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Author Topic: Any Suggestions for Vegetarian Alternatives to Chicken in a Particular Dish?
Noemon
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I've been attempting to cut back fairly dramatically on my meat consumption, possibly transitioning to a fully vegetarian diet. I've got a recipe that I really like, though, that involves shredded chicken. Anybody have any suggestions for something I could use as a substitute for the chicken? The key thing I'm looking for is texture, here. Things that I've thought of are (in no particular order):
Spaghetti squash - too noodly
Tofu - too mushy
Textured soy protein - not a bad choice, but I'm wondering if there might be something better
Tempeh - not the right texture at all
Seitan - not a big fan of what little seitan I've had, but if someone turned out to be a big seitan booster I'd listen. I don't really know much about this one.
Quorn - seems like a distinct possibility, and may be the best thing I've been able to come up with, if I can find someplace around here that sells it

Anybody have any other ideas, or input on those I've already thought of?

[ July 05, 2007, 10:31 AM: Message edited by: Noemon ]

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Tante Shvester
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Morningstar Farms makes some vegetarian meat analogues, including a chicken-y one.


Or maybe you can use mushrooms in your recipe. Those big portabella mushrooms have a texture not entirely unlike chicken.

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Javert
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No suggestions. Just eat chicken.

You know, given half a chance, they would eat you!

[Wink]

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Noemon
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I'm familiar with their pre-shaped products, but do they sell blocks of the stuff that would be large enough to be useful for cooking purposes?

Mushrooms are an interesting idea. Really interesting. I'll have to give that some thought. I could see using a variety of mushroom types in the dish, actually.
In case it helps in brainstorming alternatives, here are the other ingredients in the dish in question:
chopped tomatoes
chopped green chilis
chopped onions
minced garlic
cumin
cilantro
red wine vinegar
crushed red pepper

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Stephan
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quote:
Originally posted by Javert:
No suggestions. Just eat chicken.

You know, given half a chance, they would eat you!

[Wink]

Not to mention, if we stopped eating them, they would go extinct.
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MattP
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Just curious - why are you cutting back/out meat?
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DeathofBees
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That looks like a great Mexican dish! Try a variety of whole, cooked beans--frijoles negros would be good or a mix of white beans. Top it with crumbled queso fresco, probably available in your grocery's dairy section near the ricotta and fresh parmesan or at your local Latino butcher shop.
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jasonepowell
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Trying to replace a meat is just going to leave you with a pale imitation of a meat dish. Skip it entirely. You'll probably find that you don't miss it.
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Tante Shvester
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Morningstar Farms makes a shredded pseudo-chicken product.
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dkw
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I think tofu can be pressed and drained to eliminate the mushiness factor.

If you're not too worried about a protein replacement I would use shredded parsnips in that recipe. Grate them on the small end of a cheese grater. You could use carrots, but the taste and color wouldn't go as well.

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Enigmatic
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I've heard that forum-based roleplaying games are a pretty good substitute for chicken.

--Enigmatic

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Tatiana
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I'm not sure if this will work or not, but there's a product called Quorn that is a high-quality protein substitute for chicken or ground beef. It's not available everywhere, and it is a bit drier and less flavorful, but you can make up for that with spices and so on. See what you think. I like the nuggets a lot.
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aspectre
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Yuba
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ketchupqueen
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TVP comes in chicken-flavored but I don't think you would get the same texture.
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ketchupqueen
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(I think DKW might be onto something with parsnips, although I would grate them on a bigger grater so they wouldn't mush quite so much.)
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Noemon
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Matt, there are several reasons, actually. I've never spent much time with an animal (well, with a mammal or bird, anyway) without discovering that it had a pretty distinct personality. I'm uncomfortable with the idea of beings dying so that I can eat them, given that I live in a society in which alternatives exist that will provide me with the necessary nutrients. That's my primary reason, really. A secondary reason is a desire to limit my environmental footprint. Health is a third concern, although that applies to red meat more than poultry.

DeathofBees, beans would be a great addition! I'll definitely try throwing some in.

Jason, in general I can see your point, although I don't entirely agree with you. With this dish, though, something definitely needs to take the place of the meat. In general I think that recipes that are designed from the ground up as vegetarian are the way to go, but in this case I'm looking specifically for a way to enjoy a variation of a meat dish.

Tante, I'll check it out. Thanks!

Dana, that makes sense. I forgot to mention it in my initial post, but baked tofu had occurred to me as a possibility.

Parsnips, eh? I've never actually had parsnips, that I'm aware of. That's an intriguing suggestion. Wouldn't they get mushy if cooked for any length of time, though?

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ketchupqueen
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They have a sturdier texture than most veggies, almost like potatoes.

In fact, one thing you could do is matchstick them and fry them before using, although that is not exactly a healthy alternative. [Wink]

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breyerchic04
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I have had unflavored tvp used like shredded pork or chicken in a bbq sandwich and it worked decently.
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rivka
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I was going to recommend the same product Tante did. It's excellent -- and when it's on sale, not too bad price-wise.

You can also get TVP that's quite good. I'll see if I can find a box of the stuff I like that's chicken-like.

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mr_porteiro_head
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Mushroom, as was already suggested, can be a surprisingly good meat substitute.
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rivka
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This one is pretty good too. However, no cheaper than the frozen stuff and more perishable.
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Bob the Lawyer
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If you freeze tofu it's texture changes when it's thawed to be more chewy.
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MattP
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quote:
I've never spent much time with an animal (well, with a mammal or bird, anyway) without discovering that it had a pretty distinct personality.
Having had a dozen or so pet chickens for the past several years, I can assure you there's not a lot of distinct personality going on with those things. That said, I did have to butcher one once (a rooster that was killing other roosters) and it was unpleasant enough experience that I probably wouldn't eat chicken if I had to kill them myself.
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DSH
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Can someone please explain why it is necessary for a vegetarian meal to taste (or feel) like meat?

Personally, I like the way veggies taste w/out trying to get them to taste like something else (i.e. chicken, beef, etc.)

If you're interested in something that tastes like chicken, I would recommend chicken! [Wink]

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rivka
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quote:
Originally posted by DSH:
Can someone please explain why it is necessary for a vegetarian meal to taste (or feel) like meat?

Who says it does? I like the way tofu tastes. I also like the way many "meat substitutes" taste.

And I like chicken too. [Big Grin]

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Tatiana
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In general, a good meat substitute in recipes (not necessarily for chicken, and doesn't taste the same) is eggplant. For instance, chicken parmesan --> eggplant parmesan. It doesn't taste like meat but it tastes substantial and makes you feel like you've eaten a real meal the way meat does. I absolutely love eggplant now. It's best to cut it into strips and let it sit in salt for a while to get the bitterness out, then rinse and pat dry with a paper towel before using in your recipe. Ratatouille, (the dish, not the movie), is one of my favorite veggie dishes. I make it the way Julia Child describes in her Art of French Cooking book, but simplified because hers is so complicated. [Smile]
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Noemon
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quote:
Originally posted by DSH:
Can someone please explain why it is necessary for a vegetarian meal to taste (or feel) like meat?

I haven't seen anyone here advance that argument. Have you?
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Noemon
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I'm really interested in trying Yuba. I'd never even heard of it. I'll probably play around with quorn too, as I've discovered through the quorn site that a grocery store near my house carries it (yay! I'd looked for it at several other stores in the last week or two, but hadn't thought of looking there).

Tatiana, I'm not really a big fan of eggplant. The larger, purple variety and the golf ball sized green and white ones both taste...vaguely poisonous to me, somehow. I wonder if I might be slightly allergic to them or something. The ones the size of big peas I don't eat, of course, but I do like the flavor they impart to the foods they're cooked in.

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Qaz
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I would try beans. The texture is different but they aren't mushy.
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Ela
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quote:
Originally posted by jasonepowell:
Trying to replace a meat is just going to leave you with a pale imitation of a meat dish. Skip it entirely. You'll probably find that you don't miss it.

I I agree with Jasone.
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Ela
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quote:
Originally posted by dkw:
I think tofu can be pressed and drained to eliminate the mushiness factor.

Yes, it can, and that's what I usually do if I want the tofu to have a firmer texture. It also helps to start with very firm varieties of tofu.

I substituted tofu in a chinese spaghetti salad that calls for chicken and I like the results - in fact, the chinese spaghetti salad with tofu has become a family favorite. But I am not expecting the tofu to taste or feel like chicken.

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Primal Curve
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I'm going to third the beans suggestion. I think it's appropriate for the dish.
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Noemon
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Yeah, I agree that beans would be good. Rice too, actually.

I think I'll make it with both of them either tonight or tomorrow night.

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BlackBlade
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Dana already suggested baked Tofu, but I REALLY want to endorse that option. The Chinese have done some incredible stuff with Tofu that you just don't see in America.

Let me see if I can find some of their recipes for meat substitutes.

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Mucus
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Since no one has mentioned it since the OP, I've had a fair amount of experience with wheat gluten (which appears to translate as seitan? no idea how that happens since I always buy it at Chinese supermarkets) and I thought I'd give my thoughts on the matter.

There's some info on it at Wikipedia if you search for "wheat gluten"

Although to be honest, the pictures in that article kinda suck and do not do the various varieties justice.

Usually you can find either small cans of what the article calls "Oily/oil fried gluten" or bigger containers with a variety of different forms and flavours. There's this reddish sweet and sour type that tastes really good. The best case is if you can get to a big Chinese supermarket like T&T. They usually have the big trays prepared fresh.

I have no idea if you can use it as a substitute in a recipe that requires cooking though, I always use it as a side-dish for noodles or other food.

Note that I simply eat it because it tastes good, I'm actually pretty far from being a vegetarian.

(As a side note, I actually hate tofu except in this dim sum dessert form, which probably makes me a Chinese heretic or something)

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rivka
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I buy seitan in liquid, in containers much like tofu. It's fairly good, and works as a chicken substitute. It doesn't stand up to heavy cooking, but adding it a few minutes before the cooking is complete to heat it through works well.
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Noemon
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BlackBlade, any tips on achieving the proper consistency with baked tofu? I haven't had a lot of luck with producing something that has the mouthfeel of the baked tofu you can buy in grocery stores.
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BlackBlade
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quote:
Originally posted by Noemon:
BlackBlade, any tips on achieving the proper consistency with baked tofu? I haven't had a lot of luck with producing something that has the mouthfeel of the baked tofu you can buy in grocery stores.

I've only made it once with my father. Let me talk to him, he can make just about anything knock your socks off. His speciality is Asian cuisine.
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Noemon
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[Smile] Very cool; I can't wait to hear his advice!
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Zalmoxis
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I don't know how they did it, but there used to be this great vegetarian Chinese place in Berkeley that made the most amazing chicken and pork-like dishes. Sadly, something happened and the quality of the food changed (the cook probably left).

I eat chicken. And pork. And beef. And lamb. And I'd eat all sort of game if I had a fresh, free source for it. But the texture and flavor of this stuff filled a need I didn't know I had -- for firm, tasty non-animal-derived protein.

I think the main reason for a "meat substitute" is not because you want something that comes across as a meat substitute (or if you do, then, in my experience, you become either a miserable or backsliding vegetarian). Rather it's about how the protein conveys texture, mouth-feel and flavours and how it interacts with other ingredients in the dish and sits in your stomach. The problem with sticking solely with eggplant and mushrooms (although I adore both) is sometimes you want a "meatier" texture and something that rests differently in your belly.

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Noemon
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On the subject of baked tofu, there's a Chinese restaurant in my area that has a Chinese menu as well as an American one. I can't read Chinese, of course, so ordering off of it is a bit of a crapshoot, but I like trying interesting things, so usually get something from it each time I go there.

They have a phenomenally good baked tofu salad, which is essentially shoestring cut baked tofu, shoestring cut cucumber, cilantro, and a few other things that are slipping my mind at the moment, all drizzled with sesame seed oil. It's one of the most delicious things I've ever eaten.

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aspectre
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Confessions of a vegetarian, kinda. Something to consider is that eating local free-range meats and poultry can be far more environmentally friendly than being a typically careless vegetarian.

You can purchase pre-made aburaage pockets, frozen or canned.
The frozen is far better for home-cooking, and probably the best replacement for chicken.
The canned is usually preflavored in a sauce that, while tasty stuffed with sushi rice, precludes use in many dishes.

Then of course there are "tennis shoe laces" stripped from calabash gourds. Kinda like spaghetti squash, but chewier.
The unenlightened call it kanpyo/kampyo or hulu/huzi.
Buy it dried and experiment in your preparations; there are some quite nice recipes.
The "ready to use" packets are mostly ready to be tossed in the garbage, preferably without opening first.
Haven't tried any Italian calabash dishes. Doesn't even appear to be the same type of calabash.

Gobo also has that type of mouth resistance which might make a suitable replacement for meat. Try julienned burdock root using several different recipes. Stirfry thin-julienned gobo with fresh green beans, snow peas, and/or 1/4inch-thick potato sticks. Make sure you undercook the green beans and snow peas, and especially the potato sticks.
Dice finer and add to fried rice recipes.
Boil in a sauce for a side dish.
Admittedly gobo can be an acquired taste. I've always loved the stuff.

Which reminds me that 1/4inch-thick potato sticks can also be a satisfactory meat replacement. The main thing is to quickly stirfry the potato sticks with lots of black pepper and a little salt, undercooking greatly so it doesn't attain the texture of french fries.

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The Rabbit
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I've found that both mushrooms and eggplant work as good substitutes for meat in many recipes. They don't taste like meat but they have good texture for things like Lasgana.

Ground nuts also work well in alot of recipes but you need to make sure the flavor works well with the rest of the recipe. I found that almonds, pecan and walnuts have a more neutral flavors than peanuts, Hazelnuts and Cashews but all of them can be good depending on the dish.

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BlackBlade
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Bah! Sorry Noemon I finally got to talk to my father yesterday but with my mom constantly trying to get the phone from me I forgot to ask about baked tofu. [Frown]
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Sterling
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I use a lot of yams and sweet potatoes in vegetarian Mexican and Tex-Mex dishes. They're great in Chili, and one of the Moosewood books has a black bean and sweet potato burrito that's about as savory and satisfying as you could possibly ask for.

Diana Shaw's "Almost Vegetarian" has some good recipes for pressed tofu. Her recommendation for pressing:

1. Put several layers of absorbent paper towel inside a baking pan or wide bowl.

2. Put a one-pound block of firm or extra-firm tofu on top and put another few layers of paper towel over it.

3. Weigh it down with something very heavy, such as a cast-iron pot or a pile of ceramic plates. Refrigerate overnight.

Then season, marinate, or glaze the pressed tofu and broil 4-6 minutes per side.

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