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Author Topic: An interesting opportunity
Tstorm
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Okay, for this thread, you'll need a little background information:

I'm currently employed as a Web Developer at a community college in Kansas. The town is (relatively) small. Most of my friends from college live quite a distance away. I participate in a few college events throughout the year and I visit my parents once every month or so, on the weekends. Work keeps me busy, but I some free time outside of work.

At work, I'm currently in the planning stages of re-designing the entire web site. On top of that, we're rolling out a new student information system portal (Jenzabar's JICS), and I'm a large part of that, though my boss, the IT Director, also has a hand in it. Between those two projects are numerous other little tasks and duties. I spend anywhere from 15 minutes to a few hours a day working on something that's not web-related. This includes PC support for faculty and staff and installing our ridiculously complex wireless security configuration on student laptops. Overall, I'm quite busy at work, but I don't feel truly overloaded yet.

As far as careers go, I'm enjoying this job immensely. I'm still foggy on my longer-term goals, though. I'm learning a ton of new technology-related skills. I've completed one good sized web application (for internal use), along with updates to several existing applications. Where I'll go from here, I'm not sure, but I know I won't be leaving soon. Not with this many interesting projects going on. [Smile]

Today, the Computer Science instructor approached everyone in my office with an interesting proposal. Next year, next fall to be precise, he will be teaching more than 18 hours of classes, and there are other courses waiting for instructors to be assigned. To get straight to the point, he was asking if anyone in our office would be interested in teaching an introductory computer science course, 3 credit hours, 9AM M-W-F schedule.

Obviously, he had the permission of my boss to ask us this question. He also had permission from the Dean of that division. I'll tell you that the other two guys in my office told him no. One guy flatly refused, and the other guy said he wouldn't be comfortable as a teacher. My boss probably laughed at his request, in a particularly evil manner. He's a good guy, my boss, so I'm sure he gave us all the benefit of the doubt, with the feeling that we'd all turn down the offer with a chuckle.

I didn't tell the instructor no; I told him I would need to think about it. So here's the situation, in pros and cons:

PROS
-----
1. I'm not unqualified to teach this. Ok, that's a bad reason. Honestly, I'm just as knowledgeable about this subject as the instructor, judging by past experience with said instructor.
2. He will provide me all his notes, quizzes, tests, and other classroom material (though I'm free to alter and make my own, obviously.)
3. There would be monetary compensation for this extra duty, though I have no idea how much.
4. Of my existing large projects, both should be done by next fall.
5. It sounds like a challenge, one I could meet and excel at.
6. Many people have told me I'm good at instructing people on computers, but this is all from one-on-one instruction. I don't let it go to my head.
7. I essentially have my bosses blessing, though it would behoove me to futher discuss the situation with him.
8. It pays to be a versatile employee.

CONS
-----
1. This course is offered during the day, which means I'll be morally obligated to make up the hours and effort for my existing job. This is something I will do, without needing reminder.
2. The loss of some of that free time I mentioned earlier.
3. The compensation may not be worth the effort. (**)
4. My father has been in public (secondary) education all his life and told me to stay away. Far away.
5. I don't know where this fits into my career goals, if it does at all.

(*) This is based on the expert testimony of the guy in the office who flatly refused. His father taught an evening course for several years, and after calculated the effort to an hourly wage that sounds pretty dismal. [Frown]

There's more pros than cons, but some of those cons are pretty big.

I welcome Hatrack's feedback on this. I'll add other info below, if something comes to mind.

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advice for robots
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Experience, experience, experience. It might not pay you much now and might be a burden, but it might pay off in the long run on your resume. It would pay off in terms of practical, hands-on experience as well. Unless it's just too big of a hassle to do it, I would say go for it.
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AvidReader
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I would check with your boss and see what he has planned for the fall. I'd hate to see you miss out on something really cool because you're doing something that seemed kind of interesting.

If you had a clear goal, figuring out if this fit would be easy. Since you don't know quite where you want to go, trying something new is always a great idea. If you hate it, you never do it again and cross teaching clearly off your list of options. If it's ok, you keep it as an option to get to something you love. And if you love it, you've found your goal.

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quidscribis
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I agree with afr. It gives you added experience that makes your resume look that much better - and experience teaching people computers could prove to be a very valuable skill.

I also agree with AR - stretching your boundaries can be good, especially since you don't have a firm career path.

Personally, I'd find out the pay, discuss things, including his plans for the fall, and then likely take it. It could be fun, it could be interesting, it could be an interesting challenge, and at the very least, you'd find out if you enjoyed that sort of thing or not. I'm all for trying new things. [Smile]

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Uprooted
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I say go for it; sounds like you're intrigued with the possibilities. It's one semester -- if you hate it, you've learned something, it'll be over in four months or so, and you'll still have your job.
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Tstorm
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I am intrigued by this possibility. Initially, my reaction was to be skeptical, because I'm deep into some projects now. When I found out it was for next year, that seemed to make it more reasonable, in my mind.

I'll do some polite inquiring and try to find out more details.

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Javert Hugo
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Do it. It's great experience, it will look great on your resume, and it sounds like fun.
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TomDavidson
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My condolences on the JICS thing.
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Wonder Dog
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I think you'll have a blast. Teaching at the post-secondary level is a riot!

Just make sure you don't show fear - college students are like dogs that way - they can smell fear once they walk in the room. :0)

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Tstorm
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JICS, yeah, thanks. [Smile] I'm sure JICS will work for us, but the biggest hurdle will be getting people to actually use it in a significant way.
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Tstorm
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I'm way overdue to update this thread, but I also need to hit the hay, so I'll cut the story telling out. [Smile]

I accepted this offer. As I'm already full-time employed in my current position and this job requires taking time out of the work day, I've been making up the extra hours by coming in to work earlier each day.

The pay for the position is not good enough to justify the time investment. The semester is not yet halfway completed, and I can say this despite inheriting the previous instructor's lecture notes, tests, and an hour's worth of setup help from him, in-person. He's a good instructor, I feel, but my note-taking and lecture styles are different from his. Ergo, I make my own lecture notes and material.

(Because of this, there is only a slim chance I'll accept the inevitable question for next Fall.)

As far as other factors go...

1. This has stretched my boundaries a bit. I'm enjoying the challenge, the slight change in work schedule.

2. There are 10 students in the class, all guys, and with one exception, 18-20 years old. At least 2 of them are athletes. Class is 8AM to 9:30AM, Tuesday and Thursday. The attendance issues encountered thus far seem predictable. [Wink]

Hmm...anything else? I'll answer questions on this topic, if you post them. [Smile]

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rivka
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Adjuncts get paid peanuts. But it's still a good thing to have on your resume, even if you've decided not to continue next year.
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Kwea
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In this market it pays to be flexible. [Big Grin]
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AvidReader
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Sorry it's not that much fun after all. On the bright side, now you know how you feel about it.
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Farmgirl
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quote:
Originally posted by Tstorm:


CONS
-----

4. My father has been in public (secondary) education all his life and told me to stay away. Far away.

This I don't understand. [Frown] I thought he was happy with his work.

When I was in college, most of my adjuncts were pretty good when it came to knowledge of the subject, because they worked with it all the time; but some of them really sucked in communicating what they know [Smile] I'm assuming you already know your communication abilities (based on your posts here over the years, they are pretty good).

I thought to teach as an adjunct you have to have a Master's degree. Do you?

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Belle
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quote:
I thought to teach as an adjunct you have to have a Master's degree. Do you?
Depends on the field. My husband is adjunct faculty in the paramedic program offered at the local junior college. All he needed was a paramedic license and five years of experience as a working paramedic. Now, that is to teach the skills lab, which he does. They want him to teach in the classroom, which requires a bachelor's degree in the field. He doesn't have that, but is starting next semester. With all his other college credit, it's not going to take long. The classroom teaching which he will then be eligible to do pays more.

They have also encouraged him to get a master's in health education, which would then make him eligible for full-time faculty position, something he would only consider after he retires from the fire department.

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Tstorm
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quote:
Originally posted by Farmgirl:
quote:
Originally posted by Tstorm:


CONS
-----

4. My father has been in public (secondary) education all his life and told me to stay away. Far away.

This I don't understand. [Frown] I thought he was happy with his work.

When I was in college, most of my adjuncts were pretty good when it came to knowledge of the subject, because they worked with it all the time; but some of them really sucked in communicating what they know [Smile] I'm assuming you already know your communication abilities (based on your posts here over the years, they are pretty good).

I thought to teach as an adjunct you have to have a Master's degree. Do you?

Farmgirl, I don't think he'd do anything else, but I'm just relaying the message I received. I think, from my perspective, the message was intended as a warning about career choice. I don't believe it was intended as a statement on the worthiness of the career or how he regrets any choices. I'm familiar enough with public education to know the pros and cons about jobs in the field, so I understood where the warning was coming from.

Here, you can teach with a Bachelor's degree, which I have. The pay is significantly lower, however.

There have been some fun parts, though. I've rediscovered some public speaking skills, for example. I also enjoy challenging the students to think, which is harder than it sounds. All the material is objective-based. I spent five minutes trying to get a student to reason through something, the other day. If a student can learn terminology definitions and basic concepts and processes, this course is easy. It's an introductory course.

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Tstorm
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Ok, the course is done. The projects and exams have been graded. The grades have been entered into our lovely portal for the students to fawn over or shirk from.

Ten students started the class, and we ended with 8, for all intents and purposes. Of those 8, they ran the gamut. Good attendance, bad attendance; A students, F students; and enough classroom apathy to last me a lifetime.

From what I observed, all these students were decent individuals. They had their strengths and weaknesses just like any other individuals in a population. For ten students, there was some variety, at least. One baseball player, one cross country/track runner, and one body-builder sat alongside an equal variety of non-athletic computer geeks that ranged from pleasant to socially awkward. One student shared my birthday, albeit nine years later. Another student experienced the birth of his first son. When I think back on the last three months, the phrase "interesting mix" seems to describe the situation.

I didn't have any trouble maintaining order in the classroom. Aside from trying to nurture the socially awkward student toward a less annoying nature, mostly done outside of class, all my interactions with the students were pretty pleasant.

I did have some difficulty in prodding any answers out of these students. Asking questions during the lecture seemed to invoke a response that ranged from, "Why are you asking me?" to "Huh?" I'd be exaggerating if I said the classroom participation was good. Most of the time, I got the feeling the students did not WANT to be in class, learning about this material. Even when the material provided an opportunity for a hands-on example, the interaction was a joke. Despite the varied personalities and backgrounds, only one student showed any enthusiasm toward participating in discussion.

Despite all the intrigue of this challenge, and regardless of the pleasant circumstances, I'm sure that I'm not excited about teaching this course next year. I have informed the head of the program that I'm officially "not interested" in teaching the course again. However, I left the offer on the table to teach the course if he absolutely needed it and could not find a suitable instructor before next fall. This is a rural area and I can begin to understand how difficult it is to find someone to teach a course in less than 9 months. I have no desire to harm this gentleman or the program he has built in the last few years.

Having taught this course, I can state with utter certainty that I would like to try teaching something else. I'm not sure if it exists, but I have something in mind, based on my own college experience. A voluntary, (relatively) advanced course, covering a topic that students elect to take. I'm fairly sure that the apathy and attendance issues I experienced were directly linked to the fact that this is an introductory course, covering basic material, which the students are required to take, regardless of their background. Well, it wasn't up to me to pick the course, it just fell into my lap, but that's my assessment of the situation.

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Lupus
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I've done some teaching myself (psychology), and I enjoyed it. You are right about the pay though. For what you put into it, you really don't make enough...even at the college level.

Even with that, if you enjoy teaching people, it can be a rewarding job. I have actually toyed with the idea of teaching an evening class at a local college, but it it tough to justify the time spent doing it (since my main job keeps me busy enough).

as long as your boss is cool with it, I'd say go for it. Even if you don't think you would do it again, it doesn't hurt to try something once. Besides, you never know who you might meet by branching out. You might impress someone who could give you another job opportunity later on down the road.

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Teshi
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Who schedules a college class beginning at eight in the morning? You're lucky anyone showed up at all.
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rivka
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At most schools, there are quite a few that start at that time. Fortunately, I managed to avoid them -- I had a hard enough time with the 9 am ones.
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Belle
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8 am classes were not the earliest classes on my campus. There were quite a few dawning classes that started at 6:30.

You know, not everyone in college is a recent high school graduate whose mom and dad are paying their way and have the luxury of going to class at times convenient for them. Many people who work attend college, and classes are scheduled at times when they can attend. Not only after work, but before. Eight am is not that early, really. Many people in this world start their workdays well before seven.

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Tstorm
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It was going to be a morning class anyway, but I was given my choice of times. I figured the Tuesday-Thursday at 8AM time was better than the alternatives, but I don't remember what the choices were.

The attendance problem was not unique to my class, or even my time of morning. The local hangout (bar), conveniently located 1 mile south of the campus, features a Wednesday night that targets the college crowd. More than a few students can blame their academic woes on their inability to resist the temptation of that weekly event.

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Shawshank
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I have a 7:30 class coming up this next semester. Immediately followed by an 8:30 one. *shudders*
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Hank
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I always really liked having earlier classes. IT made the day seem so much longer.
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ketchupqueen
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And a long day is a GOOD thing? *shudder*
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Lyrhawn
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quote:
Originally posted by Teshi:
Who schedules a college class beginning at eight in the morning? You're lucky anyone showed up at all.

I took an American Civil War history class last semester that went from 8am to 10:50am, and included a 40 minute commute (thanks to the construction traffic). Considering I generally skip one to five classes during a semester in general, I can proudly say that I only skipped two classes this whole semester, both times because I wasn't feeling well.

Having said that, I made sure this semester that I wouldn't have to wake up before 10am. The only reason I went to so many of those classes was that it was a class I absolutely loved, and the time just flew by. I had a 4 hour long Ancient Greece and Rome class that felt like it was 10 minutes long it went by so fast. It'd hard to get motivated that early in the morning if you don't really love what you're going to be working on. I'm thrilled that I took the class though, as I met an awesome prof that I'm taking another class with this semester (at noon).

tstorm -

Have you decided against teaching the course again? I know you said before that you thought it was unlikely that you'd continue on, but that you'd like to teach maybe an upper level course, but I'm wondering what your final conclusion is, or if they even offered another semester to you.

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Tstorm
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The offer was on the table for me to teach the course again. It's a required course for one of the degree paths, and it's taught every fall semester because of that. There's a difficulty in finding qualified instructors to teach computer science courses around here. Rural, northern Kansas is not exactly a mecca for computer-related jobs.

I did decline to teach the course again, but I left the option open in the event they could not find anyone else to teach the course. I know there's an instructor with an overload of courses, and I don't wish to make his life terribly difficult.

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Farmgirl
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quote:
Originally posted by Tstorm:

I have informed the head of the program that I'm officially "not interested" in teaching the course again. However, I left the offer on the table to teach the course if he absolutely needed it and could not find a suitable instructor before next fall.

You do know, don't you, that this almost guarantees that he won't find a replacement instructor? If he knows he has an "out" he won't be very motivated to look for someone else to take it off your hands.
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