First of all, I just wanted to let you know how much I have loved reading your work. I must have read Ender’s Game early in Middle School, and since then, I have been completely hooked! I’ve devoured every book in the two series...s (what’s the plural of “series” anyway?) along every other book of yours I could get my hands on. It wasn’t until I reread the Shadow series to have them fresh in my mind before reading the manuscript that I realized what a formative experience reading these books must have been. There was occasionally a little bit of wisdom imparted by one of the characters which I realized that I had long ago taken to heart, but forgot where I had first heard it! It was never anything terribly important (for instance, Bean and Sister Carlotta’s conversation about looking like you have an errand to run but aren’t in a hurry, or the comment about flattery presented as a joke), but it was interesting to run across them from time to time.
Anyway, my only regret is that I had not heard of this website when “Shadow Puppets” was released, and so missed the opportunity to participate in that round. After reading “Shadow Puppets,” though, I saw your mention of Hatrack.com, and have been visiting frequently to read your weekly essays. When I saw the possibility to contribute to this series which has itself contributed so much to my childhood, I jumped at the opportunity. So here are a few requests for clarification:
First, it seemed to me that Han Tzu’s change of heart was a bit abrupt. We all know that he had a rather -- let us say -- unconventional view of patriotism, but from Shadow Puppets it seemed that he was content to serve rather than lead. I wish we had just a bit more time to explore this change in his personality.
Second, I think reintroducing Mazer Rackham provides the perfect opportunity to explain the rather dubious assertion that, in spite of having been the most famous person on earth, his face is almost completely unrecognized. As the documentary about Achilles shows, the media culture has not changed significantly. What would have happened to the approximately 8 million television specials on the “Man Who Saved the World” (or some such thing ;-) ) which would have been looking very hard for photos? What would have happened to the school reports which every second grader would have been doing ten years after the Second Bugger War when they were asked to write about a hero of theirs? They would have hopped right on the nets and started looking for photos to spice up their report. This is already commonplace in schools today and in the world of Ender’s Shadow where the Nets have been integrated even further into society, it would seem to be only more so. So, while I would imagine that it would be possible to prevent any photos from surfacing, the fact that no photos existed would have been the subject of rampant conspiracy theories for many years. Since you took the opportunity to mention the media culture in chapter two it would make sense to at least briefly explain this discrepancy.
By the way, I like the idea that Mazer is of Maori ancestry, but why go halfway. I think it might add some depth if he were to be ALL maori, raised in the modern (or extrapolated as necessary into the future) maori culture. It would shed some light on the attitude he takes with Ender in their first encounter, as that bears a striking resemblance to a Maori rite of passage. Also, and maybe this is just me, I would find it immensely enjoyable to imagine him speaking with that distinctive New Zealand Maori accent! :-D
That’s all I’ve got. I hope I have been some help, and even if not, I enjoyed to opportunity to participate in the community surrounding these wonderful novels. Thank you!
Posts: 61 | Registered: Jan 2005
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My guess is that it is long past the time where Card can make any significant changes in the book.
Posts: 16551 | Registered: Feb 2003
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Maybe... but neither of these are actually very significant. Four or five strategically placed sentences could flesh out the change in Han Tzu's personality, and the two bits about Mazer could be changed in one sentence a piece. In any case, I thought it would be worth mentioning.
Posts: 61 | Registered: Jan 2005
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quote: First, it seemed to me that Han Tzu’s change of heart was a bit abrupt. We all know that he had a rather -- let us say -- unconventional view of patriotism, but from Shadow Puppets it seemed that he was content to serve rather than lead. I wish we had just a bit more time to explore this change in his personality.
This, I think, is why he simply *had* to become the emperor. Because in essence he still just wanted to serve his country.
posted
Yeah, I know it's supposed to be a different facet of the same personality, but it was just a little jarring. In Shadow Puppets, he had this very submissive air: he would do the work, and take the blame, and when he finally let them have it, if they were going to excecute him he wasn't going to stop them. It seems like a rather different mentality to kill the rulers and take over.
Or...maybe it's just me.
Posts: 61 | Registered: Jan 2005
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Han Tzu strikes me as a perfect Chinese... person? He is culturally submissive to authority respecting the rulers and the ancestors and doing good/great work in order to better fufill the goals of his Nation-state and yet is soo aware of his surroundings that when he notices that his government has lost its Mandate of Heaven acted on it to better serve his people and his nation. In fact as far as I can tell all of Han Tzu's dialog over the past 2-3 books in my opinion go perfectly well with what has happened.
Posts: 1567 | Registered: Oct 2004
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Well, I suppose you guys are right. After all, it was always a matter of degree, not of kind. Sid, what do you think about the two sugestions related to Mazer?
Posts: 61 | Registered: Jan 2005
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quote:I like the idea that Mazer is of Maori ancestry, but why go halfway. I think it might add some depth if he were to be ALL maori
My response to that is why not go halfway? It seems kinda silly to contradict the first book without a good reason. Yeah, Maori character raised in an interpolated Maori culture would be interesting, but how much of the book is going to focus on Mazer anyway? Just because something is interesting doesn't mean it should be part of the book. Down that path lies Wheel of Time bloat. Besides, he's already writtin about an extrapolated polynesian culture in Children of the Mind.
About nobody knowing his face. It appears that before he won the war, he was a pretty unremarkable person. I assume that's because in the culture of the military at that time, being an excellent commander/andor/strategist/andor/tactician didn't do much to get you noticed -- being a good beurecrat did. So there would be almost nothing available pre-war. And after the war, the military took immediate steps to hide him, etc., in preparation for the next war.
Posts: 16551 | Registered: Feb 2003
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Right, but those steps to hide him would inevitably have fueled massive conspiracy theories about WHY. They couldn't have stopped 8 million second graders from LOOKING for pictures of him, and from complaining to their teachers when the couldn't find any.
As for bloating the book with Mazer's cultural background, I was suggesting a change which would pertain to that sentence only. The rest of it was taking place in my imagination. Posts: 61 | Registered: Jan 2005
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I feel that the mandate of heaven thing was very patriotic because under the mandate of heaven a ruler only rules until he loses the mandate and then it is up to the loyal chinese people to see that and usurp him. Also what do you have against the wheel of time?
Posts: 832 | Registered: Jan 2005
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AutumnFire: First, it seemed to me that Han Tzu’s change of heart was a bit abrupt. We all know that he had a rather -- let us say -- unconventional view of patriotism, but from Shadow Puppets it seemed that he was content to serve rather than lead. I wish we had just a bit more time to explore this change in his personality.
As others have stated, he would be able to best serve China as the emperor. I think you are also mixing personal ambition into it. In the books, Han Tzu seemed indifferent to awards and accolades and cared more about the overall picture than just what he could grab for himself.
AutumnFire: Second, I think reintroducing Mazer Rackham provides the perfect opportunity to explain the rather dubious assertion that, in spite of having been the most famous person on earth, his face is almost completely unrecognized.
Ender did not recognize him in Ender's Game either. Just because a general is famous, doesn't mean people know what they look like. For example, can you describe what General Patton looks like? How about when he was still a military commander? Finally, most people wouldn't go around looking for the commander who defeated the Buggers over 60 years ago.
AutumnFire: By the way, I like the idea that Mazer is of Maori ancestry, but why go halfway. I think it might add some depth if he were to be ALL maori
posted
What's the other half of him y'think? Irish? (eck, i'll stop now before i ruin my image of the guy completely)
Judas
Oh- and they mention in ES that you can't find any pictures of Mazer Rackham- which brought Bean to believe that there may not have actually been a war hero, they just needed to put a name with the victory for the public- y'know? The humans needed a war hero to look up to. Something to help promote the war effort, and increase numbers in the force for the future.
Posts: 132 | Registered: Feb 2005
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As for Mazer "being" full Maori umm that wouldn't work. Now I am not certain about New Zealand/Australian aberiginals but I am positive I could be wrong that they are like the native north americans in the First Nations here in Canada, that if you were born among them it may mean that you wouldn't get into the military/merchant marine because it goes against your cultural beliefs etc. Do maori live in resevres and have their own representation? Having him half Maori would mean that he could've maybe been born to a maori mother and australian father (or vice versa) and raised in both worlds. Maybe the plot for a mazer book could be him looking up to the stars one day and wishing for the chance to travel among the stars and go into space with all of its beauty and mystery... The book from there could be him leaving the reserve with the anger/love of his family/community and struggling to join the I.F facing racism because the austie representation doesn't like Maori (I'm speaking outa my ass here I don't know if there is any amount of prejudice against Maori) and so instead Mazer joins the Space Merchant Guild becoming eventually captain of his own cargo ship when his captain dies at the hands of pirates (space piracy is mentioned in Speaker for the dead) Mazer takes command of the ship and in a daring manouver defeats the pirates. This gets the attention of the I.F who realize that their lower echelons denied him from joining make him an irresitable offer... Maybe he fights curroption in the I.F which some faction of I.F command tries to court martial him (mentioned also in Ender's Game) and etc etc, a book about Mazer is going to resemble a Star Trek novel alot though seems unavoidable, meh I like Star Trek.
Thats my take on it.
Posts: 1567 | Registered: Oct 2004
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Post Preview quote: -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Do maori live in resevres and have their own representation? --------------------------------------------------------------------------------
(strange, i can't get highlight-reply to do this automatically with the author's name?
No and yes - Maoris are fully integrated into NewZealand life, and don't - i believe - suffer the sort of discrimination you suggest (which is well protected against, so they are possibly stronger than the whites now). Though they do retain their own culture, it is from a strong political/economic position. From http://www.learnenglish.org.uk/magazine/magazine_home_new_zealand.html
quote: In 1975, the government established the Waitangi Tribunal, to clarify the Treaty and honour it as a relevant and living document. Now the New Zealand government has a large Maori representation, and Maori rights have been recovered.
So there would be no problem with a full Maori reaching Mazer's position - But, giving him the mixed background of race/culture gives a double pool of strengths for the author to draw on, which is always good in a hero - The mix gives the option of the "best of both worlds". As well as possible additional strengths, from not being fully accepted in either culture?
(Isn;t this mixed race also dealt with with the - ?Delphiki's, being half-greek?)
Sorry, vague memory - i haven;t read OSC for a number of years, except the 3 books i finished the past 2 days to "catchup" :-o
quote:I am not certain about New Zealand/Australian aberiginals but I am positive I could be wrong that they are like the native north americans in the First Nations here in Canada, that if you were born among them it may mean that you wouldn't get into the military/merchant marine because it goes against your cultural beliefs etc
There are many, many Australian Aboriginies serving in the Australian Army, Navy and Airforce.
In fact, Aboriginal servicemen have been common since WWI. Of course at that time we let them die for the country but didn't officially count them as people - but that's a whole other story.
Posts: 4393 | Registered: Aug 2003
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>>>I am not certain about New Zealand/Australian aboriginals
Also, there is a huge difference between Australian Aboriginals (who have had a pretty rough deal, and some of whom do live in 'reserves'), and New Zealand Maoris who are more integrated into the societies and have better representation, economically and politically. (She said, sitting in the UK talking to mainly US readers about Australasia) h.
Posts: 15 | Registered: Feb 2005
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There has been such an effort to integrate Maoris into the pakeha society that is has almost gone past equality. Not that this is inherently bad but there are many, many opportunities available to those of Maori descent. Additionally, court cases come up continually granting Maori new lands and rights. So, their situation is pretty good, at least compared to how other indigenous people have been treated!
Posts: 57 | Registered: Feb 2005
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quote:so instead Mazer joins the Space Merchant Guild becoming eventually captain of his own cargo ship when his captain dies at the hands of pirates (space piracy is mentioned in Speaker for the dead) Mazer takes command of the ship and in a daring manouver defeats the pirates.
Why would there be space merchants or space pirates when all civilians lived on Earth until colonization began after the third invasion?
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I made Mazer half-Maori because it occurred to me - no great plan in mind.
But having now visited New Zealand for the first time, I have observed that while there are many pure -lineage Maoris, many of whom are trying to maintain at least some aspects of the traditional culture, there is also a lot of intermarriage and a lot of Maoris living very much within the European-sourced culture. Maoris in suits and speaking and acting like any other New Zealander, with, of course, the individual differences that any person brings to the culture.
I've never had a person of part or full Maori ancestry complain that I made Mazer only half-Maori - they seem to recognize that intermarriage is a fact of life in a fully integrated society. Instead, all the part- or full-Maori readers who have spoken to me here have simply expressed appreciation that Maoris are mentioned AT ALL.
The truth is that, relative to their population as a percentage of the population of the entire world, Polynesians in general are VASTLY overrepresented in my fiction <grin>. While I haven't even scratched the surface of India, China, and Indonesia.
I simply don't have a program of equal representation; my only policy is simply NOT to make the future dominantly American or European. In that, at least, I hope I've at least partly succeeded.
Posts: 2005 | Registered: Jul 1999
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