda-pop culture, something has "pop," popcorn movies, a popping party, etc.
The word isn't a litteral shortening of "popular" anymore. If it was then anything alot of people liked would be "pop," So Beethoven would be pop music, as well as Classic/romantic.
Posts: 9912 | Registered: Nov 2005
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