quote:Originally posted by Carrie: Except for GoldenEye, the Brosnan plots sucked.
Funny you should point that out... isn't Goldeneye the only one in the series that isn't an Ian Fleming creation?
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But what I'm thinking is that maybe more original, better ideas come out of thin air, rather than trying to ramrod a pre-existing novel or story in to a screenplay.
With Goldeneye, it was all new, and wasn't dependent on any of Fleming's existing work other than the nature of the character himself. And, even then, Goldeneye was criticized because it used too few gadgets, which is why they returned to the gadget-fest that was Tomorrow Never Dies.
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quote: Funny you should point that out... isn't Goldeneye the only one in the series that isn't an Ian Fleming creation?
GoldenEye was the first Bond film not to draw on Fleming material. Tomorrow Never Dies and The World Is Not Enough didn't either, while Die Another Day tried to incorporate parts of Moonraker - Moon's identity change was a bit like Von Der Drache and Frost was originally named Gala Brand - but the movie failed pretty hard.
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I swear, before the scene in the train with Bond talking to Accountant Love Interest (We'll call her ALI), I don't even think Craig had that much dialogue. I was a bit shocked to see him string more than a couple sentences together in a row, and that was what, an hour into the movie?
The opening chase scene was awesome for what it was, but really, way, way too much. It was like watching a zoo employee chasing a monkey. I don't know, the movie as a whole was a great romp, I liked how I was carried from locale to locale, but towards the end the plot really swerved off into crazyland.
Especially the end. I mean, the romp around Europe stuff was pretty and all, especially the part where we see Mr. White apparently staying at the same castle on Naboo that Anakin and Padme did. But it was dead air. We all KNEW that something else was coming, and we knew the status of their relationship, why bother with all that? And who sent him the message that said where Mr. White was? The girl? Why not just tell him beforehand? Why not tell him what is going on and then get his help on the matter? As it was, he damned near pulled off rescuing her, and that was with NO knowledge of the events.
I think it was a fun ride, however ridiculous, until the last 30 minutes or so, at which point I felt like I was watching the first 30 minutes of Casino Royale II, which abruptly ended with little to no explanation of what the hell just happened.
I like the new style, and by the way, I think that was the coolest opening credit sequence I have EVER seen in a movie. But there were plot holes to drive an Astin Martin through.
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quote:Originally posted by Lyrhawn: Why not just tell him beforehand? Why not tell him what is going on and then get his help on the matter?
M explained this, Lyr. The organization Mr. White works for was holding Vesper's -real- boyfriend captive. They bought her silence under threat of killing him if she gave even a hint of betraying them.
Hence, her only clue being an "accidentally" left-behind cellphone.
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Um, didn't they also say that she made a deal with the same organization to protect Bond, and she'd give them the money to spare his life? And that she also knew that in the process they'd probably kill her too?
So, again, why not tell him beforehand? Was there any guarantee they'd let her Algerian boyfriend go? Why'd she stop wearing his necklace towards the end?
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quote:Originally posted by Lyrhawn: Um, didn't they also say that she made a deal with the same organization to protect Bond, and she'd give them the money to spare his life? And that she also knew that in the process they'd probably kill her too?
M speculated that was what happened, yes.
And no, I don't think she knew her boyfriend's life would be safe, or if she could trust James once he found out Vesper had lied to him from the start.
In the book she committed suicide, Lyr. I think it's possible she wanted to die.
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Loved it. Best Bond dialogue ever. Great action and plot.
*Spoiler*
And I'll echo that the last 30 minutes needed cleaning up and shaping up. It would have been logical, of course, for her to steal the money as soon as she'd gotten the password so she could pay off Mr. White and get her boyfriend back. But, she loved Bond and that slowed her down. When she saw the contact in Venice, she knew she had to act and decided to halfheartedly go through with the trade, ending in her death.
I really just wrote this out so I could understand it myself. I was horribly confused at the end in general.
What I would have rather seen:
Bond finding a way to fight back in the torture scene. I was totally let down when a dude just walks in and shoots the bad guy. Bond should have kicked him in the balls and choked him with his feet--then White could come in and 'save' the day right as Le Chaffre was pulling his gun. THEN: 2 minutes of recovery, not 7. THEN: 4-5 minutes of Eva Greene falling in love with him, not 15. THEN: A closing action sequence that rivals the first in tension (I was pretty bored at the end).
I thought the ending plot was weak. I can see why they went there, though--they had to develop the love story between bond and vesper before killing her in the end.
Maybe Eva Greene should have gotten kidnapped again(or had STAYED kidnapped after the first torture scene)--then Bond would have to go on a rampage vendetta to get her back (without her dying) and end the film. Much more effective, if not true to the original.
Close to perfect without the convolution at the end.
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I'm so behind the times. I just saw this movie last night and absolutely loved it.
The low gadgetry works in this film's favor. Daniel Craig's Bond is both more brutal and more resourceful than any other Bond. He doesn't need Q.
I liked the film's pacing, though the second ending ran a little long. They could have done a different torture scene and resolved both traitor plots without a false denoument.
The parkour sequences were amazing. Amazing enough to make me want to exercise so I can do that stuff.
Again, I think the low-tech approach to Bond is the right way to go.
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I'm behind in my movies too. I just rented this DVD last weekend.
I thought it was pretty good, maybe in the 60% area of my Bond film rankings. Daniel Craig seems like a good choice for Bond, he has the looks, physique and panache to pull off the role. He was very believeable.
I guess The Living Daylights and Goldeneye are my favorite Bond films. A View to a Kill has to be the worst--a blimp for a getaway vehicle? And Roger Moore just looked tired, he should have been replaced before that.
Casino Royale did have one thing missing: what my college roommate called the "obligatory dude on fire." You know, when one of the bad guy's no-name henchmen gets set on fire and runs around for awhile waving his arms; usually he ends up falling off something. I can remember a ODoF in at least 4 or 5 Bond films, but I'm sure there are others in the 21 films.
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You're the first person I've seen describe those scenes as such. I didn't think most people on this side of the ocean knew what parkour was.
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You're the first person I've seen describe those scenes as such. I didn't think most people on this side of the ocean knew what parkour was.
I'm usually not a fan of these in Bond films because the jumps look unconvincing or the acrobatics are lacklustre. But I must admit, the sequence ten minutes into CR was pretty darn cool. I love how Bond rips through that wall while the bomb-maker shows off his agility. Hence the phrase "blunt instrument", I suppose.
I had to look up 'parkour' by the way.
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I knew what Parkour was, but it was great being able to watch it on the big screen, rather than some grainy footage on the internet.
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I've never heard of parkour before, very interesting. The parkour sequence at the beginning of Casino Royale was great, exciting yet believable, except when they shimmied up the cable on the crane.
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Why was that unbelievable? Keeping in mind it was just that one black dude, I thought it was, hands down, one of the greatest feats of strength I've ever seen. Do you think it was staged somehow?
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My husband rented this because he likes Bond films, and it's not one of the few genres of movies that I absolutely won't watch. I wasn't expecting to care for it very much, but I was quite impressed.
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That particular part of the scene I found a little incredible, too. That was steel cable they were scaling, and it was taut. If they managed that, in real life-- wow. The human body IS amazing.
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Yes, I think it was staged. I think it might be barely possible, but your hands would be shredded doing it unless it was special cable.
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I have *such* a crush on Daniel Craig, and I do *not* go for blonde guys.
I was hugely impressed with this Bond. I thought it was slick, but still a little dirty...and Bond was smooth, but with some hidden - and very raw and jagged - rough edges.
It made him seem much more real, to me....and I *love* the new sculpted, hairless bod...
I *really* shouldn't be thinking about this at work.
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![[Roll Eyes]](rolleyes.gif)
And Roger Moore just looked tired, he should have been replaced before that.
