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Author Topic: The Graduate School Advice and Support Thread
Jhai
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Advice: if anyone wants to know much of anything about applying to graduate school in different topics, what type of books and internet resources are out there, or even really basic questions, well... I've done a lot of research over the past couple of years, and have just been through the process. I know a lot of others here on the Rack are in or have been in graduate school, and can comment as well.

Support: right now I'm in the waiting stage to hear back on applications, and it's killing me. I thought there were a couple of other applicants, so perhaps we can complain together. Also, next year I'm sure I'll have TAing, classes, and the like to ask advice and rant about. Others should join in, since misery loves company. [Smile]

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pfresh85
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I'm waiting to hear back about applications as well, although I don't really plan on going to grad school anymore.
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blacwolve
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*waves* I'm applying to grad school in the fall, and I feel totally lost. I want to get my Masters in Public Policy, but I don't know much more than that. And I'm supposed to have areas I want to focus on and professors I'm interested in doing research with! I'm just glad I finally figured out what I want to do.

I'm confused about everything related to graduate school. So even the most basic advice would be greatly appreciated.

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pfresh85
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As far as professors in areas you are interested in, the only advice I can offer is check the list of faculty and staff at the various schools you are applying to. Most times they will give you some list of what the professor is focusing on and what they might have written. You can check those out for a starting point. Also it's probably a good idea to talk to a grad student in your field at that school to get some idea for how it is. How you find one though can be tricky.
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Jhai
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What were you applying for, pfresh, and why have you decided to not attend?

Well, considering that you're already on lj, blacwolve, I would suggest you subscribe to the community "applyingtograd," and see if they have any MPP's in residence (be sure to do a search of back-threads). I guess the biggest first question to ask is "why do you want to go to grad school in subject X?" What will you get out of it? Is it for the intellectual learning (a noble endeavor, but one that hurts the pocketbook)? Is it for future career plans (as I would suspect with a MPP)? After you answer that question, you can start thinking about the subfields and particular departments you are interested in researching, and all the other logistics like the GRE.
The first couple chapters of Getting What You Came For: The Smart Student's Guide to Earning an M.A. or a Ph.D. by Robert Peters, one of the best books on graduate school, should lead you through these questions (although I'd be very interested in hearing your answer as well). There's also another book in my school's library (whose title slips my mind), which gives brief, but very good introductions to what graduate school is all about for all of the humanities/social science fields. I'll find that tomorrow and list the title.

Public policy is in some ways very similar to my field of economics (altho easier on the math). My summer research adviser got his ph.d from Chicago's Public Policy program, and now works as an economist.

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Carrie
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I can give both advice and support. I'm waiting to hear back from PhD programs, and am about to finish my MA in May. I've been through the whole application process one full time and another half, so I'm full of support. As far as advice goes, well... I'll do what I can. I mostly know about applications for the Humanities, but one never knows.

TAing blows, most of the time. The most depressing thing is reading horrible paper after horrible paper, as I'm sure I'll be doing this coming weekend - the class has their first paper due Thursday. [Angst]

Also, just keep in mind the motto of graduate school: "Work Harder, Play Harder." [Big Grin]

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Jhai
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What are you applying for, Carrie, and what are you currently in (field-wise)? Is an MA prior to a Ph.D common in your field? We just jump right into the Ph.D in economics.

I'm lucky in that, should I get a TAship (fellowship or research assistant would always be better, of course), I'll probably be able to deal with most of the grading through scantrons and short problems that have right answers. I'm a philosophy major as well, and wince at some of the comments that come from Intro students (and even advanced students). Grading papers cannot be fun.

I wasn't expecting to hear back from programs until very late Feb or even as late as mid-March, but a few departments have been pretty early this year (Caltech, Ohio State, Minnesota, etc). That just makes it twice as worse, since I now feel like I need to check my email every few minutes.

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pfresh85
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I am applying for Ph.D. programs in History. Why have I decided against it? Well for one, I am really uncertain about teaching history (which is what I would probably have to do with a Ph.D.). I'd hate to spend all that time on this degree and then realize at the end of it that I hate teaching. Another thing is the fact that I don't feel like I can take much more history. My whole time in college I've felt like I'm not learning anything from my professors or my peers really. Everything I'm learning is because I'm reading required texts and then going off and reading other things related (via various tangents and the like). I have a feeling Ph.D. work is going to be fairly similar and I just feel like I have better things to do with myself and my time. Who knows though. Maybe I'll change my mind between now and when I have to make a decision about this.
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HollowEarth
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Assume most stuff on a professor's website is either inaccurate or outdated. Send an email to them or one of their grad students. Better: ask on a visit weekend.

You shouldn't go to a school where zero or one person you really want to work for is. Two is the minimum.

Be prepared for everything to take longer and be harder than you think it should be. Doesn't matter if you've done similar stuff before.

I've been told that the first 3 or so years are the worst, I'm not yet sure that I believe them.

I would assume anything that isn't a physical science is probably different.

Chemistry Phd, currently 1.5 years in.

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Carrie
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I'm currently in an MA program in Classics (Greek Philology) and applying to PhD programs in the same. Most programs incorporate the MA into the PhD track, making the latter take about 7 years; for those of us who were slightly deficient straight out of undergrad (I didn't have enough Latin), there are a number of terminal MA programs to help us shore up our deficiencies and then we progress to the PhD program.

I got my first rejection email last Thursday night - my first thought the next morning was Thank the Gods I was drunk when I got that, or I would have been way more upset by it... [Smile]

Sometimes grading papers is a great time. I had a few excellent writers last semester. My (anticipated) problem this semester comes from the subject matter: I'm TAing a class on Homer, and that's my primary research interest. I have a feeling I'm going to need to hold back.

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Samprimary
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Choose one sacrifice: Mind, body, soul. Pick wisely!
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Celaeno
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I'm here for the camaraderie.

In the fall I'll be applying to law schools (I already took the LSAT and have letters of recommendation secured), but I've been thinking lately that I really want a Masters in either Public Policy or Economics. I'd probably apply for the program for my second year of law school, but right now the thought of all the extra research is stressing me out.

I get the feeling that I'll be frequenting this thread if it keeps going for a while.

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Katarain
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Don't settle on a school just because it's close. Move, if you have to. I am disappointed that I went to get my English masters without looking around for other options, like a school that offered an English masters with an emphasis in creative writing.

There should be an college advice and support thread... I would tell all freshman to GET CAREER COUNSELING. I got it in the last few months, and I could just kick myself for not getting it when I STARTED college. So, if you're considering grad school because you just don't know what you want to do with your life, it's not too late to get career counseling now. Don't make a huge, expensive mistake by taking the wrong thing or going in the wrong direction. Your university probably offers it for cheap.

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Tarrsk
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I'm just entering interview season on PhD programs in molecular and cell biology. I just got back from my first interview on Sunday, and have pretty much the rest of the month set aside for them as well. Speaking of which, it is incredibly helpful to plan ahead for the time-sink that your interviews will likely be. If you're in currently in college, schedule your classes so as to keep Thursdays and Fridays as open as possible. If you're working, make sure your employer knows that you'll be missing work consistently for a while- months in advance, if possible.

I second Katarain's advice about career counseling. PhD programs in particular should only be applied to if you know for sure that you can, at the bare minimum, stand research (something that isn't as easy to figure out as it sounds). It helps a great deal to have had actual research experience before applying, not only because it helps your application, but also because it gives you a sense of what life in research is like.

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blacwolve
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See, I've had career counselling, and it was the most useless thing I've ever done. Apparently, I'm suited for just about every career on the face of the earth, including a few that horrify me, like engineering (note: engineering in general doesn't horrify me, just in relation to me). So it actually broadened my options rather than narrowing them.

I want to go into Public Policy because I've noticed that when I watch C-SPAN, I'm paying attention to the policies they debate more than anything else. And I spend a lot of time in my head just coming up with public policy ideas. I'm currently working on a policy proposal for personal finance classes in high school just for fun (although I'd like to do something with it once it's completed). Finally, I want to do something meaningful with my life. I want to know that the world is a better place because I've worked and lived in it.

I'm going to have to make that nicer and smoother for my personal statement, but that's pretty much the gist of it.

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Megan
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See this webcomic for my thoughts on the matter.

[Big Grin]

Good luck to all the applicants, though.

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dkw
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I absolutely loved being a TA. I didn't have to grade papers, though -- mostly facilitating group discussion and the occaisional lecture.
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Katarain
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I did the testing thing in career counseling, and that was pretty neat, but what was really useful was sitting down with the counselor and talking about what I liked and didn't like about previous jobs, what I would want in a job and my personality traits, etc. It helps to know those things about yourself when choosing a career. A test can't tell you everything. And it's not a magic button either. I've had 3 sessions, and I might go for a few more. It would have been amazingly useful when in college for the first time.
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Carrie
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Got my first acceptance today - feels pretty good to be in somewhere. [Smile] It was via email again, but they also say that there's a letter in the snail mail, detailing whatever sort of financial aid package they're giving me. [Smile]

Go Duke!

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Kasie H
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Congrats, Carrie!

[Big Grin]

That's so exciting!

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Ikemook
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I'm going to be applying to Graduate school within a year (I'm taking a year off to recouperate and earn some money), and have been asking some grad students I know for advice. Here's what they've been saying:

1. Have funding. Make sure you have the money to do the work you want to do.

2. Have a clear objective for your Masters, and have it fairly soon. Don't dawdle around on this. Once you have that objective in mind, research it, and don't take too long.

3. If you can find ways to provide your own funding, do so. Professors like students who can bring money to their projects, especially if it prevents the students from begging them for TA positions and whatnot (at least, that's what I've been told; don't know how much this applies outside of anthropology).

4. Learn a technical skill. Learn some sort of technical skill related to what you want to do, so that if you can't find a job, you at least have something to sell yourself with. This is especially important for people who want to get into academia for their career.

5. Make sure this is what you want to do. It's a helluva lot of work and very stressful. Don't do it if you aren't willing to commit to it.

6. Pick a school that will help you. Don't just pick a school to go to because it has nice scenery, or gives you the most money, or because its close. Someone else already suggested something similar to this point. If you're going for a higher degree (Masters or PhD), the education is vastly more important than the fact that the trees on campus turn red in the fall.

Hope this helps. It's all I can remember *_*

[Edited to add: And congrats to those who got accepted to their colleges!]

--David

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pfresh85
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quote:
Originally posted by Ikemook:

5. Make sure this is what you want to do. It's a helluva lot of work and very stressful. Don't do it if you aren't willing to commit to it.

This is the very reason I don't think I'm going to go to grad school, despite the fact I expect the schools I applied to to accept me. I'm not 100% certain it's what I'd want to do, and so I'd rather not commit to the time and work it entails.
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blacwolve
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Congrats, Carrie!

Katarain, it probably would have helped if I'd had previous jobs. But I was a 19 year old freshman in college whose only previous job had been telemarketing for a few weeks, and while I was sure I didn't want to do that anymore, I couldn't narrow things down beyond that. Perhaps if I went in now, I'd do better.

I've noticed one thing about myself, in particular, that would probably narrow things down considerably. I like working on long projects, things I can put down and come back to the next day, things that take me weeks or months to do. Since every job ad I've seen has had something like, "must be able to juggle many tasks", I think my hatred of doing that would severely limit my options.

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Ethics Gradient
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Routes in grad school are very dependent on subject area (obviously) but also on school and country. I'm doing a Masters at the LSE in England and the process and what they are looking for is very, very different to similar programs in the states. I'm sure Kasie can attest to that too.

There are some good books out there - the thing I would really look carefully at is advice on how to write your personal statement (and research statement if you have to do one). What schools look for in personal statements is not necessarily what you might think and it can be good to hear that from the horse's mouth. There was an excellent book I read when applying for my course but I don't recall the title, unfortunately.

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Kasie H
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*nods*

I applied to schools in the U.S. and in England; the application procedures were very different and so were the programs.

The program I was accepted to at Cambridge, for example, is much more self-directed and open-ended than the program I applied to at Georgetown. At Cambridge, they were looking for a fleshed-out, substantive research proposal that fit with a faculty member in the department and had a strong theoretical focus. Basically they expect you to build a foundation for later research on a PhD.

The Georgetown program, by contrast, was a one-year program in security studies that works more like an MBA than like a research degree. It's taught courses, with examinations, and a short paper at the end. They're long on practical experience and networking, shorter on academia, etc.

Going to Cambridge is scary because I know I'll have to be so self-driven and completely focused, but I think the challenge will leave me better off in the long run.

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pH
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Please advise...

After I finish my MBA (in December), I'm wanting to go into another masters program (market research). Is it going to matter if I send more than three letters of recommendation? Because everyone I've asked is more than willing to write one, and I can't decide who should.

Also, oh my Lord, I am going to have two weeks to aggregate years' worth of survey data that's sitting in manilla folders collecting dust....so many folders....

-pH

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Jhai
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I sent out four recommendations with my application for economics. None of my recommenders thought that this would be taken in poor form, although I have been warned that it is possible that the school will just take the three on top, and ignore the fourth.

I would strongly advise against sending 6, and I think 5 might be pushing it a little. If you're having trouble figuring out which ones to use, try to get recommendations that will focus on different parts of your strengths as a student and researcher. In my case, I used one from my academic adviser; she knew about my overall plans and had done a summer research project with me. I asked a professor who I had taken a lot of upper-level classes with to write one, and I also got one from the head of the department, who I had TA'ed for and taken a couple of independent studies with. Finally, I had one from a math professor to comment on my math background (very important for economics).

One thing to think about when applying to grad school is the overall worth of the different parts of the application. For economics, the ranking is roughly: recommendations, quantitative GRE score, math & stats classes and grades (and a few econ classes are important), and research experience. Everything else (like overall GPA, the verbal and analytical GRE scores, statement of purpose) you just need to not embarrass yourself on. Some schools won't even read your statement of purpose.

In English, on the other hand, the statement of purpose is very, very key. So research is important to find out what you need to focus on.

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pH
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I've got:

My MBA director (which could maybe be important, since about 50% of my MBA might end up being independent study)
The professor my assistantship is with (who is the regional director of the SBDC, which is where I do my assistantship)
One of the marketing professors (who apparently thinks I'm super awesome)
One of the SBDC consultants I worked for and her client, for whom I wrote what they thought was a really, really good marketing plan (I thought it kind of was...not so great, but hey)

-pH

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scholar
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I've got to agree with Megan. Of course, this comic sums up my recent experience:
http://www.phdcomics.com/comics/archive.php?comicid=816

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pfresh85
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So I got my first response from graduate schools: a rejection. From the wording of the letter though, it sounds like they didn't accept me because they wanted people who are specialized in Western US and Native American history, whereas my focus is on European and Asian history. *shrugs* I guess that's how it goes.
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Jhai
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I haven't heard anything from any school yet, so I'm freaking out a bit.

Oh, and pH, I'd got with the first three, since the second professor can probably talk about the work you've done at SBDC.

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Carrie
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I'm still waiting on six letters. At current count, I've got one letter up on the "Wall of Shame and Rejection," and two offers of full funding.

I keep telling myself not to worry, and that I should probably focus on finishing the semester out. [Wink]

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Carrie
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Quick! What are phone interviews like? I've got one coming up either Monday or Tuesday evening and have no idea what to expect. My sister was tormenting me with the idea that they'll quiz me on my knowledge or - even worse - try to speak with me in Greek, but I really hope that's not the case.

Any advice?

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Celaeno
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I would assume that phone interviews aren't very much different from in-person interviews, but I've never had a phone interview. I guess I wouldn't know.

I highly doubt they would "quiz" you or try to speak to you in Greek. That just wouldn't be a fair test of your capabilities. It'll probably be more standard questions like, "Why do you think we're a good fit for you?" and "What can you contribute to our environment?"

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GForce
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anybody here looking at Hopkins?
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sarahdipity
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I have a friend in the Math PhD program there.
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Jhai
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Carrie - I don't have any specific advice, but I bet some of your professors might, since they went through this whole grad school application thing once upon a time... I have a feeling that Celaeno's "standard questions" are more like what you'll be facing. It'd probably be a good idea to be familiar with the work of the department so that they'll know you're interested in attending.

GForce, I'm applying to Hopkins for their econ program. Haven't visited or anything, though.

In personal news, I got my first news today - a rejection from Duke. I'm not too sad about it: the department wasn't one of my favorites, I knew that they had weird history of rejections and acceptances, and they rejected some really, really good students. So I'm hoping that they thought I wouldn't attend there because I'd surely get an acceptance from somewhere better or something.

*whistle* That's my belief and I'm sticking to it.

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katharina
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I have heard from no one. [Frown]
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Carrie
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The interview today went well. The professor with whom I spoke, even though I could hardly hear him half the time, seemed impressed with my "initiative" both in the teaching and study abroad spheres. I guess that means I'm in at UT.

Hmm. Last time, I only had two options; the time before, one. This is a new experience.

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katharina
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I got accepted into one place, which is great. It is not the one I want to go to, though, so I'm still hoping.
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rivka
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Congrats, Katie. And good luck!
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Carrie
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Congratulations! Once you're in the first place, the waiting becomes a bit easer - you know you have at least one option. [Smile] I have no doubt you'll get into more places, but at least now you can relax a bit.
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katharina
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I am happy to get accepted. [Smile] It means I am not the disaster of a candidate I secretly suspect I am.

However, I really, really don't want to go there. If that is the only place I get in, I have a terrible decision to make. I want to stay in DC, so there's really only one place that matters. I applied to one tony school that I don't have the slightest chance of getting into, but in case I do get in there, I think I would accept that as well.

It seems like I'm waiting for everything right now. Waiting for schools to get back, waiting to hear back from a job application, waiting for my personal life to straighten out. It's very strange.

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Kasie H
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Katie,

I knew you had asked about schools before but didn't know where you were applying! Congrats on your acceptance, hope the DC school works out (*dying to know which one*...)

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katharina
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No secret. [Smile] U of Maryland has a program where I could get a Master's in Latin at night and still keep my job. If I get funding I'll be tempted to quit and go full-time, but I've grown fond of health insurance and new shoes and paying rent, so that would be hard to do.
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Shmuel
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As a general rule, no news is good news. The first wave of rejections tends to hit mailboxes earlier... the longer the wait, the further along you've gotten toward being accepted.
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Kasie H
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That is awesome! Very exciting.
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Carrie
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Depending on the funding, you may get health insurance. I know that with TA positions (which come with full-time student positions) normally provide it.

New shoes and rent, however... well, they're another story entirely. [Smile]

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Jhai
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I got my first acceptance today, after 3 rejections, so I'm feeling pretty happy. I had been really worried that one of my recommendation writers screwed me over and written something really horrible (not that I had ANY reason to suspect that).

But, as of now, I know that I can at least attend UC Davis' Econ program in the fall. It's my last-choice school, but it still has a decent program in international trade and development. I made sure that I didn't apply anywhere that, when push came to shove, I wouldn't want to attend. To future applicants: don't waste money & time on safety schools that you actually don't want to attend. It's just, well, a waste.

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Carrie
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Congrats on your acceptance!
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