posted
I thought I saw a couple news reports says that Putin was in Beijing for the Olympics too, not that you can't start an invasion by remote control or set a kitchen timer before you go. Still ... must make for awkward conversations given the atmosphere.
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posted
I cannot fathom what the Georgians are thinking. The Russians aren't what they once were, but Georgia?
Posts: 10645 | Registered: Jul 2004
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Blayne Bradley
unregistered
posted
The thread title is incorrect they are sending troops in support of a break away region of Georgia who the Georgians attacked first.
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quote:Originally posted by Blayne Bradley: The thread title is incorrect they are sending troops in support of a break away region of Georgia who the Georgians attacked first.
It's part of Georgia. The Russians sent troops there without invitation or permission - making it an invasion.
Therefore, the Russians invaded Georgia.
At most, the thread title is less complete than your modification. It is not inaccurate.
And from our perspective, what was put in the title was the most pertinent. Russia has sent its troops into Georgia and considers itself at war. That's bad in so many ways.
Posts: 26071 | Registered: Oct 2003
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Blayne Bradley
unregistered
posted
And your looking for a foot up your ass. -To Squicky Dag posted faster then me.
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Assuming that was aimed at Squicky, his interpretation is far more charitable than the one I came up with, which is that you actually meant to celebrate war.
If his interpretation is correct, than my opinion of you would actually be improved - although still quite low. I doubt I'm the only one.
Edit: Also, threatened violence is unacceptable.
Posts: 26071 | Registered: Oct 2003
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Blayne Bradley
unregistered
posted
Really its part of Georgia now? This Pro-Russian region is suddenly a part of Georgia when you know so many Pro US regions are somehow independent states?
quote:Really its part of Georgia now? This Pro-Russian region is suddenly a part of Georgia when you know so many Pro US regions are somehow independent states?
The hypocrisy is awe inspiring.
Hypocrisy means the espousing of an ideal or belief that one does not hold.
In colloquial terms, it can mean applying one principle to judge others and not applying that principle to one's own actions.
Either way, I'd appreciate you articulating the principle involved and citing your evidence that I don't apply that principle to other situation.
Posts: 26071 | Registered: Oct 2003
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Blayne Bradley
unregistered
posted
Russia supporting Abhkazia is almost a direct parallel to US supporting Taiwan.
Both are geopolitically important to the supporting nation, both would go to war to defend it, both are to differing degrees seeking independence (Taiwan less so now that the KMT is in power).
quote:Russia supporting Abhkazia is almost a direct parallel to US supporting Taiwan. Both are geopolitically important to the supporting nation, both would go to war to defend it, both are to differing degrees seeking independence (Taiwan less so now that the KMT is in power). The parallel is obvious.
I see the problem. You think I made some commentary about whether Russia's actions in this case are justified.
Yes! It's always been part of Georgia (well for at least 200 years). This region is within the internationally recognized boundaries of Georgia. No country, not even Russia, has recognized South Ossetia as an independent nation.
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Blayne Bradley
unregistered
posted
It stated it was making moves to do so before georgia escalated matters.
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It seems you're the one being hypocritical here,not us. See, you do think Taiwan is part of China. Yet you posted here that you don't think this region is part of Georgia. What's the difference?
Posts: 26071 | Registered: Oct 2003
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posted
Ah, fanboiism. Still, it does seem to me that Russia can reasonably claim to be playing by the same rules as the West, what with Kosovo. There's no particular reason to consider South Ossetia part of Georgia.
(Aside) Never mind Georgia, are you going to support Italy against the blatant aggression of the Bretons in accordance with your obligations under the Samoyeds Pact, and if not why not?
Posts: 10645 | Registered: Jul 2004
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Blayne Bradley
unregistered
posted
That whole issue is leaving me very very confused I wasn't aware Italy is a part of it.
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posted
Well, I guess that explains a bit about the timing:
quote: It has always been hard to work out who fired the first shot in any of the many conflicts that had broken out in the Caucasus.
Ever since June 1992, when the tiny mountain enclave of South Ossetia won the first round of its bid to detach itself from Georgia, the two sides have been intermittently at war.
But the flare-ups in the last decade have been skirmishes, and for a while it looked as though peace had broken out.
The weapons used today — tanks, multiple rocket launchers and fighter aircraft — made the fighting qualitatively different.
Observers had little doubt that the operation to take South Ossetia back under Georgian control bore the hallmarks of a planned military offensive.
It was not the result of a ceasefire that had broken down the night before - it was more a fulfilment of the promise the Georgian president, Mikhail Saakashvili, had made to recapture lost national territory, and with it a measure of nationalist pride.
The assault appears to be have carefully timed to coincide with the opening of the Olympics when the Russian prime minister, Vladimir Putin, was in Beijing.
Tom de Waal, of the Institute for War and Peace Reporting and an expert on the region, said: "Clearly there have been incidents on both sides, but this is obviously a planned Georgian operation, a contingency plan they have had for some time, to retake [the South Ossetian capital] Tskhinvali.
"Possibly the Georgians calculated that, with Putin in Beijing, they could recapture the capital in two days and then defend it over the next two months, because the Russians won't take this lying down."
If Georgia calculated that Russia would be inhibited by Putin's presence at the Olympics, that soon backfired.
Within hours, the Russian president, Dmitri Medvedev, chaired a session of the security council in the Kremlin, ordering units of the 58th Russian army to retake Tskhinvali. The Russian president's military credentials are so weak - he had no other choice.
...
Jonathan Eyal, the director of studies at the Royal United Services Institute (Rusi), warned that all-out war between Russian and Georgia would amount to "the worst crisis in Europe since the end of communism".
He described Georgia's decision to shell Tskhinvali as a brazen effort to humiliate the Russians.
"It is clearly a calculated gamble by the Georgians," he said.
"If they manage to overrun South Ossetia, where there are probably only around 1,000 Russian troops at the moment, they will have humiliated Russia and would have created a triumph for themselves.
"They will also have propelled the west into a diplomatic involvement on the ground."
...
He described a feeling that the country was "more sinned against than sinning" but that there was also significant frustration over the actions of its president.
"If it goes into an all out war, the predicament for the west is acute and the crisis would be the worst crisis in Europe since the end of communism.
"It would be much worse than the Yugoslav wars, mainly because it has the old traditional element of an east-west confrontation.
quote:Did I threaten to murder his parents, grind them into my homemade chili and force him to eat it?
Blayne, you have to understand: physical threats in online discussions don't carry much weight at all in serious-minded people.
Physical threats from you carry even less weight in the minds of the serious and the whimsical alike.
Posts: 17164 | Registered: Jun 2001
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Blayne Bradley
unregistered
posted
And so do your pretensions to maturity.
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You know, I actually came in here planning to make a joke about Georgia, as in the state, and and how some people who didn't realize there WAS a Georgia besides the state might get confused...
But you know - War, armed conflict, invasion,- whatever you want to call it is no laughing matter. I agree that it's unfortunate it is happening around the Olympics, which are supposed to be about unity and coming together to celebrate athletic achievement across the world.
Of course, that's not diminishing the fact this kind of thing is unfortunate whenever it happens.
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But seriously, man: you gotta realize how absurd you make yourself look when you make physical threats online.
Don't get me wrong, I'm having fun breaking your balls over it too, but seriously, it's also for your own good. You looked like a complete jackass with that foot-ass thing. Try to remember that the next time you get the urge.
Posts: 17164 | Registered: Jun 2001
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Blayne Bradley
unregistered
posted
I said "your looking for a foot up your ass" I did not say "I am going to kick your ass" it is merely my expression of displeasure in much the same way Red Forman from the 70's show does.
"breaking your balls" once more pretension to something you do not have.
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One reason why Taiwan has not "declared independence" is because Taiwan considerers itself to be the rightful and legitimate government of all of the former Chinese Empire as it existed at the collapse of the last imperial ruler. It considers Communist China to be a rebel government holding territory by hostile force.
If Taiwan declared itself to be "independent" it would essentially give up any and all right to regaining its lost territories. It is also the same case with Communist China not wanting Taiwan to declare "independence" because if that happened, Communist China would lose all pretext to Taiwanese territory and also have to allow Taiwan the same rights as any other nation which shares a border, sea, or waterway.
So if you are comparing Osetia to Taiwan, the comparative is essentially false.
Then again your initial outburst was beyond petulant behavior. So, why I am surprised at the remainder of your comments simply indicates I assumed you to have some sort of human decency in you.
Apparently you wish to demonstrate that you do not.
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quote:I said "your looking for a foot up your ass" I did not say "I am going to kick your ass" it is merely my expression of displeasure in much the same way Red Forman from the 70's show does.
When Red says it it's funny.
Posts: 26071 | Registered: Oct 2003
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Blayne Bradley
unregistered
posted
if it declared independence it would be immediately invaded, the PRC actually would never allow Taiwan to be independent just because a region "declares" independence does not by any means force the contesting nation to somehow accept it.
Right now it stands is that the Independence leaning parties want independence but lack political support do to so and the KMT and other Pro Unification leaning parties want closer economic and political ties with the mainland following the 1992 Consensus and possible unification on their terms.
The PRC doesn't "have to" do anything it has over 600 Ballistic missiles pointed across the straights for that purpose, your being overly naive and ignorant of international law.
Next and yes, I am Satan. Carry on by dehumanization through strategy games is not your concern.
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Blayne Bradley
unregistered
posted
quote:Originally posted by Dagonee:
quote:I said "your looking for a foot up your ass" I did not say "I am going to kick your ass" it is merely my expression of displeasure in much the same way Red Forman from the 70's show does.
posted
Its more like 1000 at this point. But despite your assumptions as to my misunderstanding of geopolitics, the fact is that the situation between China and Taiwan is not comparable to the situation with Russia, Georgia, and Osetia.
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