posted
Tom, you are correct that since i am new i've never had the possibly of experiencing a politcal debate here. i don't doubt that there are far more intellectually superior beings that have graced these forums with their arguments, but quite honestly i dont know that i want to read all of them. i'll take your word for it...
Posts: 27 | Registered: Sep 2003
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posted
william, yaknow, i've often thought the same thing before. well, wondered why people use the term "could care less" but i guess it's never stopped me from using it either....
Posts: 27 | Registered: Sep 2003
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quote: as we have grown up through the list, behaviors that were once considered benevolent and more moral are now barbaric.
Amka. Kind of makes you wonder what future civilizations will think of the glories of America in the 21st century, huh?
Would I go back and change it, elektron? Beats me. I have enough problems deciding what to have for dinner, much less changing human history. I guess it comes down to whether it's better to live on your knees or die on your feet. You never know till you get in a life-or-death situation what you can live with.
Posts: 6316 | Registered: Jun 2003
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posted
I know. I should stop harping about it, but it's fingernails on a chalkboard to me.
I also really dislike on this particular forum when people say things such as "your argument is just stupid" and "I'd refute you point by point, but instead I'll let you go do some studying because I'm too lazy to forge a coherent argument right now."
But, that's just me. Posts: 524 | Registered: May 2003
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quote: I also really dislike on this particular forum when people say things such as "your argument is just stupid" and "I'd refute you point by point, but instead I'll let you go do some studying because I'm too lazy to forge a coherent argument right now."
WIlliam- did you consider that maybe their usage of "I could care less" is just a variation on the same theme as the above? Probably what they would type if they weren't so lazy is: "I could care less about your argument, but really I can't be bothered to summon up the energy to care less. Your argument is so foolish that I am just a step below apathetic; which is to say that I care very slightly about your arguent only because it isn't worth the bother required to care less".
Posts: 4548 | Registered: May 2001
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posted
Thanks, Amka. As usual, I am completely uninformed.
Jacare. Of course! You have made me feel so much better! Now, instead of all five fingernails on the board, it's just one exceptionally grating fingernail on an unusually rough board. Thanks again.
[ September 05, 2003, 12:09 PM: Message edited by: Sweet William ]
Posts: 524 | Registered: May 2003
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posted
*grin* Basically, Sweet William, the reason I'm not going point by point through eleKtron's posts is that I've said it all before. DOZENS of times. With literally dozens of caustic newbies of this sort, all of whom tend to behave exactly the same way when they first show up.
I COULD just let OTHER people make the same arguments, but that would probably wind up just as tiresome. So I'm referring eleKtron to threads that he might not only find interesting but actually edifying, to make it possible for him to bring something NEW to this topic that we haven't already considered.
(BTW, how do you feel about "flammable?")
Posts: 37449 | Registered: May 1999
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posted
Could it be possible that the caustic nature of the original post made eleKtron feel a tad put out, and he felt the need to respond in kind?
And then, instead of addressing his points with intelligence and wit, we flame back with "you're stupid;" "you need to study more;" and you don't spell/capitalize very well, and if you want to enjoy the fragrant flatulence of Hatrack you simply must spell well, unless you happen to post things which are joyous to the ear of liberals."
Just wondering if, from time to time, we aren't all just a bit condescending.
BTW, I couldn't care less about "flammable." Posts: 524 | Registered: May 2003
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posted
See, elektron the thing is, that calling people ignorant when your own arguments are vague, fairly incoherent, and horribly mispelt just lends absolutely no credibility to the things you claim.
Also, the juvenile and assinine tone you've taken in this thread makes me wish i could swat you with a rolled up newspaper.
As for you 1000 years ago, whole nations were wiped out argument is crap. Wiped out where? The most common modus operandi of warfare was not mutual annihilation, but subjugation. It's -really- hard to embark on widespread killing when you have to individually stab, cut, burn, or drown entire communities.
Sold into slavery, thats a different matter.
This isn't a matter of "intellectual superiority" this is about making sense, and not abusing others when they point out that you don't.
Posts: 4482 | Registered: May 2000
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posted
SW, I don't recall our resident Grammar Nazis ever saying that he only had to spell well if he were a conservative. IIRC, liberals don't get a free pass from those girls, either -- although they DO tend to swarm like sharks when they smell the blood of newbies. *wry laugh*
Posts: 37449 | Registered: May 1999
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Granted, porcelein girl doesn't use caps either. But there's a difference between the two of you. She's nice. You're being a wanker.
Why the double standard?
Thor regularly gets to post the most incendiary anti-Bush stuff I've ever seen, most of it approaching the infantile level of eleKtron's posts. But Thor never gets the "Little Condescending Talking To From Ralphie."
God, you're all so self-satsfied I can't believe it.
Posts: 524 | Registered: May 2003
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posted
SW - Thor has never gotten a condescending little talk down to from Ralphie because he was around before me. But I have pestered and teased and made fun of and lectured him numerous times.
And he sort of swatted at me like an annoying bug. Much like what just happened. I'm down with that. Once I state my peace, I'm coo'. But I feel the need to at least try and be nice, especially when the tendency is to dog-pile. I'm sorry you think I'm being condescending. I try really hard not to be. I haven't slept in a while today, and I fear it may be affecting my diplomacy. :/
But, ultimately, the thing is that this is a really unique place for most of us. I belong to three forums, and lurk at one, and this is the only place I call home. I think people tend to get REALLY protective of it, because we view it as potentially fragile considering all the crap other forums have.
We're not better, but where we're at FITS, and so we're afraid of losing it to many of the cookie-cutter standard forum dynamics of flames and difficult-to-read english so we stamp that bad boy down before it can emerge.
And, really, if you stick around and find your nitch people are going to be more forgiving you, because they understand you better through time. But you can't come in with both barrels at a place that values peace and not get some kinda smack-down.
edit: "You" as in the collective, not as in Sweet William.
posted
Thor is part of the club. Firstly, we have some insight into what makes Thor tick, and more importantly, we've seen his pain.
Plus, IIRC people did try to deal with him, and found it was throughly pointless (wrt political topics), so he's mostly ignored whne he goes all political (we love ya thor, but sometimes you get a little fanatical).
For instance, in this very thread he's being pretty thoroughly ignored.
People did respond to his first posts with cogent counterpoints, despite their relative nonsensicality but ^eleKtron chose to insult instead of debate.
What facts he did include aren't particularly cohesive, and almost all woefully distorted.
I think the spelling and grammar tangent was more a way for some people to release some of the tensions and redirect them from the personal attacks ^eleKtron was making.
While I try to keep my spelling and grammar relatively clean, I don't mind a mistake here and there in my own discourses. In others, I'm generally tolerant.
^eleKtron, I don't mind your spelling and grammar, though I will say I would have an easier time following your points were your arguments structured more coherently, on both a macro (logical) and micro (grammar/spelling) level.
You are not bringing anything revolutionary to the field of political discourse; in fact, your debating style is best described as tired polemics. I don't bring anything revolutionary to the field either, nothing wrong with that. If we did, we'd have some books on the shelves. What I do not bring to the table are vicious and baseless personal attacks.
You've said some pretty insulting things, things which you shouldn't say to anybody, much less a group of people you just met.
If you're going to stay around, please clean up your act. Be polite.
While you have gotten off on the wrong foot, that doesn't mean you won't fit in pretty well. just ask Ryan Hart .
Posts: 15770 | Registered: Dec 2001
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posted
Sweet William, it seems like I've very often seen you expressing distaste or disgust for the general conduct at Hatrack. I'm curious, if it really bothers you so much, why do you keep coming back?
Posts: 4534 | Registered: Jan 2003
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quote: I guess that means that brains are more important than decency.
No, I think where we differ is whether or not to use the word decency when describe a man who is willing to lie to the congress, UN, and american people in order to start a war that will make his friends rich. Whether it is decent to imprison and torture hundreds in Guantanamo in violation of both US and international law. Whether or not it is decent to cut support for veterans, schools, and the poor so that you can give big tax breaks to the rich. Whether or not its decent to allow corporations to poison our air and water.
In my book, Bush's ethics are the worst of any president in the last century.
Posts: 12591 | Registered: Jan 2000
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posted
Wow, at this point i believe this thread has given up all pretense of being a decent debate between sentient people. From now on, youre all only allowed to point and yell 'poop head'
Just thought I'd pop in and say BAH! You're all wrong! And bad grammar abounds!
and.. and...
poop head.
carry on with the regularly scheduled bickering Posts: 2532 | Registered: Jul 2001
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posted
I try to lend a helping hand whenver possible. Just want a little lightness. This therad was getting heavy. I needed a spotter just to get in. Posts: 2532 | Registered: Jul 2001
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posted
I got a tax break too! And I'm poor! Woo hoo!
Seriously Rabbit, I agreed with some of that, but most of it still seems attributed to lack of brains (i.e. Guantanamo and environment).
Posts: 6367 | Registered: Aug 2003
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posted
:points at PSI, juts chin out: What Rabbit posted, poop head!
My point is that I couldn't care less if a president cheats on his wife. I know plenty of people feel different.
[paragraph cut because I was taken in by that bogus pres. IQ study.]
Say what you like about Nixon, or Clinton. Nixon was a very creepy guy, and Clinton had his share of faults. But at least they had brains, and hopefully tried to use them to advance the interests of America.
posted
SW, do you really not realize that people WERE, in fact, remarkably hostile and dismissive towards Thor's political ranting, back in the day? Heck, it's not like anyone takes Thor's political posts seriously NOW, either.
Posts: 37449 | Registered: May 1999
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posted
When the political commentary is indistinguishable from babbling fluff, there's something seriously wrong. Posts: 37449 | Registered: May 1999
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I think anyone that believes that either end of the polar political spectrum has a moral or idea advantage over the other side is a fool in that area.
American politicians are lazy, faggy, blowhards that eat $5000 dollar dinners, wear fancy suits, and have a clan of 35 people look over their every word.
Worst of all the PROFIT greatly off of the ills, weaknesses and diseases of society.
So everytime people get all hell bent out of shape that their politician is a "good guy" - I've now learned to just read it with a grain of salt.
Bush and his boys are rotten to the core, and it's fuggin' bloodletting laughable that Bush has done such a horrible, horrible job, but he still attracts the blind nationalists who think Jesus Christ is a stock owning, Hummer driving Capitalist.
Bush is rotten. Clinton is rotten. The whole gaggle of politicians that our parents have lined up infront of us as our countries "best men" are pathetic, weak and lame.
49% of me thinks that humanity has gone past the brink of return and GOD should wipe the human race from the face of the Earth and start over.
To see so many people blinded by a talking pile of dung is maddening.
Jesus Christ died for this?
Posts: 2752 | Registered: Feb 2001
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posted
I never claimed that Bush was a saint or that his intentions are pure, what I do claim is that the actions that Bush has taken in office are not those of the devil. In fact, the actions have been more than satisfactory for me. He very well could be a rotten scumbag who only went into politics because he wanted to increase his wealth, but I have little problem with the results and I consider the probable results of a Democratic term to be far worse.
Posts: 3446 | Registered: Jul 2002
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IIRC, liberals don't get a free pass from those girls, either -- although they DO tend to swarm like sharks when they smell the blood of newbies. *wry laugh*
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