posted
I keep seeing the preview for this , and each time I think, man, this is such a non-event.
I rather feel the only halfway decent reason to see the last trilogy was to see Jedi do cool Jedi things. Heaven knows it didn't do a particularly good job of, oh, filling in backstory... Or making us care about Anakin Skywalker... (I mean, feel free to disagree with me on these points, but I think I've got pretty good backing.)
Trying to have Jedi do cool Jedi things in mediocre CGI? Just not that interesting. Nor am I particularly interested in spending any more time with our Petulant Emo Sith-to-be friend cast as our "hero". I saw the last trilogy through, Mr. Lucas; I really don't feel like I'm obligated to pad your pockets further.
I'm also, I must confess, somewhat baffled that this movie is being distributed by Warner Brothers. All the movies of both trilogies were Fox products. Is this a matter of the rights to Clone Wars being attributed to WB by way of the television cartoon, or something else?
Posts: 3826 | Registered: May 2005
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I didn't realize it was being released in theaters until the other day when I that saw the commercial on tv. The CGI is ridiculous looking and the jokes in the previews hardly seem direct-to-dvd worthy, even for children.
Despite two of the three prequels on the big screen (I have yet to see Episode 2 and I'm okay with that), I've convinced myself that nothing exists outside of the original trilogy. Everything else is just an illusion.
I'm not a big Star Wars fan. Just a girl who liked the movies growing up and still thinks Han Solo is pretty cool. But the more garbage that Lucas puts out, the faster my affection for the original trilogy fades into frustration and disgust. What is it going to take for him to stop?!?!
Posts: 1733 | Registered: Apr 2005
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As someone who probably defends Lucas more than anyone else on this board, I have no intention of seeing this in theaters. I liked the prequels, I love the original, I love much of the EU, and the games, and the animated series that won an emmy.
But this "movie" is basically the first episode of the new series. I absolutely refuse to pay for something that everyone was going to get for free on television anyway (not sure if it's on cable or not, so, not technically free). That's just greedy.
I do however think the show itself looks pretty neat and I plan on watching it when I can when it starts on TV. Paying to see a premiere episode? Nuh uh. Watching the show when it comes out like I was planning anyway? Sure. I think the CGI looks rather neat (though I admit it's certainly stylized and not for everyone), and makes a nice combination with the more professional sounding sound effects and music that we're all used to from the actual movies.
I'm not much of a console gamer these days, but I'm looking forward to that new game of his too.
quote:What is it going to take for him to stop?!?!
Honestly? For everyone to stop buying everything he puts out. I hear here more than most other places how awful the guy is, yet he's still one of the richest men in America, and whenever he releases something, people come out in droves to see it or buy it or experience it. Whether it's just blind devotion to the brand or they actually like it, I doubt he'll stop producing until well after people stop consuming, and that hasn't really happened yet.
Posts: 21898 | Registered: Nov 2004
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I don't think it looks good, but I'll still see it in the theaters; not because it's Star Wars -- I try to see everything I can in the theaters. I've been surprised so many times, I try to give every movie a chance.
Except for Beverly Hills Chihuahua, or whatever.
Posts: 2267 | Registered: May 2005
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quote:Originally posted by Shanna: But the more garbage that Lucas puts out, the faster my affection for the original trilogy fades into frustration and disgust. What is it going to take for him to stop?!?!
This is EXACTLY how I feel. The "magic" is gone for me. I would like to go back to the days of the original trilogy, before Lucas went back and messed them up.
Posts: 1766 | Registered: Feb 2006
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Recent reports say that Clone Wars tries to go back to the storytelling style of the Original Trilogy, with the character growth and the lighthearted side jokes. I don't really see anything particularly funny in the previews, though.
Okay, that was a blatant lie. "Kidnapped, Jabba the Hutt's son has been" had me rolling on the floor for HOURS! Really, I mean it. But it also kind of offended me because I was planning to have a level in my fan-game that features Jabba the Hutt in the Clone Wars, so I'm going to have to rewrite that part.
The video game trailers that show a bit of footage feature random Jedi saying stuff like "this is where the fun begins" and "this should be fun." I hope to God that this is NOT their idea of humor, and that those are the only instances in the entire series for them to say things like that. The sneak peak and behind the scenes websites say that they're putting a lot of emphasis on character and story, and trying to emulate the humor of the Original Trilogy, but it's just NOT funny to watch Jedi swing their lightsabers in front of a bunch of battle droids and say "oo this is fun."
However, there is that one moment in the Wii game trailer where a battle droid says "Well that was impressive" and Greivous slaps it. The timing and delivery was just so great that we were hysterical the rest of the day. Saying "that was impressive" and mocking a slap has now become a running gig in our family.
The CGI is a bit hard to handle at first, but after looking at it for a while, I began to appreciate its style. The only thing in the animation department that disgusts me now is Dooku's head. Seriously, he looks like a Muun.
Reporters who have actually seen the film or some episodes are actually giving positive reviews. This may be because all of them are die-hard Star Wars fans, but I'm not sure that explanation works in the real world because many a Star Wars fan is still a Lucas basher.
I'm probably going to see it in theaters because if anything, it can't be worse than Attack of the Clones, and I still enjoyed the (non-Anakin) parts of that movie, and besides, it's my birthday week when it comes out, and I'll have just got out of summer school. If it weren't my birthday, I'd probably wait for the DVD release and Netflix it.
By the way Lyrhawn, it's only on cable so I can't see it on TV.
Posts: 1029 | Registered: Apr 2007
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Edit: I agree with what was said about the Anakin character. For a three film story arc, this was without a doubt the worst character possible. Thanks to the writing, and with no help from the terrible acting, Anakin comes across as stupid, selfish, annoying, power crazy, jealous, ungrateful, childish, and naive. There is not one positive character trait he ever seems to have. It truly amazes me that this happened.
quote:But this "movie" is basically the first episode of the new series. I absolutely refuse to pay for something that everyone was going to get for free on television anyway (not sure if it's on cable or not, so, not technically free). That's just greedy.
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I just like Shaak Ti, is that Shaak Ti because if it's not I don't think that I'll see it. (I'll still see it. )
Posts: 1574 | Registered: May 2008
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quote:Originally posted by Orincoro: Thanks to the writing, and with no help from the terrible acting, Anakin comes across as stupid, selfish, annoying, power crazy, jealous, ungrateful, childish, and naive. There is not one positive character trait he ever seems to have. It truly amazes me that this happened.
Well, aren't the prequels all about how Anakin turns evil?
I think the problem was that it just worked too well. People seem to forget that Anakin was a cutie in Phantom Menace.
Posts: 1029 | Registered: Apr 2007
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quote:Originally posted by Shanna: Despite two of the three prequels on the big screen (I have yet to see Episode 2 and I'm okay with that), I've convinced myself that nothing exists outside of the original trilogy. Everything else is just an illusion.
Hey, you're me! Down to the part about Episode 2.
Posts: 4519 | Registered: Sep 2003
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quote:Originally posted by C3PO the Dragon Slayer:
quote:Originally posted by Orincoro: Thanks to the writing, and with no help from the terrible acting, Anakin comes across as stupid, selfish, annoying, power crazy, jealous, ungrateful, childish, and naive. There is not one positive character trait he ever seems to have. It truly amazes me that this happened.
Well, aren't the prequels all about how Anakin turns evil?
I think the problem was that it just worked too well. People seem to forget that Anakin was a cutie in Phantom Menace.
Well yes the prequels needed to show Anakins descent into evil however there needed to be some positive character traits as well. In the Return of the Jedi Luke's love for his father despite his father's dark ways is what brings Anakin to redemption allowing him to join ObiWan and Yoda at the end. I don't think there was enough positive character development in the prequels to make that redemption believable as an overall story. It was more believable before the prequels came out.
Posts: 1132 | Registered: A Long Time Ago!
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I would have liked to have seen Anakin and Obi-Wan as friends, as they were said to have been.
Posts: 37449 | Registered: May 1999
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I would have liked to have seen how Leia could have any memories of Padme, what with Episode 3 contradicting pretty much the entire "Do you remember your real mother?" scene.
Posts: 6689 | Registered: Jan 2005
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Hey, she's strong in the Force. She's allowed to mystically have memories from the moment she was born. Is it a coincidence that Luke happened to echo his mother's last words, "there's still good in him", and that was his driving motivation to redeem Anakin against the explicit instructions of Obi-wan and Yoda? I know it sounds far-fetched, but I like the idea that Luke and Leia both bonded with their mother through the Force in the moments before she died. Luke sensed and clung to her belief that Anakin could be saved, and Leia sensed her sadness and (apparently) her beauty.
Posts: 1569 | Registered: Dec 2004
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quote:I would have liked to have seen Anakin and Obi-Wan as friends, as they were said to have been.
I would have liked to have seen three different movies written and directed by someone who wasn't Lucas(he'd be allowed to write the story treatment and produce).
Posts: 8741 | Registered: Apr 2001
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...When explanations to make the existing continuity make sense begin to sound like fan-fiction, you know you've got a problem.
Posts: 3826 | Registered: May 2005
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quote:Originally posted by neo-dragon: Hey, she's strong in the Force. She's allowed to mystically have memories from the moment she was born. Is it a coincidence that Luke happened to echo his mother's last words, "there's still good in him", and that was his driving motivation to redeem Anakin against the explicit instructions of Obi-wan and Yoda? I know it sounds far-fetched, but I like the idea that Luke and Leia both bonded with their mother through the Force in the moments before she died. Luke sensed and clung to her belief that Anakin could be saved, and Leia sensed her sadness and (apparently) her beauty.
Nope, nope, nope. Doesn't fit. You've stretched what was said in RotJ to the breaking point in order to make it fit Episode III.
The final season of the Genndy Tartakovsky Clone Wars shorts did finally give us a taste of Anakin and Obi bonding and acting like good friends. Too bad it's expanded universe.
Posts: 6689 | Registered: Jan 2005
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I don't believe I've stretched anything, or made anything up. I've just offered my interpretation. There's no denying that Luke seems to have inherited his mother's last sentiment. He had no reason to believe that Anakin was good based on his own personal experience. And to be fair, given the amount of SW material out there (films, books, comics, games) its continuity is actually fairly consistent. Every franchise has contradictions. Part of the fun of fandom is looking for ways to explain them.
quote:Originally posted by Puffy Treat: The final season of the Genndy Tartakovsky Clone Wars shorts did finally give us a taste of Anakin and Obi bonding and acting like good friends. Too bad it's expanded universe.
So what? That's exactly what the EU is for.
Posts: 1569 | Registered: Dec 2004
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I think it was believable. Looking at how it all started and what kind of kid he was, and what kind of parent he had. Then you see him get a little drunk with power in his apparently angsty teen years. Ultimately his biggest problem was pegged by Yoda; he was too old when his training started. Usually the Jedi were taken from their parents when they were much much younger, but Anakin already had a lot of flaws and susceptibility to his emotions that other trainees his age would've had fixed by then.
He always loved Padme, even when he went a little crazy and attacked her, due I think to a decent amount of brainwashing from Palpatine. After he learned of her death I think he was crushed, especially knowing it was his fault, setting up their kid or kids as the perfect vehicle for his redemption. And for that matter, Anakin's relationship with Obi-Wan was real, despite the falling out they had.
I think Anakin's switch to the Vader persona has a lot of the same characteristics of someone who falls to an addiction and loses everything but then is redeemed in the end by a family member or loved one.
Anakin was a good guy who was steered very deliberately (and probably with some Force influence) wrong by Palpatine. I think he was a cocky kid who knew just how good he was also, and Palpatine found him ripe for the picking. But the person that he once was, when he fell in love with Padme and when he was just a boy following his mom around, I don't think that ever went away, and that's what Luke appealed to.
I don't think the prequels ruin the believability at all.
Posts: 21898 | Registered: Nov 2004
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In re Leia saying that she remembered her real mother --
Did she EVER give any indication she knew or even thought that she was adopted? I always thought that her memories of her "mother" were of Bail Organa's wife -- not Padme.
Posts: 1323 | Registered: Aug 2001
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She would have objected to the real mother statement if she hadn't known she was adopted. "Real mother? I've only got one." Heck, had she been raised by Mrs Organa and thought of her as her real mother, she might have objected to the phrasing even knowing she was adopted.
I think the biggest problem with Anakin was something Aristotle called maximum dramatic reversal. Whatever the character ends up as, he should start as the opposite. Precocious, insanely lucky kid is not the opposite of the incarnation of evil and destruction in the universe. Neither is whiney teen.
I think I'd have liked to see some kind of mystic healer doing good with his powers on his own. Maybe with his own utopian cult in the wilderness or something. When the Jedi find him, they "save" his followers, bring him in for training, and sow the seeds of his downfall. That would be dramatic reversal.
Posts: 2283 | Registered: Dec 2003
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quote:Originally posted by neo-dragon: I don't believe I've stretched anything, or made anything up. I've just offered my interpretation. There's no denying that Luke seems to have inherited his mother's last sentiment.
Because if nothing else, the original trilogy tells us repeatedly that "Force sensitive people transmit their very last emotions and thoughts to their offspring."
Except...we're not told that at all. And thank you for pointing out the bad writing and moral weirdness that pretty much ruins the third act of RotJ.
Man, the more you try to deny the precarious fan-fic of your hypothesis, the stronger and more blatant it gets. Posts: 6689 | Registered: Jan 2005
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posted
My biggest problem with the portrayal of Anakin's main fall is that at no point did it happen because he actually chose the Dark Side...it happened because he was easily mislead and not very bright.
That, and his few friends had the same moral weirdness disease everyone in the SW series has gotten from the last act of RotJ onward.
"You murdered an entire village just because they were the same species as the guys who killed your mother? Well heck, Anakin...nobody's perfect!"- Padme (paraphrased) Posts: 6689 | Registered: Jan 2005
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Given the prequel, you might also think at some point in the original trilogy ol' Anakin might have gone "Wait a second, my children are alive? That's not what raisin-face told me at all!"
Posts: 3826 | Registered: May 2005
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quote:Originally posted by neo-dragon: I don't believe I've stretched anything, or made anything up. I've just offered my interpretation. There's no denying that Luke seems to have inherited his mother's last sentiment.
Because if nothing else, the original trilogy tells us repeatedly that "Force sensitive people transmit their very last emotions and thoughts to their offspring."
Except...we're not told that at all. And thank you for pointing out the bad writing and moral weirdness that pretty much ruins the third act of RotJ.
Man, the more you try to deny the precarious fan-fic of your hypothesis, the stronger and more blatant it gets.
I'm not actually trying to convince anyone, just explaining how it makes sense to me personally. If I can overlook the flaws and still enjoy the entire saga and much of the EU I guess I'm the lucky one.
quote:Originally posted by Sterling: Given the prequel, you might also think at some point in the original trilogy ol' Anakin might have gone "Wait a second, my children are alive? That's not what raisin-face told me at all!"
By the time of the OT Anakin had long since known that Palpatine had been lying and manipulating him from the start. He was planning to overthrow him at the first opportunity, just as Palpatine was prepared to dump him for a better apprentice. They were both planning to replace the other with Luke.
Posts: 1569 | Registered: Dec 2004
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quote:Originally posted by neo-dragon: By the time of the OT Anakin had long since known that Palpatine had been lying and manipulating him from the start. He was planning to overthrow him at the first opportunity, just as Palpatine was prepared to dump him for a better apprentice. They were both planning to replace the other with Luke.
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The true cause of the downfall of the Jedi was not Palpatine. It was not Vader. It was not Anakin.
It was the Jedi themselves.
They became too proud, to powerful, to full of themselves.
They swung at Palpatine first.
They feared Anakin's potential. They didn't try to save him.
Luke, with his small town ways and small justices and the ability to seek to save Vader, not destroy him--even reaching out to save first Jabba, then The Emperor, is the true path of the Jedi.
Posts: 1941 | Registered: Feb 2003
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I think the big differences between Luke and Anakin was that Anakin grew up knowing he was "the one," wheras Luke grew up knowing he'd likely never make it past Mos Eisley. And, Luke didn't find out about any of his abilities or heritage until after he'd already gotten past most of his teenage angsty years that Anakin fell to darkness during. Luke was just starting out, Anakin was at the height of his power.
Posts: 21898 | Registered: Nov 2004
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quote:Originally posted by neo-dragon: By the time of the OT Anakin had long since known that Palpatine had been lying and manipulating him from the start. He was planning to overthrow him at the first opportunity, just as Palpatine was prepared to dump him for a better apprentice. They were both planning to replace the other with Luke.
From what I've seen and read, that's not particularly unique to Vader/Palpatine; that's just what all the Sith Master-Apprentice relationships are like. I wouldn't be the first to point out that Sith Apprentice is not a job with a lot of security.Posts: 3826 | Registered: May 2005
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Yeah, I know, it's a Sith thing. Which is why Dooku was so stupid to be surprised when Palpatine told Anakin to kill him. How could he have not guessed that Palpatine would want to replace him with the younger, more impressionable, and more powerful Anakin?
Posts: 1569 | Registered: Dec 2004
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I just watched the tomato meter for this film drop from 19 to 5 to n/a in about a 2 minute period.
Posts: 11017 | Registered: Apr 2003
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quote:Originally posted by Puffy Treat: I would have liked to have seen how Leia could have any memories of Padme, what with Episode 3 contradicting pretty much the entire "Do you remember your real mother?" scene.
quote:I would have liked to have seen Anakin and Obi-Wan as friends, as they were said to have been.
I would have liked to have seen three different movies written and directed by someone who wasn't Lucas(he'd be allowed to write the story treatment and produce).
quote:Originally posted by theamazeeaz: So ... did anyone see this? Just how bad is this?
Pretty bad. I took my little brother to see it -- he, being seven, is a natural Star Wars fan -- and it was painful for me to get through it. I mean...I guess it wasn't gut wrenchingly terrible. But it wasn't good. This should have been (and probably was going to be) a direct to DVD movie. And not a good one at that.
Posts: 290 | Registered: Sep 2002
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Not even direct to DVD. It's essentially the pilot for a new series that starts in the fall, so it's going to be on tv pretty soon. Notice how they don't mention that?
Posts: 1569 | Registered: Dec 2004
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This is my problem. Lucas opened the universe up to other writers. I'm sure he made tons of money off their work in fees and stuff. All those writers tried very hard to read each others works (at least during the time period when I was reading them) and to make the stories internally cohesive.
THEN he goes and makes his prequels, and totally screws up no only his own original movies but all the work other people had put into his universe and making him rich.
I tolerated the first movie, but got increasingly uneasy with the last two prequels, and this new animated one just made me go "What?" when I first saw the preview.
The only reason I might see this is that I live in the middle of nowhere and sometimes it gets boring on the weekends. We have a small theater only a few miles away that is still reasonably priced, and I think my 4-year-old might enjoy it. Still... I haven't been bored enough yet THIS weekend.
HA HA... I just noticed as I went to post this, that the advertisement on the bottom of the screen is for the movie. How funny!
Posts: 1321 | Registered: Jun 2006
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Oh man. Read the last page of reviews on Metacritic for this movie. WAY TO WIN, LUCAS. THANKS FOR ALL THESE NON-CRAPPY PREQUEL PRODUCTS. I BET YOUR TV SERIES WILL BE AWESOME FOR REAL
Posts: 15421 | Registered: Aug 2005
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quote:Originally posted by theamazeeaz: So ... did anyone see this? Just how bad is this?
For me, the worst thing about the movie is Ahsoka. She had some good moments, but most of the time she was either annoying or suggestive. I went to see this knowing it was really just a TV show; like McDonald's take-out in a plaza and theme where most expect four-star diners. I went expecting some cheap TV-grade flick, and my expectations were exceeded. Therefore I enjoyed this movie.
With the possible exception of Yoda, the acting meets, and sometimes exceeds, the standards set by the prequels, and I almost like Anakin more in The Clone Wars than in Attack of the Clones. They deserve a few bonus points for that. The story is not very special; it would make sense if it were one plot in a long series (which is what it was originally, before Warner Bros. decided to put it on the big screen), where every week there was something new, but it is epic failure as a stand-alone movie.
Some sequences were clever. I liked the Christophis and Teth portions of the film, minus Baby Jabba Is Sick, with the uphill battle (REALLY uphill), the idiocy of the Battle Droids (I learned to appreciate it, and expect it, with Revenge of the Sith; deal with it), the tension and courage of the Clone Troopers, and the space battles. I also thought the opening battle with Obi-Wan's "negotiations," Anakin's trouble with Ahsoka, and the battle scheme with the expanding shield generator (though why didn't the CIS use their shields in the FIRST engagement?) were clever enough to be worth watching.
The stupidest part in the movie is when Anakin takes Jabba's backpack and fills it with rocks and strolls through the desert and meets Dooku and Dooku slashes the backpack and Dooku gloats and then Anakin acts all Yu-Gi-Oh! and says "You've fallen for my trick." It's so pointless. Although it was followed up with some clever Force tricks with the sand. I honestly thought that lightsaber fight would be really boring, since there are no bottomless pits, no creatures, no lava, no structures to jump around on, nothing exciting. Then they start doing neat tricks with the sand and all of a sudden I'm not disappointed.
The secret to appreciating this movie is having low expectations: don't even call it a movie, call it a TV show on the big screen. Because that's what it is, and as a TV show, it works pretty well. It also helps if you're a big Star Wars fan that has read nothing of the Clone Wars books like Republic Commando yet. I'd sure love to see the series this fall, but no, I don't have cable, so I have to rent the DVD releases. Just forget it's a movie, pretend it's another episode in the series. You just have to sort out the stupid time-fillers from the ingenious concepts, as there are both in the movie. I watched the movie expecting more of the former, and receiving some of the latter, and I chose to take note of the good points. Yes, this movie is not a worthy continuation of the standards set by The Empire Strikes Back, or even Revenge of the Sith, for that matter, but I had fun, and that's what matters.
Posts: 1029 | Registered: Apr 2007
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Blayne Bradley
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posted
I also liked it for largely your above outlined reasons. Though I wish Asoka was older, and yes I liked the lightsabre combat very much and I feel that this movie does a better job at portraying Anakin did the trilogy did.
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so I can't see it on TV.
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Down to the part about Episode 2.
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