I think on-line videogames are probably a different matter from console play. With the average console game, there is a limit to the variability of intensity, which I think is one of the more important symptoms of addiction in my opinion. I mean, fortunately, you only have so many hours in a day to flush down the toilet so you can't generally go beyond the time you already posess in playing videogames. Though most videogames have grades of difficulty one can use to intensify the experience.
But in interactive settings, I think there is the ability to intensify the game playing experience. I guess it's one reason I haven't gotten my Xbox online. I've also seen my husband go overboard with "unbeatable scenarios" in his Real Time Strategy games.
I don't know, maybe it can happen with forum posting as well.
Posts: 11017 | Registered: Apr 2003
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Just look at the number of people who play World of Warcraft to excess.
I would, however, say that anything and everything cna be addictive. Psychologically addictive at the very least. I know at times I would go to Chick-Fil-A 10-15 times a week (and mind you that was when I would 20 or so hours a week at 7.25 per hour, trying to save money for college)
I started going there when I would go into work- I'd eat right before after school, then it progressed that I would go there even if I wasn't going to work- and I could just go home and get a bigger meal anyways.
Or people that are addicted to work? Or money?
Posts: 980 | Registered: Aug 2005
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quote: I don't know, maybe it can happen with forum posting as well.
That's the craziest thing I have ever heard of!
My favorite part of the article was, "Despite a lack of scientific proof, Jacob Schulist, 14, of Hales Corners, Wis., says he's certain he was addicted to video games — and that the AMA's vote was misguided."
Well its too bad that AMA does not accept the testimony of a 14 year old as authoratative.
Out of curiosity are withdrawal symptoms required to label something as addictive?
Posts: 14316 | Registered: Jul 2005
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[On an unrelated note- that emoticon is the absolute best one for visualizing addiction/withdrawal]
Posts: 980 | Registered: Aug 2005
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quote:Out of curiosity are withdrawal symptoms required to label something as addictive?
The inability to focus on anything else, crankiness, headaches. Withdrawal is one symptom. Excessive time is a separate one, as well as displacement of family and friend relationships, continued use despite adverse consequences, and increased intensity as mentioned above. They all overlap a bit, but are separate problems.
In workaholism, I have found myself grinding away at a task that is not particularly necessary or productive. I wasn't even working excessive hourse, but I was using work to avoid thinking about other situations. Must have worked, I don't remember what they were.
P.S. I thought you asked what withdrawal was. That's what I get for working while I post! Posts: 11017 | Registered: Apr 2003
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Did they ever do a study of collectible card games like Magic: the Gathering?
I was totally addicted to that in high school. Every waking hour was spent thinking about card combinations, strategy, and themed deck-building. I always had at least one deck with me, and my friends and I would play everywhere from the bleachers during gym to the seat of a bus on the way home.
It got to the point that I would play my own decks against each other to see potential weaknesses - even sometimes playing five decks against each other to see how they fared in larger group games.
I'd talk about it, think about it, and even dream about it. All my spare money went toward it, and I even shoplifted a pack or two of cards when I didn't have money for it.
If that's not an addiction, I don't know what is.
Eventually my friends and I made a "cold turkey" pact that we were going to stop altogether - none of us would play each other at all, or talk about the game at all. I got over it, and now I can play with my old decks without feeling those old compulsions.
I was starting to get that way with World of Warcraft, too - and when I noticed, I cancelled my subscription before it got worse.
Posts: 3960 | Registered: Jul 2001
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The only reason some people say that videogames are addictive is because videogames are not productive.
You would never hear anyone say a teenager who reads a lot is addicted to reading. This is because reading is educationial.
However, after getting Red Prophet from the library on a Saturday afternoon not too long ago, I stayed in my room until I finished the book. I doubt my parents would have let me stay home on a Saturday night just to play videogames by myself.
Curse you Orson Scott Card for making your books so addicting!
Posts: 77 | Registered: Apr 2007
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I'd post a reply, but I'm busy chatting with an apparently female dark elf. You know how they are...
Posts: 3486 | Registered: Sep 2002
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I'm curious, what is the medical distinction between addiction and obsession?
Based on my experiences with Magic (and later, with Command and Conquer, StarCraft, and World of Warcraft... and even poker, to a certain extent), I started to think that maybe I had an addictive personality - that I would get "hooked" on things.
But thinking about it more, I think have an obsessive personality - sometimes certain things consume me, and I have trouble letting them go. This mostly happens with games or puzzles - I need to finish, to get to the end, to accomplish the goal. And when there is no single goal, but multiple, nigh-infinite goals... I have trouble letting go at all.
So, is there a real distinction? Are those who are "workaholics" simply obsessed with work, rather than addicted to it? And is this just splitting hairs - are the two conditions treated the same?
Posts: 3960 | Registered: Jul 2001
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I think it's been proven that workaholics- don't actually get as much real work done as somebody who... you know... sleeps.
I think addiction would work here more than obsession can- because look at OCD- the obsessions are quite different than what we would know as an obsession. (If that makes any sense at all), I think addiction is a good word.
Posts: 980 | Registered: Aug 2005
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quote:The only reason some people say that videogames are addictive is because videogames are not productive.
How much time do you or other people spend just staring at the wall? Hours on end? Clearly video games fulfill some sort of need or desire and therefore they are productive in that regard.
I think online games are more addictive for MANY people because it introduces the ability to socialize with people while playing. People spend hours upon hours texting, messaging, calling, etc. That function is also possible in a game and you can play at the same time.
edit: Its why the arguement, "But its not real therefore its not as valid as a chess addiction or a book addiction" bothers me. Online video game ARE populated by very real people who have feelings and opinions.
If you are minding your business and a guy sneaks up and kills you, there is a person behind the attack. If you decide to come back, hunt him/her down and camp their corpse you can expect they will respond in a human way. They might give up in dismay and log. They might ressurect and try to run away, fight back, plead for peace, laugh at you, either way its a feeling with far more depth then defeating a computer controlled character whose actions can be predicted.
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My thought on obsession rather than addiction was that I think you really can stop playing games if you want to (at least I did).
I mean, I understand addiction to chemicals (nicotine, alcohol, adrenaline, endorphins, etc), and I understand addiction to risk/reward behaviors like gambling. It just seems easier to walk away from games.
At least, that's my experience. I think my dark gaming days were obsession rather than addiction - mainly because I willed myself to stop, and can still have a more casual relationship to the same games I "gave up" years ago.
Posts: 3960 | Registered: Jul 2001
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I believe video game addiction is usually a symptom of a larger problem. The one person I know who is addicted to video games uses them as an escape. In his case, I think he doesn't want to admit that his mother's been dead for a year and a half, (before she died, he was a bit anti-social, but he didn't play video games too much and could actually be persuaded to go out and get a haircut now and then) Nowadays, he has something like four online game subscriptions, avoids all human interaction, doesn't have a job, and hasn't been outside since the funeral. So yeah, I'd say he's addicted to video games, but for reasons that really have little to do with their content.
Back when I was in Junior High, I'd say I was addicted to video games to, but again, it was an escape from situations I didn't want to think about or work on fixing.
Posts: 681 | Registered: Feb 2004
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quote:Originally posted by Shawshank: I think addiction would work here more than obsession can- because look at OCD- the obsessions are quite different than what we would know as an obsession. (If that makes any sense at all), I think addiction is a good word.
Although when it comes down to it, you can view OCD as an addiction. Or a series of addictions. I think.
Wasn't there an article posted a while ago about people who fail out of college because of WoW?
quote:Originally posted by otterk10: You would never hear anyone say a teenager who reads a lot is addicted to reading. This is because reading is educationial.
There is such thing as "too much of a good thing". People can and have been addicted to things like reading before, for sure. Me, for example.
Posts: 1594 | Registered: Apr 2006
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The word "compulsive" comes up a lot in discussion of addictive behaviors, like gambling, eating, spending etc.
quote:My thought on obsession rather than addiction was that I think you really can stop playing games if you want to (at least I did).
Not everyone who drinks is an alcoholic. Even opium didn't keep hold of everyone who tried it, based on the usage of soldiers in Vietnam (according to M. Scott Peck, arguing on the morality of palliative end of life care).
Posts: 11017 | Registered: Apr 2003
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It's old and prolific already, but the Daedalus Project is worth mentioning in every discussion about the psychology of online gaming.
Posts: 4313 | Registered: Sep 2004
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quote:Originally posted by erosomniac: It's old and prolific already, but the Daedalus Project is worth mentioning in every discussion about the psychology of online gaming.
I hadn't seen that before. Thanks for the link! It looks great.
Posts: 628 | Registered: Nov 1999
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quote:Originally posted by FlyingCow: I'm curious, what is the medical distinction between addiction and obsession?
There is no medical definition of "addiction." Well, no standardized medical consensus -- the word is not defined with standard criteria.
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Edited to add: There are, however, standardized [medical] criteria for "abuse" and "dependence." And "obsession" has a standard [medical] definition -- but not "addiction." It's a lay term, not a diagnosis.
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Well, I would have to say that any habit is an addictive action, a compulsion to perform a certain action. We are addicted to our cars, to lights, to running water and inexpensive media. We are addicted to our spouses and our jobs and our friends.
When someone has a serious life-based shift, they go through all the stages of grief and/or withdrawal. We are creatures of habit. Habit is the manifestation of addiction. I think the problem here is that we are immediately assuming an addiction is a damaging effect. My personal addiction to running keeps me from getting overweight and stabilizes my emotions and my metabolism, I sleep better and feel better, but nonetheless it is an addiction. I think we need to remove the negative stigma from the term "addiction" before we start asking whether or not a particular action is an addiction. This prejudice is clouding our thought processes.
Posts: 883 | Registered: Aug 2005
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Maybe, though, that's the distinction the word needs, RunningBear. The difference between "habit" and "addiction" is that an addiction is something that has negative impact.
I also think that "addiction" (at least in my mind) is something that is extremely difficult to give up without outside intervention.
So, chewing gum can be a habit. Smoking an occassional cigarette can be a habit (though likely considered a "bad habit"). Smoking two packs a day (and being unable to go a day without lighting up) would be an addiction. By contrast, collecting every piece of Joe Camel memorabilia ever produced would be an obsession.
At least that's how I've defined the terms in my own head. YMMV.
Posts: 3960 | Registered: Jul 2001
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quote:Originally posted by FlyingCow: The difference between "habit" and "addiction" is that an addiction is something that has negative impact.
then bad habits = addictions? that doesnt sound right.
The one thing that i dislike about any online game is there is no point to it. you level up a character to become stronger, but thats it.
Posts: 813 | Registered: Nov 1999
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quote:The one thing that i dislike about any online game is there is no point to it. you level up a character to become stronger, but thats it.
At first I thought that the purpose of leveling up would be to be able to go to unexplored areas that are more of a challenge, but it ended up that those areas aren't really much different; they're really the same thing, just with different scenery and monsters that require more clicking to kill.
I've only played two online MMPROGs in my life:
- The Ultima Online second Beta, which was exceedingly weak, but then gain I was basing it on my love for the original series, which was really nothing like it.
- Pristontale, which is the single most pointless MMORPG I've ever seen. The sole purpose of the game is to level up by beating monsters; last I played it, there was literally only ONE quest in the ENTIRE GAME.
Posts: 3486 | Registered: Sep 2002
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quote: The inability to focus on anything else, crankiness, headaches. Withdrawal is one symptom. Excessive time is a separate one, as well as displacement of family and friend relationships, continued use despite adverse consequences, and increased intensity as mentioned above. They all overlap a bit, but are separate problems.
This description fits a few people I know that are hooked to WOW. The worst example occured when I went a trip with some people a few years ago. After a few days of constant crankiness and talking about missing WOW, one guy went and bought a laptop for the sole purpose of playing the game on the trip.
Posts: 1947 | Registered: Aug 2002
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I worked with a guy who would show up late for work (the shift was 1-9:30, usually, or 12-8:30 on weekends) after staying up until 3 or 4 in the morning playing WoW. He lived maybe 10 minutes from work.
Posts: 3354 | Registered: May 2005
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